Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Optics 2008 Finnish Low Light Scope Test--FYI only, not necessarily the gospel.

The following information is about a test of scope performance in low light levels done in Finland. The data were made available by an individual who is identified as Low Light Hunter. Tom B.

From: LowLightHunter Sat Jan 05, 2008 1:00 am

To: MrGman. Here is a test from a Finnish magazine where a bunch of scopes where tested.
A test board with E letters in different sizes on separate levels(the same as used for the driving tests) where placed 110 yards away. The test results show how many rows could be seen through the scope at different times during the evening. If a minus (-) sign is placed after the row number, it means that it could not be determined where the E pointed (up, down, left or right). The test results are in Finnish, but here is a translation table:

- riv = row
- ei n�y = could not be seen

The test where done during winter time conditions.

Here are the test results:

Burris 2,5-10x44 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 1 riv.- 20.00: ei n�y
Bushnell 2,5-10x50 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 1 riv.- 20.00: ei n�y
Bushnell 3-9x50 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv.- 20.00: ei n�y
Docter 2,5-10x48 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv.- 20.00: 1 riv.
Docter 3-12x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 1 riv.
Kahles 2,5-10x50 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 1 riv.
Kahles 3-12x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 1 riv.
Karl Kaps 2,5-10x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 1 riv. 20.00: 1 riv.-
Leupold 4,4-14x50 17.00: 3 riv.-17.30: ei n�y 20.00: ei n�y
Meopta 3-12x50 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv.- 20.00: 1 riv.-
Meopta 3-12x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv.- 20.00: 2 riv.-
Schmidt&Bender 1,5-6x42 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 1 riv. 20.00: 1 riv.-
Schmidt&Bender 2,5-10x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 2 riv.-
Shirstone 4-12x56 17.00: 2 riv.-17.30: ei n�y 20.00: ei n�y
Swarovsik 2,5-10x42 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 1 riv.
Swarovski 2,5-10x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 2 riv.-
Zeiss 2,5-10x50 17.00: 2 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 2 riv.-
Zeiss 1-12x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 2 riv.-


The following info is for a different test. Tom B
From: LowLightHunter Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:55 pm

Ok, the test was conducted in the following conditions. 19 scopes with 56mm objective and illuminated rectile or red dot were chosen. A silhuette of a deer was placed out on a field abt 20 feet away from the testers. Then they waited for the sun to set. They looked through the scopes and when it was not possible to see the deer anymore, they put the scopes away.

Scopes tested were the following:
Barska Euro Pro 3-12x56IR
Docter Classic 3-12x56R
Docter Unipoint 3-12x56R
JahtiJakt 4-16x56
Kahles CBX 3-12x56L
Leupold VX-L 4,5-14x56
Luger PRO-NA 3-12x56
Meopta Meostar R1 3-12x56RD
Micro Dot 2,5-10x56
Night Force 3,5-15x56NF
Nikon Monarch E 2,5-10x56 SF M IL
Schmidt & Bender Zenith 2,5-10x56 FD LM
Swarovski 2,5-10x56 L LD
Vixen VF 2,5-10x56
Weaver Classic Extreme 2,5-10x56 SF
Zeiss Classic Diavari 3-12x56 T*
Zeiss Victory Diavari M 3-12x56 T*
Zeiss Victory Varipoint 3-12x56 T*
Zeiss Victory Diarange M 3-12x56 T*

At 4pm the deer was difficult to see the deer without a scope. Also at 4pm the first scope was put to the side. This was Barsk. The next seven in the order of how difficult to see were Luger, Vixwn JahtiJakt, Weaver, Leupold, Micro Dot and Nikon. All within 40minutes (4pm - 4:40pm).

