Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Gunsmithing Mini mauser trigger

Just picked up a used lefty Charles Daly mini-mauser in .223. Neat little gun, blue and polish on the barrel is very nice. And it shoots pretty good so far. But the bolt throw is rough and bindy and the trigger needs some adjusting; it has a little creep. I don't have a manual for this rifle and haven't any experience with adjusting the trigger. The Timney replacement triggr is no longer available--they sold the last one a few weeks ago, dang it. I was hoping someone could point me to a manual and/or offer some tips on working on the trigger.

Thanks,
Ella

it adjusts like the standard mk x trigger from interarms.

That's very helpful. Thanks.

Ella

I have the same action on a 222 rem.

I don't like to give too much gunsmithing advice, mainly because I'm a hack, but that quoted 3.5 lbs is a guideline perhaps.



If you take apart the trigger, (take photos when you do it, so you can put it back together properly) and polish all the parts, my guess is you'll see it a wee lower..


I agree that all the workings are kind of rough, but a nice clean and polish on all the working parts (sans removing any appreciable material) will smooth things up considerably.

RWE,
I appreciate the advice. You can't tell me anything I already know. Am probably a few steps closer to "bubba" status than "hack."
This thing definately needs some TLC: bolt is downright hard to close and feeding at the moment is iffy. Free float, bedding (I notice that it's already got pillars), trigger and some polishing on the lugs I think is in the works.
I've heard they clean up nice. Yours looks great. What kinda groups you getting?

Ella

RWE is far from a "hack".

I suspected as much. All the more gratitude for the advice.

Va, don't you have one of these actions yourself? In researching campfire threads I vaguely recall comments of yours. Any thoughts or suggestions from your experience?

Ella

VA has one, but its right handed. 7.62x39 IIRC.


My last grouping was a 4" 5 shot group at 300 yards off the sandbag on the truck hood.

It's got a 22" Shaw barrel, "heavy-sporter" taper, 12 twist, 50gr Blitz's jammed into the lands (no throat). 22.2gr H322.

With the Burris FFII on it, I got the hash marks 'calibrated' at 100, 205, 332, and 425.

That 425 is spot on (within about 5-10 yards). Ask the last yote I saw on the neighbors property....

The carrier is finicky, and will definitely benefit from the cleaning. Other feeding issues may be caused by: your OAL, a lip between the mag box and the action opening, too much downward pressure on the bolt handle as you feed the bolt forward (it may angle up the bolt face), spring set in backwards or weak, keeping the carrier too low to get the next round up, or angled so that it can't hit the ramp.

It wants to be bedded. I slept with mine for a couple days before I realized it was whispering "bed me with epoxy." After I took care of that, it started behaving better.

I've got 2 of the 799's, Rem's version of the Mini Mauser. The first is a 7.62x39, the 2nd a .223.

Both were rough when I got them, both bolt travel and triggers. I adjusted the triggers per the above post and both came out great.

I filled the actions with Flitz and cycled a few hundred times. After a tear down and cleaning they are pretty smooth.

Due to the design the bolts will tend to bind if you don't work them briskly and don't give a lot of side or vertical pressure.

Both of mine are very accurate with several different loads.

RWE and Terry,
More thanks for the suggestions. And it's good to know the potential is there.

RWE, you were spot on about the feeding. The mag spring was in fact in backwards. The more I get into this, the more I see bubba has been here before me--the trigger weight screw has had its slot stripped, the mag box wasn't seated properly against the bottom metal and the long/short action screws were reversed. It's going to end up a double-bubba specialm .
One more question: Did you bed the whole action or just the lug?

Terry, I've heard of this method of smoothing an action, but I've always just gone w. a couple hundred rounds down the tube. Maybe this baby calls for more drastic action. But how do you remove the polish afterwards? Spray it down w. brake cleaner?

Thanks again,

Ella

I gots me a Harbor Freight parts washer with some safety solvent.

Trigger is adjusted and passed a couple "slam tests," seemed to come out well. Don't have a pull scale.

Didn't do much polishing on the action, am hoping that'll mostly work itself out. Test fed some rounds, no problems now.

Just put together the stock and action, am bedding the lug and the tang, will take it out in the morning and see. It always makes me a little tense. Haven't glued one together yet but....

Ella

Ask me how I knew. Go ahead. Ask me....




The whole action. Make sure you given enough clearance for the safety to move. May have to file some out afterward.

