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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 10,170
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Campfire Outfitter
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Why drop one on purpose? To see what it does... Whitworth, when you first said you dropped your gun "numerous times" from a tree stand, I was really starting to wonder about you. I'm glad "numerous" turned out to be only twice. Anyway, here's a DD M4 torture test by Larry Vickers and that dainty looking thing on top is an Aimpoint Micro. Looks fragile doesn't it... http://gunblog.com/daniel-defense-ddm4-torture-test-with-larry-vickers
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Joined: Jun 2008
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Why drop one on purpose? To see what it does... Whitworth, when you first said you dropped your gun "numerous times" from a tree stand, I was really starting to wonder about you. I'm glad "numerous" turned out to be only twice. Anyway, here's a DD M4 torture test by Larry Vickers and that dainty looking thing on top is an Aimpoint Micro. Looks fragile doesn't it... http://gunblog.com/daniel-defense-ddm4-torture-test-with-larry-vickers Yes, I too want to "see what happens," but not when I'm on a hunt and counting on success. It was the same sight twice -- I have not been kind to it. Like I said, I hunt a lot in the off-season (wild hogs -- a benefit of living in the southeast), and I give my Ultradots no quarter, LOL! But if you do enough hunting, all kinds of stuff can happen to you. Whenever I hear a hunter preface a declaration with "I have never," it usually means he/she has limited experience. For example: "I have never lost an animal." Hunt enough, and you will at some stage. Seriously, if you are not familiar with Ultradot's products, I recommend acquiring one and putting it through its paces. I don't think you will be disappointed.
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Joined: Nov 2006
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Joined: Jan 2010
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Lets solve this. Im going to need a Aimpoint T1, and a Ultra Dot. Donations will be welcomed into my paypal account. 
John 8:12 "I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life."
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Joined: Aug 2002
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I did and don't think anything with an exposed turret would have survived it.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Joined: Jun 2002
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Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
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[quote=Whitworth1How many of you are taking your personal ARs into battle? Y'all talk like you're hopping on the next flight to Kabul and this sight is a critical decision for you. Good grief.[/quote]
While I may not be taking mine into battle in Kabul, I use my equipment Every. Single. Day. in the protection of myself, the citizens I am sworn to serve, and those families of the Soldiers that ARE overseas and are depending on me to be vigilant in keeping their loved ones safe.
So it is a matter of perspective. Your focus is hunting, and that is where your frame of reference is. However, for those that would like a different frame of reference that is more defence oriented, some would be wise to look carefully at what is being said on here. It pains me to see people advocating stuff that's "Just as good as" without really having a true perspective into what the differences are. Not knowing what they don't know.....
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Joined: Jun 2008
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Your focus is hunting, and that is where your frame of reference is. However, for those that would like a different frame of reference that is more defence oriented, some would be wise to look carefully at what is being said on here. It pains me to see people advocating stuff that's "Just as good as" without really having a true perspective into what the differences are. Not knowing what they don't know..... Now you are definitely making assumptions about my background. Just because I am not alluding to time spent in crappy places in every post I make, doesn't mean I haven't done my time in crappy places. I spent a majority of the '90s in crappy places, under crappy conditions. I just don't feel the compulsion or the need to talk about it all the time. Also, I take the well being of myself and my family very seriously. I was stating that I use my red dots rather extensively and often in the field, on firearms that produce a hell-of-a-lot more recoil that any AR platform. They're not just riding around in my vehicle. I too take personal defense seriously. I am not deriding the use of Aimpoint's products, only that in my experience, there have been very few optics that will stand up to the recoil these revolvers produce. Maybe their new models are better, I don't know. What I do know is that, for my use, on a heavy recoiling platform, you would be very hard pressed to find a better sight than an Ultradot. Also, they stand behind their products like very few companies. I would just like to open a few eyes about these little known optics. Ultradot makes fine products that are perhaps less known as they don't advertise like some of the other producers of red dot-type sights. That is the reason I posted in this thread -- not to get into pissing contests or arguments about who has more "tactical experience." Everyone here needs to lighten up a bit. Life is too damned short to get worked up over the internet. JMHO.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Just curious, which optics have you personally seen fail on heavy recoiling handguns? (not counting a friend on the net had one go down and showed pictures)
I've hunted all my life, up until I bought my shop I hunted every weekend and 2-3 times a week at night. I've hunted with handguns, shotguns, rifles and bows. Tree stands, walking, running behind dogs and even out of the back of trucks in the killin chair. I currently shoot a 44 Magnum, 45ACP and 9MM for handguns but I did own a few contenders in various calibers and one encore in 308 Winchester which was quite easy to shoot. I remember the warnings of exessive recoil on handguns. Personally I've had 3 scopes go down and had dead batteries on eo-techs, never had a problem with my Aimpoints. I too, use my equipment.
Did you watcn the video?
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TWR: Thanks for the video link. Impressive. I'd like to have seen the aftermath of a 10K lbs. loaded H-vee run over the rifle rather than that little Jeep. I understand why the tape on the muzzle, but what would happen if this was battle field fire fight conditions? Are they going to take the time to clear the barrel? How would they do that? That same test sequence on some of the other popular configurations and sight options would be interesting to see.