With the rest of the scopes it was still possible to see the deer picture to be able to make a shot at it. The moon started to give some light, so the deer picutre was moved to a darker place. After that the scopes were put in an order by which it was hardest to see the picture and so on. The two scopes that fell out first were Meopta and Schmidt&Bender. The next two scopes were Kahles and Docter Classic It was still somewhat possible to see the outlines of the deer with Docter. The next two were Docter Unipoint and Zeiss Diarange. Zeiss Victory Varipoint was a bit better than the last two. Swarovski PVI-2 and Zeiss Classic Diavari were on the same level, a little better than the varipoint. The last scope on the table was the Zeiss Victory Diavari.

The test also included other parameters which I will not mention, simply because the test was 6 A4 pages and I am only interested in the low light performance. They also measured light transmission, which gave totally other results. But what counts in the end is what you see through the scope and not the measured numbers.

Please note that this is my translation of a test that was conducted in a Finnish hunting magazine last month. I do not take any responisbility of the outcome of the test itself.

To MrGman, the scopes that I would recommend is Meopta Meostar and Docter Classic. They are good low scopes for low light hunting at a reasonable price. The best you can get, if you are prepared to pay, is of course Zeiss Diavari, both victory series with loctec coating and the classic series. For daylight hunting only I would for sure chose another scope.

From: LowLightHunter Wed Apr 16, 2008 2:59 am
Sorry It should be 55 yards! They put the deer picture 55 yards out in the field. 55-110 yards is quite a normal distance for low light hunting on deer or wild boar.


I rearranged the data from the first test in the order of most to least Es seen at 8 PM. Tom B
Zeiss 3-12x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 2 riv.-
Zeiss 2,5-10x50 17.00: 2 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 2 riv.-
Swarovski 2,5-10x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 2 riv.-
Schmidt&Bender 2,5-10x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 2 riv.-
Meopta 3-12x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv.- 20.00: 2 riv.-
Swarovsik 2,5-10x42 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 1 riv.
Kahles 2,5-10x50 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 1 riv.
Kahles 3-12x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 1 riv.
Docter 2,5-10x48 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv.- 20.00: 1 riv.
Docter 3-12x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv. 20.00: 1 riv.
Schmidt&Bender 1,5-6x42 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 1 riv. 20.00: 1 riv.-
Meopta 3-12x50 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv.- 20.00: 1 riv.-
Karl Kaps 2,5-10x56 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 1 riv. 20.00: 1 riv.-
Bushnell 3-9x50 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 2 riv.- 20.00: ei n�y
Bushnell 2,5-10x50 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 1 riv.- 20.00: ei n�y
Burris 2,5-10x44 17.00: 3 riv. 17.30: 1 riv.- 20.00: ei n�y
Leupold 4,5-14x50 17.00: 3 riv.- 17.30: ei n�y 20.00: ei n�y
Shirstone 4-12x56 17.00: 2 riv.- 17.30: ei n�y 20.00: ei n�y

I changed the power numbers from 1x12 to 3x12 for the Zeiss, and from 4.4 to 4.5 for the Leupold. Tom B

Interesting results...If you consider that the best and worst scopes had very similar power range and both had 56mm objectives, I find it amazing that the Zeiss offered approx 2 1/2 hours more viewing time...

The other thing that struck me is that the Finn's obviously don't know how to focus a Leupold!

FU........................

Ah, yes. A test done by someone unknown using testing methods that aren't described and, guess what ? Leupold comes out on the bottom. And another expert telling us that light transmition numbers mean nothing.
I believe guys like Barsness who aren't impressed with tiny differences based on his experiences in the field. And we get to know just how he tested.
Then there is JJHack who says they all work, right down to the 32mm sizes. The biggest factor is being able to see the reticle. You don't need to see much of the target, but you do need to see the reticle. That after many years of hunting and killing all sorts of game at night.
Then there is my own expereince at night. According to this test, I didn't see that herd of elk, in the dark at 125 yds. and couldn't tell that one was a spike. That's because I was only using a 6X42 Leupold M8. E

I value guys experience who've been there, done that, with their own eyes......unlike idiots like E who regurgitate the same BS every other post.

Here ya go. Analyze the test results for us and explain the flaws in testing methods.