Well, bedding turned out nice, but I'm one step forward two steps back with feeding. It ran a bunch of dummy rounds slick as can be, then quit doing it. I've turned the spring around and upside down, tried shimming it a little to give the follower a different angle, stretched it out, gave a light polish to the feeding rails, everything I could think of. Sometimes it'll do a round or two but mostly it jams em into the rails or fails to pick em up, the bolt slides over 'em. My dummy rounds have the brass beat to heck at this point.

Would like to try a new spring but am not sure where to get one. The Reminington 799 part is the same as the 700 I think....

Going to take it to the range tomorrow and single feed it. Only two groups I shot with it, it put two under an inch and the third about 3 inches away. Both were almost perfectly horizontal lines, two different bullet weights. I'm figuring to have solved that issue at least.

sure looks similar. Not sure if its the same.



Midway has them for their 700 SA 223's.

I've got one coming from Brownells. We'll see. I've been tweaking and polishing. It'll feed first and third round; and if I give the cartridge just the slightest tap, it'll feed the 2nd round.

The shooting is kinda touchy. Maybe it's just the light rifle thing. Every load I tried (couple factory loads, couple of handloads, bullets from 45-62 grains) goes between 1-2" at 100 yards. The one load that did better, just under an inch had a coal .1" longer than an otherwise identical underperforming load. Hmmm.

Anyway, I very much appreciate the help. Will keep tweaking. I do find it a fun little rifle. Will have to go after the yotes once the feeding is a little more reliable.

Ella

Well, the spring don't fit--too wide, too long. Will do some trimming and see what happens. Thought I'd post that for the archives.

Ella

Try bending the tip of the magazine box out just a little in the side it's failing to feed from. I had that problem with 2 different CRF rifles; different brands. A little bending fixed it on both.

Good luck getting a magazine spring to fit. I had to beg & plead with Charles Daly to get one, and in the end the only reason they sent me one is because they were going belly-up. Remington never had Mini Mauser parts.

You will probably have to have the spring custom made, as it is unique to that firearm.

ShootDogs, preciate the thought. It's the receiver that the follower presses the rounds against, no mag lips. I've done a little polishing, but Bubba gets real nervous removing much metal from the receiver.

BarryC, yeah I've been unable to get an original. Sent an email to CZ but they told me the serial # wasn't in the range that they'd sell parts for; they're holding them for some other series.

Some more bending and a little more polishing on the follower, it'll feed three rounds from the mag. But not if I close the bolt on an empty chamber. Then the first round hangs up a little unless I give it a tap.

Is there some way to retemper/revive an old spring?

I'm still trying to find a good load. For about a dozen loads I've tried factory and handloads, it'll put two out of a three shot group together and the third an inch or two wide--45 grain factory H. v-max to 63 grain fmj handloads. (It does stablisze the 63 grainers.) It's a pretty constant pattern that's got me scratching my head. Every once in a while I get a teaser of a group with three rounds touching.

It's a neat little rifle though. Having fun messing with it while I have some free time.

Preciate all the help.

Ella

The 799 was only imported by Remington. The gun was made by Zastava and there are no parts interchangeable with Remington made guns.

USSG is the current Zastava importer, but they don't seem to carry the Mini Mauser.
http://www.ussginc.com/firearms.html

It would help if you remove the fake "extractor" from the bolt and polished inside of the collar and the groove the "extractor" collar turns in. I used 600 grit sandpaper and oil. Beware, the collar is held on with a truly tiny pin and it is difficult to take off and even harder to put back in.

While you can improve things with polishing, there is a limit. The Mini Mauser has to cock a firing spring that is as strong as any other bolt action, but it has a very short bolt handle so you don't get much leverage. So you can make it smoother, but it will always be heavy.

natman,
My understanding is that the 799 barreled actions are made by Zastava but are stocked in the US. Somewhere I read that the 799 mag spring was the same as the 700 but I can't confirm that this is true; it definately is not the same as the Charles Daly spring--but the 799 and the earlier C.D. mini-mauser seem to have some significant differences. I don't have access to a 799 so can't directly compare.

The action is actually smoothing up pretty good. May try your suggestion later on--I can tell the "extractor" is the source of some friction--but I'm happy enough with the bolt throw. If I could solve feeding and get it to shoot consistently, I'd be content.

Went back today and shot some 5 shot groups w. the same loads as before, logging which shots went where in what order. With all loads, including factory, I'm getting 2-4 holes tight together and 2-4 as far as 1-6"! off. No pattern as far as which shot goes where. Swapped scopes and checked bases, nothing there.

Will take the action out of the stock to recheck bedding etc. next....

