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Campfire Regular
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The 700 design is not enough gun! Get a rifle with CRF (control round feed) so that it will not double feed and jam and a M70 type safety. What are the ranges there for the black bear shooting? Broken 700 extractor: ![[Linked Image]](http://imageshack.us/a/img440/2291/m700extractoriwasoutsho.jpg) I better sell all my Remington and Weatherby's..are you serious?? The 270 and a Nosler PT is a good choice though I do like the 338-06 suggestion.
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Joined: Oct 2002
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Campfire Tracker
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I shot my 3 bear with a .270 win./130 gr Rem. core-loc bullets. The first one was 100 lb bear in the head. DRT. Second bear I shot broadside through the lungs. It blew out a piece of rib on it's way out. It hit no other bone. The bear ran off 125 yds and there was very little blood. A bear is very hard to track with leaves on the trees. I found the bear but if I had to look 5 more minutes it would have spoiled cause I never would have found it that night. It was 224 gutted. A nice young male. I decided to never use a .270 Win for bear again and a 45-70 gov. would make a bigger hole for better blood trails. Four years later I shot another bear with my .270 win., only 107 lbs gutted but another head shot and DRT. Last year my 25 yr. old son got a kill tag and said he only wanted to use his .270 Win. I went with 150 gr Hornady. At 18 yds quartering a bit to him he blasted through the front shoulder, blew the heart to pieces and out the bottom. The bear went 20 ft and was 206 lb gutted. I will shoot through front shoulders from now on to keep them from running. I am sure any other gun would not have done better. The load was IMR 4350/ 53gr 150 gr. Hornady interlock, 22 bucks a 100 pack. Just my experience.
But the fruits of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness,faithfulness, Gentleness and self control. Against such things there is no law. Galations 5: 22&23
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Joined: Jul 2007
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Jeff, I suspect that your .270 is plenty of gun.
That said, I've used black bear as a great excuse for a bigger gun! My son uses a .30-06, and (ahem) I used a .375 H&H with a 260 gr Nosler. Did a fine job at a tad over 300 yards... Blood trail? Yeah, it was about two feet wide and eight or ten feet long, ending in a very dead bear.
Did I "need" a .375? No, of course not! But it was a great excuse and a lot of fun. One of these days I may even smack an elk, or hopefully a moose with it!
Enjoy your hunt - and get the bigger rifle if you want it!
Regards, Guy
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Joined: Apr 2001
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Yeepers, real world here if a fella can't get it done with a .270 and or questions the .270's capability as a black bear round then I say it's time to take up ping pong or something else...
Amazes the crapola out of me (well not really) that there's people in the world who can be so inexperienced as to actually think that the .270 somehow aint quite enough gun.
This semi rant isn't directed towards the OP either and welcome to the Fire by the way.
Now if a fella can't take out 100 lb rockchucks that hibernate with a .270 then I say make a move towards a 223 and a 64 PP!
Dober
Last edited by Mark R Dobrenski; 02/08/13.
"True respect starts with the way you treat others, and it is earned over a lifetime of demonstrating kindness, honor and dignity"....Tony Dungy
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Tracker
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Sounds like we should be helping this new campfire friend to rationalize buying a big bore rifle. The pic below is from a small black bear, maybe 130 lbs. live weight. Think about how much bigger the claws (and teeth) of a full size bear would be and let your imagination drive selection of your new bear rifle! ![[Linked Image]](http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s199/lokanagan/IMG_2834.jpg)
Last edited by Okanagan; 02/08/13.
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New Member
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OP
New Member
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Great advice guys, Keep it coming!
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2009
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Sounds like we should be helping this new campfire friend to rationalize buying a big bore rifle. The pic below is from a small black bear, maybe 130 lbs. live weight. Think about how much bigger the claws (and teeth) of a full size bear would be and let your imagination drive selection of your new bear rifle! Deer have nasty sharp pointy hooves and antler tines that could skewer you completely through. Does that mean you need to pack a 416 Rigby for deer?
