Home Forums Birds & Dogs Turkey Hunting How is this for a pattern?

I'm working on getting my first shotgun ready for it's first turkey season (last season I borrowed one). Is this pattern OK or should I be trying something different?


Beretta Optima HP Extra Full Choke
Winchester Double X 3 1/2" with 2oz of #5
27 yards

Too many holes in the pattern. Try some 3" in number 5. The Win XX magnum shoots really well with number 5s in all of my shotguns.

If that doesn't work, try a couple turkey chokes. Th Indian Creek Black Diamond is hard to beat.

I'm no expert but looks pretty thin at that distance. I'd try and find a Truglo Strut stopper extreme (ssx) choke tube and give it another go. The Winchester double x or Federal Turkey Thugs from Walmart seem to be the best low cost options for ammo.

Thank you for the input.

I'm finding that the aftermarket choke selection for my gun is quite slim. I need Beretta Optima HP.

The gun came with a full choke, which measures at .691 according to my cheap calipers. I purchased Beretta's XF choke that measures at .689.

The only aftermarket one I can find is the Gobblin Thunder. According to their chart Kick's Industries, I should be using .680 with #5 3 1/2". Anyone think that is worth a try or should I go tighter at .675 or .670?

OPTIMA HP
#4 � 3" 680
#4 � 3 1/2" 680
#5 � 3" 675
#5 � 3 1/2" 680
#6 � 3" 670
#6 � 3 1/2" 675

I'd try some magnum blend before I changed anything else. Pattern looks a little light though imo.

www.oldgobbler.com


This place knows its stuff.

Already mentioned, but I wouldn't be surprised if 3in offerings did better.,

Sumtoy choke and 3" Hevi 7's or Mag Blend. The combo never dont work. Start with that combo in the beginning and you'll save time and money chasing what you're after.

Hevi shot is your friend

I did try a 3" shell with #4 but the results weren't any better. I'll upload that picture tonight.

yikes the hevi-shot is expensive. $35 for 5 shells?

i wish there was a combo pack you could buy that had 1 or 2 of various types of shells. that would help when breaking in a new gun.

Go to Old Gobbler like Bearcat suggested.
There is a lot of good information about Chokes & choke/shell combination choices, barrel polishing, deep cleaning barrels etc.
Look at the Turkey Gun Pattern pictures and compair yours to some of those. Keep in mind that some of the guys are looking for the most holes in a 10" circle at 40yds.
I would be more concerned with as even and consistant pattern at 40yds in a 20" circle. I would probably miss some turkeys with the super tight patterns they are shooting due to turkeys showing up at a different place than I expect them to at distances much closer than 40.

Did you try your full? The extra full may be to much relative to your bore diameter.

If you decide to shoot hevishot get the Hevi13 in 3.5" #6 or my favorite 3.5" #7. The #7's are serious stuff and have more than enough power for 50yds if need be. They are expensive but they are worth it. I shoot 7's from my 835 and my 870 20 gauge.


Here is a 20 gauge pattern @ 41yds - 16" circle:





I have another that I did not snap a pic of that is 229 - 16" and 147 - 10"

Yes. It is VERY expensive. I think there is still a rebate going now too though. I'd try the magnum blends or the #7's. Buy some mag blend and you'll probably be very happy. It gets less expensive once the research project is over.

Again thanks for the info. I started reading on oldgobbler.com and found that some guys with my gun have success with .660 chokes and hevi-shot #6. They also turned me on to a few more choke manufacturers and I am leaning towards on from Pure Gold.

I was planning to shoot #4 or #5 but it seems like a lot of people go with smaller pellets like #7. I'm just afraid that I'll end up with more pellets in the meat if I go with a smaller pellet.

Is that much of a concern when going from #4 to #7 shot?

Beretta Optima HP Extra Full Choke
Winchester Double X 3" with 1 3/4oz of #4
27 yards

Want less shot? Go with the Mag Blend. $30 well spent. I'll buy your left overs if it doesn't satisfy.

