Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Honest pig question...

So you could become a multi-millionaire.....


Here's my argument to those who bitch and moan about the private land deer hunting/leasing in TX. I would much rather have it this way, than dealing with the moron hunters on public land, most of whom haven't the first clue about what they're doing. They are often times much too numerous than they should be and just in the way. I used to hunt public land in S NM for years growing up. When I was a kid i could usually turn up a 140" muley buck during the season. Tags were over the counter. Up until a few years ago, when tags became draw only, turning up a 120 class buck was a chore. It seems to me that most states are only concerned with revenue, not game management. I may be wrong about that, but that's the way it seems to me.

If I had to, I'd sacrifice a smart phone, $45,000 pickup payments, etc and spend that money on a good private ground lease here, where it's not over run with morons who aren't supposed to be there, you can still count of having a great hunt if you've done your homework and leased good ground, and if you treat it right, be a good steward of the land, help the landowner with chores, etc, you'll have a place to hunt for many years, guaranteed. Everyone has a choice, but it's a no brainer to me anyway.

IMO, if a hog could see like a whitetail deer can, or an aoudad can, you'd never kill one, ever.

Thank you for that. If you don't like my butt, don't look at it. Not running my mouth, just trying to gain some insight to this hog craze going on. Nobody cares what you think either and please GFY!!!

Do you guys ever think that every time you make a reference to stupid and moronic hunters that you are referring to yourselves also. In your minds, all hunters besides yourself and your group are irresponsible. Then you label yourself the same because correct me if I'm wrong, you too are a hunter and most don't know who you are.

Maybe there are some major [bleep] ups in the state of Texas who fit the moronic and stupid hunter profile. Personally, just being a hunter makes you a part of what I stand for and gives you the benefit of the doubt.

Explain to me how BLM(Block Land Management) in Northwest states work but cannot work in Texas. Are Texas hunters more apt to shoot houses and tractors and tear up and than Montana hunters? There are not any invasive species in Montana and it works. Are the pigs the reason it will not work?

Texas hunting is working just fine the way it is. Charging a higher lease fee keeps the trash out. And no, I do not consider myself a stupid or moronic hunter. All it takes is some common sense to act otherwise. It's a big reason I've had a place to hunt every year for the past 41 years. Some I paid for, some I had access to because I'm honest, do what I say, and take better care of a place than if it were my own. You know, common sense stuff. That doesn't include shooting road signs, windmills, etc that I've seen done in every state I've ever hunted in. Newsflash KSMITH......there are moronic hunters in every state.

As a landowner and a former guide the problem I have had with hunters (and about 75% of those were from out of state) were not shooting stuff, not closing gates, literring etc...but rather guys who told you they wanted to kill a big/mature deer and tell you about all the big deer they had killed in the past and then drag out a 1-1/2 year old 8 point. Texas doesn't have a corner on that market I can tell you.

Let's compare the number of post this fall about people who run into idiots who are hunting while they are out hunting and let's see which region wins and if more are on public or private land.

Texas has options of both. If you don't like it don't hunt here. I've managed to kill what I call a decent deer for public land in TX (125") for about 15 years in a row to burn my buck tag and use my state given tags on my own land.

I still think people fail to see how invasive pigs are. Pigs have been in South, TX for a LONG time. About 15 years ago there was a pig explosion that nobody expected and caught everyone flat footed. I'm not going to fault a landowner who tries to recoup some cost associated with pigs. Hell I've lost thousands and multi thousands a year when pigs get into a freshly planted pine platation and totally tear it up and that sets you back an entire year on a 20 year rotation so right there you are out 1/20th of your profit on that acre not including replanting cost.

You aren't going to get rid of them. To make that point again I worked on a state owned WMA that did wage war on the pigs and we couldn't even make a dent. By wage war I mean techs, biologist, guest etc...rotated out nigthly - every night for a year in teams shooting pigs from a high rack in a truck. Someone was on the WMA every night all night. On many nights we stacked up 100's of dead pigs

We did a very intensive survery using game cameras and after one year we couldn't tell that we had made a dent in the pig population. In fact we lost ground. It was used as a test and we thought we would show at what point you could actually reduce pig numbers. We never got there.

