Home Forums Hunting & Shooting BPCR OK, boys, the hunt is on!

Paul & Don,

Thank you for the tips. I wouldn't know the difference between a Baldwin and a MVA from looking at them.

A question for you BPTR / BPCR competitors;
Seeing as they are roughly equal in quality, why would a person choose one over the other? Are there certain qualities/characteristics about each one that set them apart from the others?

I don't know of any shoots around here to attend to bug the shooters at, so I have to keep asking questions here.

Ed

You are correct about the quality being approximately equal with the brands mentioned here. Not all sights are of that quality, however. Generally, you get what you pay for.

I've gone with the Hoke over the MVA Soule type, not because of quality, but for the following reasons.

I'm a lefty. The Hoke shaft is marked on both sides, and I believe the Baldwin is too. The Hoke engraving is fairly bold, while the MVA is precise and perhaps a bit "delicate". Nice, but harder for my old eyes to see. Both the elevation and windage scales on the Hoke are true verniers, which I prefer to the Soule drum. Just personal preference. The Hoke has a dovetail windage gib, which allows adjustment of tension and takeup for wear. The windage knob on the Hoke clears my left thumb, whereas the MVA I had used to scrape it under recoil (not the Soule version).

Front sights. I don't like the swinging leaf spring on the Sharps sight. Catches, and seems a bit delicate. The Distant Thunder has a globe that is somewhat larger than the Lyman 17A size that is found on several sights, and seems to let a bit more light in. Ditto the Baldwin front sight. Both have internal spirit levels.

That said, under certain light conditions I prefer the external level on my Browning front sights. The Browning takes 17A size inserts, and I have never felt a need to replace the factory sight. My Brownings have Hokes for the rear.

Hope this helps.

Paul

Pic of the Hoke elevation scale, right side as viewed by a lefty.

Paul

Hoke on a Sharps.


Distant Thunder globe sight, midrange version with slight forward angle to maintain perspective looking through the rear aperture sight.

Go here http://www.blackpowderspg.com/upcoming_matches.html for a listing of clubs/matches, pretty good chance there are some closer than you might think. Well worth the time to attend one or a dozen, you can learn a lot in an afternoon, especially if you're competing.

Looks like closest one is on Coolidge, 2.5 hours from here. After that, I may as well drive to Tulsa, OK

Thanks for the link, Don. I had been on that site, but hadn't seen the match listings.
One of my old rookies is running the matches in Alaska. Probably the toughest SOB you'll ever meet in your life.

Ed

Thank you, Paul, for the pictures and explanations.

I notice you don't seem to have a Hadley eyecup on your sights. You claim eyesight issues due to age. Wouldn't a Hadley eyecup with the varying apertures help with that in differing light conditions?

Ed

Ah, but the Hoke comes with its own adjustable aperture disk. Don't have to pay extra.

Coolidge is cool! I've shot there a couple of times. Love their mini-BPCR long range .22 matches. I've also shot the events at OKC. A bit of a rivalry between the Okie and Texas shooters. I sure wish they had matches like that anywhere near where I am now. Closest is Phoenix, about 380 miles, and they don't do the .22 version, just BPCR silhouette and Creedmoor.

Paul

I don't own one, but IIRC the Baldwin is a Soule type tang sight. If I were looking for a Soule, I'd go with a Baldwin, if only because it is marked on both sides of the shaft, or can be ordered that way, and Baldwin is second to none in quality. Plus, Steve is a good guy, as is Kermit Hoke, as is Jim Kluskens (Distant Thunder), as are the folks at MVA, as well as Shiloh. Lots of good folks in the BPCR game. They are not just manufacturers but shooters all.

Paul

As far as I can tell the best bet and value in a purely target sight right now is the Red River soule sight. That Borchardt copy is great for fine tuning adjustments in 1/4 minute increments. Staff is marked on both sides so it doesn't matter if you shoot a rifle with the wrong hand or not.
The eye cup on that sight is the best I've seen with it's deep dish and adjustable aperature it will deliver a sharp sight picture.
The gibb adjustment on the back of the windage drum allows for keeping the slop out of the staff.
All a person needs do to judge whether those sights are worthy or not, simply check out the scores turned in by Eron Ahmer..

Don,

Is this the sight you're talking about?

LINK

Ed

Yessir, that be the one.

Interesting sight with some nice features.

Red River used to be made in Ukraine and imported through Canada. I wonder if that's still the case?

The price is up there for a quality sight, which makes me wonder if the sights, or at least certain models, are now made in the USA.

BTW, all "Hadleys" are not the same or equal, and you can't tell by looking at them. Has to do with the design of the detent. If the aperture hole doesn't lock positively in its place, it can cause misses.

Paul

The Red River Mega Soule sight in its current incarnation is absolutely the finest tang sight available. None of the others can match it feature for feature. I have been using them for years, and the current variation is head and shoulders better than any other sight on the market.

Which brings us back to my earlier point, that just because "everybody" uses and touts certain products doesn't mean they are necessarily "the best", and certainly not the best for a given individual's needs. Do your homework!

Great discussion, good info.

Paul

I been looking at the Red River sight. I need one for the 77. But does the sight change travel in the same direction as the MVA? right up left down. Forward for right wind back for left wind?
I don't want to have to think which way do I need to twist that idiot knob to make a sight change.
I like the way the lead screw is protected inside the staff. I have bent a few MVA screws cleaning the rifle till I got smart enough to take the sight off when I clean the rifle.

Kurt--Looking at the sight from the rear, the windage on the Red River sight moves right if you turn the windage knob on the right clockwise and left if you turn it counter clockwise. In other words, tighten the windage knob with your right hand and you put in right windage, and loosen the knob and you get left windage.

The elevation screw lowers elevation if you turn it clock wise and raises it if you turn it counter clock wise.

Sort of self-induced astigmatism?

Ed

Fiddlin with this Red River on Carol's rifle, it's like Mr. Sharpsguy explained.

That sounds pretty intuitive to use for us right handed folks.

Bill,

I've only seen the tang sights used with a globe type front sight. Are they effective with the blade-type barrel sight as the Shilohs come standard with?

Ed

Thank you SG.
I have a couple rifles where the sights are reverse to the MVA's I use and when I shoot those I have the habit going in the wrong direction.

Kurt