Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Internet rumor regarding Lil Gun

Is there anything to the intenet rumors regarding Lil Gun and it's supposed tendancy to burn hot and accelerate wear on revolver forcing cones, etc.?

I am working up a relatively heavy bullet load (300 - 340 grain gas check cast bullets) for my Bisley Blackhawk in 45 Colt and would like to add Lil Gun to my very short list of suitable powders for heavy hunting loads. My list is so short that it currently has contains only one other powder - H110.

What do those in the know feel regarding Lil Gun?

I tried LilGun in revolver loads only briefly. They seemed to work as advertised to give maximum oomph, but I simply don't shoot loads like that any more. I burn a lot of it in the Hornet and Bee with no issues, but that doesn't answer the question you pose.

I dunno why Li'l Gun would burn any hotter than other ball powders, since they're all double-based.

I've put over 2000 rounds of Li'l Gun loads through a .22 Hornet that's often been shot when VERY hot. I checked the throat through my bore-scope recently and there was ZERO trace of throat erosion.

You might talk to the folks at Freedom Arms. I heard that they strongly discouraged its use in their revolvers.

I know first hand it can swing in pressure very fast. I use Ramshot Enforcer now, couldn't be happier. Adam

I look no farther than H-110/296 for my top 45 loads. In fact i use H-110/296 in my 454, 475L, 500L and JRH and see no reason to look any farther

I believe that the above poster is correct in reguarding FA advice not to use Lilgun

Freedom Arms does caution against the use of L'il Gun, they have seen a number of M83's in 454 Casull come back with severely eroded forcing cones. Some of them were cracked also IIRC. I'm not an expert by any means, but if what I've been told is correct, the flame temp of L'il Gun goes way up when run up in the 60,000+ PSI range. I have no data to back this up, but know and shoot with some of the most experienced folk shooting 454's.
Some of these guys have been shooting 454's since it was introduced and all are personal friends of Bob Baker.
I'll defer to their experience and stopped using L'il Gun in my FA 454.
I still use it in lower pressure cartridges, 44 mag, Ruger level 45 Colt and 480 Ruger.

I had some interesting things happen when I was working up cast bullet loads in my Ruger SuperRed 480. When getting close to the top loads, they sound would change, and there was a perceptable "ringing" sound. I took it as a sign that pressures were near top and I decided to back off a little till it went away.

DZelenka
Silver Member Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 181

Re: 357 Magnum and Lil'Gun powder

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Worker
Hey that's very interesting ! So does that mean I'm harming my 44 magnum with Lil'Gun ?

Give Bob Baker at FA a call. I spoke to him at length on the subject. Shortly after the powder was introduced, they had a significant increase in guns being returned for service. Lil' Gun was the common denominator. So they did some experimentation and also spoke to hogdon about it. Lil' Gun has a high amount of nitro glycerin in it and thus burns hotter. That was eroding the metal. Personally, I wouldn't use it in a revolver. I do use it in a TC .22 Hornet. Great powder for that.


That was posted here: http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f28/357-magnum-lilgun-powder-83562/


Call Bob Baker at Freddom Arms and talk with im, I think that is the best bet

The first run of Lil Gun was recalled by Hodgdon. This was eons ago, and none has been recalled since.

I have heard the same thing regarding XMP5744 powder - that it burns very hot. In fact, I looked into it after noticing that my Marlin 45-70 felt noticeably hotter after firing just a few rounds loaded with it. I'm not worried about it though because I only use the stuff in low pressure reduced loads in high volume rifle cases like 45-70 and 416 Rigby, and I'm not going to be shooting them full-auto any time soon. XMP5744 is excellent for reduced loads and no filler is required, and I think one main reason for its excellence in this application is the high nitroglycerine content (I'm no chemist so am open to being corrected by someone who knows).

Coot,

I ran Lil'Gun when I was working up a 335 gr WFN LBT gc for back up in case I got into it in Alaska. This was in my 4-5/8" SS NMBH. I settled on Hodgon's max load of 20.5 gr. Accuracy was good. I never noticed any fall off in accuracy or velocity if the throat was burning out. Someone above mentioned 60,000 psi. The max load by Hodgdon only reaches 29,600 CUP. Surely not 60k.

Vel = 1106 fps
ES = 49
SD = 17

Ended up using it too but not for Grizzly.

Alan

Great moose! You killed it with that little gun?

Hope you weren't too far from motorized vehicles.

Taxi in.....



Taxis around and out.......



Alan

It burns out the vent liner in Savage ML10IIs faster than other powders, so I could see it being a hotter powder.

I love LG in pistol and shotgun, but it is one of the only powders I've seen get sticky in the jug. Don't leave it in a thrower for a while either, PITA to clean out like it's glued in place.

If it does that in the thrower, does it clump together in the cartridge case?

Burn rates can make or break things. I believe I've read that the 357 Maximum was a great revolver cartridge until Remington switched powders and the burn rate of the new one started to wear the revolvers it was made for; something about the pressure peak coming just as the bullet was leaving the throats of the cylinder, or something to that effect.

I don't see enough difference between W296 in my revolvers to matter, consequently 296 and 231 do revolver work for me, while Lil' Gun is reserved for the hymenopteroids (the Bee and the Hornet).