Everyone east of the MS just wait till they show up on your door ;(

The argument against charging to shoot pigs was a valid one 15 years ago. Today there's no point to it. Not only are they walking money on the hoof, they are walking money on the hoof that can be hunted 24/7/365 days a year when turkey and deer season are closed.

Don't think for a minute that there aren't huge numbers of people who fly in the San Antonio for a weekend with the guys who go out and pay to slaughter pigs because 1 - they don't have pigs where they are from and 2 - they don't have anything to hunt in June where they live.

Very informative Nathan and I appreciate that. I wonder if the northern climate will stop their spread or if they will be able to survive the harsh winters too.

There are pigs in Russia, dude. They can survive most anything.

Can't take the weather here, no feral pigs.

Interesting thread. Some people in the northwest part of the state closed a lot of acres to hunting in protest of the state not allowing commercialized big game hunting. Then with unmanaged wild herds they demanded depredation payments from the state. They got no sympathy.

I think the real problem is lawyers and the liability laws. In CA its set up so the land owner is liable for any bad thing that happens. So some stranger is hunting on his land and accidently kills someone the land owner is liable. How would you feel about losing your ranch because of something like that?

I have never lived where hogs are a problem. After reading most of the posts and looking at the pictures I want to go shoot a few.

I am a land owner who has a few whitetails and partridge. I don't let anyone hunt if I don't know them. Don't have to know them well, just know who they are and a little about them.

I'm a landowner, have guided a bit, and am an avid hog hunter. Everything NathanL said was spot on.

These posts about "I can't believe someone would charge me to shoot a hog - I'd be doing the landowner a favor" seem to be made by folks who live a long distance away from wild hogs and aren't familiar with a) the biology of hogs and b) issues landowners face.

Hogs reach sexual maturity quickly, reproduce year round, have lots of little ones per litter and are very rugged animals. Once they're 10-15 pounds, predation isn't much of a problem for them either. They're just amazingly successful critters from a biological standpoint.

Killing a hog or two isn't that hard, but it is impossible to make a significant dent in the hogs with sport hunting - even if you run a suppressed auto with night vision, which few sport hunters do. In fact, it's very difficult to do damage their numbers enough even with commercial aerial hunting.

A friend of mine has hired helicopter shooters to kill hogs for the last 2 years. They flew one day in 2011 and once this summer. They killed about 120 hogs on each day. The hogs moved off of his place only very briefly. Soon after those flights, there were just as many hogs as ever hammering his rice fields. And it would take a whole lot of man hours to equal the killing that was done in a day from the helicopters.

The only thing that will ever make a real dent in hog numbers is disease, and that's a very spooky double edged sword because that disease could harm great numbers of domestic livestock and/or people.

My friend generously lets me hunt hogs on his place since he trusts me and some pressure on the hogs is better than none, but no one's kidding themselves about it making any difference at all to their overall numbers - and that's with me killing a hog or two fairly often.

Also keep in mind that farming and ranching are very tough to make a living at, period. Crop losses hurt, and so do hunters that leave gates open or start fires or shoot livestock or steal things.

So a landowner runs risk/reward calculation: he knows that a hunter killing 1-2 hogs in an evening won't make any difference to his crop's success and the hunter might tear things up and pose a liability. If the landowner knows the hunter and knows he's responsible, then he's usually amenable to letting the hunter kill a few, figuring a little pressure on the animals is better than nothing. But strangers and people with I'm-doing-you-a-favor attitudes are usually turned away.

And, again, agribusiness is very hard to make a living at, so any income the realize from hunting, for hogs or deer or any other species, may well make a huge difference by paying for a farmer's gas, or kids' schooling or whatever.

Hogs are fun to hunt and the small ones taste great, and the fees for hog hunting are minimal compared to "trophy" species. I wouldn't have a problem paying for the privilege of hunting another's land (though fortunately I don't have to for the time being). But this is America, if you have a problem with paying to hunt on someone else's property, you're always free to go buy your own farm or ranch.

