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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 42,620 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 42,620 Likes: 1 |
Weatherby Imperials. Made in Germany.
A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 12,530
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 12,530 |
You might be right maybe I should just leave well enough alone. Here's the rifle with the 1993 vintage (I bought it new and mounted it then) Leupold VX II 3-9, it looks fine. ![[Linked Image]](http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o320/GlacierJohn/945_zps1d1ce04b.jpg) Actually it doesn't too big in front, and too modern. Nothing wrong with that!
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,380 Likes: 1
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,380 Likes: 1 |
Best is an indeterminate quality but for my 2 cents I would try to find a Weaver K-4 or K-6 in good condition with nice bluing.
Some of the others mentioned may have slightly better optics but there are probably more old K model Weavers still in use than all of the others put together. Something about them just looks right. Plus, they have click adjustments that tracked well something that not all scopes of that era did.
drover
223 Rem, my favorite cartridge - you can't argue with truckloads of dead PD's and gophers.
24hourcampfire.com - The site where there is a problem for every solution.
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,221
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,221 |
Kahles Super Helia 4x and 6x are really nice scopes and are from the 60's.
Give me land, lots of land, under starry skies above. Don't fence me in.
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,913
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,913 |
Now you got me fixated on fixed power scopes.
From another recent topic on scopes, fixed scopes seem to be less problematic and trouble free than variables.
The Fire is a great place to learn - Thanks!
It was Jerry "Mad Dog" Shriver (SFC E-7)who said:
"No, no, I've got them right where I want them -- surrounded from the inside." http://www.macvsog.cc/1969.htm
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 14,807
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 14,807 |
Now you got me fixated on fixed power scopes.
From another recent topic on scopes, fixed scopes seem to be less problematic and trouble free than variables.
The Fire is a great place to learn - Thanks! Perhaps you meant to write: 'More trouble free.'? Over the last 60 years of using riflescopes for hunting the only one to have a problem was a 4X Lyman All American that filled with water after a day in the rain.
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 71
Campfire Greenhorn
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OP
Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 71 |
It seems from this thread that there is no one standout amongst the popular scopes of the sixties. Those that have owned or still own a Lyman, Weaver or whatever and have had good luck with them, like them the best. I have had great luck with a mid sixties B&L Balvar for the past 22 years, I love the tapered cross hairs, good clear optics and general good looks. Like I said I have a perfectly usable Leupold on the rifle right now, and would have not even thought about a retro scope if I hadn't picked up my buddies Weaver K-6.
This thread has been fun though as I spent a lot of time shifting through ebay looking at a lot of old Weavers, Kollmorgan, Lymans and B&L's. They all look great to me and really the price isn't killer high, so it might be fun just to buy something and try it out.
Thanks,
John
Last edited by GlacierJohn; 12/23/14.
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,586
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,586 |
If the choices were opened up to include European-made scopes there'd be options like the Nickel Supra, Pecar, Zeiss, Hensoldt etc, as well as the already mentioned Weatherby Imperial (made by Hertel & Reuss)and Helia. I've used several of these, as well as older Leupolds and steel-tube Weavers, and I think I'd give the European scopes of that vintage the edge, given the same condition, especially over the Weaver (a decent scope of the time, but mid-level not premium)
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 71
Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 71 |
So, is there a consensus best American made scope of that era? Bausch and Lomb?
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 235
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 235 |
Weaver is making anniversary model K4s that would be both period correct and Brand new.... This is what I would do. A modern Fully Multicoated Click Adjustable Blued Steel Scope. If I had to go back to using El Paso K4 and K6s I'd probably just shoot irons.
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 71
Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 71 |
Weaver is making anniversary model K4s that would be both period correct and Brand new.... This is what I would do. A modern Fully Multicoated Click Adjustable Blued Steel Scope. If I had to go back to using El Paso K4 and K6s I'd probably just shoot irons. I shoot iron sights, old and new scopes, good vintage optics are way closer to new scopes than any open sight. For sure modern multicoated glass is way better, but good vintage scopes in good or restored condition is more than adequate for 95% of any hunting scenario.