Ella

Just acquired an Interarms Mark X Mini Mauser in 223 so these posts are useful to me.

Following RWE's instructions I was able to adjust the trigger to reduce pull weight, back lash and creep. Now it breaks nicely at about 2.5 lbs according to my very old trigger gauge. THANKS!

Question: When the safety is on is it supposed to lock the bolt? If I lift it twice it will open.

Sarco eComm has Interarms Mark X Mini Mauser stocks for sale. New ones are nearly $100.00 and "...nice take of stocks" are about $75. I've ordered a take off stock.

Reloading dies, brass, bullets, etc. are not here yet I haven't tested it for feeding or shot it.

When the action was first taken out of the stock it really was binding in the action area. It appears that the two small ears on the magazine box were not slipped inside of the action rails as there is a mark on the left rail where the ear touches it. After squeezing the magazine box a little the rifle does not bind nearly as much. A previous owner removed a lot of wood from the barrel channel so there is some slop around the front of the action and if the front screw is tightened hard it will bind.

Thanks for the information and help.

CKW,
Congratulations, neat little rifles aren't they?

My safety does not lock the bolt or come off with bolt operation--sounds like something's not right.

I removed a little more wood from the barrel channel of mine and bedded the bottom metal and torqued the screws to 45 inch lbs. It's now shooting consistently and putting a couple loads into cloverleafs. Feeding is still a little iffy though. If you find anywhere to buy a mag spring, please holler.

Ella

Ella, Figured out the trigger/bolt lock issue. Another screw adjusts that so now my bolt locks and the safety works better. A little creep came back with the latest adjustments but I'll work on that again sometime.

I tried to see if Sarco carried any other parts but the only thing that their search engine showed were the stocks. There was a note on their site saying they had bought out Interarms some years ago. You might call them because they state they have parts that are not listed on the internet but that you have to call about.

Wish my brass, etc. would come so I could make dummy rounds to see how it feeds.

Do you know how to remove the front sight? The sight is dove-tailed into the ramp so tight that it won't budge when I try to drive it out. It looks as if there is a cut of some sort in the barrel under the ramp but I'm not entirely certain of that.

They are interesting to tinker with; I'll cut down one of the stocks for small people (the length of pull is just over 14" on the stock that came with the rifle) and leave the other long. Both will be bedded and the barrel floated.

Hope mine shoots as well as yours.

Don't drive out the front sight, you will only peen it. Use a press & press it out.

I just went and looked at it. You have to press out the sight blade. Once you do that, a screw is revealed. Loosen that screw and that releases the sight base from the barrel dovetail.

Thanks BarryC, I wondered if a press was necessary (I don't have one) so a trip to the gunsmith seems in order -- if when I shoot the rifle it is sufficiently accurate. The sight may already be peened as it is kind of beat up, I was using a brass hammer and rod in my attempts so it wouldn't damage the metal further. The rear sight is missing and the front sight and ramp are TALL! This is why I'd like the front sight gone.

Ella, brass bullets and dies came today. Mine feeds pretty well, but the fourth round in the magazine often mis-feeds if it is not positioned just so. Three rounds in the magazine always feed fine in my testing to date. The base of the fourth round tends to set too low and the bolt either rides over it or just catches the rim making the angle of the cartridge too steep to feed properly. The magazine will hold five rounds and it feeds the first round fine but then the same problem with the fourth round often happens. Think I'll just put three in the magazine and call it good for this rifle.

CKW,
Thanks for the tip. I'll give them a ring. My Charles Daly version doesn't have sights.
If I could get three rounds to feed reliably, I'd be happy as a clam. Mine acts like yours only not just on the 4th round--I never know which round it's going to slide over or misangle; sometimes it's the first.

Let us know how it shoots.

Ella

Yeah, you can peen steel with a brass punch! Don't ask me how I know.

Just go to Harbor Freight and pick up a bench-top press. I think mine is rated for 1,000lbs or less. It's pretty cheap. That's all you need and you'll find lots of uses for it.

Just from my experience and conversations with other MM owners, the .223 MMs seem to be about 3/4 to 1 1/2 MOA shooters. Not benchrest, but certainly not bad for such a little dainty.

Mine is an Interarms import. It has a NATO-type chamber and a 12 twist barrel.

BarryC, thanks for the advice on the Mini Mauser front sight. I also appreciate insight you have shared along with others on this thread on these interesting little rifles. People with knowledge sharing information with those with no knowledge (e.g. me) are the what makes the Campfire great. Thanks again. If you don't mind I have another question.

