Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Long Range Hunting Scope Tracking Tests...

Ok.

Actually, I won't want to at all.

When Leupold makes a scope like the Mark 4 M5 A2 there's no reason to do so unless you don't like money.

How many S&B's, Nightforce's, US Optics, Steiners, Khales etc....do you think I have beaten over the last few years with Leuopold scopes finishing as high as I have at the few major matches I've shot?

I admittedly don't have the drive or desire anymore to prove what I can do in the Rifle World as I did in the Shotgun World. But there's no doubt that Leupold isn't holding me back

Ric,

Does Leupold send loaners when yours are getting repaired? Or are you like the rest of us... without scope/rifle for a few weeks?

I was pissed when my LRF died, but Swaro gave me a loaner so that eased the pain a bit. Didn't do me any good while I was in the field with a dead LRF though. I'd imagine the same would apply to a scope dying on a hunt or comp, wouldn't?

Jason

They don't send a loaner. Repair turnaround time is quick. The two I had to send back were returned to me in 3 weeks

I explained my post as slowly as possible and why I posted what I did... It has nothing to do with my lack of knowledge on how a scope works or the value at which one tracks... As stated before I did not watch the video prior to making that post...I've seen at least 2 other video's and numerous pages of complaints on March scopes and took for granted that the attached video was the same... That was my bad and I manned up to it...

Now I will ask for a third time....


I guess it doesn't really matter as you've dodged that question in another thread as well as 3 times in this one... It's really none of my business or anyone else's for that matter... Obviously it works for you and you're happy with it... I still think its cheesy at its chessyest...

I doubt Tanner was blindly agreeing with anyone... The young man is very astute and will go places and do things that 90% of the masses will only read about...

I painfully will have to Bow out of this discussion for a bit as I have to attend a Crocheting Convention in the southern part of the state... That Crocheting stuff is serious business... I won't have service again until the 16th so you gals have fun...

Keep it Real Agent "Orange"...

"Cheesy" 1/3 MOA clicks equate to .1 mil.

Wtf is wrong with that? That's what good scopes are based on.

I recall Frank Galli (Lowlight at Snipershide) stating, "Leupold fails the most, Nightforce the least, and S&B somewhere in between." Or something to that effect, I just remember the main idea.

I know Frank used to be much more willing to share opinions on Leupold failures but I think people started getting defensive (offended). He stated numerous times that he is just relaying what is seen in his classes and others precision shooting schools. Its really no different than what Formi has been saying...

Post by Lowlight:

Re: whats wrong with leupold?

Funny, you see the truth, you point out the problems, which happen far too often, you're a hater of the company...

When class after class the number one scope to fail is Leupold, --then people claim because so many of them are out there, well these are their "tactical" scopes and not the hunting line. When we have a competition with 92 shooters and the one brand with multiple scope failures on the line is Leupold, to the point where people can no longer continue to compete, that is not hate, but a problem within the product line.

However if I see a problem and bring it to the company and they tell me we'll look into it, and I say nothing --- people also get up in arms.

When you point out the scopes "no longer" say Made in USA, people get upset with the messenger, and don't question a company who's prices have gone up, who's failure rates has increased, and who moved to second tier parts enough to lose the Made in USA tag, we are haters.

Sure plenty of scopes are made overseas, but their failure rate is not reflected on their location. For a company like NF, who is bringing things on shore, and is used every bit alongside Leupolds in the military, the failure rate cannot be compared... it's easily 5 to 1, maybe even 10 to 1. Sure Leupolds are packaged with system rifles, but that is not based on success, but volume, the ability to produce replacements better than any other company.

Are they god awful, no not at all, but really would I invest my money in one given the choices, absolutely not. Given the same budget, there are better scopes to invest in, some for less money.

I have a new M5 here to review, I think from the outside it is a decent scope, we'll see how it performs... but other companies out there are definitely beating Leupold at their own game haters or not.

Link to Lowlight post

Always get a kick of the "Leopold" reference.

Interesting, but....

I'd rather see a summary data table with accurate measures as opposed to watching videos where data is reported as something like "about 19."

I can see giving them another go if you've had good luck with them..

What about the next time? I dont have that exact scope you have, but believe they all use the same erector..So it will happen..someday you might just get tired of fuggin around.

I agree with formadiolo on why the Horus came about. However I think it's a crappy concept when your scope works correctly mechanically if I am doing a holdover reticle the best one I have seen is the nightforce velocity reticles.

Look the Leopold deniers are ill rational. That means they can't be reasoned with. That means it does no good to argue with them, imagine pouring water on a rock.

It has everything to do with your lack of knowledge. You didn't bother to actually watch videos you posted because you were just sure those vids would support your view point.

March gets a pass and a (wrong) explanation of how to adjust for miss matched clicks but Leupold is crap. Seems Legit.

Here is a hint. Do your phhucking due diligence. That's how the Big Boys play the game.


Do you know how I know that you know you know way less than I know on this subject.

Looks like there isn't a body hit on that cow pic John ? Blood on the front leg though. Probably a non-pass through VLD ?

Your friend,

Roy

I experienced too adjustment issues with Leupold just as Lowlight posted. RC, john Burns and a friend that is an amazing long range Hunter shooter use leupolds and have had better luck with them than I. I simply moved on have been very pleased.

I like tater tots................

This.

I think the reason so many confuse the two are they have little actual experience hunting, and none gun fighting....

To borrow a term from my 10 year old, that's Captain Obvious, and has been my thought process all along.

If my priority is reliability, should I listen to a gun fighter whose survival is at stake or should I listen to a long range hunter who sales the scope he promotes and has no risk of survival?

....

Troops:

I'd rather not listen to anyone. Just put up documented data describing ones methods or procedures, the products compared, and the results.

I see statements here like 5 to 1 failure rates. How many of each were compared? If there were 500 X's and 100 Y's with respective failures of 100 and 20, then we have similar rates of 20%.

Show us some data please. The videos exhibiting 1 Burris, Leupold, Tasco, etc that are not even remotely similar products (i.e a 12X vs a 6X vs a 20X) does not a trial make.

How much are you paying for documented data? Discretion is your friend.

Heck, I couldn't tell you how many Leups have failed me alone. But I can tell you its WAY more than is acceptable TO ME, without quantification.

There is one constant that is the same in both hunting and gun fighting, the need for reliability and that Is why it is brought up.
A totaly reliable scope with high resolution and excellent low light ability is an asset in either gun fighting or hunting. Those aspects correlate.

Wow, I am imagining pouring water on a rock.



Look again.

VLD exit at point of shoulder. Stream of lung blood on front leg.

Right now I am very angry at you and will not be sending you a birthday card this year. Harsh, yes, but fair.

Your Friend,

John



Seems like a pretty level headed approach.