Home Forums Birds & Dogs Shotguns Looking for a 16 ga

I was looking at som Browning A5 shotguns the other day and forgot how well they feel, is there "sweet 16" built on a 16 ga receiver?

The sweet 16 is lighter than the A5 16.

What is the diff?

Try and find an early BRNO sidelock as they are built lean on a proper frame, hell for stout and can be had at very reasonable prices. My 16 bore below.

I have spent a lot of time behind 16 ga M-12s going bang. I have seen Remington hulls have trouble ejecting out of 2-3/4 inch chambers, but never Winchester or Federal plastic hulls. I have four or five 16 ga M-12s in the safe now including a 1913 gun.

Dave

I think I must have been born lucky, as I have been spared the issue of shells hanging up in the 16 gauge Model 12 - this one is a 1947 model. I shoot Super-X, Remington Express and Game Loads, Federal blue box and Premiums, and Estate - none have hung up on me.

PM sent...

I've had more than a few M-12s and have seen the ejection problem a couple of times. It is not related to one specific brand of ammo. But... an individual gun can seem to dislike a specific brand. Personally, I don't think it's a length issue. There's not that much difference in the length brand to brand or lot to lot. I also do not believe it's related to chamber length. Like Phil, I have a 1913 16 (nice old solid rib gun) that does not seem to be picky.

I can say for certain after building a couple of franken guns out of parts of 6-8 others that fitting and timing can be a bitch and certainly can make this happen. We have basically lost all the people who know how to tune a M-12 and who know about the differences in the parts across 50 years of manufacture. My current project gun has a late forties barrel extension, an early forties receiver, It has a late fifties barrel with a potato on the end and now has a fifties skeet barrel. I have no idea of the age of the bolt and magazine tube. The trigger group also does not match the receiver and I still have to replace the lifter, but need to figure out which one I need. Currently it shoots well and feeds/ejects properly.

I do not know of a smith who specializes in M-12s anymore.

I find Citoris to be a little on the clubby side for my taste in grouse guns. If you want to look for something light quick and less clubby, try looking for Charles Daly 20s. Some of them are very nice. 101 20s can be really nice too. I had a super light super quick 20 gauge skeet gun that I really liked but couldn't shoot consistently. One day everything I shot at fell out of the sky, the next I couldn't hit the ground. I shot a 101 pigeon with Winchokes for a lot of years, and That's a nice light quick gun even with a heavy figured walnut stock. They're pretty hard to find too though. Franchi Falconets are nice an really light 20s too. I passed on a Titanium O/U some years back that may have also been a Franchi, but I don't remember the model.

Ithaca model 37 16ga is sized for the gauge. I bought one recently and like it over my 12ga Model 12. Less parts and a better design overall IMO.

Get yourself a 16 ga. Remington 870. Preferably one with a plain(rib-less), fixed-choke barrel, and a corncob for-end.

Or, if you have the money to spend, and the time to look, get a 16 ga. Remington 31.

I had an 870 16ga with all 3 chokes and plain barrels. My son has it now. I bought an Ithaca 37 16ga with a poly choke and I'm not looking back.

16 gauge 870's are on a 12 gauge frame and end up being heavier than the 12. Might as well have a 12 to begin with.

The A-5 and the old Ithicas and M12s were on 16 ga frames. I have had a light 12 for fifty years. I scrimped and saved so much to get it that it is here for the long haul. I have also had a Light 20 and a Sweet 16. They left during my gun of the week/month period. Dumb.

I tried the Citori. Too heavy gor what you get. Bank vault strong, but clunky.

One poster mentioned that the Ithica 37 droped live ammo out the bottom. That was what doomed my 12 ga. Neither I nor the smith could figure it out at the time. My brother's 20 never developed that problem.

Jack

The Model 12s were actually built on a modified 20 gauge frame.

The new BPSs are made on modified 20 gauge frames too. You can see the taper in the barrels to get the screw chokes in the current make of Brownings, BPS or Citori. You don't see this in any other make.

The A5s were gauge specific. The difference between a Standard weight and a Sweet was some holes drilled into the barrel and chamber areas of the barrels to lighten the Sweets.

The 870s are, and always have been built on 12 gauge frames, same as the 1100, the difference in weight is in the barrels. The new non-toxic mandate and Remington bottom line has changed barrel construction, that's the biggest difference between old and new manufacture. You see the same thing when comparing old manufacture 12 gauges.

Remington's accountants and MBAs have killed the sweet handling of the pre-90's 870s.

Just got back from SD took my model 12 16 Gauge Poly choke and model 12 12 Gauge Mod choke. Shot the the 12 gauge better as it does not have pad and fits me. The model 12 16 is a joy to carry and faster handling. Love the simplistic way to load and unload for fence crossings. Compared to the BPS wish someone had a tang safety mod. for a model 12.

The Federal shells hang up in the 16, Fed shells are longer and crimp star is different. Win, Rems, Fiocchi all work great. Going to have local smith open up ejection port. But non toxic is tough to find.

Need a factory plastic but plate for the 16 any ideas?
Stock has not been cut.

I'm partial to SXS's. The only reason I would go 16 over 12 is weight. Many 12's are just as light as 16's and some lighter.

Here are a few 16's
Well. for some reason I can't get the links to work. Check out Cabela's gun library and search the 16 ga's. They have a very nice refinished Parker Trojan and a nice Ithaca in your price range.

I personally think the Merkel 1620 would be the perfect upland game gun in 16 ga at 5.95 lbs. but the price tag is a bit salty. I picked up a nice light 12 ga Merkel model 8 this year for just $650 so bargains do exist if you are patient.

The Browning Sweet 16 is about half a pound lighter than the regular 16 gauge A5. The Sweet 16 will normally weigh about 6 3/4 lbs. The difference is that the Sweet has holes drilled in the barrel ring, some metal removed from the receiver, hollow areas in the buttstock and a bit less wood in the forearm.

I bought a nice Sweet 16 a couple years ago and it carries easily and points like the Wand of Death. It has also NEVER malfunctioned, although you should be aware of the need to change the spring arrangement when switching from light to heavy loads. It takes about a minute to do this.

The older Model 12 were a 2 1/2 in chamber. Here is a source where I buy ammo for mine.

http://www.polywad.com/vintager.html

Looked at 2 Winchester Model 12,s, 16 Gauge one was Win 12 16 Gauge 2 3/4 "

2nd marked Win 1912 16 Gauge, not marked for length. Ejection port on the 1912 model was over 1/16 " shorter. Which would be made for 2 9/16 " shells.

Could not resist bring home a like new 20 Gauge solid rib, Win Model 12. Made in 1942.