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Joined: Jan 2013
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New Member
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New Member
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Killed my black bear in Alaska with my 30.06...190 gain
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2003
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.....I am afraid that my Rem 700 .270 is not enough gun... Jeff It makes them go "all loose"... I've heard that terminology somewhere.  I killed one with a slow, soft 45-70 slug one time; right through both shoulders; went straight down. Then recovered enough after a few seconds to plow its way off into the forest without the use of its front end. Unlike many of the ungulates often do, bears can fight 'the inevitable' and sometimes make their recovery a bit more challenging. Nothing wrong with a 270, but never assume they will just lie down where you poke them either. Tracking ain't just a convenient skill to have. 
Sometimes, the air you 'let in'matters less than the air you 'let out'.
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Joined: Jun 2012
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Campfire Member
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Well now I think ill relate a story about one of my blak bear hunts and you al can decide for youselves whatgun you would like to carry. Here baiting isn't legal. Ichoose to still hunt for bear and the terrainn is mountain Forrest and wet lands. Mighty thick in spots. Anyway I use a single shot rifle with spare ammo on my pack belt. I had taken my pack off to sit and have a coffee and I heard a noise behind me, I stepped out around a tree I was sitting against and a nice bear stepped out maybe 20 yards away. I fired and the bear turned right towards me and charged. I reached for another round but the ammo was laying on the ground with my pack. I grabbed the rifle like a ball bat and stepped behind the tree just as the bear ran past. It went maybe another 20 yards past me and went down. I retrieved a bullet and put another in him and when he twitched still another. Later I was to discover that my first shot with the 270 gr. 444 broke both front shoulders and lodged just under the skin on the far side. Ow it was able to run is beyond me. As to the charge it may have been simply a mattervof the bear turning into the shot as they often do and it may have been unaware of me. At any rate shooting a bear at long distance or from an elevated stand is one thing but for up close and personal bear I like big bore. For this type of bear hunt I wil pass on the .223's, 270 or 30-30's.
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Joined: Jan 2001
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Adirondackbushwhack, Great story! Since he ran past, you are probably correct about why he ran toward you. Sometimes we have had bears and other game "charge" or run toward us when they hear the echo of a shot off a wall of timber at the edge of a clearcut, or off a bluff, etc. The echo is closer to them than the actual shot and they apparently run from that sound. A parrallel story: An acquaintance of limited hunting experience but deep pockets was after a black bear with an old wolfer friend of mine. The proper novice had his new 375 H&H (and his grizzled companion had a .243 for back up!) The hunter missed his first shot at 40 yards and the bear ran straight toward him, apparently confused by the sound in a ravine/bowl. The hunter and bear were both scared and when the bear realized he was running toward a man, he reversed course. The hunter put a Nosler Partiton in his hind end that stopped under the hide on his forehead. I helped with the skinning. Shot him right between the eyes! Bear killing calibers IME: tire iron, old style Bear razorhead from a recuve bow, compound bows & various high tech arrows, .22 long rifle, 22-250, .243, 6mm Rem., 25-06, 6.5 Swede, 270, 280, 7mm Rem. mag., 30-30, 30-06, .300 Win. mag, 338 Win. mag, 375 H&H, .44 mag. pistol;. 12 guage shotgun. I haven't done all the shooting, and have likely left out one or two. 270 will do. If you want a new rifle it is a prime opportunity: As Rahm Emmanual says, never let a good reason to buy a rifle go to waste!  One added comment, dead serious, all joking aside: When hunting the wet side of BC, no snow and virtually impossible tracking surface for a soft footed animal, I REALLY want a blood trail. An exit hole more than doubles chances of the critter leaking enough to track on duff, moss, etc. That is more a function of bullet than of caliber.
Last edited by Okanagan; 02/09/13.
