Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Single Shots 45/70 Browning/Winchester High Wall

What is the general opinion of the High Wall replicas made by Browning? I have seen one in 45/70 that I may try to pick up soon.

They shoot well if you are talking about the BPCR version. Nice target rifles. Possibly the best in their class off the racks.

Downside is very difficult to reassemble if stripped.

It is the BPCR version. What is the problem with reassembly? Are there springs that are hard to depress?


edit: It is not the BPCR version with the tang sight, globe front sight, and rifling specifically for BP and lead bullets but rather the regular 45/70 version with buckhorn sights on the barrel. That is fine with me because I will probably not use a whole lot of BP in it and because I will probably not be using it in matches that require long range precision.

I'm not a expert on why it is hard to reassemble. I am very familiar with the original Highwall action and own three of them. They are easy to deal with. The new version is completely different under the skin. Someone in San Diego makes a jig or kit for reassembling them. If you post a note on the BPCR forum on this site you will run into a few folks that know more about them. Paul39 and TexasMac among others know a lot about them.

The "regular" .45-70 is lead bullets you know Just sayin'.

I believe the Browning/Winchester's had buckhorn sights. But the similar Browning B78 did not have a tang. I think the Traditional Hunter was also tangless. And there may be others.

Tang sights have more purposes than just target matches too. And running BP is the only way to go in my opinion. Very easy and safe and effective to boot. Plus, more fun.

Tang sight + highwall + lead + blackpowder = mule deer.

The BPCR forum is a much better place for you to get answers.

If you feel the need to disassemble your guns regularly, the Browning probably isn't for you. Like Brent said, it can be done and there is a kit available that makes it easier. Texas Mac's book also has detailed instructions. Like so many such things, it becomes easier with practice. An original 1885 or a Sharps is the way to go if you want to keep it simple.

My Browning/Winchesters have had thousands of rounds through them over the years, and they have never been apart except for gunsmith modifications. A periodic hosing out, especially with the stock removed (easy) is all it takes.

Paul

Thanks, gentlemen, I will heed the warnings about taking it apart. I am not one who has a burning desire to disassemble every firearm I get.

I did pick it up today and look forward to shooting it soon. I load mainly lead bullets for my other 45/70 rifles but rarely use black powder. This rifle may get me back into it.

I shot black powder quite a bit years ago out of the 1851 Navy Colt my great grand daddy used for shooting Yankees during that unpleasant episode in American history. I also have used BP in several PC rifles and in a few shotgun shells.

A hunting buddy and I are planning a single shot deer season this year. Between the 1885 and a #1 Ruger in 7/57, I should not be under gunned.

What is the twist rate of the barrel and the land/groove dimensions?

There are quite a few of the Browning and Winchester tradtional hunter models used at the buffalo gong matches in this part of the country. Most of them 38-55's and a couple of those are very competive.
So unless someone has done something to smuch that rifle up it should serve you well.

I will have to get back to you with those data. I am away from home at the moment and may not be back to all my stuff in my toybox for a while.

The owner's manual from an online source shows the BPCR version has a barrel with 8 grooves that are 0.004 inches deep. I could find no data for the version I have.

edit: The rifle looks almost unused and shows no signs of being altered.

I've had my B78 apart, and also a newer Low wall in .22 Hornet, though it's been a few years. The two mainsprings are very slender, and are guided by two struts. It's very difficult to get them properly back into position during re-assembly. I might have to investigate that fixture.

The original B78's are really good, and I like the .25-06 I still own. The other models made in the last 30-40 years vary from WTH were they thinking, to really interesting. I could like a Low Wall in .45 Colt as a companion to a single action revolver. Maybe a Traditional Hunter like yours, as well.

I don't believe those traditional hunters have tangs do they? Maybe I miss remember, but I thought mounting a tang sight on them was an issue.

This one does not have a tang.

Brent the 38-55's all seem to have a tang. The one 45-70 that a fella used a crossno 22 liner to convert to a 22 match rifle does not, but he did adapt a tang sight to it along with using a 3006 extractor so the rifle ejects the empty 22 case, instead of using the screwdriver.
The "traditional hunter" models sold by Winchester in the last few years all have tangs and come with a marbles tang sight.

so did the Browning "Traditional Hunter" both High & Low Wall. They also came with satin finished stocks, and crescent buttplates.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=333492477

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=333673852

I got my B-78 .45/70 in 1976 and have put more game in the freezer (using lead bullets) with it than any other rifle I own. Never had the need to take it apart. It's pretty heavy and doesn't seem to get as much use now as I must have gotten weaker in my old age.

The "Tension Tool" kit that makes assembly of the Miruko pattern HW a LOT easier was designed and sold by John E. Stepp.......that's going back a 7-8 years, when I got one. Swell fella' and fun to have a phone conversation with.

John E. Stepp
26687 Dersch Road
Shingletown, Ca 96088
(530) 365 7036

Anybody that's running one of these rifles can benefit from having one of these kits, and the COMPLETE and well written directions included. Continually removing and re-mounting a HW's butt stock is NOT something I recommend, myself.

GTC

Dittos to what crossfire posted.

Stepp's gadgets are not complicated, but the real value is in the detailed instructions he provides.

To round out a disassembly kit, there are some punches you'll need, and having a few spare parts on hand is never a bad idea.

And to underscore cross's final comment, this is not a rifle that lends itself to frequent disassembly. Some things are meant to be taken apart, others are not. This is the latter.

Paul

i took it out to shoot some today and had quite a few incidents in which I need two hammer strikes to fire the round. The reloads were several years old but fired well in my Marlin Guide Gun. I will try some recent loads soon to see if it was the ammo. Those that did fire seemed to have a rather shallow firing pin indentation on the WLR primer. Is there some mechanism for increasing the force of the hammer strike?

Other than that, it shot very well.

EDIT: I looked more closely, did a little tinkering, and found that the hammer frequently falls down only to the half cock position and never hits the firing pin. Recocking will frequently allow the hammer to fall fully. I had noticed that I could not lower the hammer all the way to the firing pin by pulling the trigger and lowering the hammer slowly with my thumb.

Any suggestions are welcome. I suppose it is gunsmith time.

I have had several, but only shot two of them, both .45-70s. An 1885 Browning scoped, and a Winchester branded traditional hunter, with the lollipop tang sight. I thought both shot extremely well. I used a scout scope on the Browning. Never learned to like that. The Win. Was the most brutal configuration I ever used. Both went down the road. Miss the Browning. I should have scoped it traditionally.

My two bigger single shots today are a Shiloh .40-65, and a Ruger No.1 S-C .45-70. Other than the Shiloh is driving me nuts with paper patches, I'm pretty happy with this pair. Jack

Thanks, I'll have to contact Mr. Stepp. Besides the older B78, I'm sure I will get another Miroku at some point. Maybe a Low Wall .45 Colt, or maybe one of the Traditional Hunters.

And I agree, taking them apart is something to be done rarely. Maybe once to lube everything real good inside.