Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Weatherby ammo Exceed Safety limits to get high Velocity?

The other pressure thread didn't seem to address this...

Does Weatherby / their ammo source exceed the pressure max to acheive their velocities that seem to be unobtainable by us reloaders, or do they have a secret Powder to acheive the extra velocity most seem to not be able to safely match?

I still need to do new load development for my restocked/ worked over Ultralight 300.... and it seems Retumbo or 7828 are the powders of choice for the 300 w/ 165-180 grain bullets. They test fired my "worked" gun w/ TSX ammo and it seems to shoot well, under 7/8" 3 shots, repeated 2x after the new stock / skim bedding.

Thanks

Allen

Weatherby factory rifles are free bored to assist in achiving their velocities. As to whether in addition to the free bore, the cartridges are loaded to higher pressures, I don't know.

I have never had any of the classic indications of high pressure with Weatherby factory loads.

I have read, but have no personal experience, that Weatherby factory loads can give dangerously high pressures in non freebored rifles, but I have no experience with this, either.

Weatherby factory ammunition is loaded by Norma. I don't know what pressure standard they load to, but in general I have been able to match Weatherby factory ammo velocities, or come close enough that it doesn't matter, say within 50 fps.

A question: Are you talking about advertised velocities, or velocities of Weatherby ammo when fired in your rifle?

They load their ammo to the balls. http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3197/is_n2_v34/ai_7423587/

Hercules powders or the R series. Reloder
Also the bullet you speak of has rings so a very slight drag on the bullet instead of full rifling contact. All ammo using this type bullets see higher velocities- no secret there. Have a good day.

Hmm. That is a 20-year-old article, published when RL-19 and RL-22 were cutting-edge news.

Are they using another powder now? Just wondering

They use Norma powders, which as I understand it are made in the same factory as the Reloder series and are quite similar.

Looking at SAAMI pressure limits, the 300 Weatherby is currently loaded to slightly lower pressures than the 300 Remington Ultra Mag. However, in the 1940's, when Weatherby was getting started he loaded his own ammunition; he did not have pressure test equipment and I'm sure he loaded right up to the limit!

Good point John.

I haven't had the opportunity to chronograph my loads, or the 150 partiton ammo that came with the gun.

I have seen many magazine ( pre internet craze) and internet threads about Wby ammo mewasured velocities are hard to duplicate, and your 50 fps is about the handloading limit under actual that I recall reading. Yes, 50 fps less than factory is pretty close.... my reference mark is take ANY other factory ammo, and handloading can easily exceed factory loads ( except the 280 remington...lol) without excess pressure signs, like bulges (.002 or more) around the belt, flat primers, etc.

Just curious , and thanks for your input, if Wby ( Norma) ammo "cheats" by exceeding SAAMI max, or they have "majic" powders.

I know it is a sin to have an Ohler and NOT work up loads, watching velocity gain per grain of powder and use it to help determine how close to max your reloads are coming, but knowing and doing are sometimes not in the mix.


Allen

Weatherby factory ammo is stout stuff from what I have seen after working with two weatherby rifles and 3 remington rifles chambered in Weatheby rounds.
The spent cases from almost all of these had ejector marks. Cartridges were 300,257,340,7mm, and 240.

I shot a lot of 300 Weatherby Mag in the mid 1970s and the 7mm Weatherby as well the factory loads are pretty stout. I don't think they were anywhere close to being overloads or unsafe in properly chambered rifles. When I was shooting the 300 weatherby ammo or cases were the only game in town. I use to own a 340 Weatherby, that I bought because the guy who had it said it didn't shoot well. Bought it for a song, along with 15 boxes of ammo. 210 Nosler stuff. First thing I did, was snug down the floor plate screws and made sure the scope and mounts were tight and proper. My first four shot landed under a half dollar at 200 yards. Made a sight adjustment, fired four more, right were I wanted it to be and when elk hunting. I don't recall any problems with that ammo or rifle, one of the Maine Guns SS. It when down the road. Would have been a great rifle, if it didn't have a break on it. Dam thing was loud with it. Weatherby has been around for a long time now, and they been selling the guns and the ammo. Maybe a bad lot of ammo would be my guess.

Norma loads are all a little stouter than their US made equivalent. IMHO it is because of the legal system in Scandinavia: Norma loads closser to the max than do US companies who have to listen to their product liability lawyers.

hemiallen,

Actually, I have been able to match or even beat some Weatherby ammo in Weatherby rifles, but didn't beat it by much.
In recent years I haven't seen Weatherby factory stuff show ay of the classic "pressure signs" when fired in Weatherby rifles.

One thing I have tried (since I have a collection of all the Norma rifle powders) is to chronograph a load, then tear ine apart and weigh the charge. Then I compare this info (MV and powder charge) to the data in the Norma manual and see what listed load might be it. Then I try that load, working up to it of course. More often than not it dupes the factory ammo.

JB: You and your first hand experiments are taking all the fun out of the internet!

Thank you VERY much John, excellent information for the newby Weatherby reloader.

If I may ask one last Weatherby ammunition question, Their 1 1/2" guarantee for Wby chamberings demand using their ammo
( which they changed Bullet type on me from The tech's statement that they use Nosler 180 partition ammo for the guarantee on my gun) but when I received it back w/ the 2 targets ( after buying a lifetime supply of Nosler partitions...lol) I see the test targets used TSX bulleted ammo...

The question I deviated on above... why is their ammo so accurate, or is it? I know you have a vangard 300 Wby, curious if you tested Factory then handloads, and if improvement is easily obtained with good reloads, or is the Wby ammo very good.

I now have a good set of dies to produce .002 or less bullet runout ammo, and the few 150 partitions ( factory ammo) I tested seemed to be of excellent bullet alignment but easy to duplicate now that my old RCBS dies have been exchanged with very concentric dies... but I haven't loaded any ammo on them to range test.

Thanks John

Allen

Actually I haven't been able to beat Weatherby factory ammo by much in our 3 Weatherby rifles, a .240 Ultra Lightweight Mark V, a .257 Vanguard Sporter, and the .300 Sub-MOA. In each rifle at least one load of Weatherby factory stuff shot under an inch at 100 yards, often much under. I can duplicate the factory ammo's accuracy in each rifles, and maybe even beat it a little, but the factory stuff is indeed normally very accurate in my experience.

Norma knows how to make good ammo, and in other cartridges as well.

I've not had any issues obtaining Weatherby velocities.

More to the point, the velocities the ammo achieves is enough to insure the performance I get is spectacular.

Good point;and the thing I have always liked about the 300 Weatherby is that I can get a nice,easy-going 3150 with a 180 gr bullet without straining anything.

Exactly, or 3000 fps with a 200-grain bullet--or 3500 with a 100-grain bullet in the .257 Roy.