Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Handguns What's wrong with the World's Finest Combat Handgun?

Nothing is wrong with the 1911, why?

I carried a Colt MK IV on duty for 5 years. It's a fine weapon, and the trigger can be adjusted and tuned by a gunsmith to a finely honed pull. I just didn't like the occasional malfunction that kept occurring. The 1911 platform was meant to rattle when you shook it (battlefield mud, sand, dirt, etc couldn't cause it to seize up, and it was designed to fire FMJ rounds. Everything else is adding to the original design, and in my view, was a malfunction waiting to happen. I could and still can clear a malfunction lickity-split. My agency sent me to a 2-week wheel-gun to auto transition course. We fired approximately 1500 rounds. We had to clear malfunctions that occurred on their own, but, even more difficult, we had to clear malfunctions set up by the instructors. They had us clearing malfunction blindfolded, reloading with one hand tied to your belt to simulate a wound, and on and on. We were ALL sick of shooting and mending cuts and abrasions to our hands (cops don't do much manual labor - our skin was soft...at the start). Afterward I had calluses on my hands that frequent shooters should have.

The bottom line for me was I wanted a firearm that would go BANG when I pulled the trigger. I lost confidence in my Colt. It had many trips to the gunsmith, but I just couldn't get all the bugs worked out.

So, I bought a Glock 20 and attended a neighboring department's transition course (MUCH shorter than the one my department sent me to - 500 rounds in 3 days). Their department was transitioning to Glock 22s. I attended the course and never looked back. I've had that same pistol now for almost 16 years, and every single time I pulled the trigger (except for sadistic instructor-induced malfunctions) my Glock 20 has gone BANG. Add that to the ergonomics I described earlier, and what else could I ask for? I still have my Colt, and shoot it on occasion...but I prefer my Glock.

There are several valid reasons for not liking Glocks, nothing twisted about it.
First, the plastic frame flexes with every shot. This flexing absorbs some recoil, but it does so at the expense of accuracy.
Second, with the possible exception of the G36, Glocks are stocky guns. Their width prevents many with short fingers from achieving a good finger purchase on the trigger.
Third, the grip angle is impossible for many to become accustomed to. Speaking personally, the grip angle transfers the bulk of recoil into the lower 1/2" of my hand, thus INCREASING rather than decreasing felt recoil.
Fourth, the Glock cannot be modified to become more ergonomic to the user-it either fits, or you deal with it.
Glock is an excellent example of what ingenious marketing can do. They set out to win police contracts, and from there to lead civilians to believe that theirs was THE pistol to have.
Brilliant. A friend of mine met Mr. Glock, and what he took away from the conversation was that the cost of manufacture of Glock pistols is literally pennies on the dollar, a fact which has made Mr. Glock very rich. It is a mistake to believe that ingenious business strategy = the best pistol in the world.
Glocks are reliable, but so is every other form of pistol. I find it interesting that so little press is made of Glock malfunctions, yet they do certainly occur.
Another friend of mine trusts their life to the Colt government model. This gun has rust, is filthy, and only gets cleaned via the dunk method, yet it feeds and fires everything in the magazine, and out shoots every plastic pistol its up against.
When we leave the hype and the advertising behind, we are left with the fact that the Glock is a reliable pistol, moderately accurate, with high magazine capacity. Its one size fits all, so if it fits you you can be happy, but if it doesn't, then you choose a better gun.

All's it would take would be a little rubber on the grips, that would seal the deal for me.

Amazing; yet another poor soul worried about the accuracy of a weapon that will be deployed at the maximum of 30 feet. ALL the major defensive pistol and revolvers are capable of hitting a man-size target in center mass at that distance. You�re confusing bench rest competition with defensive pistol craft.



That's incorrect. In fact, many, if not all of the models come with a choice of a slimmer grip now: such as a Model 20 or a Model 20S.




The grip transfers the large majority of the recoil straight back into the web between my thumb and trigger finger and the TOP half of my palm. You're the first person to ever tell me Glock's design caused more felt recoil. That polymer frame soaks up a tremendous amount of recoil.




That�s not correct. If you get on the web, and go to Glock Talk (just one example), you can find several companies that will modify the grip to better fit your hand.




What would you have them do? Set out to fail? Here Mr. Police Officer, I made a pistol, but I don't think you'll like it. If you feel like it can you adopt it for your department? Please, be realistic.




Gaston Glock must control the media.




You can make it fit you and there is no better hand gun.

What concessions?

That's really an Apples and Oranges comparison, but we can make do. What is the most important thing in any weapon being used for self-defense, police work or combat? I submit that the primary concern in any of the three uses I mentioned is reliability; that the firearm discharges a projectile when you pull the trigger...each and every time you pull the trigger. Your six-cylinder metaphor doesn't fit because for the most part, all the pistols and revolvers shoot the same ammo - the horsepower of the weapons are equal. There aren't any six-cylinders; they're all V-8s.

