Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire debt ceiling update

Now one, myself included, may not agree with Paddler yet his argument was well stated.

It did not at all deserve the middle digit. If you have not the mental horsepower to make a reasonable response your best response is none.

Hey, OP, where did you find that emoticon? It's pretty funny. Well, it doesn't bear repeating, but it's funny the first time.

Personally, I believe the Democrats (under Obummer) will introduce a "debt reduction" bill the day before we go into "default". It will be comprised of at least 10,000 pages, and be scheduled for vote the next day - because of impending doom. NO ONE will have time to read it before our legislators "must" vote yea or nay!!!
(Think Obummercare) and prior experience.
Mark

Another thousand point drop, like what we saw when first Tarp plan didn't pass or a debit downgrade with instant, but ultimately short term interest rate spike will get to two sides calm enough to pass something.
They care to much about getting re-elected, both sides, to really affect a drastic change. Both sides known since Feb. That this would be an issue, but nothing really done till last hour....and the politicing...It's worse than the TV craze over the tot hoo how was found not guilty.

I don't think that's true at all....it's funny that even here in liberal Massachusetts, working people are not at all happy with Obama.They seem to know what Obama is up to and frankly those working people I speak with,all want him gone.This is the street talking....the guy is toast come 2012.

That Repubs don't know how to win a horse race is apparent.Throw them out ,too...

Tea Party should hold the line hard,let the deadline pass....nothing will happen August 2 and we'll be downgraded anyway,if the rating agencies are to be believed...it's all smoke screen and mirrors.

I don't believe for a second any scare tactics from the Left.

Paddler you speak in generalities and platitudes. You are as intellectually dishonest as your handlers.

From http://www.military.com/benefits/military-pay/retired-pay/military-retirement-system#1

"Military Retirement Overview
"The military retirement system is arguably the best retirement deal around. Unlike most retirement plans, the Armed Forces offer a pension, with benefits, that starts the day you retire, no matter how old you are. That means you could start collecting a regular retirement pension as early as 37 years old. What's more, that pension check will grow with a cost of living adjustment each year."

From: http://www.moneycrashers.com/military-retirement-pay-pension-benefits/

"What is a High 36 military pension worth?
"Although the benefits gained from a lifetime military pension will differ based on the pay grade of the member upon retirement, I�ll provide two examples of the worth of a lifetime military pension.

(The following calculations assume the following: High 36 retirement plan, began service at age 22, served for 20 years, and national average life expectancy of 78.4 years.)

1.The typical officer: The typical officer who retires in 2010 as an O-4 with 20 years of active duty service will receive $2,523,817 total over the next 34 years.
2.The typical enlisted member: The typical enlisted member who retires in 2010 as an E-7 with 20 years of active duty service will receive $1,465,308.00 total over the next 34 years."

I certainly do not begrudge retired military members their pension, but in today's fiscal environment, can the nation afford a lifetime of payouts, starting at age 37 or so (depending of age at joining)? Perhaps the pension should be payable (adjusted for inflation) on reaching age 62 to help balance the budget and reduce the load on the national debt. Until reaching age 62, the retiree would have to work and save just like the rest of us.

True, this pension benefit was granted by a liberal, welfare oriented Congress, but we need to consider its ramifications in light of the current fiscal situation.

Look stupid, here is the way it works:

The PRESIDENT (you know the current marxist occupant in the WH) SUBMITS a budget to the Congress. He has failed to do so now for over a year and a half. The last one he sent was voted down by a democrapically controlled Senate 99-0 and that is when he had both a democrap controlled House and Senate.

If he repeals the so-called Bush Tax Cuts that would net him about 90 billion out of his ridiculous 1.3 TRILLION budget and in the process, severely handicap small businesess because of the way they fill their taxes on individual 1040s, meaning a business owner might declare say a million in total income, most of that is in operating expenses employee salaries etc and his personal income might be well below 100K. So, if you cut that, their only option is to reduce expenditures, i.e employees thus reducing the tax base.

if he were to tax at 100% tax rate every penny everyone made above 250K and I mean every penny, that would net him about 900 billion and in the process destroy the economy as most small business owners file their business on individual tax forms, thus causing mass layoffs.

