Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting All hail the wonderful and mighty .338 Winchester Magnum

Others opinions differ on the .308 bullet versus the .338 unless you consider an 8 year old Bull Elk tougher than an Alaskan Brown Bear.

Here are a few quotes from Phil Shoemaker.



Then there was John Barsness's earlier post here.




Enough quoting for one day.

Merry Christmas...Jayco

That was the very resoning behind my un-scientific experimentation.
And, note I never said the .308 diameters were not suitable for large game.
Heck, I think game is the worst "medium" for true scientific experimentation, for various reasons. One of which is game sometimes just does not want to die. But it is a great "medium" for filling freezers!

I know what I saw that day. The .338WM dominated in penetration.
I do not believe ANY caliber makes up for a poorly placed shot.

Your results may vary.

I feel that one of the biggest challenges about using game for tests is that darn few people shoot a lot of game (and I mean a Lot) and even fewer people shoot much in the way of Big Big game (ie elk, moose, big bruins and some big stuff cross the pond).

Not tough to find people who've shot a lot of deer, but hey what won't work on a deer if directed properly?

Lastly with game and bullets I've long said if you use a bullet long enough sooner or later it'll give you reason to go hmm...what was that all about.

Dober

[quote=logcutter]Others opinions differ on the .308 bullet versus the .338 unless you consider an 8 year old Bull Elk tougher than an Alaskan Brown Bear.

Here are a few quotes from Phil Shoemaker.

[quote]

There is not much difference in performance between a 220gr .308 Partition and a 250 gr .338 Partition.



As much as I like Phil and as much as he has endorsed Buffalo Bore Ammo, I still gotta disagree with that quote.

I hunted AK Brown Bear with Schoonover close to a dozen times, always holding out for 10+ foot bear. I got to know him real well and he probably has more AK Brown Bear kills under his belt than any human still alive (guided hunters on Browns for over 50 years and was killing them as a kid, before that) and he told me that he did not really like to see a hunter show up with an 06, but the 300 manums were OK as long as they had 180 NP bullets loaded into them. Back in those days the NP was the only "premium" hunting bullet around. Kenny said that if he ever decided to kill one last big bear for himself, he would use a 340 WBY with 250gr. NP's as he had observed it kill a number of bear and as a hunting (not guiding) cartridge, it was his favorite because of how it hammered the big bears.

Jayco, Do you live in ID county? Have you seen the Id County Sheriffs raffle called the "SSS wolf pack raffle"? I just bought 110 tickets, mostly to support the sheriff there. The prize is a Win. rifle in 308 and a short handled shovel, both of which are engraved Shoot Shovel and Shut Up and they come with a window mount, so you can hang both in the back of your truck. Funny, funny stuff.

I do Tim..6 Months in Grangeville(Winter) and 6 in Elk City infact,this was in the local paper last week and the family is who I help from time to time and speak of often.



There is no doubt the 338's are Elk killing machines but to what extent,I tend to disagree with some but that's hunting and experiences as they go.

Jayco

Bob...ain't no doubt when Bill Steigers speaks about hunting bullets, calibers and etc one better listen..he is the absolute authority on this subject...as you know Bill does not give a dang about marketing a product...if he did he would have sold out his BBC to Speer just like Jack did with his trophy bonded...and look what has happen to a great hunting bullet for reloading...ain't there no more...

OU: True enugh. He had numerous chances to sell BBC but refused because mass manufacturing methods of the time would have compromised his bullets.

Jack Carter tried to get Bill to mass manufacture;it was Bill's refusal to do so that caused Carter to create the TBBC.Some folks say Carter was the "father" of bonded core bullets but this is untrue.Steigers was the guy who set the standard.

Elk, Moose, Grizzly and Brown Bear ain't no telephone pole...

yep...ol' Bill made them the old fashion way...one at a time..and that is why I never got to use the 130s in my 270...Jack's TBBC were good bullets until he sold out and the mfg left Texas...Bill was/is one of a kind...if you give him a call...you better be prepared for the phone billl as he will give you an education...something that just ain't out there anymore...Art Mashburn told me Bill Steigers had forgot more about bullets and their performance than most experts ever knew...

Jayco,

Why are folks letting any wolves stay alive over there? With your governors latest position, Idahoans can kill wolves with impunity now.....I know a few who are. Seriously, you guys can kill all the wolves you want and no Idaho authority will even raise an eyebrow as per the governors instructions. The feds could still go after any perpatrator, but there is only one federal investigator for the entire state. I know him--he lives in Boise and he couldnt investigate his own butt with both hands. Idahoans have a free ride to kill all wolves. Wolves are no longer politically protected and are a political liability, now that the truth (a few of us knew from the beginning) is out.

