Home Forums Birds & Dogs Shotguns Benelli Vinci vs Beretta A391 Xtrema

Just got back from gun store. They told me the Shot guns with "Inline Inertia Driven" actions kick harder then gas auto loaders ? I was looking at the Benelli Vinci and the Beretta A 391 Xtrema. Why would some one want one over the other ? salesmen said the Beretta's recoil is smooth and the Benelli will pound you.

Never owned a Beretta, but it is a gas gun and will kick equivalently to any other gas gun of the same weight, firing the same load. I traded for a Benelli M2 last fall, used it for waterfowl and did quite a bit of patterning with it shooting 12 gauge 3" MAG loads. My only comparison is with my Browning BPS (pump gun) shooting 3" MAG 2 oz. turkey loads through XF chokes. My impression was that the Benelli was a very light recoiler compared to the BPS (not apples to apples). Overall I would say my shoulder is not discerning enough to tell the difference between the same 12 gauge, 3" MAG load shot in a gas operated semi vs. an inertia operated semi - I think gun fit would factor in much greater as to how it feels.

391= smooth less recoil but have to clean

Benelli= more recoil and muzzle jump, hard to not make it cycle and never have to clean it.

PS The only waterfowl load that kicked as hard as a turkey load was the Remington Hyper Velocity stuff. My duck hunting pardner gave me a few to pattern, they hit my shoulder hard. He hunts with a Beretta Extrema II and said they kicked the crap out of him, but they worked good enough to put up with the additional recoil. I patterned them - worse of any similar load I patterned in the Benelli M2.

The comfortech stock on the Benelli works for me. I have an M2, which seems to recoil lightly for its low weight (6.75 pounds). Have shot a Vinci and it was the same. For hunting, I like the Benelli, but for target (sporting clays), I prefer the 391, which has a little more weight in target versions.

I shoot a M1 for ducks and sporting clays. I personally don't shoot heavy loads for any game or reason. I don't believe a heavy load is giving the hunter/shooter an upper hand. When I see 3-1/2" 12ga I just laugh. The Benelli M1 just plain works.

The store gave you an easy answer to a complicated question.

I think the softest shooting 12g semi is the Beretta Xplor now. For the weight of the gun, its is soft shooting, no matter what load you cycle. It's the 3 1/2" chamber model, original. It has a recoil system in the stock from the factory, gas operated action, and the forcing cone is less restricted.

Beretta's get internally grimmy, they are a gas operated recoil gun. Benelli is a recoil operated system, shoot it forever and just worry about inside the barrel.

The equation is gun fit to shooter, weight of the gun, and ammunition (load) plus all the techie stuff, recoil system and forcing cone restriction. The key is fit to the shooter. Bad fitting gun, more felt recoil, no matter what gun. Most of the US market guns are made for the average size right hand shooter.

All the above, a Stoeger M2000 synthetic with a few ounces of lead in the buttstock and a limbsaver recoil pad swapped in, shoots with about the same felt recoil of the Beretta Xplor using heavy dove loads and target loads.

Start with what fits you best, LOP, sight alignment, and cheek mount. If your walking around a half day or full day with the shotgun weight will matter after the first day. Sitting in a duck blind, weight is less of a factor.

Gun fit goes without saying. Seeing that the Benelli and Beretta are next to the same size wise standard fit is pretty much a wash. I find it funny that people actually fall for the guns are made to fit the average size right hand shooter. What is the average size of an American man (is this white man? of what decent?)? What is the average sleeve lenght? What is the average chest size? what is the average neck lenght? way to many veriables to say average. Everyone that really wants to shoot a shotgun well should be fitted by a good fitter.

No my answer would be from years of field and tournament experiance. You can over complicate it all you want. The bottomline is the 391 has less felt recoil and muzzle jump then the Benelli. The Beretta 391 needs to be cleaned regularly, the benelli does not need to be cleaned.

I'm 6'-4" and left-handed and was able to fit a Benelli Ultralight perfectly using the shim kit that came with the shotgun.

I think the difference in recoil between gas and recoil operated is negligible and mostly caused by the weight difference - recoil operated is always lighter. The lightweight of the Benelli is the attraction for me, and the simplicity is a welcome bonus. The shotgun can be taken down to parts in less than a minute.