If he were to CONFISCATE ALL OF THE WEALTH of the top income earners that would give him a balanced budget for ONE YEAR. The problem with that is in year two, our revenues would be non-existent because we'd be back in a 16th Century ecoomic process.

While I'm at it, destroying all your silly-assed communist talking points, the total debt amassed during the Bush eight years in office was 2.8 billion. The marxist obama's debt since he took office stands at 5.3 TRILLION. Speaking of democraps, the president responsible for first tapping into social security funds? LYNDON JOHNSON.

Oil companies: Currently pay over 40 BILLION in taxes and work on a 9% profit margin.

And perhaps the most telling comment of all on that worthless POS Marxist evoked by the non-partican CBO:

"Mr. President, we do not score speeches, we score budgets"

if that is not a world-class embarrasing bitchslap, I don't know what is. (well this post to you is even better).

I realize I've probably overtaxed your pointy head, but if the hammer and sycle fit, stick it up your commieass and go post your crap somewhere else.

Good morning Jorge.

WHY do y'all keep lettin' that troll bark your tree??

"Oil companies: Currently pay over 40 BILLION in taxes and work on a 9% profit margin."

Jorge - you are correct that oil (and gas) companies work on a 9% profit margin on average; but his is profit based on sales. Economists generally rank profitability using investment as the denominator.

I do not know what their rate-of-return on investment would be, but I' guessing it would be nearer to 15-18%. True, they have huge capital need, but they keep managing to put holes in the ground.

I think between jorgeI and BobinNH, we have it covered....

Hey Piddler, go back to posting on the the HuffPo, Daily KOS and Media Matters. You can wrap yourself in the red flag with like minded fecal heads.

My comments above in BOLD I expect *MY* contract with the gov't to be honored. If they want to change stuff and do as you suggest, I'm fine with that, then we'll see where we are with making our recruitment goals. jorge

As to working overtime - I know of no Federal employees who decide to work overtime on their own; their supervisor has to approve it. Also, just as in industry, exempt employees (such as I) often work 50-60 hours a week and get NO overtime compensation - we just do it because it is the job (as to our military counterparts).

As to contracts, they can be legally altered due to changing conditions,, such as the lack of ability to pay. If the nation cannot pay its debts, then any contract is subject to revision.

I am not trying to start an argument, but sacred cows may have to be slaughtered in a time of famine (or possibly, we can opt for some "revenue enhancements").

Having trained troops sitting at the pointy head of the spear is a good thing IMO...I only served 6 years but at ANY given time, you can be called on to do what many in this country (including the current POTUS) are either afraid or unwilling to do...the fact that some people want to cut their pensions says much about their character...

I missed this point in my previous reply.

"The rest of "us"? your gov't benefits are a long way off "the rest of us" for example in addition to your retirement, you get free money plus matching into your Thrift SAvings Plan."

I am CSRS Offset. I pay into both CSRS and Social Security AND, i get NO free government matching money into the TSP.

Contrary to your feeling, I do not oppose military retirement. You and all retirees earned it and should be paid the retirement, but the nation cannot afford to pay it out until a "full retirement age� is reached, just like Social Security. Or perhaps it can be "discounted" so one can receive a discounted monthly payment, based on age when payments start.

In times of national emergencies, drastic measures have to be taken - it is not a matter of character, but of economic reality and fairness to the country.

Certainly a topic for discussion, but in my view military pay and retirement, if anything needs to be increased and if it must be cut, it should come after we've disbanded the departments of Energy, Education, Commerce, the EPA and of course Obamacare. Then we can talk.

jorge

Throw in TSA, and the IRS, then you're in a real discussion - and a valid one.