A few comments on hogs in general.

A litter of twelve is pretty common for a well fed sow. She will easily produce two litters a year for many, many years.

Of the 24 pigs she has this year, 12 of them will be having litters next year.

One bred sow will yield almost 300 pigs on the ground within 24 months. The only limiting factory is available feed.

With a reproductive rate this fast, pigs also evolve very rapidly. The Razorback which was hunted and even managed for meat during the early 20'th century was a fairly tall, thin, and aggressive animal. But that animal evolved from the portly, short legged domestic swine of the 19'th century which escaped and/or were released into the woods.

Before the introduction of Crisco vegetable oil to the grocery carts of America, the hog was primarily a producer of lard, which was a staple of every kitchen. Pork chops and ham were just a nice bonus.

The hogs which populated the swine farms of America up until the sixties were a much different animal than those which are bred for lean cuts of meat today.

Point being, it takes just a few years for a population of feral domestic pigs to change appearance and behavior due to environmental pressures. Add in a bit of European DNA and where European traits favor survivability, European traits will soon dominate.

To ALL,

Our family has owned a moderate sized farm in NE Texas for generations & we have MANY hogs on our place.

Our partial solution is a professional trapper out of OK, who comes in sets her traps, loads her catch, huals the catch to NE OK & sends my kid sister a check quarterly for our "piece of the action".

"Sue" is GOOD at her job BUT she will never run out of hogs to catch & transport.
(My friends & family will never be short of young pigs to BBQ.)

yours, tn46

Years ago my brother & I hunted in one of the controlled hunts in your area for deer & hogs. Since dogs & baiting were not allowed it was a difficult hunt. I did see one hog that responded to a call, but no shots. There were several small hogs checked in during my hunt. In the Culpeper area there are a number of feral hogs, but all on private land. Lots have been shot there. I have hunted hogs in South Carolina, Georgia, Florida, & Texas. Techniques have included using dogs (my favorite), stalking, & out of tree stands. I gladly paid for access & usually a guide. As several posters noted allowing strangers to hunt your property leads to major problems. It may come as a shock to you, but a number of hunters & shooters could care less about leaving gates open, gut piles on roads, trash every where, & even occasionally shooting a stock animal. A private range I belong to has had target post shot repeatedly, back stops shot full of holes, & piles of cases left behind. Many today could give a chit about any thing they don't own.

A few years age i killed a small(400+) dry sow on the farm here.

Out here they are sneaky and you seldom get a shot unless you are in the right spot at the right time.

A farmer/rancher is liable for the actions of anyone who they let hunt on their property. So they could lose their property because someone screws up big time. Would you let strangers hunt on your place?

I thought this was another "Cop" thread.

Sorry.

You guys talking about the landowner being liable for anything that happens on his property might want to take a look at Ohio law. It basically removes any liability from a landowner who has given written permission to a hunter. The hunter can't sue if he is injured or killed on a hunt.
I don't know how that might affect adjacent land owners whose property gets damaged, though. Probably the hunter could be sued, but not the guy who gave permission.

Myron

I'm headed to my lease next weekend, it's the last one of turkey season, and I'll go after some pigs, too, if they show up. Oddly enough I'll probably take a blackpowder rifle for the turkeys, and an AR or AK for the hogs. In that country, shoot one and the rest instantly scatter into the brush. Reckon I need to bite the bullet and get a can, maybe at that point I could shoot more before they realize they are in danger.

From what I've seen, shoot them as you would a deer, and they'll run off. Their lungs are smaller and farther forward, and you need to keep that mind or they will seem tougher than they are.

The landowner is already getting pretty good money for the lease, and he wants us to kill all we can, so they don't eat all the mast crop the deer need.

As far as other hunters go, about half our guys can't hit a barn from the inside. If you expected them to cull large numbers of animals, it ain't happening. They're all good guys, but some just hunt for fun and really aren't hardcore gun guys. I reckon it will be up to me and another guy to knock down as many as we can.

Thank you. My first thought, too.
:-)