Results of Riflescope Testing

Here's a flaw - No Leupold was tested. I mean, if you want your test results to shame Leupold, doncha think it ought to include one as part of the test?

The testing methods were described. Try again.

That you don't like the outcome, doesn't change what they saw.

Try similar yourself, and prove or disprove the results.

No they weren't, at least not in the original post by JGRaider. For instance:

What day of the year were the tests performed? Were they done the same day as the posts from the tester, or at some other time?

At what what geographical location? For all we know, 5:00 PM in Finnland in January could be well after dusk. As in full on kid dark. If they can't see a deer without optics at 50m at 4:00 PM in April, then do you really need to be able to see an "E" at 100m at 5:00 PM in January? For hunting deer? In AMERICA?

What powers were the scopes set to? Were they all set to the same power? Were they all set to the lowest/highest power?

Seriously, what I'm getting from the test, is that if I want to poach deer at night, I best use a Zeiss.

Scott

Let's see the original article to see whether the methods were actually described.

Love it!

Did you notice that the tests were performed in a lab? Why would it matter what time of year/day/temp or if the stars were in proper alignment. No, I don't know the type or model of the light transmission device or the name of the impact testing device, but the point of the matter is all the scopes were tested equally so the results are what they are. It's not like they were tested with an agenda, it was an independent lab.

I edited my posts so you'd have an easier time comprehending to which of the tests my responses were directed. Or are you really telling me that LowLightHunter used a light transmission device to read the "E"s and see the deer at various times of the evening. Indoors. In a lab???

I have no problems with the other test, whose URL you published. Well, other than the fact that if you want to use an openly documented optics test to show just how bad Leupold scopes are, it would be nice if Leupold had a scope in the test...


Scott

My bad Scott, I provided the results to an older test. I think I have a link to these tests as well. The name of the firm that did the testing was Aerotech. If I can translate them, I'll post it.

These are the 2004 tests, Scott. No reason for you to be a smart azz as I was only trying to help. I should have known better.


Swedish magazine Vapentidningen no 6 / 2004 has printed a consumer lab testing for Copes rifles suitable for hunting at dusk / dawn.
Their conclusion is that the German/Austrian scopes are by far the best, but the leap from the cheaper US scopes are smaller today than it was at the last test 7 years ago. Their conclusion is that the Germanwings / Austrian scopes are by far the best, but the leap from the cheaper U.S. scopes are smaller today than it was at the last test 7 years ago.
Aerotech Telub lab did the scientific testing using spektrofotometers, broad spectral lamps and kolliminators. Aerotech Telub lab did the testing using scientific Spektrofotometer, broad spectral lamps and kolliminators.
The scopes were tested for field of sight, eye relief, "tube effect", ergonomy, click adjustment accuracy, impact change with change of magnification, sharpness and contrast, light transmission, reflexes, twilight performance. The scopes were tested for field of sight, eye relief, "tube effect", ergonomy, click adjustment accuracy, impact change with change of magnification, sharpness and contrast, light transmission, reflexes, twilight performance.
Here's a bit more on the test. Here's a bit more on the test. unfortunately the scope selection was somewhat limited. Unfortunately the selection was somewhat limited scope. And please not that the test was geared towards scopes for post hunting in dark autumn evenings. And please not that the test was geared towards post scopes for hunting in the dark autumn evenings.
The test and description of the test criterias runs over 10 typed pages, so there's a bit too much work to translate all of that and post them on this forum However, I will post the scoring scales. The test and description of the criteria's test runs over 10 typed pages, so there's a bit too much work to translate all of that and post them on this forum However, I will post the scoring scales.