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 723
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 723 |
I have an old steel Weaver K4 bought about 1968 and an early 60's vintage Pecar 4X. The Pecar is much superior optically to the K4. The only problem with the Pecar is that the reticle is non-centering while the K4 is.
I love the view through the Pecar but even with Burris Signature rings with inserts; I can't get the reticle centered on the rifle I'd like it on as the holes on the rifle seem to be incorrectly drilled. (Pecars are 26mm diameter but the Burris Signatures fit.)
p.s. the Pecar, Burris Signature rings with two full sets of inserts along with some other vintage scopes and newer Talley mounts will be for sale on the classified ads after Christmas.
"It is wise, though, to remember above all else: rifle, caliber, scope, and even bullets notwithstanding, the most important feature of successful big game hunting is to put that bullet in the correct place, the first time!" John Jobson
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 18,033
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 18,033 |
I'm an unabashed Weaver slut when it comes to old scopes. My old 99 wears a K-4 as do so many others. Lots of very good old scopes have been mentioned here, but the iconic K-4 will always get my vote in this race.
molɔ̀ːn labé skýla
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,154
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,154 |
I've got to agree with you gopher. I still have several old K-4 and K-6 scopes that have served me well and I don't hesitate to take them hunting. I also like my old B&L scopes, though I have had one that the seals gave up on, probably from to much Hoppes No. 9 vapors.
My biggest fear is when I die my wife will sell my guns for what I told her they cost....
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 14,275
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 14,275 |
I still have the first rifle I ever bought, a Remington 700 BDL that I bought mail order from Sears in 1967. I shot it a couple years with open sights before I could afford a cheap Universal 3-9, that I used until it fogged up in 1992. Then I put a Leupold VX2 3-9 which is still a fine scope, but after borrowing my buddies early 70s Weaver K8-1, I thought I might go with something similar to keep it period correct. Of my four rifles my favorite scope is the Balvar 2 1/2 - 8 that came on my Burgess 98. Scope and rifle are 1964 vintage, but since my 700 already has Leupold bases and rings I don't want to hassle with the external adjustable mount required of the Balvar.
So my criteria are 1) internal adjustments. 2) Fixed four or six power. 3)Period correct for a 60's rifle. 4) Good optics and overall quality for then. 5) Looks good on a rifle.
I have a Lyman All American fixed four, it is fine optically, but the black has worn off the aluminum tube and it looks a little ratty. My buddies Weaver is clean and classy looking with that blued steel tube. Did B & L make any internal adjusted scopes back in the day? I love my Balvar. So between Redfield, Weaver, Lyman and Leupold what was best? It will be fum to ebay shop a bit.
Thanks,
John I never had 50`s or 60`s Weaver that did not fog!!!
Its all right to be white!!
Stupidity left unattended will run rampant
Don't argue with stupid people, They will drag you down to their level and then win by experience
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Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,891
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,891 |
I'll put in a plug for the old bushnell scopes from Japan. Mine are probably mid 70s to early 80s vintage but I have three one sport view, a banner and a scope chief, all fixed 4s. All of them work as well as they did when new and have never given any trouble. The scopechief is probably going back into service on a Sears 51L I just acquired. The sport view is on my old moss erg 22 mag.
Last edited by bangeye; 12/31/14.
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 71
Campfire Greenhorn
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OP
Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 71 |
Can any of you old timers tell me anything about the first of the Japanese Bausch and Lomb scopes, late 60s early 70s? I think these were the first internal adjustable B and L scopes.
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 4,079 Likes: 1
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 4,079 Likes: 1 |
How about a Leupold 6x Mountaineer I picked it up in a trade a number of years ago. I put it on an old Rem 722 for an egg shoot that I wanted to use something old at, tied for first. Pretty clear scope.
After the first shot the rest are just noise.
Make mine a Minaska
Heaven has walls and rules, H-ll has open borders
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 4,464
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 4,464 |
I have no idea date range but I always thought the Unertal Hawk/falcon was cool
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2,083
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2,083 |
I've been very pleased with the performance of both leupold and steel tube weavers over the last 30 years. Since this is an "ain't it cool" purchase, I'd go K6 with a duplex reticle. That blued steel tube looks so sweet.
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