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Joined: Mar 2002
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,288 |
Go tell the Spartans,Travelers passing by,That here,Obedient to their laws we lie.
I'm older now but I'm still runnin' against the wind
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 43,763
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 43,763 |
30-40 Krag would be 30 Government. I do not believe so..... The 30/40 was also called by winchester as the 30 U.S. and or the 30 Army. The 30 government was what winchester called the 30 06. People would confuse the U.S. with the government hence the later 30 Army designation. Odd.. because I find some references to "30 Government" cartridges back in the late 1890's.
“ The Savage 99 Pocket Reference”. All models and variations of 1895’s, 1899’s and 99’s covered. Also dates, checkering, engraving.. Find at www.savagelevers.com
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 23,101
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 23,101 |
Because in the late 1890's there was only one .30 cartridge used by the government- the .30-40 Krag. (The Navy Department used a 6mm cartridge at the time.) The official nomenclature for the Krag round was "Cartridge, Caliber .30, U.S.Army". It was superseded by the "Cartridge, Caliber .30, M1903" and then the "Cartridge, Caliber .30, M1906" (.30-03 and .30-06) They were all known as "government" rounds at one time or another.
I'll chime in on the side of those who decry the less than optimal handling characteristics of the 95 Winchester. But if I were a well heeled sportsman circa 1898 and I were going up against critters that could bite back, I would arm myself with a 95 Winchester chambered in one of the rounds that packed a whale of a lot more authority than the .303 Savage (which was all of them chambered in the Winchester). One has to make a comparison of the two rifles in context of their times and their intended usage.
"You can lead a man to logic, but you cannot make him think." Joe Harz
"Always certain, often right." Keith McCafferty
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 12,723
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 12,723 |
Well now you're just being logical. Show off!!
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Joined: Feb 2013
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Campfire Outfitter
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OP
Campfire Outfitter
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Posts: 7,750 |
I am talking about what is on the barrel of the 1895 or 95 that will identify cartridge. I have also seen it on a model 70's. For some reason rifle manufactures do not like using other rifle makers names on their barrels in the olden days, hence the winchester 1895 that I have says 30 gov. on the barrel & it shoots 30 06 springfields, the winchester 95 that I have says 30 ARMY & it shoots 30/40 krag. The earlier 1895's as in older (pre 30-06) in 30/40 krag will have 30 U.S. on their barrels. I think marlin and savage also would avoid using the winchester (& perhaps others) name on their barrels at that time.
"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,213
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,213 |
IIRC, my Winchester 1895 carbine in 30/40 is marked "30 Army" and the 303 is marked "303".
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 9,332 Likes: 1
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 9,332 Likes: 1 |
I'll chime in on the side of those who decry the less than optimal handling characteristics of the 95 Winchester. But if I were a well heeled sportsman circa 1898 and I were going up against critters that could bite back, I would arm myself with a 95 Winchester chambered in one of the rounds that packed a whale of a lot more authority than the .303 Savage (which was all of them chambered in the Winchester). One has to make a comparison of the two rifles in context of their times and their intended usage.
Well stated. The 303 Savage is essentially a 30-30 Win of a different flavor. Hardly comparable to the 405 win, the 35 win, the 30-40 or the 30-03 in their day.
"You cannot invade mainland America. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass"
~Admiral Yamamoto~
When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty. ~Thomas Jefferson~
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Joined: Feb 2013
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Campfire Outfitter
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OP
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It was Teddy Rosevelt that has been ever entwined in the "Big Medicine" of the winchester 1895. However I read somewhere he was quoted as believing the savage 1895/1899 as being the finest sporting rifle of it's time. As for me I get a medium baitfish out of shooting either.
Last edited by Angus1895; 06/28/13.
"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills
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