Field of view at 100m Field of view at 100m
0-5m 0 points 0-5m 0 points
5-6m 1 point 5-6m 1 point
6-7m 2 points 6-7m 2 points
7m+ 3 points 7m + 3 points
Eye relief Eye relief
0-6cm 0 points 0-6cm 0 points
6-8cm 1 point 6-8cm 1 point
8-10 2 points 8-10 2 points
10+ 3 points 10 + 3 points
Tube effect Tube effect
Sight picture severly disturbed by tube effect at all magnifications: 0 points Sight picture tube severly disturbed by impact at all magnification: 0 points
Sight picture severly disturbed at lowest magnification, disturbed at highest: 1 point Sight picture severly disturbed at lowest magnification, disturbed at highest: 1 point
Sight picture distusturbed at all magnifications: 2 points Sight picture distusturbed at all magnification: 2 points
Sight picture disturbed only at lowest magnification: 3 points Sight picture disturbed only at lowest magnification: 3 points
Sight picture not disturbed: 4 points Sight picture not disturbed: 4 points
Ergonomy Ergonomy
Magnification ring turns smooth and even: 1 point Magnification ring turns smooth and even: 1 point
Possible to read magnification marking in the dark: 1 point Possible to read in the dark marking magnification: 1 point
Quick and smooth focusing: 1 point Quick and smooth focusing: 1 point
Possible to click scope without tools: 1 point Possible scope to click without tools: 1 point
Click adjustment easy to feel: 1 point Click adjustment easy to feel: 1 point
Good markings on all adjustments: 1 point Good markings on all adjustments: 1 point
Indication of scope center: 1 point Indication of scope center: 1 point
Sight adjustment Sight adjustment
Click adjustment deviation in percent Click adjustment in percentage deviation
100-50% 0 points 100-50% 0 points
50-20% 1 point 50-20% 1 point
20-5% 2 points 20.5% 2 points
5-1% 3 points 5.1% 3 points
0% 4 points 0% 4 points
Adjustment range at 100m Adjustment range at 100m
0-50cm 0 points 0-50cm 0 points
50-100cm 1 point 50-100cm 1 point
100-200cm 2 points 100-200cm 2 points
200-300cm 3 points 200-300cm 3 points
300cm+ 4 points 300cm + 4 points
Change of impact with magnification at 100m Change or impact with magnification at 100m
5cm+ 0 points 5cm + 0 points
5-1cm 1 point 5-1cm 1 point
1cm- 2points 1cm-2points
Nil 3points Nil 3points
Resolution and contrast Resolution and contrast
Field testing, can/cannot see various targets, details and colours under equal conditions and settings Field testing, can / can not see various targets, details and colors under equal conditions and settings
Resolution 0-10 points Resolution 0-10 points
Contrast 0-10 points Contrast 0-10 points
Anti reflex Anti reflex
Under equal conditions and settings with light source facing the objective Under equal conditions and settings with light source facing the objective
Lenses Lenses
Not able to see through scope: 0 points Not Able to see through scope: 0 points
Sight picture is white, difficult to aim: 1 point Sight picture is white, difficult to aim: 1 point
Sight picture is white, but aiming possible: 2 points Sight picture is white, but aiming possible: 2 points
Sight picture a little white: 3 points Sight picture a little white: 3 points
Sight picture good, but without contrast or colour: 4 points Good sight picture, but without contrast or color: 4 points
Sight picture not affected: 5 points Sight picture not affected: 5 points
Reticule Reticule
Not able to use the reticule: 0 points Not Able to Obtain reticule: 0 points
Severe shadows and reflexes on it: 1 point Severe shadows and reflexes on it: 1 point
Shadows and reflexes on it: 2 points Shadows and reflexes on it: 2 points
A little shiny: 3 points A little shiny: 3 points
Sharp but mis-coloured: 4 points Sharp but mis-colored: 4 points
Sharp and black: 5 points Sharp and black: 5 points
Light transmission at 500-550 nm (twilight light) Light transmission at 500-550 nm (light twilight)
Please note that scopes can transmit other wavelengt light better Please note that other scopes can transmit light better wavelengt