What do you mean when it has a NATO-type chamber? Because mine also is an Interarms import presumably it has the same chamber and twist as yours. Are there any "watch-outs" with a NATO-type chamber such as is associated with military brass?

I've never loaded anything smaller than a 6mm Remington so the tiny cases, primers and bullets seem like toys. But this will be a good rifle to move grandkids from rim-fires to center-fires.

I went to Harbor Freight and bought an arbor press. Then dressed the edges of the front sight with a needle file where it was peened (either by me or a previous owner), applied the press and -- it never budged. The barrel would turn as pressure was applied to the sight at the top of a tall ramp; after several attempts at using lead wire, etc. to try and brace the ramp so it wouldn't move I gave up.

Then I resorted to plan B and brought out the favorite weapon of gun bubbas --- the fearsome, dangerous and dreaded DREMEL!!! Using a cut-off wheel the front sight was cut in half and the rest was easy. The ramp had to come off because the front ramp was loose when I got the rifle.

Shooting will have to wait until I bed both of the stocks and I'm waiting until the one from Sarco comes before starting. If it will shoot under 1.5" with me shooting it; I'll be happy as my skill level usually runs 1.5-3.0" with most rifles.

Thanks again, Clint

It's a versatile chamber and you can shoot any commercial or military 223/5.56. It's the same chamber you'll find in an M-16.

However, the twist is too slow for 62gr "SS109" type ammo and it keyholes. My rifle really likes Sierra 52/53gr HP match & Hornady 50/55gr SX bullets. Someday I'd like to try some 40 & 45gr bullets in it.



Was I wrong about the attachment method? Did I overlook something? Maybe I pulled the wrong sight out of the drawer.

Anyway, glad you got it off. A loose sight is more useless than no sight.

Have fun with it!

I reworked these small action starting in the 1980's. Here are a few things to know about these Mini Mausers. The first actions seem to be better to rework. They need to be smoothed up all over inside and out. I have changed the bolt shroud and made new safeties. The 98 triggers can be fitted up by someone that understands how it must function to be safe. The feeding problem is the hardest part to get correct. When working the bolt handle don't force forward as it will bind up. Relax the hand and it will work fine.

I am retired now and my last rifle is posted over on:
http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/9411043/m/4711078031

James Anderson, Gunmaker, has used some of my ideas on the small actions. He has made new machined trigger guards and new bolt handles. I met James in 1992 when he was in TSJC summer school. Look him up and find some of the actions and rifles he has made on these little actions.

If you don't like birdseye maple here is an English Walnut stock. This little rifle was the one I had in 1992 and we shot lots of PD's in Colorado out to 300 yds with the 17 Rem. It only weighted in at 6 1/4 lbs.

Les,
Can you make mag springs for the Mini?

BerryC

What is the problem with the spring? I could have made the spring and reheattreated the old ones when I was working. I don't take in work since I retired. If the back of the case is not getting into the bolt face it could be the spring has too much forward tension. The area to bend would be the bottom section of the spring. Then check for the forward lift of the bullet to see if it will raise up into the chamber. If you have too much of an angle the spring may need to be bent to one side. Savage may have a spring for their short action that may work in a Mini Mauser. Take it to someone that can adjust it for you.

James Anderson could help with the feeding problem.

BarryC, thanks for the information on the NATO chamber. Your instructions on the ramp removal were spot on, I just couldn't get the sight to move in the dovetail in the ramp even with a press (at least with me running it). Thanks again for your help.

LGB, WOW!!. Beautiful work by a true master of his craft. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

Les,
The problem with the magazine springs is that if one breaks, you can't get a replacement. I finally got one when Charles Daly went out of business, but no other spring that I know of fits and no one has parts.

Oh hurray, there is another human being on the planet with a left hand mini-mauser!
this guy here http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=93866 says EAA is supplying parts for the mini-mauser these days. He got an extractor from them.

My charles daly lefty mini shoots great but has been a bit of a problem child. The mag follower would hang up, the action was incredibly stiff etc. Sorted out the follower issue, and I actually ended up pulling the firing pin spring and turning it way down on a belt sander to help with the closing. That helped a lot. It was way overpowered.

Getting is scoped was a trick too. The bolt handle kept hitting the rear ocular and the weaver mounts didn't fit the contour of the receiver right. I finally went with warne mounts and very high rings. Scope's too high, but the action works now.

I only have 1 last issue to sort out: the extractor. most, but not all the time, when I close the action I can feel the extractor being forced over the case rim, and it shaves off a small sliver of brass. That can't be right. I shoot mostly range brass reloads, but it also does it with several types of factory ammo. Do any of you guys have a solution for me? I"m not a gunsmith, I just tinker.

