Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Savage Collectors Savage 40/45 Super Sporter

Local shop has a Savage Super Sporter in pretty decent shape. Not a museum piece, the rear sight is gone and a nearly new looking Weaver base is screwed on, but it looks like it spent most of the last 80 years sitting on the really squished recoil pad.

The stock is checkered, so it looks like a 45. But there was a dovetail rear sight instead of (or maybe in addition to) a receiver sight, so it looks like a 40. So, is it a 40 or a 45?

The safety and receiver look a whole lot like the ones on a Model 23. Are these about the same to shoot, as far as trigger and accuracy?

The wood and the blue look real good. I'm thinking it might make a good .30-06 shooter.

Some people say the action is weak for a .30-06, and it does have rear-locking lugs. Any experience/reading about that issue?

The 45 had both an open sight and a receiver sight. The ones I've seen had a folding Marbles open sight.

All I've heard about the 30-06 being too stout for the Model 40 and 45 is based on hearsay, but I have heard from several folks that the action doesn't hold up well in this chambering.

The 45 is a cool gun in my opinion, and both underpriced and underappreciated.

Rod

I too am a fan. Be sure the safety holds. Trigger does double duty as the bolt stop a can get hammered with use. I too think they are an underappreciated piece of Savage history.

I have a model 45 SS in 300 Savage. It is a nice shooting cool gun. I really like it.

I've heard that it was common for the 30-06 caliber to develop headspace issues in this model.

Maybe others can with more knowledge can elaborate?

There is a period magazine article critiquing the model 45 in 30 06 ( I'm looking for it). While they complained that the action was based on the model 23 sporter rather than the Beautiful Model 20 (Oh they are beautiful), it was noted that the mass of steel within the tubular receiver and rear locking bolt lugs was greater than the Model 20 and even the Springfield receiver. The action is actually very strong and stronger than most. I don't understand the principal but somehow the length of bolt throw is less for the rear locking action as compared to a front locking action. They then began to throw proof pills through the rifle and after doing so there was no increase in head space. They aren't as graceful as the M 20 and I think the clip could be improved upon but the rifle holds a very important niche in Savage history. BTW
I have a NOS Lyman 45 rear receiver sight in the box for this rifle if anybody would like to buy it. (<:

Thank you, gentlemen. Maybe I should go back with headspace gauges and look at it again. After that, I may be in need of a receiver sight.

If it looks lightly used and the price is right go for it. It is typical Utica quality (wood, steel)It really is a good gun to shoot and hunt with. I'll be hunting with mine Oct 26 not 30 miles from the old plant where it was made. The stock should have a notch where the sight was. Also the rear sight should fold down. I still have the sight packed away from a move. I'll try and find it. Don't think you'll ever find another one of those sights in the box. Good Luck.

http://pics.reedssports.com/gb/sav192221.JPG
I think Savage got it right the first time they made this action.
I'm suprised they didn't call it a Super Sporter

I gave my .300 Savage Super Sporter to my BIL 20 years ago and it remains his favorite deer rifle. IMO an ugly gun that feels/handles surprisingly well. Of course Savage had a knack for making homely guns that worked well.

I gave my brother a 90% grade, Model 45 in .30-06 that he had lusted after for years. That was some 25 years ago and he has never had a single problem with it and shoots groups just over 1" at 100 yards. Now he isn't a high-volume shooter (maybe 40 rounds per year through this gun), but if there were really an issue with action strength it should have showed up by now.

I believe the "rumors" about the Model 40/45 being weak are mostly from those who don't have any real knowledge of rifle design.

Sure it has rear locking lugs, but so did the Remington Model 788 which set many records in benchrest competition where the volume of fire was hundreds or thousands of rounds per year.

If you look at the tubular receiver of the Model 40/45, you will find one of the heaviest receivers of this type ever made. In addition (like the 788) the openings machined into the receiver are very small (no larger than needed for ejection and magazine) which makes the action very stiff. This is the reason than many of these rifles give much better accuracy than one would expect from a "cheap" rifle.

The bolt it's self on the 40/45 is as large or larger than any other centerfire bolt action. It is the diameter of the bolt, not the length to the locking lugs that determines strength.

The Model 45 is a piece of firearms history that has been overlooked by collectors so far. That might not always be true as less than 6000 were produced.

It is often criticized when compared to rifles by Winchester and Remington, but you have to remember the Model 45 was introduced in 1928. Winchester was making the Model 54 (hardly a beauty queen) and the Model 70 was still years away. Remington had the strong, but ugly Model 30.

The real key was that both the Remington and Winchester rifles cost more than $50 while the Model 40 was available for less than $40.....quite a difference in 1928. Savage with the Model 40/45 set a marketing strategy that has continued to this day....make a good (if not as pretty) rifle for a bargain price.