Pure Golds are a very good choke, I had one in my 835 for awhile.


The #7's have great penetration, I have not had any more #7's hang up in meat than #4 or #5 lead. The #6 Hevi13's are great too. I shot them for a few years and then switched to the 7's because I wanted as many pellets on target as possible.


Here is one of my 835 patterns with 3.5" 2oz #6's @ 22yds.

It put 15 OUTSIDE the 10". Personally I would like a tighter pattern than you are throwing.




41yds
Winchester XX 3" 1 7/8oz #5 - $6.47 at Wal-Mart

119 - 10"
210 - 20"




Here is my 835 + Pure Gold + Hevi13 3.5" 2.25oz #6's

Yep, I'd switch to Federal with flite control wad too...#4 shot works good....

No good as far as I'm concerned...

You can't eat what you can't kill.
If you have a good pattern with a good pellet count in the brain and neck you will be fine. Most shots are under 40 yards and most are in the 30 yard range. The reason people pattern at 40 yards is to check what most think is max range or worst case. At 30 or 25 you will have a much tighter pattern and if you shoot him in the head you will not have to worry too much about pellets in the meat.

I picked up a box of Hevi-Shot mag blend to try. And I'm looking for the Federal heavyweights in 3" #4 with flightcontrol but they were out of stock.

FYI Gander Mountain has the Hevi-Shot 3 1/2" mag blend for $29.99 + $10 mail in rebate. not a horrible price.

I'll report back...hopefully will get to pattern on Sunday.

If I were going to use the Fed Heavyweight it would not be in a #4. I would use #7's or at the biggest a #6. That stuff if way heavier than lead.
By the way the Fed Heavyweight has a rebate on it as well.

Pullet is right, #6 or #7. The point of hevishot is it's heavy, you shoot smaller pellets getting more in the air and on target.

From what I have seen you can drop down 2 sizes from lead to hevishot for similar penetration. That's like the magblends, they are great shells, but they are about 5% #5's, 5%-10% #6's and the rest 7's so I just shoot 7's.

lead shot is 11 g/cm3

Hevi shot is 13 g/cm3

Heavyweight is 15 g/cm3

The heavier the more energy it will carry and the deeper it will penetrate therefore you can go smaller in shot size which will give you more shot in a shell and give you more pellets on target.

great info. and thanks for the tip about the Federal rebate. it's $7.50 cash back on up to 2 boxes of the heavyweight. that puts the price right around $20 per 5, right around the cost of hevi-shot.

Here's 3" Hevi Magnum Blend from a 21" barreled 870 with .665 Jelly Head at 45 yards. I aint scared of a short barrel. The Sumtoy choke gave a tighter pattern, but more tight than I wish at 18 yards so I went with the Jelly Head. The Hevi 7's gave a more dense pattern but I like the thump of the few extra #5's and 6's so Mag blend it is. You can see the larger holes in the target.

Sorry guys, I don't draw circles, mark each shot, and count them. I eyeball it and rock on. This is a standard size poster board (28"x22")and a dead arss gobbler at 45 yet still plenty wide enough to be comforting up close.

Pullit is right, if you go with any denser than lead shot then there is absolutely no need to go any bigger than number 6 shot. 6's or 7's will hold a killing pattern much farther than 4's or 5's and will kill just as far as they hold a dense enough pattern.

Get a good aftermarket turkey choke. Indian Creek, Hevishot, Pure Gold, Rhino, Sumtoy, or even a Primos Jellyhead.

Shoot at a dot centered on a full sheet of poster paper. That way you can see what the whole pattern is doing and if your gun isn't throwing patterns perfectly in line with the sight. You may need and adjustable sight to correct that if it isn't.

AGREE 100%

That's a turkey killing sombeesh right there...Nuff said...

I've decided to order a Pure Gold 670. It should do well with the mag blend.
They also make a Pure Gold 660 but they say it works best with the #6 and #7s. I like the idea of having some #5s mixed in and I don't want the pattern to be too tight at close range.

