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#7064453 - 11/11/12 Zim vs. Namibia Considerations  
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isaac Offline
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isaac  Offline
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Buff/leopard and plains game. Fall 2013,with my son.
My dime.

Is Zim still worth being included in the mix? I'm hearing and reading mixed reviews due to their government's malfeasance and intrusions.

I love Namib and feel rather confident I could organize a solid adventure there but I also have a desire to experience Zimbabwe,especially since I first hunted in Namibia. I'd be content to book Zim if you guys feel the concerns are overblown.

Have any of you Africa vets written off Zim for the time being or would you still have no hesitation booking Zim for a safari?


The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward




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#7064488 - 11/11/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: isaac]  
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dukxdog Online content
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Myself and all the guys I've sent there have not ever had any problems in the country or getting trophies out. I too love Namibia.


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#7064587 - 11/11/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: dukxdog]  
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ODay450 Offline
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Bob,

I was in Zim in June of this year and living conditions were better than when I was there in 2009. You will need to be very careful in selecting an area to hunt if you want a good chance of success for buff, leopard, and plains game. I have hunted in both the Zambezi valley and the Midlands and plains game was not plentiful in the areas I hunted. Also, in some areas leopard is a full time hunt as the educated cats are difficult (Midlands). Areas in the Save might be a good place to look as leopard and plains game have been reported in good numbers but that was before the current land grab problems.

I will go back and I suggest that you can have a great hunt if you pick one of the well known, ethical, and honest outfitters and a good area. I would not worry about the politics or safety unless there is a revolution the week you leave. Your outfitter will keep you safe and the govt needs your business.

I haven't been to Namibia but am considering it and Mozambique for next year. Moz has areas reported to have good success on both the DG and PG. but again, there are both good and dodgy outfitters. Good luck in whatever you choose.


Maryland - Where the criminals are the government.
#7064607 - 11/11/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: isaac]  
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ingwe Offline
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Namibia is a lot more of a sure bet Bob...


He spoke in tears of 15 years his dog and him traveled about. The dog up and died. She up and died....After 20 years he still grieves.
#7064646 - 11/11/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: ingwe]  
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isaac Offline
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Northern Virginia
Thanks guys.

Oday...PG would largely be a aside and a opportunity for my son to be introduced to hunting in Africa. I'd only desire a mtn zebra and possibly larger kudu,gemsbok and warthog than the ones I took in Namib last year.

Tom...I'm tending to lean more towards the sure bet safeguard. I'm figuring 35K plus all said and done and I wish to be as close to sure bet as I can possibly be.

Leopard is my bucket list priority and the main reason I'm going back,aside from sharing the experience with my son. Buff can wait,if necessary,but I want my son to have his own hunting itinerary and he for darn sure isn't going to shoot my leopard. Well, I don't think he is,anyways.

Thanks to all for their input.


The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward




#7064685 - 11/11/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: isaac]  
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jorgeI Offline
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My vote still goes to Zim for buff & leopard. Either Chewore or the Bubyee. That said if money's not a big consideration, Tanzania and the Selous.


Teddy Roosevelt, John Wayne, Winston Churchill paid to hunt...
#7064724 - 11/11/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: isaac]  
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PieterKriel Offline
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[quote=RISJR]Oday...PG would largely be a aside and a opportunity for my son to be introduced to hunting in Africa. I'd only desire a mtn zebra and possibly larger kudu,gemsbok and warthog than the ones I took in Namib last year./quote]

Mtn zebra does not occur in Zim. If booking with a reputable outfitter you will be fine. At this point in time the one consideration with regards to Zim will be what old man Bob is up to. I think he may be fixing to trade places with Mother Earth and a hot place. That being said he may have the hot place on hold for another year or two as he is the one that can cheat the devil himself.


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#7064828 - 11/11/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: PieterKriel]  
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teal Offline
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Kewaunee - on the lake
Dad?


Andrew

#7064834 - 11/11/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: teal]  
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isaac Offline
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Robert Mugabe,Zimbabwe's ruler.


The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward




#7064863 - 11/11/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: isaac]  
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teal Offline
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Kewaunee - on the lake
I know who Peter was talking about - I was calling you dad.

I need a leopard.


Andrew

#7064873 - 11/11/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: teal]  
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isaac Offline
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isaac  Offline
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Sorry Andrew. If my son ditches me after getting his girlfriend back here from Columbia,I'd be happy to let you tag along...as my Gunga.


The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward




#7077792 - 11/15/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: isaac]  
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tim416 Offline
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I have been hunting and arranging hunts in Zim since 1996. We have never had an issue with getting trophies out or with clients taking thier desired trophies. As has been mentioned earlier it is essential that you book with one of the reputable outfitters in Zim. I spend one two three months each season in Zim and still think it still offers great value for the abundance and quality of game. You mentioned Gemsbuck and Mt. Zebra which are not available on quota in Zim. There are several areas that have been taken over by nefarious characters, some of which are on the sactions list. Bubye Conservancy is a great option with plenty of buff and plains game. The Save Valley is known for its abundance of plain game and ample supply of buff. The Bubye books up far in advance. The Save has come under some pressure this year with government officials siezing many of the hunting areas within the Save. The Matetsi area is very good for both buff and plains game but not every unit in the Matetsi should be considered. The Omay is very good as well.

