Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Swiss K31 question

That is pretty neat, it gives you a connection to the poor guy that had to tote that near 9 pound rifle up and down the Alps.

Here's a couple of links that help decipher some of the info on the tag.

http://www.swissrifles.com/sr/tags/
http://theswissriflesdotcommessageb...ions-amp-military-IDnumbers#.VQpN--H-XII

If I read it right your rifle's owner was Walter Schmid of Fuel Company 106 (kp = company, betrst = Betriebsstof which means fuel) He lived at #3 Waldegg Way in the town of Kloten.

I understand some of the Swiss rifle collectors contact the original owner, if he is still alive, although I'm not sure what all they'd say. "Hi, I have your rifle. If you want it back deposit xxx Swiss francs in a numbered account at..." .

Jim thanks for that link and info, deciphering that tag was going to be my next step. Not shown in my pic is the back side of the tag which has a serial number matching my rifle, so no doubt it is the original slip..
Again, I find this very interesting. Thanks for the knowledge MD!

Jim, i had 5 different K-31's about 5 years ago with one of them using the left hand op rod and the Swiss products peep sight. Phenomenal accuracy when you get these setup right. 168 grain sierras and reloader 15 will make it sing!!!!

Certifiable,

You're welcome!

My rifle was a late model, made in 1955, so the citizen it was issued to may still be around. His name was Jurg Aeschliman, from Bern, and was a member of an intelligence unit.

In my rifle the two most accurate loads came from data listed for older 7.5x55's, 49.0 grains of H4831 with the 165 Ballistic Tip, and 46.0 grains of IMR4350 and the 200-grain Speer Hot-Cor. The most accurate load listed for K31's is 54.0 grains of Norma MRP and the 150-grain Hornady Interlock.

A few years ago when we were at Epcot in Orlando, I struck up a conversation with a Swiss gentleman who was working at the German Biergarten. He asked me what I knew about Switzerland, which wasn't a whole lot, so I told him that I thought that the K31 was a great rifle. His eyes lit up and he told me the story of his K31, about being in the Swiss Army, and how committed every Swiss soldier was. About how Switzerland stood neutral through two World Wars because the Germans and Austro-Hungarians during WW1 and the Germans and Italians during WW2 decided that the cost of attacking Switzerland wouldn't be worth the cost. He was proud to be Swiss and it made me a little sad to think about the lack of pride so many Americans feel toward my Country.

Thanks for load information Mule Deer - GP11 ammo has been so accurate for me that I've been lazy on working up any loads for it. Even went to the trouble of removing the primers from the GP11 brass and getting berdan primers. Seems to be an issue with either primer hole depth, primer "thickness" or both because when I seat the primers they are considerably (I know this is scientific and helpful terminology) below the brass causing inconsistent ignition? I do have some boxer primed brass but being the person I am I hate to throw such good brass out (and I have a literal pile of it)! I really need to get a load with expanding bullets as I would like to hunt with it.

Great story 260Remguy....there is another often told story centered around this rifle on one of the Swiss forums (and I probably have it twisted a bit) but it is something about a Swiss General was asked by a visiting German military officer what would his 250,000 men do if the Germans invaded with 500,000 men? He thought for a moment and replied “Shoot twice.” They do seem proud of their country and this rifle (I would be proud of this rifle too if I were Swiss and I still am being Irish ).

PennDog

I bought 21(?) boxes of new Norma 7.5x55 brass from Tal35(?) a few years ago, so I have brass for life. Got a good deal on some PP factory ammo awhile back, $9 per 20, and have been shooting that on the once every year or two that old # 6401xx gets to the range.

The story that I heard was that before WW1, Kaiser Wilhelm was watching the Swiss Army on a field exercise and when he asked a crusty, old, Sergeant Major that question, the SGM gave the same answer. Being a SGM, he probably sprinkled his response with a little spicy language, but isn't that the norm for a senior NCO? Whatever the Swiss did, their threat of violence kept them out of both World Wars. They probably could have kicked the Austro-Hungarians and Italians collective butts, but the Germans don't play by the rules, so that might have been bad for all involved.

Yea that's it - love that story!

I do have some Norma and Graf & Sons brass (probably enough to do what I need for my time here) but I still hate to not use that GP11 brass - guess I need to just get over it

PennDog

When I first saw the cases I thought they looked pretty modern for a case design from 1911 (or 1889). Fairly straight body with a relatively short neck and a 30 degree shoulder. The rim diameter is an odd size at .498 but cases can be made from .284 Winchester brass.

I'm guessing that American shooters were so wed to the .473 head size that this one never got looked at seriously but seeing the case capacity which is better than the .308 or even comparable 57mm cases and the increased shoulder angle I'm a little surprised it wasn't latched on to by earlier wildcatters. It would make a nice short .25 caliber and you could easily keep the OAL down into the 2.8" range for short actions.

Here are five fresh ones ready to go. Those are Hornady 150 gr. Spire Points with the cannelure buried in the neck. Since these were part of my very first batch they were seated to the Hornady manual COL spec which actually leaves the ogives pretty close to the lands.

Cool looking cartridges!

