If the Key West Accord prevents the Army from having them, let the Marines have them. Modify them so they're able to launch and land on aircraft carriers and the Marines will have the best ground support plane they've ever had.
Just down the road from The City of Lost Souls in the Land of the Blind. Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla
For your viewing enjoyment. Years ago, one was here and did serious aerobatics, including a hammerhead stall. Then flew west, dropped below the trees and flew down the creek, turned left down the river, then popped up from the trees in an attack run center stage. It don't get any better then that.
My introduction to the A-10 was in July of '76. We had a pair of F-15s, an F-16 with the chief test pilot and a pair of A-10s flown in for our bicentennial celebration. The F-16 and an A-10 put on an amazing show. The left our base for a quick flight to the Paris Air Show where one of the A-10s crashed during a demonstration. The pilot did a split s, hit the runway when he was pulling out of the verticle loop.
Saw a 4 ship of hogs fly over us leaving Las Vegas (SHOT) last week. Red Flag at Nellis AFB. They seem to just hang in the air as they can fly so slow.
Had to really watch out on the flight line on Kadena if we had hogs on base because they are pretty quiet. Easy to hear an F-15 taxi up behind you but not so much with the A-10s. Flight OPs shows a distinct lack of humor if the pilots have to wait for a fuel truck to get out of their way.
John Burns
I have all the sources. They can't stop the signal.
The 442 FW transferred from Richards-Gebaur to Whiteman AFB down at Knob Noster, Missouri in 1994 and now parks its A-10s next to all those B-2 bombers.
Our house sits directly under that flight path. I love it when the A-10 flies over. They fly low enough that I can hear them coming. I was an engine guy on them for 4 years. They still give me goose bumps when I see them.
You guys are missing the point. Some congress critter can promise their constituents 300 more planes will be built in that plant where the F35 is being built. THAT is the only reason the A-10 isn't going to the army and is going to the bone yard.
Stupidity is expensive If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck!
There is no doubt that the A-10 rivals the AD-1 for the best Close Air Support craft ever built but you have to back away from the plane and look at where it is in it's lifecycle and the support tail
Yes, they have new wings available (http://tinyurl.com/A-10-rewing-at-Hill) but if they think that the rest of these airframes will last another 30 years in a tactical flying environment then they are doing drugs. We have seen what happens when you try this, a gradual flight envelope restriction to preserve airframe life to the point that you have a really nice flying club airplane and your pilots are reduced to flying instrument flights and pretending to be tactical aviators. It happened to the A-6, EA-6B, F-14 and is happening now to the early generation (A/B/C/D) Hornets.
The second issue is that support tail. Say the Army gets the airframe for free (think free puppy). Now you have to adopt/acquire/staff all the staff and equipment to keep Depot, Intermediate and Operational level support going. I assure you that is millions of dollars that an Army, who is conducting significant reductions, wants nothing to do with taking this on. http://www.army.mil/article/106355
Don't mistake my post, the F-35 is an abortion. It will look great on paper but we will have seriously reduced ability to conduct diverse missions and CAS, more than anything else, requires diversity and flexibility.
This is simply a money thing and the only way to save money, grand money, is to get rid of entire platforms. The A-6 and F-14 (and soon the EA-6B) didn't go away because the F/A-18 can do it better. They went away because the services were able to close complete supply and maintenance lines. Don't look for the Army to make their financial position worse in this time of constructing budgets. It's not about capability but about money right now. We'll pay for it with blood later but we never learn that lesson or there would have been P-47's and not P-51's doing CAS in Korea.
If something on the internet makes you angry the odds are you're being manipulated
If the Key West Accord prevents the Army from having them, let the Marines have them. Modify them so they're able to launch and land on aircraft carriers and the Marines will have the best ground support plane they've ever had.
I don't know if you could sling an A10 off a carrier. Good idea tho.
A government is the most dangerous threat to man�s rights: it holds a legal monopoly on the use of physical force against legally disarmed victims.
There is no doubt that the A-10 rivals the AD-1 for the best Close Air Support craft ever built but you have to back away from the plane and look at where it is in it's lifecycle and the support tail
Yes, they have new wings available (http://tinyurl.com/A-10-rewing-at-Hill) but if they think that the rest of these airframes will last another 30 years in a tactical flying environment then they are doing drugs. We have seen what happens when you try this, a gradual flight envelope restriction to preserve airframe life to the point that you have a really nice flying club airplane and your pilots are reduced to flying instrument flights and pretending to be tactical aviators. It happened to the A-6, E-6B, F-14 and is happening now to the early generation (A/B/C/D) Hornets.
The second issue is that support tail. Say the Army gets the airframe for free (think free puppy). Now you have to adopt/acquire/staff all the to keep Depot, Intermediate and Operational level support going. I assure you that is millions of dollars that an Army who is conducting significant reductions wants nothing to do with taking this on. http://www.army.mil/article/106355
Don't mistake my post, the F-35 is an abortion. It will look great on paper but we will have seriously reduced ability to conduct diverse missions and CAS, more than anything else, requires diversity and flexibility.
