Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Africa Penetration on african plains game with the NP and the Swift-A-Frames

Thanks JB...forgot about that original issue stuff...mine was a "pre-caffiene" post...
Ingwe

Ingwe and JB,
Thanks for the correction, fellows.

I musta been having a brain cramp, I suppose.

The barrel was made with a 1 in 8 twist as I wanted to make sure it handled heavy bullets well. It also shoots everything down to 150 grs quite well and even shoots 32acp ammo thru an ACE adapter well at 25 yards to the same point of aim as the 220's at 100yds.
There is a reason the 30-06 is still so popular world wide. It is so versatile and if the shooter makes the effort to place the bullet correctly it will suffice for anything. I haven't given up on my 458 though.

Thanks,Phil!


BTW, sounds like a nice rifle.

The charge must have knocked the scope off of Phil's rifle. Wonder if he used turrets or dots at that range...

Holy Christ Phil!! His head is bigger than your whole torso!

I have killed Cape Buffalo with the 06 and the 180 gr. Noslers and solids of unknown heritage..I have seen a couple of elephant killed with shoulder shots and head shots, one with milsurp ammo..

I would never attempt to fault the 30-06 and as those who know me know, it is probably my favorite caliber or at least among my favorite calibers..Anyone that has used it to any extent will love it..

I have yet to stop a charge with a 30-06 and don't really want to be there because the 3.5 charges I have faced with cape buffalo I had big 40 calibers and my thoughts at the time were "why don't I use a bigger caliber like maybe 500 Nitro Express or a Bazooka" Charging cape buffalo and I'm sure big bear are an awesome sight to behold, and they get more awesome as they get closer, A buffs eyes are big as ornages and red and bloodshot when he wants to kill you..Jeeez he is awesome! But its a rush, no doubt about it, and those that tell me they don't want any part of it, and they are many, must not be true hunters IMO..I wouldn't instigate a charge from any animal but when it happens, there is just nothing like it in this world...Guess that's why some guys bungie jump, now thats some scary stuff...:)

Maybe it's a sickness, I dont't know, but its my sickness....:)

Hell Ray, I'll be the first to tell you that I don't want any part of it. Every time I have to I ask myself why - and vow to never let it happen again. Doing is nothing like reading about it.

Phil,

just as a curisosity how to you compare the penetration with the ole 220 grains core-lockt ???!!!

I don't know Phil, I've never killed a big Brownie (or any Brownie for that matter), just some nice blackies, and my paltry credentials fall far short of an expert, but no way I would ever consider an 06' for say a lion, much less that bulldozer with hair and claws in that picture you posted! I have a friend of mine who has hunted bear with the "Rosen somethings" (sorry can't recall the name) and he recommends the 416. Not being disagreable, just disagreeing with the 06 as a stopper. Cheers, jorge

For over fifty years the vast majority of Alaskan guides carried 30-06's for everything - including backup - and were happy with it. With today's bullets and the ability to load it heavier it is even better.
I know of a few African PH's with decades of experience who claim that they prefer their 30-06's ( one prefers it over has original 416 Rigby) for following wounded cats - both leopard and lions - as cats are so blazingly fast that they feel the nanosecond faster handling of a lighter 06 offsets the bit of extra power.

I certainly am not recommending that the 30-06 is the best stopper - but I have stopped a number of wounded bears besides this one over the past thirty years with my 30-06 and it works just fine so long as the bullets are correctly placed.
the point is that correct shot placement is the single most important factor in stopping anything and no amount of excess power, bullet weight or bore size will offset that.

Phil...I'm with 'ya...I wouldn't hesitate to use the '06 and 220 gr. combo on LOTS of stuff....
Don't have your level of experience, but I'd do it anyway...
Long ago my mother got used to hearing " That boy ain't right...."

Ingwe

Phil: I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. I know of no PH that prefers an 06 for following up lions and while Craig Boddington's two surveys done about 15 years apart, the 06 did't show up in that regard, but I don't for a moment doubt your word. Hell, if YOU say it works, it's good enough for me. We are in complete agreement on the shot placement issue, in fact Ganyana just has an article in the latest issue of the African Sporting Gazette where he tells of shooting buffalo with a 22 Hornet, almost all one shot kills. Having just been involved in the shooting of two buffalo, perfectly shot, I believe I'll pass on the Hornet. jorge

Reading an article makes me a national expert. Therefore I will chime in.

I read about an Alaskan guide who switched to the .458 Winchester. If I remember correctly he uses 350 soft noses. He said since he switched, he had to follow up on ten grizleys. He said it made no difference where he hit them or what angle, they all dropped at the shot. This includes animals that were comming at him or going away.

Kinda like shooting a squeek with a .22 rimfire.

I don't know who that guide was as I prefered the 500 gr Hornady bullets for many years, then after Finn Aagaard gave me a box of Jack Carter's new TB bullets I used them. I eventually tried and liked the 400 X as well as the 400 Swifts and Kodiaks.
I have stated that I have never had a bear stay on it's feet when I hit it well with my 458 - but even big bullets still have to be well placed.

Phil,
I wouldn't know I have never been charged by a bear...A Lion charge is the most fearsome thing I have encountered, and it totally wiped me out! wow! and wow again!...Hippo and buffalo are a maidens caress compared to a Lion and the evil in his eyes!

Ray, I'm sure that every animal and every situation is different but - if you can imagine a wounded, angry, vindictive animal nearly the size and tenacity of a buffalo, almost as quick as a cat, hiding in brush as dense as anything found along the Zambezi - then you'll have a good idea of what following a wounded bear is like.

It's not pretty and it's not fun and is why when a hunter tells me not to shoot their animal I tell them I have no intention of shooting their animal but if they do it poorly then it becomes my problem and I will shoot if I deem it necessary.

This was a very good,and informative thread.Thanks to all those who contributed.One of the better one's!

I particularly liked the very clear,and decisive descriptions of how the various bullets performed and what you can expect from them....free and clear of drivel and speculation.

Agree Bob. This is how multi experience folks with differing experiences should have a discussion.

We all benefit when ego's and deference to experience are the norm.

I was deer hunting in Maine last weekend and was doing so with my reworked cz 375 because it's the rifle I have this year. I had the barrel cut to 23" and it makes a marked difference in the way it feels in my hands. At any rate, to finish off the day I made a little push through an alder thicket that was probably 80 yards deep. Practically the whole way through I could think of nothing else but what it must be like to go through that or worse to weed out a wounded bear. I can tell you that 23" barrel felt mighty long right then. I was also thinking there would not be a whole lotta time to make a good shot if needed and how easily a bullet of any caliber could be deflected by verge. I can imagine how at close quarters like that good ammunition is worth its weight in gold since striking velocity must be quite close to muzzle velocity.