Mike

I have always wondered why the U.S. didn't adopt the 7.65x53 as is, or as a 7.62x53, instead of the 30-40 USA, 30-03 USG, or 30-06 USG when the Ord Corps were looking for a replacement for the 45-70 Trapdoor Springfields.

I wish more rifles were that easy to convert for us lefty's.

Doc

Factory ammo and the cases I've resized with Lee dies have a lot more taper than the fired cases. I've been neck sizing mine with a Redding die for case life. My left handed friends with these rifles consider them to be about the least friendly rifle there is for left handed shooting. Not to bad until they try to use them in the rapid fire portion of CMP matches.

I have a friend who is both a US and Swiss citizen. He holds both passports and each year returns to Switzerland to shoot his military auto rifle in military and civilian matches (he keeps his military issue rifle at a relatives home). He has several K-31's, some with diopter sights and they are all very accurate. My K-31 with issue sights is good for 1.5-2.0" groups at 100 yards.

These rifles were built to commercial standards with tolerance and finish - all beautifully made.

There is a local dentist who is of Swiss heritage and has set up "Swiss Over-Seas" or "Swiss Abroad" matches at the local rifle range. Kinda fun when a bunch of old guys get together to shoot their Swiss rifles and handguns.

If you like the regular k31, they do/did make a sniper version. It is pretty slick.
You can buy through brownells, or could, as screw on, ho whole, base for a scope. I have one set up that way.
The bayonets are of extremely high quality particularly if you can find one of the engineers bayonets, like a big saw.
Solingen steel
They have paper cartridge guides, and the k11 is match quality.
Because of that i bought starline brass for reloading.
Also have the slings, muzzlecovers, and the cleaning kits are typically anal swiss.
If you have a black substance on the wood, that comes ffrom the cleaner/lubricant in the gun cleaning kit. They used it with a screen wire patch to clean the gun, but it get all over every thing.
The germans at one point bought a bunch of these, put scopes on them and sold them as sniper rifles in south america.
You do see the earlier 1900's vintage rifle around now and then, the predecessor to the k31. I have the long rifle and the calvary carbine.
I can get with the scope sub moa at 100yards.
And that cartridge was instrumental as i remember in development i think of the 30.06.

The Mojo sight arrived yesterday so I installed it last night and it was a chore to put it mildly. All you have to do is drive out the pin holding the original sight on, that was easy, and then push the pin back through the sight holder and Mojo - that was a royal pain! Those Swiss used some extra special kind of steel in the leaf spring under the sight, that's for sure. This is the third Mojo I've installed. The M24/47 and Swede 96 only needed thumb pressure to get the sight lined up but I had to use my biggest pair of channel lock pliers and a little jury rigged pusher to get the sight holes lined up on the K31 and get that pin back in.

But now that it's on it's a definite improvement in sight picture. I'm almost curious why the European armies never caught on to a peep sighted rifle, even when it's mounted out on the barrel. Could be they figured it would get plugged up with mud which is certainly likely.

The range is closed for a BPCR match this weekend but I can probably get out for a couple of hours in the late afternoon when they're done to try it out. Have used IMR4895, RE-15 and H4350 with the Hornady 150 Spire Point and so far it looks like RE-15 will be the way to go. It got right up to 2800 fps with the lowest ES of the three powders.

The more I play with this rifle the more I like it. Actually, the more I play with these old mil-surps the more I like them. As the saying goes, "they just don't make'em like that anymore". Even the Yugo, which is crude in comparison to the Swede 96 and Swiss K31, is a solid piece of steel and wood. Don't know why, but I get as much if not more pleasure whacking a 12" steel gong at 200 yards from the kneeling position with these than shooting tiny groups with a custom barreled, accurized and scope sighted modern rifle.


P.S. You can add an original Winchester 1895 .30-GOV'T-06 to that list of really fun to shoot rifles as well.

you do realize you are on the road to perdition, don't you, the .41 is bad enough, but mil-surp? The only country i think i have avoided are italian. Just for a little temptation, look for those german built mausers for the argintines. Either the 1895 or the 1909. Among the finest mausers ever built.
At roosevelt campfire outing some weeks ago, i think the hit of the weekend was a mosin. At a gong somewhere i think out about 300meters or so. And paladin ringing it pretty regularly with that surplus ammo.
as to the K31, at one time you could get basically new ones for about 69 bucks.

It is definitely a slippery slope. I went through a .41 Magnum phase all through the 90's and survived that, so I know I can quit at any time.

Mil-surp prices have jumped tremendously just over the last few years as the supplies run down. Shootable Swedes are running $400 minimum with good examples going much higher - I passed up several examples in excellent condition for $165 at a gunshow not five years ago. Genuine German K98's are commanding collector prices for original specimens. My father told me of traveling the roads in Germany and seeing pile after pile of them, each ten feet high where they were thrown by the surrendering Germans.

I remember the ads by Interarms of VA in the back of the American Rifleman offering throw away deer rifles. Carcano's and such so cheap, even in early 1960's dollars, that when you shoot your deer you just leave the rifle in the woods. Those days are long gone for sure. The latest flood of Mosin Nagants are probably among the last of the great untapped wells of really cheap surplus rifles.

Oh well, better to get in now since they'll only get more expensive.