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30-30 is a KEEPER! Sherwood ![[Linked Image]](http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c146/rushmoreman/black_bear_pic_.jpg)
FIRE UP THE GRILL - is NOT catch and release!
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Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
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Adirondackbushwhack, Great story! Since he ran past, you are probably correct about why he ran toward you. Sometimes we have had bears and other game "charge" or run toward us when they hear the echo of a shot off a wall of timber at the edge of a clearcut, or off a bluff, etc. The echo is closer to them than the actual shot and they apparently run from that sound. A parrallel story: An acquaintance of limited hunting experience but deep pockets was after a black bear with an old wolfer friend of mine. The proper novice had his new 375 H&H (and his grizzled companion had a .243 for back up!) The hunter missed his first shot at 40 yards and the bear ran straight toward him, apparently confused by the sound in a ravine/bowl. The hunter and bear were both scared and when the bear realized he was running toward a man, he reversed course. The hunter put a Nosler Partiton in his hind end that stopped under the hide on his forehead. I helped with the skinning. Shot him right between the eyes! Bear killing calibers IME: tire iron, old style Bear razorhead from a recuve bow, compound bows & various high tech arrows, .22 long rifle, 22-250, .243, 6mm Rem., 25-06, 6.5 Swede, 270, 280, 7mm Rem. mag., 30-30, 30-06, .300 Win. mag, 338 Win. mag, 375 H&H, .44 mag. pistol;. 12 guage shotgun. I haven't done all the shooting, and have likely left out one or two. 270 will do. If you want a new rifle it is a prime opportunity: As Rahm Emmanual says, never let a good reason to buy a rifle go to waste! One added comment, dead serious, all joking aside: When hunting the wet side of BC, no snow and virtually impossible tracking surface for a soft footed animal, I REALLY want a blood trail. An exit hole more than doubles chances of the critter leaking enough to track on duff, moss, etc. That is more a function of bullet than of caliber. Thank you Okanagan. I enjoyed your story as well and it points to one of the enjoyable parts of hunting, you never know what is going to happen. I've long thought that animals, whitetail anyway, are not afraid of the sound of gunfire but rather are startled, not by the sound of a shot, but rather by the bullet striking something close to them or some movement of some kind. I've come to beleive that an animal is more likely to be alerted by the working of a bolt than they are from the sound of a rifle being fired. In the case of your friends bear I would guess that the bullet struck something behind the bear causing it to run towards your friend. I've in fact testeed my little theory and while doe were close by I've fired my rifle into the air. The result was that they didn't react in any way. Never tested it on bear though. I am in complete agreement about wanting/needing a blood trail but I take a different tactic. I have taken the position that I want a good blood trail even if complete pass through is not attained for some reason. To accomplish this I believe is a function of caliber. A minimum caliber of 35 is required for my idea of punching a nice leaky entrance hole into an animal and a flat nosed bullet makes a nicer entrance hole than a pointy one. I or my frieds have shot game with many cals from .243 to my 444 and there has come a time with every caliber that pass through was not achieved for whatever reason, hence my desire for a big entrance hole.
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Joined: Dec 2002
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2002
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I have hunted bears a lot and have hunted them in BC. The last outfitter I went hunting with said that they recommend a 30-06 as a sensible minimum. I get to see about 10 bears a year killed, not as many as some but a lot more than most.
I feel that the type of country you are hunting in dictates your choice in caliber to some degree. If you are hunting in thick stuff where a blood trail would be nice (they seldom drop at the shot) then a larger caliber is preferred. My buddy kills a bear every year and the last three have been killed by his 270WSM because it is his lightest rifle and we typically hike in several miles. He has had to track them as far as 300 yards for some reason. I told him it is a bad luck rifle! I shot mine with a 260AI this past season but it was in open country and I could pick my shot and watch him run- which he did. I found a enough blood to track him down and finish him off. I didn't get both lungs, only one.