0-10% 0 points 0-10% 0 points
10-30% 1 point 10-30% 1 point
30-40% 2 points 30-40% 2 points
40-50% 3 points 40-50% 3 points
50-60% 4 points 50-60% 4 points
60-70% 5 points 60-70% 5 points
70-80% 6 points 70-80% 6 points
80-85% 7 points 80-85% 7 points
85-90% 8 points 85-90% 8 points
90-95% 9 points 90-95% 9 points
95-100% 10 points 95-100% 10 points

Twilight performance Twilight performance
Light were progressively reduced and scopes where excluded when it was no longer possible to determine target/crosshairs. Light scopes were progressively reduced and where excluded when it was no longer possible to determining target / crosshairs. Lighted reticules were not used. Lighted reticules were not used. Scopes where used at all magnifications. Scopes where used at all magnification. Scopes where scored 0 to 10 points according to how little light it was possible to use it in. Scopes where scored 0 to 10 points according to how little light it was possible to use it in.

Scopes tested: Scopes tested:
BSA big cat 3,5-10x42 BSA 3.5-10x42 big cat
Burris fullfield II 3,5-10x50 Burris Full field II 3.5-10x50
Bushnell elite 4200 2,5-10x40 Bushnell Elite 4200 2.5-10x40
Docter 3-12x56 Docter 3-12x56
Kahles cb 3-12x56 Kahless cb 3-12x56
Leupold XIII 3.5-10x50 Leupold 3.5-10x50 XIII
Meopta artemis 2000 3-12x50 Meopta Artemis 2000 3-12x50
Meopta artemis 3000 3-12x56 Meopta Artemis 3000 3-12x56
Micro Dot 2.5-10x56 Micro Dot 2.5-10x56
Nickel gerhardt 3-12x56 Gerhardt Nickel 3-12x56
Nightforce np1 3.5-15x56 NP1 Night Force 3.5-15x56
OXO ontario 3-9x56 OXO 3-9x56 ontario
Pecar 4-10x56 Pecar 4-10x56
S&B Zenith 2.5-10x56 S & B Zenith 2.5-10x56
S&B 2.5-10x56 B & S 2.5-10x56
Shirstone Gold 4-12x58 Shirstone Gold 4-12x58
Shirstone Gold 3-10x56 Shirstone Gold 3-10x56
Swarovski Habict 2.5-10x56 Habict Swarovski 2.5-10x56
Tasco Titan 3-12x52 Tasco Titan 3-12x52
Trijicon accupoint 2.5-10x56 Trijicon Battery Point 2.5-10x56
Zeiss diavari z 3-12x56 Z diavari Zeiss 3-12x56
Zeiss varipoint v 3-12x56 V 3-point range Zeiss 12x56
Zeiss diavari v 3-12x56 V 3-12x56 Zeiss diavari

A short summary of the results below. A short summary of the results below.
Scope name Scope name
B resolution (max 10) B resolution (max 10)
C colour & contrast (max 10) C & color contrast (max 10)
D anti-reflex (max 5+5) D anti-reflex (5 max 5)
E light transmission (max 10) E light transmission (max 10)
F twilight performance (max 10) F twilight performance (max 10)
G overall test result (including all test results, not just the ones I've printed. Max possible 7Cool G overall test result (including all test results, not just the ones I've printed. 7Cool Max possible

Remember, this is a lab test, not some testers subjective opinion. Remember, this is a lab test, not some testers subjective opinion.