The Vinci fits me great but I hate the safety in front of the trigger guard, they made the trigger guard extra big for glove shooters and my short stubby index finger doesn't comfortable get to the safety, if the safety was in the back of the trigger guard I would own one. On the vinci because of the pistol grip the trigger guard also really smacks your trigger hand, but they redesigned that on the new super vinci.

To me The Extrema 2 is to barrel heavy and just didn't fit me right, but it is a great quality gun if it fits you, with the kick off system you can shoot anything and recoil is managable.

Gas guns can be tough in cold weather, but not if they are clean and dry.

You must be 6'4" with allagator arms then because the shims don't do much in lenght of pull. Or you think that the gun fits you, but in reality it doesn't. I am all of 6'4" and have about a 2" spacer between the stock and pad. Not to mention having to raise the comb height too. I won't even get into cast! Anyways if it works for you that is great.

Beretta 391 looks like the one for me. Don't need to shoot 3 1/2 shells.

Nobody needs to shoot 3-1/2 12ga shells. Why anyone would even want to is beyond me.

M2..

The M1 and M2 are 3" guns the SBE is the 3-1/2" gun

Personally, I don't think you can compare a 6 something pound inertia gun to a 8 pound autoloader accuratly. As far as I am concerned, they have different uses for me. I own a vinci, and like said above, when I first bought it, the safety location bothered me. All that had to do with is because every other shotgun I owned had it behind the trigger and my Moss. 410 has it on top, of course. I just wasn't use to it, and now I am and it feels as natural as any of the others. I have full intentions of buying an extrema 2 as soon as I can justify spending 1000 dollars on a shotgun again. They have different uses for me. As far as the duck hunting I do, well, lets just say I took my uncle out for a day last year, and he is also an avid duck hunter. That night he called my mom and told her that her son is "extreme." I put on a lot of miles in my waders, if ducks aren't where I am, I go find them. This means I am lugging my shotgun around, and the last thing I would want to do is lug around a 8 pound Berretta, but my vinci is absolutly irreplacable for this. It is the PERFECT duck gun, for ME. Now I goose hunt in fields, and I want a 3.5 inch autoloader that has some weight behind it. It just makes sense, I am not lugging that shotgun around all day. I am in one place shooting 3.5in shells, so the heavy beretta autoloader works in that scenerio and is PERFECT for ME. The felt recoil of the new A400 exploror is going to be more than the Xtrema, not from my experience, but it has to. It is lighter, and wieght makes a heck of a lot more difference than the difference between two gas-autoloading actions. This is long, but it just shows how the two shotguns you asked about have different uses and whichever fits your hunting style, use it. They are both quality shotguns, and they both have their pluses and negatives. My benelli kicks, it really does. I use the remington hypersonic loads, and they kick, but they also flat whack ducks. I went from using black cloud to that stuff, and crimples went way down. So to answer your original question, yes, the benelli will kick more, because of the inertia system and the low weight. The beretta will kick less because it is heavier and it is a gas-autoloader. Buy the one that fits your style, or more importantly, fits you,

i am a really big fan of my Vinci 12! i sold an 1187 and a 1300 to get it and i am hammering doves,pheasants,turkey,ducks and geese unlike i have ever done before! it cycles the lightest to the heaviest and i love it!
it brought my shotgunning back to life and my 2 labs don't have to come home and tell my wife that all they did was watch me miss them again.they are getting their exercize and eating up all their food.

I see alot more extrema 2 ejector repairs, and with the new xplor400 it also has the same bs system. I havnt seen many vinci shotguns. I have had to reassemble a couple Bc customer couldn't get back together properly. I'm not really a fan yet. I'm still having fun with my SBE 2. I have always told my customers the xtrema is a rice blind gun, The benelli is a Workin mans gun.
The benelli being lighter and has a more slender ergo. Than the xtrema. Making it easier to tote all day. The extrema has less felt recoil bt also feels like Ur shooting an old A 5 with the kickoff system, the xplor400 seams to be hot on the market. I have no attachment to this gun at all. It is an extrema with a lighter smaller(more vulnerable) piston and piston ring. Also they have cut away any so say extra metal, to make this lightweight 3.5 inch gun. Needless to say it kicks more. The weight alone makes this true. Also with the failure to redesign the largest flaw the xtrema has, the 400 is bound to be found this season on the rack w broken ejector stop pins, which are junk roll pins that break. And every parts supplier will be out of during the season. FAIL.

