Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting WHY AREN'T THE 6.5s MORE POPULAR ??

You mean this picture?



Definitely glad I had a camera that day. Its not often you see a rig that has its wiring grounded by an empty soup can, with a fuel pump from a motorhome hard wired direct to the battery and attached in front of the grill to keep it cool. Also impressive that the rig had NO clutch, wouldnt go into first gear at all. Of course the spark plug wires being held to the plugs with gray duct tape wasnt anything to sneeze at.

My buddy and I reworked the wiring in that thing as it was arcing all over the place. Wrapped the exposed wires in a greasy old glove so they wouldnt short one another.

Also wired the distibutor down so it wouldnt fly out every time the dude hit a bump.

That is some serious engineering...I dont care what you say.

Also pretty brave of anyone to even attempt driving that vehicle over 100 miles each way...

I was actually impressed.

I will concede that the "suspender" is a nice touch to the culture of Yellowpine.

John,

Actually, you might have to go up in SD with a 7mm to get an equivalent BC to what the 6.5mm bullets have. I think you nailed it with those two thoughts - more velocity and/or less recoil with the 6.5mm. Somebody may come through with additional thoughts, but you've basically answered the question yourself. Take the Berger VLD G1 BCs for example (good example because the BCs have been tested):
6.5mm 130 gr (SD = .266) BC = .552
.277" 140 gr (SD = .261) BC = .487
.277" 150 gr (SD = .279) BC = .531
7mm 150 gr (SD = .266) BC = .510
.308" 175 gr (SD = .264) BC = .498

6.5mm 140 gr (SD = .287) BC = .612
.277" 150 gr (SD = .279) BC = .531
7mm 168 gr (SD = .298) BC = .617
.308" 185 gr (SD = .279) BC = .549
.308" 190 gr (SD = .286) BC = .570

6.5mm 140 gr (SD = .287) BC = .612
7mm 180 gr (SD = .319) BC = .659
.308" 210 gr (SD = .316) BC = .631

For elk, some might see some advantage in going to a 7mm or .30-cal instead of a 6.5mm, but I don't remember reading about people having any problems with elk with 6.5mm cartridges if the bullet is placed correctly, and the Scandavians don't seem to have any trouble with bagging moose with the 6.5x55.

Hey Fellows......You Do Know We Have a Photography Forum

Don't You?
Jerry

Some people just need to get by..Not all are complimented by a retirement package at retirement.Try living off of Social Security without a stash somewhere.

Don't knock the seniors who can't make ends meet in today's environment.

Your picture is kinda funny and I am sure that guy is thankful.I was married in Yellowpine some 23 years ago and took our honey moon at packsaddle creek eating brookies morning noon and night.It was a nice place until Boise exploded..

Jayco

because here in the u.s.a the 30 cal is king. dad and granddad probably used something in 30 cal, so junior does as well. the vast majority of hunters don't reload, and ya can't just run into wmt for some 6.5 ammo the day before season starts. joe the hunter decides what is popular, and the 6.5 just simply doesn't have the following. not a criticism, just an observation. what's popular here at the fire has little bearing on what joe hunter is doing/thinking/wanting. as rodney king might say, "we be the monority".

Best answer yet.Definitely a thumbs up..

Jayco

BTW - For those who have never really looked at how the numbers are calculated, bullets with different diameters but the same SD and the same form factor (aerodynamic shape) will have the SAME BC. When somebody says "compare bullets with the same SD and same design," what they are really doing is saying to compare muzzle velocities because that's the only variable in the analysis. That's a one-dimensional analysis that doesn't really tell you anything.

To have a comparison that means anything, you have to set something else as constant, and what you set constant to compare cartridges could be recoil or bullet weight or something else because same SD + same bullet shape = same BC.

Yes. .284, and .308 calibers. I've only been shooting 6.5's for a little while so no elk hunting (yet) with them. But I wouldn't hesitate. Got a few 6.5 160-grain Woodleighs from a friend yesterday, I have no doubt they'd do the trick, as would 140 partitions, TSXs, or any number of bullets. I have three 6.5's in the safe and I've been wanting a .260 Remington for a while now. As Razorback said, 6.5's differentiate themselves on longer shots and my best right now for those is the 6.5-06 Ackley. So availability of ammo. is not something that keeps me up at night.

Next time I get my hands on a good, light short action I'm gonna go for the .260. Maybe get a match for my 7-08.

I like 7 mm's. too, for the same reason I like 6.5's--good combination of relatively light high BC bullets compared to other popular elk calibers like .30 and .338, and the ability to shoot 'em fast and flat without a lot of recoil andless drift.




PS, now I'm curious. Where do you see me giving anyone advice on what they should shoot elk with?

Many are shooting the "7's". I did for a while.

Economics played a part for me. Much cheaper to reload and shoot the 308, 260, 6.5X284 than the 7wizzum, 7 RM etc.

Except for the 6.5X284 the barrel life tends to be a bit more as well. Longer barrel life more rounds down range.. things tend to lean in your favor then.

I'm playin' with the 6.5-06 and hopefully soon orderin' a 260.

well placed bullets tend to give you "luck"

Just checking..

Are we supposed to be impressed with this picture?

I think he was saying that how he hunts elk...

In a pavement queen, without the lug wrench, on a road a soccer mom can drive in her mini van?

Got it...

Less of a chance in bumping the scope that way. But you do have quicker access to wally world to get ammo to re-zero.

I hear lots about "wind"...to listen on here,the slightest zephyr drifts bullets a long ways,and a 270 bullet seems to drift like a whisp of smoke.

