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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 17,302 Likes: 7
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 17,302 Likes: 7 |
165 Ballistic tip (.308) at 2750 fps impact. Accubond should have done much better!
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 20,379
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 20,379 |
C'mon man.. Shooting into water?
Apples and apples is a little more meaningful.
I replace valve cover gaskets every 50K, if they don't need them sooner...
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,387 Likes: 44
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,387 Likes: 44 |
pathfinder the fellow it happened to was using a 200 gr BBC in a 338 Win Mag.....can happen with the best of them I guess but never had it happen to me personally.
But I can see how it could....at 30 yards and 2800+ fps that elk shoulder would be about like a steel plate.Bullet hits at an angle and sort of deflects instead of digging in. I've seen three elk killed with AB's now.......contrary to some breathless early repots, so far I wouldn't mistake it for a Partition. Had a friend who has hunters on his family ranch, he essentially said the same thing this past month. Don't get me wrong, the AB is a better than average bullet........ Casey In your mind, what is average?
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,387 Likes: 44
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,387 Likes: 44 |
all rifles will fail, all scopes will fail, all ammo will fail.
I think the angle was probably the biggest issue there.
I am still waiting to see a barnes fail for me or friends, but I expect I"ll see it sooner or later.
Personally for elk in an 06 I'd be running 180s of about any standard bullets flavor. But I really think that the angle was the issue here. Like tossing a stone at a flat water surface... I suspect it kind of skipped in a way.
Being that high of an angle the ideal would have been a very low entry shot though, and exit high due to angle. As it was if this one had penetrated it may well, dependign on angle, only stunned the elk with a hit above the spine, rather than killed it.
Bottom line, the shooter knew to never drop your guard, and to keep shooting, till its down and out, and all was good.
Loved the story and pics. Especially the last picture. Excellent post rost. I agree that the shot placement was off at that angle as well.
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 20,831 Likes: 2
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 20,831 Likes: 2 |
If it blew up were there bullet fragments imbedded in the meat or hide? Should have been more than couple with that small amount of penetration. If not, then something else altered a normal outcome.
laissez les bons temps rouler
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,303
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,303 |
I too shot an AB this year into a moose and had it "blow up" the shoulder. I will take some responsibilty as I should have used a heavier than 165 gr from a 300 wsm.
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 17,302 Likes: 7
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 17,302 Likes: 7 |
C'mon man.. Shooting into water?
Apples and apples is a little more meaningful. I may have been misinformed but I was told that water puts severe strain on a bullet.
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 5,173
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 5,173 |
Hey Fotis, how goes it? Yeah, I think the water jugs are an acceptable test med, for a soft-tissue shot on game, but I don't think they substitute for an elk shoulder blade very well. Still, in general, my "water jug testing" has pretty much shown the same thing as my in-the-field observations: The heavier constructed bullets penetrate deeper, expand less. The lighter constructed bullets expand more and penetrate less. Not really all that difficult for me to accept. Bullets like the TSX, Nosler Partition, Nosler Accubond, Swift A-Frame, all penetrated well. The Ballistic Tip impressed me by hanging together as well as it did, and I've seen it do the same thing on game, meaning it performs pretty doggone well. Why this particular Accubond & elk shoulder didn't work out so well? I don't know, but I tend to go along with the guys who are thinking it was the angle of impact. That's got to play a significant part. Okay, hopping in the Jeep now, looking for a big ol' trophy spike mule deer dink... Hopefully the Ballistic Tips in my .25-06 will be adequate. Again. Regards, Guy
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 17,302 Likes: 7
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 17,302 Likes: 7 |
If in fact it was a dead on hit that shoulder bone should have been broken as a minimum. And I am not limiting that statement on the AB alone. Hornady, Sierra, and other non premiums should be able to crack that bone too.
I have seen this done on a 7x7 bull elk in Laramie peak.
180 gr BTSP Interlock at 3050 from a 308 Norma mag. Impact at 30 feet. I still have the bullet at home.
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 578
Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 578 |
We cut the meat up tonight and did find the shoulder blade was broken. We did not find any evidence that the bullet penetrated beyond the blade though.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 8,423
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 8,423 |
Any chance you hit a limb before the elk
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 578
Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 578 |
I was standing next to my uncle when he made the shot, he had a clear line of sight to the elk.
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,237
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,237 |
A few years ago I shot an antelope at 100 yards with a 140ge 7mm Accubond. The animal was facing me. I figure the impact velocity at over 3000 fps. The bullet entered just in front of the left shoulder and never exited the chest cavity. DRT.
The bullet acted just like a Ballistic Tip. I still us them.
molɔ̀ːn labé skýla
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 578
Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 578 |
I went searching for the bullet that put the cow down. It entered the back of the neck, devastated the vertebrae, broke the jaw bone, nocked out some teeth and exited through the mouth. This is impressive to say the least, I only found one small piece of jacket in this mess. Conference restored.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856 |
pathfinder the fellow it happened to was using a 200 gr BBC in a 338 Win Mag.....can happen with the best of them I guess but never had it happen to me personally.
But I can see how it could....at 30 yards and 2800+ fps that elk shoulder would be about like a steel plate.Bullet hits at an angle and sort of deflects instead of digging in. Scary what it would have done at that distance with a hot gun/load.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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