I like them both. I bought an A390 16 years ago and absolutely love the shotgun. Dad recently picked up the Benelli M2 and although id differs in recoil, I wouldnt say it is any better or worse. I prefer my beretta because I am used to it. I can use the M2 back to back with no issue. dont think there is any wrong answer here. Dad went with the benelli mainly because it came in a left-handed version.

I want the Vinci but I'm trying to decide on the original vs the newer Super Vinci.
Does anyone have a link to or know what the specs are on each for comparison?
I'm not ready to buy yet, but I'd like have the info to plan on.

Thanks,
Jeff

Have you thought about going to the Benelli website and looking? Seems logical and simple enough...

For what it's worth. Brand new to the shotgun world. After researching and speaking with some friends decided on the Benelli Vinci. Felt the best, liked the weight and even though I'm meticulous about cleaning my firearms, it's an easier break down and cleaning job.
Only shot about 30 shells in my life until yesterday when we took it out to break it in. Shot over 350 shells. I'm a small guy, 6 ft only 180 lbs but broad shoulders. The only thing sore this morning is my back from leaning over to grab more shells. Shot mostly trap shells, but did shoot 4 boxes of field loads as well, 2 boxes of 2 3/4 Win. #4 steel and 2 boxes of 3 in Win #4 steel.
A friend on mine has the Baretta 391 and I shot one round with it. But I really couldn't notice a difference in the recoil. If pressed, I'd have to say the Berretta was a little lighter in the kicking department, but just doesn't feel as good in my hands. Go by what feels better.

Inline Inertia Driven shotguns have a lot of recoil, I had a Benelli and it also jammed after 10 boxes of shells on the dove field. The Benelli also turned my shoulder green from recoil(T shirt only as clothing).

I now have beretta 391 and it is a pussy cat compared to the recoil of the benelli.

Guess what guns they provide to shooters in Argentina when shooting Doves???? Answer, Beretta 390's and 391's in 20 ga.
You can forget about the Beretta's having to be cleaned often.

Krueger, if you shot the Benelli first, then the Beretta, your shoulder was sensitve from that hard kicker. Next time, shoot the beretta first, then the Benelli...it rock your world.

In an inerta driven shotgun, the only thing that absorbs recoil is a rubber bushing on the back of the bolt and in the rear of the action, the rest of the recoil goes to your shoulder.

I'll eat a rat before I own another Benelli anything, kicking bastards! Of course, after you put down $1200+ on a shotgun, it is hard to admit you just got the schitt kicked out of you.

I shoot my Beretta in Sporting Clays, some loads run hot. It is easier to recover for 2nd and 3rd shots with a shotgun that kicks less, Clay targets and live game.

My coyote loads run 1 5/8 oz of #4 Buckshot at 1300 fps, this load really tells if a shotgun is helping you out in recoil. My Benelli felt like a Rem 870 in recoil, while there was a noticable difference in Recoil reduction between the Benelli and a Remington 1100 and Remington 11-87 and even less recoil in the Beretta 390 and 391. Even a Browning Gold had much less recoil than the Benelli.

If you are even the least recoil sensitive, shoot heavy loads in light clothing, looking for fast recovery time for follow up shots, get a gas operated shotgun.

I shot a the new Rem gas operated auto last Sunday and it has very little recoil, also. The new Rem gas auto has a totally different gas design than the 1100, 11-87, and Beretta.

Isn't it interesting how we all perceive recoil? I have two Benelli M1S90's and my son has a Vinci and neither one of us consider them "kickers." I've owned Beretta, Browning, Franchi, Remington, and Winchester semi-auto's to compare and the Benelli doesn't bother me one bit. My son just got rid of a jamming Winchester SX3 for his Vinci and is glad to be rid of the SX3. My coyote load is 1 1/2 ounces of tungsten BB's at 1,350 fps. I've patterned hundreds of heavy magnum coyote and/or turkey loads through my M1's and never payed it much mind. We just did the same for his Vinci and quite honestly I think it recoils a bit more than my old M1S90. He says he can't tell any difference between them.

MOCG, I think it depends on how you came to the inertia guns. I shot Winchester M1300 and Browning BPS pump actions for years using assorted 12 gauge, 3" magnum loads (for waterfowl and turkey). When I switched to a Benelli M-2 last season I could tell I was getting far less recoil on my shoulder than I got with the pump guns. If I had started with 12 gauge gas guns, shooting the same ammo, I may feel that I was getting more recoil from the inertia gun - I believe it is all relative to what you consider recoil to normally feel like. Odessa

In an inerta driven shotgun, the only thing that absorbs recoil is a rubber bushing on the back of the bolt and in the rear of the action, the rest of the recoil goes to your shoulder.