I am going to hunt with a bigger rifle next season- at least for bear. I want them to stay where I shoot them. That is reason enough. Sure, a 270 is 'adequate' for black bears but it isn't ideal. A 30-06 is a nice step up and a 300 magnum would make more sense seeing as you already have the 270. My experiences in BC were in thick timber. I used a 30-06 with 180 Partitions. In Alaska I used a 375 H&H as it was an area with more grizzlies that blacks.
Use this excuse to get a new rifle. Don't get something exotic for which you will not be able to find ammo (338-06 et al). Get a medium caliber or 30 caliber magnum. Knock the soup out of that bear!!
NRA Benefactor Member
Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.
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Campfire Ranger
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Dennis-I find it curious that you've had runners on black bruins via the 270 WSM. Which slug is your friend using and how far have they been running (normally)?
Thx
Dober
"True respect starts with the way you treat others, and it is earned over a lifetime of demonstrating kindness, honor and dignity"....Tony Dungy
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I feel that the type of country you are hunting in dictates your choice in caliber to some degree. If you are hunting in thick stuff where a blood trail would be nice (they seldom drop at the shot) then a larger caliber is preferred.
You nailed it, dennisinaz. We hunt bears in wet jungle and I prefer a .30 or larger in our area because of my experience seeing a number of bears killed with .243-6mm. Larger bores aren't neccessary to kill a black bear, but to help find it if it runs. Good bullets push on through, and larger diameter ones usually make a bigger hole and leak more. If we have to blood trail, the bigger the hole the better. Black bears are nortorious for plugging exit holes with fat, especially Fall bears, so large exit holes are good. Anchor the bear on the spot with the first shot if you can. If that does not happen a blood trail is helpful anywhere and essential in some jungles. Our mileage does vary! (This topic reminds me of sheep hunting in grizzly country: a sheep is easy to kill and doesn't require a .338, but that is what most sheep hunters in Northern BC were carrying. The purpose for the .338 wasn't to kill sheep but for a secondary reason. Ditto for larger calibers on black bear in thick brushy country with no dirt to leave tracks: the purpose is not killing power but the secondary reason of tracking/finding power.)
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I've killed bears with a 3006, a 308, a 338wm, a 416 Rigby,and I've seen them killed with a dozen more cartridges, they all work and I'm sure your 270 will. As others have said your 270 is fine, use a good bullet and place it well. More important than the cartridge is placement of the bullet on a bear.
Bears are funny because it's all good until it's not all good and then it goes poorly rather fast. What I mean is that 9 out of 10 will have the good manners to drop or run a short way and drop, but every now and then you get a bear with an ill natured disposition.
I shot a bear a few years ago with my 338wm. At 50 odd yards, double lung, broke a shoulder, the bear took off. At about 100 yards, near the tree line I yelled at him, he stopped and looked at me, I put another through the lungs and he came straight for me. While he never made it his intent seemed clear.
When we cleaned him both shots had gone through the lungs and pulped the heart and lungs up, he just didn't care for about a minute.
Another one that a hunting partners, cousins, son wounded (his first bear) we went into some really thick stuff after. From his tracks he kept button hooking back to watch us. My partner mentioned to be cautious. I spotted him at about 25 feet coming around the root ball of a fallen tree then towards us. I double lunged him with the Rigby and he dropped in his tracks.
Another one was chasing a guy around a cold deck pile and one shot from a 308 dropped him in his tracks.
My point is that sometimes they drop and sometimes they don't and with the exception of the Rigby from 270 to 338wm there doesn't seem to be much difference in how fast they go down. I think the disposition of the individual bear makes more of a difference.
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(This topic reminds me of sheep hunting in grizzly country: a sheep is easy to kill and doesn't require a .338, but that is what most sheep hunters in Northern BC were carrying. The purpose for the .338 wasn't to kill sheep but for a secondary reason. Ditto for larger calibers on black bear in thick brushy country with no dirt to leave tracks: the purpose is not killing power but the secondary reason of tracking/finding power.)
This is why I hunt elk and moose with my 338wm.
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