My Rem 870 does quite well with Magnum blend and the IC Black Diamond Strike. Shot a big gobbler at 50 yards in NE last year. Very long range for me. All previous birds were taken between 10 and 30 yards. I had no chance at all to get any closer, as there were 6 or 7 strutters with 8-10 hens and only ankle high grass. My buds were surprised I got that close. They hung back about 150 yards and called for me.

That was the second bird I killed in NE with that blend. The first was at about 10 yards. Hunting pard shot his second bird at almost 60 yards with the same load in 3 1/2". I stick with the 3". Plenty is good enough for me, in this case. First class stuff.

Didn't realize the Fed Heavyweight is that much heavier than heavy shot!! Thanks for the info.

Good luck with your new rig jd. And enjoy the season.

A pattern board is essential to see where the center of your pattern is. Sometimes all you need is to adjust your sights to get your best pattern and leave your choke and load alone.

To make a portable pattern target for shotguns (essential for testing various loads), you will need to get some conduit, 1x4 scrap, some small threaded bolts/nuts and fender washers and some re-bar. Pick up roll of brown builders paper too. The roll of paper can be found in Home Depot or Lowes. Other paper can be used, but the builders paper is pretty heavy duty, and easy to use off the roll. I had most of this stuff as scrap in my garage.

The conduit is used as the 2 long legs of the target stand. Make them as long (high) as you need for standing up to shoot your bow (I have used this frame to paper tune my bow also), shooting off a bench, or sitting against a tree shooting at ground level (as if you were turkey hunting). The 1x4's are used as the frame to staple the paper on. Since the kraft paper is 32" wide on the roll, that is the width of the frame. The length can be what you want, but mine is a 32"'x32' square.

Take the 1x4's and bolt them to the 2 conduit legs (across and along the conduit) forming a square frame. The paper is stapled onto the wood (staple gun). A couple of 15-20" re-bar pieces are hammered into the ground, and the conduit legs slip over them to stand it up. Draw a target circle in the center. I also tape on turkey targets.

I have used this stand for years, and it works great.

I have used shipping pallets in the past. Fast easy and you can find them almost anywhere. The down side is they are heavy.
Just staple paper target to it and shoot away.

While talking target boards, here's an old post on how I made mine:

It takes about an hour to make and only cost me $32 inculding paper and tax.

Materials needed(Home Depot):

2- 1" PVC Elbows(.44 each)
2- 1"x1"x1" PVC Ts(.56 each)
2- 1"x1/2"x1" PVC Ts(.93 each)
1- 1/2" SC40 PVC Conduit joint 10' (1.09 each)
2- 1" SC40 PVC Conduit joints 10' (2.30 each)
1- Box of 100 #8x1/2" round head sheet metal screws(2.87 each bx)
1- 4" PVC Drain pipe 10' (7.82 each)
1- 35" wide 140 ft roll of contractors paper(9.97 each) (in the paint section)
1- 1x6 fence picket (cheap)
2- Paper clamps(had them on hand, have no idea what they cost)

Cut 2 1" conduits 37-1/4" long
Cut 1 1" conduit 37" long
Cut 1 1/2" conduit 37-1/8" long
Cut 4 1" conduits 10-12" long
Cut 2 1" conduits 2-1/8" long
Cut 1 4" PVC piece 36-3/4" long

37-1/4" 1" pieces are the sides
37 1" is top
37-1/8" is the paper roll axle
4-10" pieces are the feet
2-1/8" piece are just connections from the 1x1/2x1 tees to connect the feet Ts

Assemble all PVC, Square, drill pilot holes slightly smaller than #8 screw at every joint(3 per Tee), screw a screw in every joint hole, cut a slit all the way down the 4" 36-3/4 pipe, insert paper roll and while inserting pull tab of paper through slit and slide roll into pipe, unscrew one side of 1/2" axle and pull from joint, slide paper roll/4" pipe onto axle, reinsert axle in T, replace screw into axle, Drill 3/8" hole in one side of clamp, drill 1/8" hole in other side of clamp, remove one clamp arm on the small hole side, level clamp on top 2" back from elbow, mark through big hole and little hole onto the pipe, drill small pilot hole at marks, insert screw through 3/8 hole and screw to top pipe, cut fence picket 36-7/8"

I did not glue anything incase something breaks you can just replace one piece instead of the hole thing.

