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Campfire Classic....Karnis, nicely said and true.

This thread wasn't intended to Bash Kimbers and wasn't a plea for help. I bought a used gun and after a closer look, it was obvious it had some issues with the stock. It will take a little bit of work to get it shooting. I'm just reporting on what I've experienced so far. I like everything about the gun and intend to keep it.

I appreciate the advise and comments.

That's the whole point and reason for my post. Unfortunately there are some folks that argue if a rifle costs (insert dollar amount) it should shoot better than (insert group size) and if not, it's a POS and shouldn't be on the market or even considered as a possibility.

You are on the right track identifying issues and suspect you'll be happy once you resolve the "problem". It's a process of elimination rather than rocket science with "today's" components/parts, etc.

Thankfully true "lemons" are remarkably few and far between. Of the 60+ rifles I've owned only ONE was a lemon, it was a Remington Mtn rifle in 30-06. From the first few loads I screwed together I knew it was a no go. Bore was way oversized and velocities were unbelievably low as in 2400 fps with a case full of H4350 and 150 gr. cup and core bullets. No Hornady, Sierra, Speer, Nosler of any weight would shoot better than about 4". That was back in the early 80's. It went down the road sure to be rebarreled.

Did I buy any more MR's? Yes, in 30-06, .280, 7x57, .257 Roberts, 7mm-08, etc. and all have been fine with a little fiddling like bedding, cleaning up barrel channels, shortening a screw here and there, adjusting a trigger, reloading straight ammunition, etc.

We've got it good today. No doubt about that.

If you think about it please post results as you go.....

Did you shoot it before you decided to "fix" it? So many people are hell bent on working on a rifle that they forget to see if it shoots good before they play with it. I think a lot of times they do more harm than good to the rifle.

Karnis.....will do.

reelman....I put 17 rounds through it; enough to tell something was not right. Read my previous posts for details. I'd rather "fix" the obvious before wasting countless hours and $$$ chasing loads. We'll see.

Just a question... why is it that people who own Kimbers that shoot think they are so much smarter - better shots that everyone else.... and those of us who have had lemons from Kimber do not know anything....(how to shoot a light rifle, how to reload, how to work up a load, etc) ?

Well I do know the chamber of the montana I bought was not correct to the point it would not even chamber a round.... 3 different factory manufactured rounds (fed, Nosler and Win) Sent it back to Kimber to be fixed....


When will the "I know better than everyone else about Kimbers becasue mine shoots" people admit that Kimber has had some Major quality control issues with their rifles?

+1 (thank you for your great post)

I recently traded for a used Kimber Montana in 257. Before shooting it, I removed the action from the stock. There was a good sized bump in the stock on the left side where the barrel starts to taper. The barrel wasn't floated very evenly either. Before shooting it, I sanded out the speed bump and opened up the channel for better clearance.

OK. From your first post it appears that you started working on it before you ever shot it.

I haven't read anything about some being smarter, better shots or major QC issues posted by anyone. You've decided not to take into account things that are done routinely to fix or improve accuracy. Do a search regarding Montana's having pillars and being bedded from the factory. They do have pillars and they are not bedded from the factory contrary to what you may have read. Using slave actions/barrels to provide a template for production purposes provides many advantages. It doesn't provide the best solution and that's the whole point of the discussion.

Surely you have had rifles that were not bedded, reloaded crooked ammunition, had a scope go haywire, triggers with creep and pull weights of 8lbs+, etc. and tended to them yourself or had someone do it for you. No? If not, buy me a lottery ticket the next time you go to the local Mart.

Rifles with barrels that have no rifling, egg shaped chambers or other issues such as those are not "fixable" by us neophytes. So how does your Montana shoot now?

Do I work for Kimber? Nope. How many have I owned? Three.

Of the three:

1. .308 Select Grade. Shot fine except the groups wandered around on paper. It would routinely shoot 1 1/4" or less except that the groups would be at 12 o'clock, then 2 o'clock, then 1 o'clock. About 15 minutes with a Dremel tool/bit and 1/4 oz of bedding fixed that problem.

2. .257 Roberts Montana. Shot 2"+ groups with factory and reloaded ammo-no matter the boolit, powder charge or OAL. Bedded and cleaned up barrel channel, now shoots TSX's like it should. Same POI all the time, no flyers.

3. .270 Win 84L. Shot pretty well from the get go except that the first shot wandered more horizontally than I would've liked. It might be 2" high and at 9 o'clock one time, 3 o'clock the next, so on and so forth. Took the rifle apart and lo and behold the barreled action was riding hard on the pillars with a relatively "loose" lug. Ground front and rear pillars a bit, added a bit of bedding. Shot it today and the problem went away.

