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Deionized water, distilled water, tap water, rain water, road ditch water...

I don't see how the type water would be nearly as critical to case capacity data than how the measurements are done...

DF

The type of water isn't nearly as critical, just asking a question about the stated method.

High purity water (deionized water) has a known, repeatable weight. Commonly available water sources are pure enough that there should be little measurable differences, but if you don't specifically state purity, then conceivably any water source could be used. Water with high total dissolved solids has a different density than DI water, thus skewing the measurement.

Deoxygenated water is typically high purity water that has had the O2 stripped and chemically removed. It is typically used for producing steam in boilers. Deoxygenated water will cease to be deoxygenated when exposed to air.

I didn't think the method was actually calling for deoxygenated water, but perhaps there is a reason for it that eludes me - hence the question.

David

I did take some poetic license with the "ditch water" comment...

My point was the skew of data all over the page, largely from a perceived lack of consistency or protocol in performing those measurements. At least it seems that way to me.

And to quote Hillary, "What difference does it make", concerning the kind of water used, given the confusion over methodology...

DF

David,
The correct word should have been non-aerated water. Water exiting my tap has a lot of air in it. I let it sit for a few hours to let the bubbles remove themselves.
SCP

DF,
Any method as long as it is consistent would give you a great way to compare a cartridge to another....if you were the one doing all the measurements. I have had up to 3gr difference in capacity of the same size case by different manufacturers.
I like the case load capacities listed in Nosler's manual and Quickload software. I'll take a measurement of an unfired 26Nosler case just for grins.
SCP

I do my capacity measurements with deoxygenated water, since it's been sitting in a water bottle in my loading room for quite a while. But I doubt it makes as much difference as temperature, though most of us probably do it with water from 60-80 F.

The reason I do mine with a bullet seated, instead of full to the brim, is that's the "functional" case capacity. As an example, the most common .300 magnums have necks varying from .21 to .37 inch long, which alone will vary capacity approximately 3 grains.

But ALL those necks are filled with the shank of any bullet from 150 grains up. What matters more (though not as much as people think) is how much space the rear of the bullet takes up below the neck--given the maximum SAAMI length, though obviously a longer than standard magazine and throat length change things.

But all of that is MUCH more accurate than filling the case to the mouth, regardless of what kind of water is used. And it's yet another reason QuickLoad is only a very approximation of reality, no matter how many handloaders believe it's the word of some ballistic god.

http://youtu.be/G2y8Sx4B2Sk

David

John,
Your method is ultimately the most applicable to real world reloading. It would be adjustable to OAL/seating depth and bullet size. What if any data do you compare it to? Or, do you just use it to compare your own data like I do?
SCP

Mostly I've compared it to pressure-tested data from ballistic labs who use the same barrel for their pressure tests AND velocity data. There are still a few places that work up loads in a pressure barrel, then shoot them in a factory barrel for velocity, supposedly to provide "real world" results. Trouble is, factory barrels vary considerably.

John,
I hear you on the difference of barrels. I have two 6mmx284s. One is 150fps faster than the other with the same load.
SCP

I'm not sure i will build a 26 Nosler until more brands of brass becomes available

I received my first 26 Nosler brass today. This batch is blem with minor cosmetic stuff, otherwise looks good. The case head will fit a mag. M-700 bolt face, but not a #4 RCBS shell holder. It uses a #38 RCBS shell holder.

The fat case won't pass between the rails on a 7RM Sendaro action. They'll pass thru the rails on a mag. M-70, will stick under the right rail and pop out from under the left rail.

So, the 700 rails will need to be opened to accommodate this case. If rounds pop out from under the rails, the box mag will need windows, like a RUM box mag. It will be up to the smith to make these fat, sharp shouldered rounds feed.

My hunting bud and I are going to send a pair of shot out 7RM BDL's for 26" #3 Shilen SS Match barrels and blueprinted actions. These guns have full 3.6" mag. boxes, not 3.4" boxes found on most std. length magnum rifles.

A 140 VLD with full case neck/bullet shank contact, only the boattail prodruding into the case body, results in a 3.5" COAL. SAAMI COAL for this round is 3.34". I'm hoping to have these guns chambered for 3.5" COAL with 140 VLD's. I like the way the longer round looks and there's less powder capacity robbing, bullet protrusion into the case body.

Plan to ship guns next week.

DF

Heard from the smith. He can cut throat to spec., just needs a bullet and dummy round, which I can easily supply.

My question: Do I throat for VLD's, bullet seated optimally for full neck contact without excessive protrusion into case body, or do I throat for NAB's, the LRAB a bit different than std. NAB?

If I only knew in advance which one was going to shoot the best...

DF

Meet in the middle -

Well, IME, VLD's like to jump. I've always done better with them jumping than kissing or jammed. So, maybe throating for std. NAB's kissing will have the VLD's and LRAB jumping a bit.

I just want to optimize the round, utilizing the full length mag box.

DF

I hear you. Meet in middle or pick a bullet -

I guess if I had to pick one, I'd go with the 129 gr. LRAB, the bullet Nosler built this gun around. But, it may not be the last bullet standing when the smoke clears.

I'd love to have a couple of those bullets if anyone cares to donate to a good cause, as they're not available at this time, all on B.O.

DF

I would think about throating it shorter for the VLD.

As the throat wears, which may happen :), you'll have room to move the bullet out and even switch to a bullet with a more pronounced ogive.

That was my thought as well.

Actually, probably the ideal basis for a custom-barreled 26 Nosler rifle would be a Ruger No. 1, because they don't have any magazine-length problems to deal with. But they also aren't aren't "tactical" enough for a lot of hunters these days....

Thanks, Rick and John.

That's what I'm gonna do, chamber for the VLD.

A few hundred rounds will most likely move the throat enough to accommodate most bullets...

I look forward to reports on throat wear from John's 26 Nosler.

DF