Once you set up the target stand prop fence picket 1x6 against the 4" PVC to keep stray pellets from busting the pipe. You now have a sweet target stand that's light weight and beats the heck out of moving a 3/4" sheet of plywood around. I have a portable Big Game shooting bench and this set-up is easy to move around to get out of the wind, find a shady spot, take to the camp, etc etc.....

Here's the finish product less the fence picket:

Back:

Front:







Ya'll have a Good One,

loder

thats awesome. i like the use of the roll of paper and the clips. i'm afraid i'll shoot the PVC though.

You probably will. Over time I busted the PVC on mine with guns that were off or stray pellets, so I later upgraded. I found that 1.25" EMT fit just over the 1" PVC, so I cut 3 pieces to fit inbetween the PVC fittings(sides and top piece) and she's been tough ever since. The EMT also gave it some weight, so it stands in wind now.

As far as your patterns, that's very unacceptable for hunting IMO. You want at least 100 hits inside a 10" circle to ensure a clean kill every time. Draw the circle after the shot, so you get the true core. You will find that most shotguns do not shoot true to point of aim, so it's best to shoot large 3'x3' sheets of paper. You will also find that the POI differs from one choke to the next. Adjustable sights cure this issue. Some guns will shoot true, but most will not. Tight turkey loads and chokes amplifies the issue.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with running cheap lead for a solid 40-45yd turkey rig, but it takes a good choke, good bbl, and good lead shells. I like Winchester's various 3" lead #6 loads, but the Walmart Federal Turkey Thug #6s are putting up good numbers as well. Don't feel under gunned with lead 6s, they'll hold killing energy much further than the pattern will stay 100 in the 10in. I've killed two with lead 6s at 65yds and 60yds over the years on very poor range jusdgements. I'd never suggest shots that far with lead, just pointing out that the energy is there. The 10" is the common judgement as a turkey's skull and neck bone are about that length and one hit per sq inch usuaully gives multiple strikes. That's only 80, but 100 is the std for a safety factor. Not to mention wind and temp effect your numbers, so a cushion is always welcome.

Good luck getting your turkey gun lined out.

loder

Back with an update.

I did more patterning with a Pure Gold 670 choke and 3 1/2" Hevi shot magblend. On my previous attempts I did not have either the choke or the magblend, so this is not an apples to apples comparison.

Check out the difference though:
On the left
37 yds
.689 choke
Winchester XX #5

On the right
50 yds
.670 choke
hevishot magblend

full size jpg: http://dianaandjacob.com/images/imisc/Beretta 312 50yds.jpg

Here is the real shocker though. Many of you recommended the Federal Flitecontrol shells. These make a huge difference.

This is different gun than the one I have been sharing pictures off. This one is a 30 year old beaten up Mossberg 500 with non-threaded barrel (I think it is a full choke).

Again, not an equal comparison since there are more BBs in the #6 vs #4. But the pattern is so much tighter with the Federal Flightcontrol.

On the left
27 yds
Winchester XX #4

On the right
25 yds
Federal heavyweight #6

full size jpg: http://dianaandjacob.com/images/imisc/Beretta 3 25yds.jpg

That mag blend at 50 yds looks acceptable. Did you shoot it at 25 to compare it against the federal? I'd say keep the yardage the same so that you get a good comparison...just my 2

Much better, now go kill turkeys

I agree!

the mag blend is amazing. granted with #5/6/7 shot, there are going to be more holes than just #5.

On the left
27 yds
.689 choke
Winchester XX #5

On the right
27 yds
.670 Pure Gold choke
hevishot magblend

full size jpg: http://dianaandjacob.com/images/imisc/Beretta 312 25yds.jpg

Yes sir. That'll kill one.

You are on the right track and good to go.