BSA Big cat 3,5-10x: B3 C3 D5 E6 F3 G44 BSA Big Cat 3.5-10X: B3 C3 D5 E6 F3 G44
BURRIS FULLFIELD II 3,5-10X: B10 C7 D6 E9 F7 G58 Burris 3.5-10X FULL FIELD II: B10 C7 D6 E9 F7 G58
DOCTER 3-12X: B7 C8 D8 E8 F7 G60 DOCTER 3-12X: B7 C8 D8 E8 F7 G60
KAHLES CB 3-12: B6 C8 D8 E9 F8 G62 Kahless CB 3-12: B6 C8 D8 E9 F8 G62
LEUPOLD VXIII 3,5-10X:B7 C7 D8 E8 F6 G60 VXIII LEUPOLD 3.5-10X: B7 C7 D8 E8 F6 G60
MEOPTA ARTEMIS 3000 3-12X: B7 C7 D7 E7 F7 G57 Meopta ARTEMIS 3000 3-12X: B7 C7 D7 E7 F7 G57
MEOPTA ARTEMIS 2000 3-12X: B6 C7 D7 E7 F6 G55 Meopta ARTEMIS 2000 3-12X: B6 C7 D7 E7 F6 G55
MICRO DOT 2,3-10X: B7 C6 D7 E8 F7 G58 MICRO DOT 2.3-10X: B7 C6 D7 E8 F7 G58
NICKEL GERHARDT 3-12X: B9 C8 D8 E9 F9 G66 NICKEL GERHARDT 3-12X: B9 C8 D8 E9 F9 G66
NIGHTFORCE NP1 3,5-15X: B9 C6 D9 E8 F7 G60 NP1 NIGHT FORCE 3.5-15X: B9 C6 D9 E8 F7 G60
OXO ONTARIO 3-9X: B3 C3 D4 E6 F2 G39 ONTARIO OXO 3-9X: B3 C3 D4 E6 F2 G39
PECAR 4-10X: B5 C6 D6 E8 F5 G46 Pecar 4-10X: B5 C6 D6 E8 F5 G46
SCHMIDT UND BENDER ZENITH 2,5-10X: B7 C8 D9 E9 F9 G65 SCHMIDT UND BENDER ZENITH 2.5-10X: B7 C8 D9 E9 F9 G65
SCHMIDT UND BENDER 2,5-10X: B9 C8 D8 E9 F9 G66 SCHMIDT UND BENDER 2.5-10X: B9 C8 D8 E9 F9 G66
SHIRSTONE GOLD 4-12X: B5 C5 D5 E7 F5 G47 SHIRSTONE GOLD 4-12X: B5 C5 D5 E7 F5 G47
SWAROVSKI HABICT 3-12X: B9 C9 D8 E9 F10 G68 SWAROVSKI HABICT 3-12X: B9 C9 D8 E9 F10 G68
TASCO TITAN 3-12X: B5 C6 D6 E7 F4 G49 Tasco Titan 3-12X: B5 C6 D6 E7 F4 G49
TRIJICON ACCUPOINT 2,5-10X: B8 C6 D8 E9 F8 G64 TRIJICON BATTERY POINT 2.5-10X: B8 C6 D8 E9 F8 G64
ZEISS DIAVARI ZT 3-12X: B10 C10 D10 E9 F10 G72 ZEISS DIAVARI ZT 3-12X: B10 C10 D10 E9 F10 G72
ZEISS VARIPOINT V 3-12X: B9 C10 D10 E9 F9 G70 ZEISS VARI POINT V 3-12X: B9 C10 D10 E9 F9 G70
ZEISS DIAVARI V 3-12X: B10 C10 D10 E9 F10 G73 ZEISS DIAVARI V 3-12X: B10 C10 D10 E9 F10 G73

I knew the Zeiss 3-12x56 was/is the best variable low-light hunting scope on the planet (2nd only to the 72)....all I had to do was hunt with one to figure that out (after having hunted with MANY other brands and powers). No lab tests needed.

Could someone please start lecturing us about the eyebox and exit pupil of the Leupold, please??? Please???!!???!!!

What, you guys can't take it when someone starts injecting reality into the ozone in your world? Now I supppose Eremicus is going to lecture us that the Leupold's were out-of-focus and therefore it was not a valid test.

Thank you Roy, I could not read the the Finnish and German lab articles and did not get much out of them. VAnimrod, I will send you an email copy of the tests, in German, just give me your email address.

Gee E, your fame precedes you!

In the future, I'll try to post test results that aren't to upsetting for the frail.