I have bumped into the wind bugaboo myself, but not often.

To those experienced at shooting in wind,how often have you had to "allow" for it in making first shot hits on animals at 300-500 yards? And how far off have you held to make these hits?

Hi Bob, just a couple of hunts out west where i worried about wind.

300-500 yds will call for 6 to 18" adjustment for a 10 MPH wind 90 degrees to LOS, and multiply as winds dictate.

Gunner

dogcatcher - First let me say, I am NOT taking exception to your statement about this being posted on the Elk Hunting Forum. I would like to explain why I began it here.

It is here & Ask The Gunwriters that I have seen MOST of the discussion pertaining to the 6.5s. Good/Bad/Indifferent, the 6.5 Elk hunters are represented here and I was/am trying to pick their brains as to Why the 6.5s are not widely used/accepted.

And even here as is evident from the discussion not all elk hunters agree as to its use.

From a ballistical standpoint it seems that both sides (pro/con) have made up their minds. Some people don't want to be confused by facts. I have virtually quit trying to explain comparrisons.

NO my mind is NOT made up. I just bought a 6.5 Swede, but I know its capabilities. It's NOT a 22 lr nor a 50BMG. Even Ramblin Razorback said, "the 260 Rem catches the 270 at 650 yds."
Personally I like A 649 yd. advantage.

I turned 62 yrs old this month, so my time and opportunities to elk hunt are LIMITED. IF I do get to go elk hunting, either here in Ark. or some other State, I'd feel more comfortable & confident with my 300 WM & 180 partitions or accubonds.

Yes, I know that elk DON'T wear kevlar but like YOU said, "elk are big & powerful animals" and I want a LARGER caliber & bullet. I may not need it, but I'd feel more COMFORTABLE with one.
Jerry

Wind?......I live with it and hunt in it year around. It's a huge factor. I wouldn't get many coyotes killed if I had to reley on hunting on calm days only.

I hold for wind on every shot if it's going to push right or left. Even if it's only one or two inches of hold off, I compensate for it.

Bob, to answer your question about how far I've held off to make first shot hits, the one shot that sticks in my mind was a coyote I shot at a bit over 600 meters with my Surgeon .308 a few years back. My Airedale was working around out in front of me a few hundred meters, when a lone male coyote showed up on a hogback across the creek, between the dog and me. He wouldn't commit to coming into the dog and layed down watching the dog for about five minutes. I had plenty of time to calculate my hold off. He finally stood up and turned broadside, before departing. I held 2.5 mils left and fired. He straighted out, then disappeared over the ridge. I waited for him to come into view going up the other side. He had no way of getting out of the swale without me seeing him. He finally appeared, slowly walking up the other side and stopped right below the top. I could see a red speck right behind his right front shoulder. He fell over right there with a clean shot through both lungs. The bullet had drifted about 60 inches to the right. A little celebration dance was in order....not for the shot so much, but the fact that he'd been killing lambs steadily for about two weeks.

I think part of the deal is that most 6.5 bullets don't really offer significant improvement over standard jello and vanilla ice creamloads like the .270, 30-06, etc etc until you get past 500 yards. I own 2 6.5 rifles....a 6.5-06 AI and a 6.5 creedmoor. Within the NORMAL ranges I shoot they are not that different from a host of other cartridges. I personally don,t take many shoots over 300 yards, and if you take a poll nation wide I would guess most shoots are from 100-200 yards. Don't get me wrong, I love em, or I would not have two of them......in particular I like the 6.5 creedmoor, accurate , low recoil, flat shooting etc. maybe they will catch on but until you get the bigger manufactures to chamber and stick with them simple economics kicks in, they have not sold well. emington tried twice......6.5 mag & the .260....... Even Kimber gave up on the .260.......it comes downtown numbers fellas........many of us may like them, but the MAJORITY has rejected them, it's a shame, but it is reality.

Bob,

You know the �magic� .264 Win Mag drifts as we had to hold off quite a bit on that breezy afternoon.

To be honest it is most likely more of a thing of confidence in what you are shooting and feeling like you have the best solution to the problem.

To at least 600yds the idea of shooting a .270 Win is simply no excuse for a bad shot. Everything drifts in the wind.

The only elk I killed this year was at 175yds and any reasonable cartridge would have worked as well as the .264 Win Mag, but it sure worked.

I did spend a lot of time chasing a ghost in the most wide open country imaginable and carrying the .264 Win Mag simply meant that I had more �gun reach� than �shooter reach�.

I like having the shooter be the limiting factor in the equation and when I am packing that .264 (yes you know and have shot the one) I know the gun will never be �the problem�. That rifle setup simply out reaches anything I have ever seen.

Makes me try and be a better shooter.

All that BS being said, if you can�t kill an elk with the .270 Win then perhaps �elk hunting school� might be a better use of funds than a new rifle in a �better� elk cartridge.

Jerry - That's not accurate. If you had presented the quote in context (see above), it would be clear that the "catching up" I mentioned only pertains to velocity and energy, and the .260 Rem has plenty of velocity and energy at all distances from zero to 650 yards and beyond.

In terms of wind drift, the .260 Rem never trails the .270 Win - the .270 Win never catches the .260 Rem on wind drift (i.e., the .260 Rem has less wind drift at every distance from zero to infinity), while the .260 Rem eventually catches the .270 Win on velocity and energy even after starting 250 fps slower.

The .270 Win is great, but it could be even better if it used 6.5mm bullets rather than .277" bullets.