I could care less about the 338 argument, it is only my opinion and if all I had was a 243, I'd still kill elk every year, I'd just have to wait for better shots, which might mean passing on some bigger bulls, but I'd still get it done.

I came to this dead horse late but who's got a whip I can borrow? Most know I built a 340 Wby up on the bemoaned M700 action back in the early 90's; it was Ross Seyfried's fault. I've killed more big game ( eleven or so bull elk, caribou, many deer) with it than any other cartridge but since then I've come to a couple of delusions, er conclusions:

1) Its a specialty cartridge, ideally suited for soft-skinned big and bigger game way out there which means it's ideal for elk, moose, etc., same as the .338 Win. Nothing new there. 2). It needs at least 8-8 1/2 lbs all up to keep it from knocking you off the hill which I've come to think is too much for me to want to carry up the hill any more where elk and moose live but the same is true of the .338. But, as Ross said of the .340, and he was right, "it hits like a .375 but flies like a .270, a bit more so than the .338. However, I believe maybe only 2%.., ok 10%, of hunters can develop a meaningful relationship with it without it ending in a divorce because while it hits like a .375 way out there, it's not as polite and courteous as the H&H on the shoulder. And in my view, neither is the.338.

2). I think the .340 is more difficult to drive without a doubt than a .375 H&H of similar weight even though that depends on many factors and is a very subjective thing. IMHO, the .375 is a a meshing of all the natural laws that govern men and nature and just may be one of the two best compromises in the world that is cartridges. I've taken eight species in Africa--not much by any account-- and a couple of elk and just fell in love with it and came to understand what has been written about it for so many years; in Africa, it's like a broad spectrum antibiotic--it will cover everything with judicous use. In our part of the world load a monolithic (ligher) spitzer and it's 400-yd flat. I've also shot my single smallest group ever (big game rifles) with a .375 at .38" for five shots with a TSX 270-gr rumbling along at a modest 2700. When it comes to it's bigger bretheren in the .375 family (I've had a .375 Mashburn [same as a 375 Wby] and have shot up to a 378 B--whew! no thanks), "less is more" and compared to most of the magnums below it-the 300s to the 338s, "the more of the .375 IS more.". I don't have one right now but if someone takes this 340 off my hands and I needed something over the 300's, it'd be the old H&H without a doubt or a second thought. Sorry, I'd pass over the .338 Win and go right to the older classic; its as easy or easier to shoot and gives up nothing in rifle weight or trajectory and can add bullet diameter and weight.

3). As Ross S. Stated after the advent of the original Barnes "X" and the Failsafe, there's been a great leveling of the playing field regarding the affectiveness of cartridges on game. Brad mentioned it too. Less IS much more than it was twenty years ago in the cartridge world which leads me to the other cartridge of superb balance, all things considered: the 30-06 with a 165-168 to 180-gr monolithic bullet out of say a 6.5 lb rifle all up (the rumor is I'll get it before I'm in wheel chair bound and someone is feeding me oatmeal, though I ordered it in April of last year). I can get it up the hill and kill an elk at 400 yds. with it, or beyond.

So, judge, in summation here, I agree that should a pox come upon me, ridding me of all my earthly marbles but leave me with one wit of good sense, I'd be happy the rest of my days with an '06 so described and and an H&H of my choice and live happily ever after.

Heck, I'm even happy now.

Good post

Excellent post there Goodnews and after using a 340 a lot as well my self totally concur with your statements! When it comes to shoulder bump the 375 is way more user friendly! Not saying that a 340 can't be worked with, IMO it just takes another level of commitment especially if the 340 is sub 8.5 lbs.

Dober

Ya think?

Honestly, Colorado elk taught me more about knives and lower back workouts than that pole taught me about the .338WM and Nosler's best.

Especially the lower back exercises..grin

Dober

Well said, gn.

So, I take it that the other one of the "two best compromises" is the 30-06???

Add a 180 Nozler and go forth and fill up a few arks!

Dober

All hail the Wonderful and Mighty 30-06 <g>!

Love that one too.

Now we are talking Jeff!!!!

To me, they are similarly "balanced" cartridges; very shootable, easy to load for, very accurate.

When I started this thread in '07 I was shooting my .338 a LOT and just reveling in the above properties. Of course, there are many Wonderful & Mighty cartridges. We are blessed that way!

I'll be giving my .338 a good burst of shootin' again here this spring, since I chopped the bastid shorter and so need to re-establish my come-ups (and confidence) at longer ranges with it. Can't wait!

With a rebarrel coming for my .325 the .338 will again become my elk "primary", likely backed up by my trusty ol' 30-06. Life is good!