Well founded points, and believe me I'm not knocking the 40/45 (although admittedly possibly damning it with faint praise). But, I defy anybody to lay a 40/45 next to a Winchester M54 and tell me the Savage is a better rifle in terms of aesthetics and functionality. Sure, the 40/45 can shoot well, and its homely stock does feel good in the hands but that's where it ends, IMO. It just doesn't cut the mustard for what me, myself, and I look for in terms of a rifle.

I daresay that that the shooting public of 75-80 years ago felt much the same way as the Savage went the way of the wind and the Winchester bolt guns continued on. In 1928 the Depression hadn't hit yet and that $10 difference wouldn't have mattered to a guy who could afford that kind of money for a new rifle. Remember too that back then Winchester had a reputation for superior quality, and Savage (with the exception of the 99) not so much. Add to that the standards by which American males of a certain age were using to judge bolt guns at the time- Springfields, Krags, Mausers- and you have another strike against the Savage, and one for the Winchester. Perhaps a shadow of that drives my subconscious today.

Even though Savage was making its mark on the world with the 99, it wouldn't have eschewed the 40/45 bolt gun if the public were beating down the dealer's doors to get them.

Not meant to ruffle feathers, but the 1920 (being the first domestic Mauser action produced) didn't seem to fare to well either. I think there are a lot of factors that play into the success or failure of a product and with the 99 being the obvious performer maybe Savage just didn't push that hard selling bolt guns.

I know this is an old thread, and fingers crossed on getting a response. Any fear in using modern ammo in this old rifle? I picked up a nice, unaltered, (but was used by the previous owner(s), has a few scars, and finish wear) 45 in 30-06. Loaded it up some hornady custom lites, and was shooting 2" groups @ 100 yards right out of the gate. Just wondering if anyone shoots "regular strength" factory ammo out of these. If so, what brand and grain, etc. Thanks in advance for any advice!

Some of those guns had some reported headspace issues in 30-06. If you aren't seeing any signs of trouble I wouldn't hesitate to run "regular strength" factory ammo in them. I guess brand and grain depends on your hunting situation and what you gun likes.

This looks like good advise to me.

Yeah, good advice. I would certainly stay away from hot rodded 06 ammo. If you compare the 40/45 action to the 23 series you will see its basically an enlarged version, a 23 on steroids if you will. If you stick to something that is in the specs of military ball ammo of the period, say around 2700-fps, you would probably be working within the design specs of the gun. Check for head space issues as with used guns you never know what previous owners might have launched out the barrel in the past, and these guns have been around for a long time. Albeit maybe not the most styling package out there, I like the Super Sporter 40/45 series and think they make a handy and respectable little rig for a center fire bolt gun. I especially like the stocks with the schnable fore arm tip but I'm a sucker for schnables.

PS - I don't know what you have for sights but both Lyman and Redfield made basic hunter peep sights for these guns that fit up to the holes on the left side of the receiver. One of these sights might help shrink up your group a bit and add a little class.

Here's an idea. There are current factory loads advertised as "Garand safe." That is, within design/safety standards developed for the M1 80+ years ago. Ie: the 2700 fps standard M2 Ball of the era which was the same era of the 40/45 Sporters. Bet it would be a safer bet for you than the regular hot factory loads in general.

Interesting suggestion. A few years ago I launched some Greek HXP out of my 45 and it seemed like a perfect match. Not too hot for an 06 and fairly pleasant to shoot in that rifle.

Thanks for the advice, I appreciate it. Just happened to find some boxes of vintage remington korelocked for sale on the interwebs that looks to be in really good shape for it's age. Very detailed pictures. The box actually lists the firearms it is specifically made for, and the Savage 40/45 is right there on the box. May just pick up a couple if for no other reason than to display it with the rifle!

You are going to have to post a picture of that!

It has the original Lyman peep from the factory. I only popped off a few rounds, not wanting to put it through too much not being sure about using current factory ammo.... hence the reason for using the custom lite. It was actually the first time I have ever fired a 30-06. Never owned one before. I plan on working on tightening that group in the near future!

I don't think it would be that delicate. You just might want to be conservative on feeding it a steady diet of the more warmer loads. But for your own educations keep an eye on the cases for signs of trouble. Look for blown back and flattened primers, neck splits, base separations and anything else out of the ordinary for a healthy looking spent case.

I have a Model 45, looking for a magazine. Any info would be appreciated.

Sorry I can't help with a mag beyond suggesting "Wanted" Post perhaps in Gunboards Forums if a member there.

Otherwise... Just caught up with this Thread for the first time. Very little chat over these models. I have Models 40, 45 and the Model 20. Noting the last mainstream Model thread in yr 2020. Just updating a bit as adding my thoughts.

The model 20 was indeed was an 'early' production sporting bolt rifle. I've more than a few times heard it referred to as "first" US production of the turn-bolt genre. Not so. The Newton bolt rifle rifle of the teens was first. I have both the First and a Buffalo Newton! They were both of "mauser' pattern.