This is simply a money thing and the only way to save money, grand money, is to get rid of entire platforms. The A-6 and F-14 (and soon the EA-6B) didn't go away because the F/A-18 can do it better. They went away because the services were able to close complete supply and maintenance lines. Don't look for the Army to make their financial position worse in this time of constructing budgets. It's not about capability but about money right now. We'll pay for it with blood later but we never learn that lesson or there would have been P-47's and not P-51's doing CAS in Korea.
Another world-class post from someone who knows WTF the big picture is....
A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
This gets me... the A10 is like a batch of a/c that nothing new betters it on the mission that it does and the versatility offered...
instead of scrapping them, they ought to be re opening assembly lines to manufacture new ones.. same with the A 6 Intruder, the F 14 Tom Cat, and even the B 52s...
its nuts try to get 30 to 50 years out of an a/c.. but retooling to make new ones would be cheaper than developing new A/C to replace them......do the technology upgrades on the new ones... and keep putting the hurt on the bad guys...
stupid politicians...and upper military brass that caters to them...
You guys are missing the point. Some congress critter can promise their constituents 300 more planes will be built in that plant where the F35 is being built. THAT is the only reason the A-10 isn't going to the army and is going to the bone yard.
I'm in a Facebook group that included active duty aircraft crewchiefs. There's talk that the Pentagon is cutting 25,000 personnel from the AF.
Modify them so they're able to launch and land on aircraft carriers and the Marines will have the best ground support plane they've ever had.
There has never been a successful transition of a shore based plane to the carrier in an operational role and the Warthog couldn't do it either. The requirements to be a carrier based aircraft needs to be in the aircrafts genetic mix.
The T-45 and F-17 are but shells of their shore-based cousins. When I applied to AOCS in 1985 I was told I would fly the T-45 in flight school. It took until a year after I retired (22 years later) before VT-86 got them. Stunts like the U-2, and C-130 and DT&E like the P-51 don't count.
If something on the internet makes you angry the odds are you're being manipulated
From Wikipedia: The B-52 completed fifty years of continuous service with its original operator in 2005; after being upgraded between 2013 and 2015, it is expected to serve into the 2040s.
As of 2012, 85 were in active service with nine in reserve.
Leo of the Land of Dyr
NRA FOR LIFE
I MISS SARAH
“In Trump We Trust.” Right????
SOMEBODY please tell TRH that Netanyahu NEVER said "Once we squeeze all we can out of the United States, it can dry up and blow away."
The B-52 completed fifty years of continuous service with its original operator in 2005; after being upgraded between 2013 and 2015, it is expected to serve into the 2040s.
As of 2012, 85 were in active service with nine in reserve.
And there were 744 built and they are not a tactical aircraft and are not subject to the stresses of CAS.
If something on the internet makes you angry the odds are you're being manipulated
You guys are missing the point. Some congress critter can promise their constituents 300 more planes will be built in that plant where the F35 is being built. THAT is the only reason the A-10 isn't going to the army and is going to the bone yard.
I'm in a Facebook group that included active duty aircraft crewchiefs. There's talk that the Pentagon is cutting 25,000 personnel from the AF.
Oh that isn't talk that's a fact! My good bud is getting looked at for the chopping block. Some folks will not qualify for early retirement some will miss it by a yr or two. That's what happens when you sign a contract with the devil. I'm in the Army and they are holding boards as we speak going through records...
Originally Posted by Bricktop
Then STFU. The rest of your statement is superflous bullshit with no real bearing on this discussion other than to massage your own ego.
Oh that isn't talk that's a fact! My good bud is getting looked at for the chopping block. Some folks will not qualify for early retirement some will miss it by a yr or two. That's what happens when you sign a contract with the devil. I'm in the Army and they are holding boards as we speak going through records...
Yep, it's 1991 all over again and I'll bet the lessons learned then get to be relearned with lots of promises to do it better next time. Retired and done with it never felt so good but I feel for you guys going through it now.
If something on the internet makes you angry the odds are you're being manipulated
I worked for several years (about 14 years ago) in private aviation with a fine gentleman and Vietnam vet who commanded a NG wing of A-10's at BTL. He was very fond of that airframe and had some great stories about it. He said back then that it was close to the end of its usefulness, at least as far as the Pentagon saw it in dollars and cents. One comment he made to me I'll always remember; "Jim, you're an aero-engineer- could you imagine someone coming into your design office just to say he's got a really big gun and needs an airplane to carry it?"
Who cares if there are Army Conus bases capable of supporting the A-10, there aren't any overseas Army bases capable, which is the whole point. The A-10 (hopefully) will never be used in the U.S., so what's the point.
Well, yeah, there's this thing the Army does called "training" so they would get use in CONUS. Wartime O-CONUS? Need an airfield? Just take it. Pick one. US Army Rangers are ready when you are.
![[Linked Image]](http://s809.photobucket.com/user/Arch48/media/dsc_3673_dm_a10_zpsd1795f6e.jpg.html)
Stunts like the U-2, and C-130 and DT&E like the P-51 don't count. ![[Linked Image]](http://militarysignatures.com/signatures/member651.png)