Art
In life you will find that constants aren't and variables won't.
Life is like a sewer, what you get out of it depends on what you put into it.
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Joined: Jun 2008
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Just curious, which optics have you personally seen fail on heavy recoiling handguns? (not counting a friend on the net had one go down and showed pictures)
I've hunted all my life, up until I bought my shop I hunted every weekend and 2-3 times a week at night. I've hunted with handguns, shotguns, rifles and bows. Tree stands, walking, running behind dogs and even out of the back of trucks in the killin chair. I currently shoot a 44 Magnum, 45ACP and 9MM for handguns but I did own a few contenders in various calibers and one encore in 308 Winchester which was quite easy to shoot. I remember the warnings of exessive recoil on handguns. Personally I've had 3 scopes go down and had dead batteries on eo-techs, never had a problem with my Aimpoints. I too, use my equipment.
Did you watcn the video? I watched the video, impressive, but I can't help wonder how other high-end optics would have fared under the same circumstances. Thanks for posting it. I hunt a lot too, my livelihood depends on it. What have I seen fail? BSA and Adco red dot on a .44 Mag SBH, Bushnell, Tasco, and Millet red dots (glass pulled out) on one of my hunting partner's .44 Mags -- they didn't make it up to the .475 and the .45/70 revolvers they were slated for, Bushnell Trophy on a .500 S&W Encore -- plus the same sight on a .480 Ruger Raging Bull (that one only went 200 rounds), a gunsmith friend of mine also had a Bushnell fail on his .475 Linebaugh (a custom Ruger he built), an Optima (now J-Point) on a .475 Linebuagh, and two Aimpoints (don't know the models but they had 30mm tubes) fail on a .454 Casull and .500 Linebaugh respectively. Now, let me introduce you to my .500 Maximum (the rounds underneath it are .44 Mags), and my .50 Alaskan. The .50 Alaskan generates roughly 96 ft-lbs of recoil energy. It will chew up and spit out most optics. If they can't hold up to extreme recoil, they are no good to me. ![[Linked Image]](http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f196/MarkoR/image004.jpg) ![[Linked Image]](http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f196/MarkoR/50AK.jpg)
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Joined: Jun 2002
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Your focus is hunting, and that is where your frame of reference is. However, for those that would like a different frame of reference that is more defence oriented, some would be wise to look carefully at what is being said on here. It pains me to see people advocating stuff that's "Just as good as" without really having a true perspective into what the differences are. Not knowing what they don't know..... Now you are definitely making assumptions about my background. Just because I am not alluding to time spent in crappy places in every post I make, doesn't mean I haven't done my time in crappy places. I spent a majority of the '90s in crappy places, under crappy conditions. I just don't feel the compulsion or the need to talk about it all the time. Also, I take the well being of myself and my family very seriously. I was stating that I use my red dots rather extensively and often in the field, on firearms that produce a hell-of-a-lot more recoil that any AR platform. They're not just riding around in my vehicle. I too take personal defense seriously. I am not deriding the use of Aimpoint's products, only that in my experience, there have been very few optics that will stand up to the recoil these revolvers produce. Maybe their new models are better, I don't know. What I do know is that, for my use, on a heavy recoiling platform, you would be very hard pressed to find a better sight than an Ultradot. Also, they stand behind their products like very few companies. I would just like to open a few eyes about these little known optics. Ultradot makes fine products that are perhaps less known as they don't advertise like some of the other producers of red dot-type sights. That is the reason I posted in this thread -- not to get into pissing contests or arguments about who has more "tactical experience." Everyone here needs to lighten up a bit. Life is too damned short to get worked up over the internet. JMHO. You initially were recommending red dot sights you have used on handguns for hunting purposes in a thread where the poster was asking about ones for an AR for defensive purposes. And then you made it seem like its no big deal in the differences, that we all seem like we're going overseas to war. I don't see where heavy recoiling has a part in this. The right optic for the right purpose. Would you stick a Leupold Vari-X II on a spring piston air rifle? How you articulated your reasons for suggesting someone try out Ultradot here is much better. Give them a look, fine. But don't expect them to stand up like a proven Aimpoint does for that purpose yet. Not without a lot more proven reliability. You mention Adco, Tasco, BSA and the like have failed. No kidding. How little do they cost? You get what you pay for. If I depend on something, I want it to work, and will pay for it once, so as to not have to buy something several times. For the money you've spent on all those cheap red dot sights that failed, you could have paid for a higher quality optic up front and maybe not had some of your difficulties. Just Saying....
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,143
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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No, I made a recommendation for a tough, reliable red-dot sight at an attractive price point. One that won't buckle under debilitating recoil. One that y'all seem to be unfamiliar with.
Well, I see y'all have made up your minds and don't seem to be open to any other options.
On that note, I shall depart.
Carry on, gentlemen.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,489
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Posts: 57,489 |
of all the ones you had fail on big handguns, I wouldn't have tried a single one of them save teh aimpoint one. Not saying the aimpoint wouldn't fall but the rest fall into the category of junk when it comes to heavy recoil.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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