Huh? I dont think u know what u are talking about. There is no rubber anything on the bolt of any benelli. The recoil absorption is found on the stock of the
Sbe2. There is a buffer like system on the action spring plunger that protects the plunger and action tube when shooting heavy 3.5 loads. This is not a recoil reduction system. The first sbe's did not have a recoil management system.

HuntingSmith, the shotgun that I had was a SBE.

I'm always willing to try something new. How does the SBE2 alter the recoil compared to the same weight gun in a pump or over and under?

Keith sorry but you have no clue. Nothing rubber on the bolt of any of the three M1's I have and shoot. Beretta's in Argentina? well that would really depend on the outfit. I have seen more Beretta's used in Mexico then I have in Argentina. Both are great guns with +/-'s. You make me wonder how I ever made AA class in sporting clays shooting a Benelli M1. I have over 50,000 rounds thru one of mine and the only jams I have ever had was from very light loads that failed to eject.

I think Tom Knapp put 450,000 plus documented rounds through one single Benelli M1 with no parts breakages or malfunctions. It is in the Benelli main offices on display. That's a pretty tough track record to beat. Neither one of my M1S90's have ever bobbled even when hot, cold, dry, wet, covered in mud, ice or snow, clean or dirty. Gives me confidence...

keith,
Even given equal weights the slowing of the recoil impulse from the semi-auto is going to alter the perception of the recoil. Recoil doesn't feel like a "jab" or "jolt" (as when firing a fixed breech gun) and is more of a "push" instead. Granted, the lightweight inertia guns probably do recoil more sharply than a heavy weight gas gun like an M1100. To me personally my M1's recoil is more pleasant than my near same weight 870's and hunting model Beretta O/U's. I do like the Beretta semi-auto's too and if not shooting a Benelli I could be happy with one of the Beretta guns.

Bottom line for me, SBE 12ga turned my arm green from bruising, then I shot left handed for 5 boxes, that arm turned green from bruising also....walmart dove loads.

I am only comenting on the SBE-I.

I also do not shoot pumps anymore and sold my expensive over and unders. The slow push of the gas operated guns is what I need. Sharp recoil will eventually make me start jerking the trigger and lifting my head off the stock.

Most of the time I am shooting a lot of shot shells, I am wearing a very thin shirt.

I never had an issue with the Beretta's jamming, nor the Browning Gold for that matter.

To me, Inertia recoil system = heavy felt recoil.

You never forget a shotgun turning your arm green from dove loads....never.

That sounds more like a bad fit then heavy recoil. If it beat you up that bad you didn't have the buttpad in tight in the arm pocket. But if it makes you feel better go right ahead and blame the gun.

Keith
For what it's worth, if you read my post I said that the barrette didn't kick as much as the benelli.
Anybody out there have an opinion on "slug guns".....

I have a slug barrel for the M1. No complaints with it.

Is that rifled?

yes

I've shot 1100's for years and like the way they feel and shoot. I have an M2 Benelli and like it a lot. I've handled the new Beretta A400 Xplor and IMHO, it is the finest shotgun of its type. Just wish I owned one, but they're a bit pricey at $1,600 or so. And there aren't any used ones that I've seen. Guess I gotta wait that one out...

DF

No there aren't any used and for that matter many that have been delievered yet. I know several people that ordered theirs many months ago and are still waiting. Beretta claims they are starting to come in now. Personally I do not care for the A400 but I do like the 391.

I'm currious why you like the 391 better than the 400. They both handle very well. I just liked the way the 400 felt and looked. From what they say, it seems to be state of the art. I Guess time will tell on that.

DF

Felt recoil has nothing to do w reliability. Dont get me started on browning golds. Can't compare an old sbe to a new 390 series. Gas and inertia really can't be compared in felt recoil. Gas wins everytime. Bt the reliability dept. Goes towards the inertia. Just a more simple,shorter and more direct action. Beretta on the range.. Benelli in the field. I would bet that there will be hardly any parts available for either the 400 or the Vinci this season.

Dirtfarmer I really don't like the kick-off. As that is the A400's biggest selling point the few I have shot all had the kick-off.

I like Benelli on the range and in the field.