Just can't get warmed up about the look of the Glock. Don't know why, I've seen worse looking pistols.

Glock has certainly revolutionized the handgun world. Just look at how many of them are out there. I have only handled a few and just didn't care for them. 3 lb.DA? One thing I liked about the concept is the DA only. 3 lb would cancel that out?

Like a lot of other shallow types, the biggest drawback for me is that it looks like it came from E Germany. The utilitarian aspect appeals to tons of people and they are practical. I think the S & W M&P feels better.
Anyway... Ford or Chevy? John Deere or Case?
Bill

Yep, that Tyvek Fulcrum Trigger groups is a marvel in engineering. It should be...it cost enough...but it makes the Glock feel like a completely different firearm.

There are so many custom options available for the Glock it'll make your head spin. My $535.00 pistols are now $900.00 and $1300.00 (long slide and barrel) pistols, and I could easily invest more in customizing the grips. There's just so many after-market options available it's hard to choose without just buying them all.

Glock is a decent bullet launcher and is as reliable AS ANY OTHER WELL DESIGNED AND MANUFACTURED HANDGUN. No more - no less - period. Glock handguns do malfunction and occasionally suffer parts breakage like anything else on the market. The Glock design is very simple and very easy to maintain by simply plugging in new parts when others fail, so that is a plus. They do not fit everybody universally, but neither does any other semi-auto design. Personally I rate them right alongside other modern design semi-auto handguns. No better, no worse�

I've owned a lot of Glocks, but am down to one at the moment - a G19. It's the only Glock that really fits me. Glocks are what they are - a basic combat pistol that's near 100% reliable.

The downsides? The ergo's suck for alot of people and Glocks have no soul.

How about the staple gun trigger?

Are we discussing defensive or combat pistols?

If it's the latter, I'm not planning for being attacked by a B-27 silhouette target. I'm planning for taking the shot that presents itself - a foot sticking out behind a tree, an elbow, or half a face peeking through a second floor window. You tell me, for those shots do you want a Glock or a 1911?

Concessions: The Glock trigger (to safety), the oversize chamber and firing out of battery (to reliability).

If you have a 16-year old Glock, the frame has been revised at least twice to address problems and a number of internals have been changed.

About the time you switched to the G20, Kimber started the 1911 revolution. Most of the complaints you seem to have with production 1911's are really old news.

I have a half dozen or so 1911s, and I'd put any of them up against any Glock for reliability. Cannot say whether or not that would be true if I weren't allowed to lube them properly, or clean them after five hundred or so rounds, since I've never tried, but allowing lube and periodic cleaning, I have complete confidence in my 1911s.

The Glock claim to fame is its ability to shoot dry and dirty, but that's due to an intentional sloppiness in design which has drawbacks of its own.

I don't like Glocks due to problems with reloading for them. That simple.

guess I'm one of the lucky ones, I've had and used both.

cut my teeth on 1911's, still my very favoritest handgun.

also Rem 870 that I bought brand spankin new for $150


never liked the Glocks, till I bought one for the wife

then it was "hey, this ain't no 1911 but it's a serviceable firearm"


so end results, my faves are still the 1911 and my 870

but have had more Glocks and Mossbergs


why? I dote on my faves, the others are like BIC lighters to me, handy to have, inexpensive and they work.

plus if one of them got stolen or damaged, I'd never think twice about it, it'd wreck my day if my 870 or 1911 ended up missing or damaged.

as far as accuracy, buncha hooey for my "personal experience"

I can make shotgun boxes dance with either, it just doesn't seem that big a deal to me to adapt to the different ergonomics of each.


but I look cooler doing it with the 1911, cause well it's purty

the Glock looks like the girl no one wanted to date, but she knows she's ugly too, so she does try harder when she gets a turn.

they ain't cool, they ain't pretty, but they work and work well ime.

what's not to like

cain't everyone be the prom queen or a 1911

Spill your guts time? My only Glock is a G20, 10mm with an extra 9x25 Dillon barrel. I love that Glock. It fits my hand good. My three defense autos are a Steyr M9A1, a Chas Daly 1911 Compac .45, and a KelTec PA3T. I used to hate the Glock 17 and the Beretta 92. I have warmed up to a Glock 17, but it does not fit me near as well as the Steyr. I still believe that the Beretta 92 is not even close to the same level of the CZ 75, either in accuracy or dependability.

So...1ak, what's your choice for the World's Finest Combat Handgun?

I actually like Glocks too, they have a place in the scheme of things. I'm hung up on this threads title. If it was the World's Finest Combat Rifle I wouldn't nominate the Rem M760, although that would do in most cases.

there ain't a choice JOG at least not for the World's Finest Combat Handgun


it's the 1911 hands down

there's only one prom queen, all the rest are just second place, or miss congeniality etc.

why you ask questions you already know the answer to?