Of the three only the .308 was purchased new. Traded for the other two with members here on the 'Fire.

Bet you a six pack naysayers would've sent all but one down the road and concluded the .270 was the only good one of the group and only because Kimber worked out all the bugs on the 84M before they built the 84L.

Balderdash.

Karnis - Balderdash? Wheeeo! That's right up there with skookum.

Haven't had the need to bust that one out in awhile. Wound up tighter than dick's hatband I am. Hehehehe...

BTW, how's the Kimber 7-em-em-08 doing? In Bridgeport right now, need to meet up at Pleasant Creek if you can swing it.

Excellent post Sako, I have also noticed the same thing with many Kimber owners. I think Kimber rifles are great rifles for shade tree gunsmiths or someone who likes to tinker around with their rifle to make it shoot, I can see how they would have a feeling of pride and accomplishment when they get a rifle that don't shoot and make a shooter out of it, I on the other hand am not a good tinkerer and expect My rifles to shoot right out of the box, which the vast majority do. I should also add that the only Kimber rifle I ever owned I bought new in box, a Mod 84 .308 Win and it shoot fine grouping three shots at 100 yds hovering around 1 inch, the bolt did have a tendency to try and bind a little when I worked the action, needless to say that was several years ago and that rifle has long since gone.............HB

Good deal, why not post a few makes and models so we can benefit and quit wasting time and money. Hate to do that if I don't have to.

TIA.

I don't blame you, some might enjoy it but it would be a pain in the azz for me to have to do all that work to make My rifle shoot. My advise would be to try a Browning X-Bolt rifle, I have owned more than a few and every one was an MOA shooter right out of the box with factory ammo, also had very good luck with Remington Mod 700 rifles as most of these have been shooters, if you want some more gunsmith work try a Ruger 77 Hawkeye.............Good luck...............HB

I should also have mentioned the Sako Mod 85, I have owned a half dozen or so of these rifles in assorted calibers and found them to be for the most part MOA shooters right out of the box. I sold all mine though as I never warmed up to Sako's cheesy clamp on scope mounting system, other than this I found Sako rifles to have superior fit and finish and be extremely well made, I would also shy away from Weatherby's MKV Ultra-Light rifles as I made many expensive tries for a shooter here with no luck, these rifles would also be a good project for a shade tree gunsmith, a good home bedding job might do wonders............HB

Brownings do shoot well, just don't like the ergos or the lozenge for a bolt knob. Have a bunch of Remingtons(Ti, M7, 700s) , MKII's, Hawkeyes, M70's, Mark X's, converted military Mausers, the aformentioned Kimbers and a couple of ARs. All have benefited (some more so than others) with some tinkering.

Trust me, if your not tinkering, you are missing out-if nothing else it will keep you awake at night. It also tends to cause you to lose hair by prolonged head rubbing or hair pulling when it takes awhile to find the loose screw.

Then again, it might just be the loose nut on the controls.

Luck to you as well.

I agree, Browning ergos aren't for everyone and Maybe I do need to tinker a little, I don't sleep at night anyway, it would give Me something to do besides wandering aimlessly from room to room through the house all night........Grin..........HB

I have had several Sakos, including a couple M85,and I have to agree with you on this point.

Not that it doesn't work ok, but the mounting flexibility just isn't there. The scope always seems to end up mounted higher than I'd like it.

The other thing that I don't like is an injection molded stock on a rifle in that price range. You shouldn't need to add $500 to a M85 to make it acceptable. It is too expensive to start with.


As far as Brownings go, I had a few early on, and they were all fine shooters. I am with Karnis on the Ergos though, and in general they just don't have the classic style I prefer.

After reading all the bad reviews on Kimbers, I was afraid my 270 WSM Montana wouldn't shoot to my specs. When I was sighting it in I used the red box 130 gr. Winchesters because they are less expensive than most 270 WSM ammo. It would shoot 2" at 100 yds. I turned to my son and said I'm going to have to sell this rifle. Then I tried a three shot group with Winchester Elite 130 gr. XP3 ammo. It has a 3x10x42 Swarovski 4A retical on it. It will shoot the XP3s in a 1/2" group all day long. I've never tried any other ammo in it but XP3s worked great on a 180 lb buck last year. I shot him at about 100 yards and he didn't take a step.
I have 4 new boxs of Winchester Elite 130 gr. XP3 ammo on my shelf waithing on November to get here.

Sounds like you got a shooter, that 130gr XP3 bullet should do a great job, Winchester advertises the XP3 as their best do all bullet.............Good hunting.........HB