#7079472 - 11/15/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: tim416]  
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Fjold Offline
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Just from what I've picked up word of mouth. In Zim leopards are bigger and plains game more plentiful in the south. Buff seems to be more plentiful in the Zambezi and Save. The save also has good plains game from what I've heard but I don't know bout leopards.


Frank

"I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money."

Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953
#7080664 - 11/16/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: Fjold]  
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tim416 Offline
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Maine
I am not sure regarding size if Zim leopards on average are larger than Namibia or not. In regards to game populations. There are areas where game is more plentiful than others. I think this has more to do with the particular concession rather than the geographic location somewhat. For instance, I have been hunting Matetsi Unit 1 since 1999. We conducted eighteen buffalo hunts on this concession this past year with 100% success. A few neighboring concessions average less than 75% on buffalo even though they are only a few miles away. This has to do with the abundance of water on Unit 1 which has a tendency to keep large herds of buffalo in the area. These same areas which struggle somewhat for buffalo compared to unit 1 hold elephant that are much larger on average than unit 1 due to the flora and fauna in those areas, again only a few miles away. The Save and Bubye conservancy arguably have the largest populations of plains game simply because of the outstanding job they have done at game management, again not necessarily do to where they are located. When considering a leopard hunt in Zim you must remember that some concessions allow night hunting and some, the government concessions, do not. This definitely has an impact on your chances for success. Matetsi being owned by the government does not allow night hunting. We had a success rate last year on four leopard of 50%.

#7080707 - 11/16/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: tim416]  
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maddog Offline
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Indiana
Bob, haven't hunted Namibia, but as you know, my son and I were in Zim., last summer. I know you want a leopard, and I think your chances are much better in Zim, provided you use a reputable outfitter. If you were just after buff/plains game, it would be more of a toss up. I'd go back to DSC, in January and talk directly to the outfitters from both countries. My son and I had absolutely zero problems while there. Here is a small list of outfitters I'd talk to.

Martin Pieters Safaris
Charleton/McCallum Safaris
John Sharp
Zambezi Hunters-Terry Labat[sp]

There are others, but the above would be a good start, plus they will all be at Dallas. Good luck!


maddog

#7080725 - 11/16/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: Fjold]  
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Winchestermodel70 Offline
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I hunted Namibia this year for leopard and PG and it was a completely successful and enjoyable hunt. I got my leopard on the first day and in doing so, completed the Big Five. Game density and trophy quality were high. We saw no evidence of poaching. Namibia is a stable and safe country. I stayed in a tented camp, but it was quite comfortable in every respect. It was my first trip to Namibia and I liked it so well that I booked an elephant hunt in the Caprivi for 2014.

I have hunted Zim multiple times, most recently in 2010 and 2011. In 2010, I took an excellent buffalo and an elephant. In 2011, a lion in Matetsi Unit 3. I have never had the slightest problem in Zim and would not hesitate to go there again. It is "wilder" than Namibia and the areas I hunted were more remote. There was considerable evidence of poaching. My only complaint was that in the areas I hunted, leopard could only be taken from a half hour before sunrise to a half hour after sunset. The end result was that I spent 42 days (over the course of two safaris) and never even saw a leopard! There are areas, such as Dande and Matabeleland where pre-baiting and hunting at night is permitted. I suggest you investigate what is permissible in the area you wish to hunt prior to booking.

BTW, my Namibian leopard was shot in broad daylight about an hour before sunset!

Good hunting.

#7080731 - 11/16/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: maddog]  
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jorgeI Offline
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There is some truth, backed up by facts regarding the size of leopards in the Zim Lowveldt. Two interesting data points; cats in the Lowveldt, just like coastal brown bears compared to grizslys are bigger because of a much richer diet. For years the Lowveldt was cattle country and leopards, the only survivors after ranchers got rid of lions and Hyenas also grew lazy. When one baits cats down there, baits are usually either low or on the ground because leopards had no other predator (aside from Badgers, etc) to deal with. Good Outfitters and PHs in Zim average in the 90 percentile when it comes to leopards, at least the ones I am familiar with. My sources for the above info are John Sharp, Andrew Dawson, and Mark Young to name a few. All outstanding reputations.


Teddy Roosevelt, John Wayne, Winston Churchill paid to hunt...
#7081581 - 11/16/12 Re: Zim vs. Namibia Considerations [Re: jorgeI]  
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PieterKriel Offline
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Pretoria, South Africa
Victoria Falls yields great success on leopard and we took a brilliant old buffalo there last year.

Couple years ago we took a 6' 7" leopard at 128 lbs in South Africa. He was full of porcupine quills and was obviously a majestic cat in his day.

The luck of the draw is what counts, BUT, you have to be there and have a rifle before anything counts.


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