That said, the Savage Model 20 was a great rifles of its era. Extremely lightweight as quite stout & durable. Bit too much drop in buttstock for my likings but otherwise nice! One of mine was modified for scope and it works out, but not the best. The Model 20 was a conventional front locking action!

he Model 40 & 45 need to be viewed 'in context'. They were Depression era, 'price point' competitors with the Remington Model 30 and the Winchester 54. Just that. The aft locking system is proven a good durable system. The central consideration of aft locking genre is of receiver strength. Not just thickness but also material. Nickel Steel was the prevalent material of the day. Win & Rem both used it. I don't know about the Savage line and even the barrels I've seen didn't recite any steel nomenclature visible. Many good rifles were made with good old carbon steel including most all mausers 'apparently'.
I'm with those that say the key is 'no hot loads in 30-06. These guns weren't intended for heavy use either. But they were fine 'purpose built' rifles for 'average use'. Below, Models 40 & 45 came in early and late versions or magazine release. with 40 early bottom latch and 45 with pronounced button side mag release! "Prominent" one stop short of toilet handle! Both above in 30-06.
Last pix as 'bonus', one of a Savage Model 1920/26, last iteration of the Model 1920 with special aperture sight. In 300 Savage. Its barrel reciting "High Pressure Steel".
So...!
My take
Best!
John

Wow.

The guy needs a clip.

You must be retired and bored out of your mind.

I have one depending on what caliber you need. I believe the one I have is 30-30 but I would need to double check.

The "Clip Seeker" didn't initiate a new Thread. He "appended to one with information trending of about a decade. I took the opportunity to respond to the wider context of such. Not a lot of info 'in the wild' comparatively concerning these Models.

And yes, I enjoy informing about subjects that interest me and seem worthy of addressing. Anyone has the privilege of ignoring. Or, as you, of critiquing inclusive of condemning! There is a wider purpose to these Forums than 'merely answering' immediate questions of narrow context. "Informing" in the wider perspective of many readers who may have interest in these Models. For me, what you call "boredom", I call "enthusiasm".

If to critique, 99Guy... To conjure the time worn stock comment quoting Admiral Yamamoto regarding invading America. Not only dated, but even as cast, his own frivolous metaphor or old. Japan with neither interest nor viable capability to "invade" America. Only to "intimidate and deter" our entry into a conflict impeding their grand Colonial ambitions of expansionism. Their strategic target, islands Southward. Having their way unimpeded of American sea power and of American will to defend. Excepting Australia, yet a continent of British responsibility. 'Other', remote islands as useless to American interests. As war in Europe and American cultural ties as yet unwillingness to enter beyond Lendlease. Surely greater reluctance to defend islands of no cultural connection. Yamamoto's comment to be taken in the negative, as while America a formidable land to invade, the island populations little credible firepower hinderance. Moved to the nowadays American small arms relevance to hypersonic nuclear missiles deterrence... Kindly Sir, what's your point! Factoring number of guns in grass consequence as factoring heads in A**! Our gun rights to be cast as "clear & PRESENT 'DOMESTIC DANGER' as "relevant"!

My retired fun inclusive of defending against those who have nothing better to do than criticize others.
Lets just be friends!
Best!
John

As shown in Iskra's pictures, there were 2 different magazine latch styles on the SuperSporters and in my experience magazines designed to work with one style don't, or don't always, work well with the other style. I had a 40 in 300 SAV that had the wrong, bottom latch style, magazine inserted into a button latch style rifle. The magazine was locked and took me more than a little effort and time to remove. Not a deal breaker, but a PITA never the less.

The only SuperSporter that I've handled within the past few years was a nearly mint early style 45 in 30-30.

Looking back, I've owned at least one SuperSporter chambered for each of the 4 cartridges that they were made in; 250-3000, 30-30, 300, and 30-26, but some were 40s and some were 45s. I had a late style 45 in 250-3000 that I really wanted to like, but the crappy trigger got in the way. The coolest 45 that I ever handled was one that had been rebarreled to 219 Zipper by Larry Koller and owned by his son, Paul.

These were decent "price point" rifles! Unique design for their era. They just weren't the Savage Model 1920 design and that's a bit of a pity. I own several because I do appreciate them. In 30-06, as noted the rifle, as many, need to be in good condition and no hot loads. The latter is the main problem as "overpressure tolerance" is small. As also noted, the trigger isn't very good. Not by standards of its era and certainly not what we expect today. Just think "era gun" and enjoy it for what it is. Mine; 2 in '06 and one in 30-30, which I prefer. I like bolt rifles in that chambering of 30-30 aka .30 W.C.F.; I have: the referenced Model 40 + a Rem 788 and several Win Models 54 carbines & one rifle - sweet guns!

I'd love to have a US Krag in 30-30 but something of huge deal to convert and I'm not into recreating a "Wright Flyer" for similar cost!

Best!
John