It seems to like the 50 grn bullets and varget better than any other combination I have tried yet, though it did pretty well with ramshot x-terminator. 50's definitely work better than 55's in my particular gun.

Greyling:

Ed Lapour, notable gunsmith in Washington state can work on your Mini-Mauser extractor problem (he replaced mine - it was an old styler [non-Sako-type]. Zastava now has gone to a Sako type extractor.

Anyway, Mr. Lapour knows his stuff if you really want it fixed.

FYI, some of these rifles (.223) just shine with the Winchester White Box, bulk pack 45 grn. hp load. For my every day load I use a lot of the Academy/ Monarch 55gr. sp. load. I bought a bunch of it, on sale about 6 years ago.

I used Weaver bases/ rings/ low. Using Weaver K 6 scopes (small ocular) and ,"dished" the bolt handle and reblued.

I have found that if I open the bolt with my pinky and close with the base of my thumb these little rifles feed very well.

Overall I use the 7.62x39 more than any other firearm I own. Under 150 yards, lethal on deer and hogs.

I have several loads for it from 110gr. to 130gr. bullets, all soft points. However, it shoots Winchester 123gr. sp.'s as well as anything else. I bought another case of them at a gun show this weekend.

I have the sako style extractor.

I may need to send it off, but I just get the feeling that all I need is to modify the extractor a bit with a dremel tool or file. (and my gun budget for the year is pretty much tapped out)

Good luck on that, if you screw it up a replacement can be found.

My old style was screwed up before I bought the un-barrelled Charles Daly action in 96' (I didn't know it).A custom, machined replacement was found by Mr. Lapour and the guy who made it did not give it away.

So, go for the fix on yours.

Terry:

Mine is in .223 and I have been so busy shooting groundhogs with it that I have not determined which brand/weight is the best bullet.

I sighted it in around 2009 and it shot a .4 inch group (3 shots and Douglas #3 , 22 inch barrel) with some el cheapo UMC factory ammo I purchased 10 years before when the project started.

So I have been reloading/hunting ever since;I use Ramshot Xterminator powder, Horn. 50/55gr SXSP, Sierra 40gr., some Vmaxs. Targets are the groundhogs. Maybe this winter I will compare loads.

Very happy with it

Hate to hijack this thread, but I picked up a Zastava Mauser that has an adjustable trigger (Looks to be the same as the one in the diagram in the first page of this thread). When you pull the trigger the firing pin falls, and then the bolt locks up. If you hold the trigger down you can then open the bolt. I've got it out of the stock and can see the bottom of the sear coming into contact with the top of the trigger (through the little hole in the side of the trigger mechanism). Pulling the trigger allows the sear to move as the bolt is opened. Is there an adjustment for this? Any help would be appreciated!

Ok, so I've been studying this trigger. It seems that after the firing pin falls, the top of the sear is being allowed to raise up too far into the indention on the bottom of the cocking piece. This is allowing the sear to reset on the trigger and causing the bolt to lock when opening. The cocking piece doesn't appear to have been altered in any way. Unless I'm missing something it appears like the only solution is going to be changing the cocking piece. Any input?

Talking to myself here (my wife would say that's nothing new) but I think someone swapped out the cocking piece on this rifle. I took the bolt out of another Mark X I have and it's cocking piece is flat across the bottom. This one is indented, I'm assuming for a two stage trigger. Can I be safe in presuming that replacing this one with a flat bottom one would fix my issue?

I'll open the safe in the morning and look at mine I have not been near the triggers for a while.

Pulled the cocking piece from my other rifle and dropped it into this one. Worked like a charm. Now to order a new cocking piece. Why is it that some people... oh nevermind!

I have three of these little devils all left hand. The first is a 221 fireball no problems at all and shoots just fine.

Second is a 6.5 Grendel. Five years in the making. More issues than I have ever seen. Anderson had it last and it feeds right now and seems to shoot very well.

Third will be a 6x45 when I have the money. Found a factory stock that was a burgundy color. Stripped that puppy down and it is a very nice looking piece of wood.

I have a couple of extra extractors if someone needs one.

I am in the process of having two of the rifles fitted with new bolt handles as with my bear paws I just don't like them.

I will take on the trigger in the morning if I can find that drawing in a much larger size:)

tag

Timney for the Mini Mauser:

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/29...ni-mauser-with-safety-1-1-2-to-4-lb-blue