Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Custom Rifles & Wildcats The 7.5lb dud...

Having dismal results with my 6.5-06. Love the way it handles, no recoil, feeds flawlessly. Then produces results like these:

Background:

Savage 110e action, Pacnor 8 twist, 3 groove, supermatch, 24" factory contour, using barrel nut. Action was trued in the past, and sits in a bedded McMillan Mtn Rifle Edge, that is floated.

3-9 Zeiss Conquest, in Burris Signature rings.

Using Norma 25-06 brass, necked up using RCBS FL dies, with carbide button. Fed210 primers.

When I first started working up loads I used R19. I tried 140 Amax, 130 Accubond, 139 Scenars, and 140 Ballistic tips. All shot pretty crappy, but did eek out one 5/8" group with the Scenars.

I decided the powder had to be too fast, so switched to H4831sc. Results seemed better, and managed to shoot one nice 5/8" group with the 140 noslers.

I then played with them further and messed with charge weights. I got a nice 1/2" group at 49grs seated .020" off the lands, then the groups shot up to over 2". I then decided to load some more at 49grs, and play with seating depth. (.005 off, .010 off, .015 off, .020 off, and .025 off. I was excited thinking I was going to find that magic depth, then shot this dogcrap...

(black dot is 3/4")

Group 1:



Group 2:



Group 3:



Group 4:



After such dismal results, I thought something has got to be wrong with the scope etc. Went home and yanked scope. Check bases, rings, and action screws and torqued to spec. Pulled a brand new Conquest out of the box and headed back to the range. Then shot this:


Group 5:



At a loss. I now have 75 rounds down the tube and have gotten nowhere. I have shot two 5/8" groups with this gun, and one 1/2" group. The rest have been averaging around 2". I loaded up those exact same loads that gave me those groups and next time out threw 2".

Now what?

I have always had good success shooting the 129 grain SpirePoint in most of my 6.5mm bore rifles. If I have a 6.5mm bore rifle that isn't shooting to my expectations, I load some of these bullets with a mid-range load of H4895 and see how it goes.

Drew, maybe call Greg T and see if he's got any ideas for you? Bedding looks good and the mag box isn't bound up? (not sure what Savage boxes look like, just a thought).

Still got a can of 7828ssc you oughta' try...

I had issues not unlike this with a 338-06 using new Remington 30-06 brass. The first firing resulted in mediocre results. Subsequent groups shot after the brass was formed to the chamber, and partially full-length sized, were considerably better.

Also, you might think about checking your run-out, as well as brass neck consistency.

One weird thing I should mention...I am still not feeling any resistance when resizing. I am at the 4th firing on some of the brass and still barely seeing a smudge on the cases when full length sizing.

Assuming bedding is good, make sure scope mount screws aren't bottoming out on barrel threads. Make sure action screws aren't too long and bottoming out on something they shouldn't. Make sure magazine box is free floating and not getting pinched between the action and stock. If you have any doubts on this one remove the box and fire it without it just to check. Have seen all of these things happen before, and on one rifle, more than one of them.

Is the barrel fouling badly?

John

Have any 30-06 or 270 (needs trimmed) brass you could neck down? Might be worth a shot.

Screws are all good in length. I was going to check the mag box height since it is an ADL type setup. Thought about that last night. Although, didn't see any marks on the stock in the mag well to indicate it was touching when I last had it apart.

On a positive note, Tikka was humming them in there like normal. Shot a nice 1" group at 300 yesterday.

You bumping the shoulder too much? Might be worth resizing a couple of .270 cases in your 6.5-06 die. Start with your die a good bit away from the shell holder and use trial and error, screwing the die down a hair more each try until the .270 case will chamber with just slight resistance. Die should be set correctly then. .25-06 case might fit loosely enough that you wouldn't be able to tell upon chambering if you have adjusted your sizing die too far down or not.

John

I'd probably run some 120s in it just to see what happens. My 6.5-06 with a 24" 1/8 #4 Hart likes 120 NBTs over 55g R19 in WW 270Win cases lit by WLRs. 7828, R25, and R22 work well under the 140 NBT & VLDs for me as well. Bought some of the 127LRX and 130NABs to try, just haven't had the time.

R17 will make the 120s scream if you need more pep.

Pullit gave me some of the 100 NBTs that he likes in his 260 and they shot pretty decent as well:


If you want some of the 120s or 100s to try, shoot me your mailing address and I'll send some over.

bumping shoulder .001-002" back. A few were snug when camming the bolt down. Talked to RCBS, chick was an clueless and didn't understand what i was asking.

DC,

Are you FLing the fired cases or NSing? I rarely use my RCBS FL die except for new cases. Getting several firings before needing a bump.

Reloader', I am using my FL die, but it isn't even resizing the body for some reason.

I do have some 100's and 120's I can try. How far off the lands are you seating the 120's? I was hoping to use 140's since I want to whack an elk.

Seems sometimes that a barrel needs 100-150 rounds down it, and brass on the 2nd go a round before things start shaping up.

I'd send it to PacNor and have them check the barrel just to have peace of mind and prevent spending a lot more dollars on bullets and powder. There have been reports of bad barrels and PacNor making it right. Never really had a problem with a new barrel from good makers not shooting good right off the bat.

Talked to pacnor, they were cool and said I can send either the barrel or rifle itself back and they would check it out. I just cannot figure out what the hay is going on here. Gunsmith is 2hrs away to have barrel pulled, and shipping whole gun to pacnor stresses me out too.

My 3 groove pac nor had some issues at first but I just had to clean it really well and get the carbon out. I had just been using solvent on a jag but once I ran a bronze brush down it one way about 20 times it started coming together. As I got more rounds down the barrel the carbon fouling dropped off.

Bb

Sounds like the die is over or the chamber under. Guess you could just look at it like a bump die and neck die in one.

Just kissing is what's working in this pipe. Short throat, looks funny with NBTs even when kissing except for VLDs. Those long 140 NBTs rob some case capacity with a short throat, but luckily I've been able to hit pressure signs and back off before much compression.

TTSX or LRX might be an option since elk is on the menu. I've seen some so-so shooters shine with Barnes. You sure expect customs to digest most anything though.

I'd give lighter bullets and necked down brass a try, as well as checking to make sure my rounds were straight, before sending it off.