Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Handguns One shot stops.....

Why did you introduce all of this in the discussion? We can all make up scenarios that fulfill the narrative we are trying to paint. You made the declaration that the 7mm mag is always the better choice for moose (I'm paraphrasing), over the .475 Linebaugh. You got challenged on the statement by those who have actually killed big-game with a big handgun, and then you introduced this ridiculous scenario. Your original declaration was just wrong -- it ignores way too many significant factors.

Spoken like someone who has never shot a head of game with a big handgun. The handgun will NEVER achieve high velocities, but this does't preclude it from being damn effective on big-game animals. Oddly enough, the big Nitro Express cartridges are still popular hunters in Africa. Big and slow, not light and fast, is still really good medicine for big and dangerous game.

This is the original quote, that I my answer addressed. This quote is referring to therms all ballistic, which is what the opening post is also referring and every answer that I have given in this thread is also referring to terminal ballistics.

Of my years shooting game and seeing game shot with a hangun and rifle, I can swear on a stack of bibles that I have never seen this to be true. The properl caliber handgun with a proper bullet placed in the vitails will put game on the ground as fast as will a rifle. That is far sure and certain.
In all of my years of hunting moose, I never saw a bullet from any rifle exit, that includes 7 mag, 300 mags, 338 win mags and 375 H&H. I never shot nor seen a moose shot with a Barnes X, TSX or TTSX bullet. I did see plenty shot with Nosler Partitions and I never saw one exit a moose. A 420 grain LFN hard cast from a 475 revolver, a 525 grain WFN from a 500 Linebaugh will exit and also leave a larger wound channel than will any 7 mag. This I know from experience.

A large heavy big bore bullet has advantages over smaller diameter lighter faster bullets for terminal performance in certain situations. The smaller diameter lighter faster projectiles have advantages over larger diameter heart projectiles in certain situations. It is not one is always better than the other. It depends.

In a life or death confrontation with a defensive handgun IMHO one advantage of a 45 with proper bullets is the better chance of seeing the visual indication of a hit. The advantage of the 9mm is the larger magazine capacity.
It is rarely a straight up one is better than the other. Let's stick to the original discussing of terminal performance. Another thread can discuss ones ability or inability to shoot certain calibers and/or platforms better than others.


PS. A 7 mag will blow a much larger wound channel in a deer than it will in a moose. The increased "hydraulic pressure" produce because of the higher velocity will stretch the tissue past it's elastic limits. The will not happen in a moose as the large mass of the animal will soak up the increased pressure. It all depends on the situation as to which is best from a terminal ballistics position.

The leg came off when skinning because of the damage from a wide meplat flat point hard cast.



Proper caliber and bullets from handguns produce excellent terminal performance. There is no question about that.

The idea of "one shot" without a CNS hit is a pipe dream no matter the platform, rifle or handgun.

That's a completely different question but I'll answer it anyway.

First, it would depend on the largest unfriendly animal I was likely to encounter.

In close timber I would still take the handgun; in my case a heavy-loaded 45 Colt.

In open country I would take the rifle, which in my case would be a 30-06.

Sarge I totally agree.

As do I.

I don't reload for pistol bullets, I guess I should, anyone know where to find some 45 ACP cartridges loaded with lead semi wad cutters? They used to sell cartridges like this or at least lead round nose about everywhere, now you don't see them anymore.

Buffalo Bore, Double Tap Ammo, I believe Underwood ammo, and Grizzly Cartridge to name a few.

45-110 Sharps High Speed Cam

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dj6xNdK2rZk

Note the secondary explosion.

Cant believe I just stumbled onto this thread today. I should really pay more attention. I have some new loads available for testing soon. There is no projectile, just powder which expands as a gas to about 7000fps, should leave a heck of a hydraulic something wound as long as your within a few inches.

There's been a lot of old-timers scratching their head, trying to figure out "that secondary explosion"

I do know that bullet didn't hardly slow down in those blocks...

Sorry I didn't answer this right away. You asked and deserve an answer from me.

The answer is no, unless you count several feral hogs that were all around the 260 lb mark. I wasn't really hunting hogs or anything else when I shot them though. I killed 4 feral hogs that size over a 6 year period while working as a Deputy Sheriff in Brazos County, Texas. The ranchers and farmers in our county and the surrounding counties begged us to kill any feral hog we saw or coyote. They told us to kill them and if we wanted, just leave the remains and the ranch/farm owner would dispose of it. I killed them with my Glock 20. I killed 10 more over that same time span with my M1A. When you have 600 square miles that is mainly dirt or gravel roads and cow pastures, plenty of chances to kill a hog presents itself.

I don't dislike big-bore handguns. We moved to IL in 2000, where taking big game with a rifle is banned; we have to use a Shotgun shooting slugs. Recently the IDNR introduced a handgun season. I have since acquired a S&W Custom Shop 500 Magnum with a 6" barrel, and a Gary Reeder "Grim Reaper" chambered in 500 Magnum. I've probably put 100 rounds through the S&W 500 Magnum; it's not much fun to plink with, nor is it the fire-breathing, wrist-breaking monster some people seem to think it is. I haven't shot the Reeder "Grim Reaper". I'm saving it for something else...

Sounds to me like you've killed big game with a handgun by any reasonable definition. Whitworth and jwp didn't put many restrictions on their original claims but then jumped you over not caveating your own. If I were facing a Grizzly, I'd rather do it over a scoped 7mm Mag. at 300 yards than with one of their custom big bores at 50.

Big slow bullets have their place just as light high velocity ones do. IDGAF about the credentials of the guy who claims the 22 Mag. is about as good as anything else for stopping bad guys. That's a crock of [bleep].

Both Marshall and Ayoob had a significant number of shootings (supposedly) compiled. Most here chose to venerate the FBI's "scientific" test results over real-world experiences. That's fine. Whatever somebody wants to stake their life on is up to them. If I had to go into a gunfight at normal handgun ranges I'd say that Glock 10mm you used would be about as good as anything. So would a .40 Smith M&P. Even better would be a 12 gauge riot gun if that is allowed in the discussion-given proper loads. All given proper loads. The vaunted penetration doesn't seem to be as vaunted when some here are talking about the lowly 556.

Why some of y'all continue to step in Safariman's traps is beyond my ken.

We can hardly be blamed when he launches this statement: "A Kimber Montana in 7mm Mag will kill more surely and faster than any handgun made. I purposely exclude the hand-rifles like the Thompson Contender or Encore. Those are not handguns."

I understand that maybe when comparing the 7 Mag with a 10mm loaded for defensive purposes is your measuring stick, but you can hardly compare that to a properly loaded .475 or .500 Linebaugh, or even a .45 Colt or .480 Ruger. That is like comparing apples to grapes, terminally speaking (and more a factor of the way it is loaded and not an indictment of the 10mm as a caliber).

As we all know Elmer Kieth had it right with his 250 gr "Keith" SWC out of a 44 Mag as being superior...

Haha, the APEX round.

But Elmer was good out to 600 yards... Being a mere mortal I would take the scoped rifle if hunting medium size and up game at ranges over 75 - 100 yards.

Huge difference in the 2 quotes above. One is preference, the other is an absolute that is not correct in fact.

Tough crowd.