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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 14,475
Campfire Outfitter
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OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 14,475 |
I don't think so. In trying out these new powders from Alliant some have said that..... "RL-22 = RL-23, but temp stable + anti-copper fouling additive
RL-25 = RL-26, but temp stable + anti-copper fouling additive"
Looking at Alliants Reloader Guide site this is what I notice for the 25-06 Rem shooting Speer 120 gr BTSP
Reloder 22 52.0 grains 2,931 Reloder 23 48.2 grains 2,988 Reloder 25 58.0 grains 3,071 Reloder 26 49.7 grains 3,020 7mm Rem Mag 160 grain bullets.
Reloder 22 63.0 grains 2,936 Reloder 23 65.1 grains 3,001 Reloder 25 70.0 grains 3,090 Reloder 26 67.0 grains 3,014 7mm STW 160 grain bullets
Reloder 22 73.0 grains 3,074 Reloder 23 74.5 grains 3,112 Reloder 25 75.0 grains 3,076 Reloder 26 76.8 grains 3,128 300 Win Mag Speer 180 gr SP
Reloder 22 77.0 grain 3,055 Reloder 23 77.2 grain 3,066 Reloder 25 79.5 grains 3,050 Reloder 26 80.2 grains 3,089 Albeit, not the same brand 28 caliber bullets, but still, something to notice. Also, the 7mm STW burns more RL 26 over RL 25 rather than less RL 26 than RL 25 as the 7mm Rem Mag does. The 300 Win is close. Case dimensions being a factor here, I would say.
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 4,340
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 4,340 |
I used to love reloader powder. Lately I've had plenty of lot to lot inconsistancy and find their data to be pretty funky compared to real world results. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out w/the new powders but I'll be looking w/a fair amount of skeptisism.
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,479 Likes: 9
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,479 Likes: 9 |
Dang...interesting comments by the Alliant guru. "CFE" type additives added to RL powders since 2002? Am I reading that right?
You only live once, but...if you do it right, once is enough.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 23,666 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 23,666 Likes: 3 |
Very interesting & informative...........thanks for posting.
MM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 20,955 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 20,955 Likes: 3 |
If the new powders are temp stable I will go back to using Reloder powders. When I discovered the temperature instability of them I called a moratorium. Haven't used them since.
By the way, in case you missed it, Jeremiah was a bullfrog.
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 14,475
Campfire Outfitter
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OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 14,475 |
Alliants response Reloder 23 is produced by our Swedish partner Bofors, and Reloder 26 is produced in Switzerland by our extremely capable partner Nitrochemie. I have seen it stated that they are both made by Bofors, so that is incorrect. I have also noticed people are equating Reloder 23 to Reloder 22, and Reloder 26 to Reloder 25. Both of those statements are definitely incorrect. We do state that the performance of Reloder 23 is similar to Reloder 22, and it is, in general burn speed terms, but they are most certainly not the same. (We could have said they are similar to IMRxxxx, or Hxxxx, but that doesn't mean to use that data.) We have worked quite a lot of recipes for Reloder 23, and they are not the same as Reloder 22. Reloder 26 is definitely slower burning than Reloder 25, so there shouldn't be any confusion there either. Reloder 23 was developed to bring a truly temp stable powder to the Reloder 22 burn speed range using Bofors new process technology. This is the second product developed for us with this TZ(R) process, the first being AR-Comp(TM). We see terrific efficiencies, sd's, accuracy and flat temp response from these powders. Please try them, I think you will be impressed. Reloder 26 is produced with Nitrochemie's latest generation EI(R) process technology. This is the same impregnation coating process used to produce Reloder 17, Reloder 33 and Reloder 50 for us, and it is fantastic. The "so what" on Reloder 26 is great ballistic efficiency, high bulk density so you can get more of the slow powder into the case to harness the energy, and decent, predictable extreme temp response. Reloder 26 is not as flat at temps as the TZ or Australian materials, but it is very manageable, usually in the 0.5fps/�F range (depending on the application). Just as important, the pressure increases at hot are very manageable. We are using quite a bit of this powder in our Federal factory ammo due to the fantastic ballistics and accuracy. Both of these new Reloders contain decoppering agent to help reduce coppering up your barrels, but this is nothing new for us. Bofors began adding decoppering agent to our Reloder rifle powders in the 2002 timeframe, and all our Swiss Reloders except 17 contain their proprietary additive. (We may include it in 17 at some point also, but right now we like it just the way it is.) Sorry we didn't have a snappy name figured for the decoppering agents, we just did it. Both of these new Reloder's are also produced to the current highest level of "green" technology. Actually, all of our Alliant rifle, pistol and shotshell reloading powders meet the current (tough) European requirements for elimination of nasty ingredients. They do not contain any dinitrotoluene or dibutylphthalate, which are a couple of the nasties that are commonly used in smokeless powders. Thank you for your interest in our new powders. Shoot well,
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 22,274
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 22,274 |
Looking at Alliants Reloader Guide site this is what I notice for the 25-06 Rem shooting Speer 120 gr BTSP
Reloder 22 52.0 grains 2,931 Reloder 23 48.2 grains 2,988
Reloder 25 58.0 grains 3,071 Reloder 26 49.7 grains 3,020
that's some strange looking data. On most of the examples you give, the new powders are off within 5%. Showing almost 20% difference between 25 & 26, in the .25-06. I use a lot of 22, so I'll certainly grab some 23 when it shows up. Nice to hear they actually are shipping it.
"...the designer of the .270 Ingwe cartridge!..."
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 2,961
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 2,961 |
Interesting stuff.... thanks for the information.
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 20,955 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 20,955 Likes: 3 |
Wonder why there is no mention of all this new stuff on Alliant's website?
By the way, in case you missed it, Jeremiah was a bullfrog.
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 42,936 Likes: 15
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 42,936 Likes: 15 |
probably we reloaders/handloaders are waaaaaaay down on their priority list for sale of product...
ammo manufacturers are going flat out still...
hence why brass is so hard to find, unless you buy store ammo to reload with it later..
just my opinion, nothing more, nothing less...
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