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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 56,147 Likes: 11
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 56,147 Likes: 11 |
Slurp, how long have you suffered from Comprehension Deficit Disorder? Is it painful? Hope so, but best of luck regardless.
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 15,685 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 15,685 Likes: 1 |
I hate to say it but Mabus was a midshipman in NROTC at Ole Miss at the same time I was. He was a couple(?) of years ahead of me and IIRC he was the CO of the midshipman corps.
Later, when he ran for governor of Mississippi, the saying was, "Save us from Mabus!"
NRA Life,Endowment,Patron or Benefactor since '72.
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Joined: Feb 2009
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Campfire Tracker
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OP
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 6,162 |
[ [/quote]
Don't forget to add "I think New Braunfels is awesome" to your resume.
It says a LOT.
Clark [/quote]
Don't forget to do your homework, junior, on matching ammo to rifle. When you get that right, that will say a LOT. Of course, you would have to leave the sheep alone long enough to study, so the jury's still out on your chances.
If you're fixin' to put a hole in something,
make it a hole to remember.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
New Braunfels...
It never gets old. Thanks again.
Dave
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Jan 2007
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 7,297 |
I have been kinda keeping up with this thread.Every time I read it I keep coming back to when the F4 didnt need guns because of missles.Guns wont be needed.Sure seems like the same sort of short sighted foolishness to me.We need both,all we can afford.
Ideas are far more powerful than guns, We dont let our people have guns. Why should we let them have ideas. "Joseph Stalin"
He who has braved youths dizzy heat dreads not the frost of age.
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 12,895
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 12,895 |
Curious on how you'd preprogram a drone for CAS... "Pre program" suggests a pre defined and somewhat fixed mission profile. A drone controlled via a data link from the ground would not have that issue. Indeed Predators are used in a ground attack role now, although its very limited compared to say an A10 or Apache. Alternatively, the future of drones will be making them autonomous and equipping them with Artificial Intelligence ie enable them to respond and be flexible, in real time so to speak.. The mind boggles at the computer and software needed for this, but if a computer can be programed to be unbeatable at Chess, I guess its only a matter of time..
Last edited by Pete E; 04/18/15.
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 10,896
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 10,896 |
Unmanned aircraft technologies will continually be subjected to electronic counter measures therefore I see live bodies in cockpits for many moons to come and certainly don't buy into the SecNav's Cylon approach.
You better be afraid of a ghost!!
"Woody you were baptized in prop wash"..crossfireoops
Woody
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,691
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Aug 2004
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I suspect unmanned, autonomous, aircraft probably don't worry much about who they are told to shoot and where. The way things are going with government, I'd rather have a pilot in the aircraft.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." TJ
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing". EB
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Joined: Apr 2001
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 12,895 |
Unmanned aircraft technologies will continually be subjected to electronic counter measures Those like the current generation which rely on data links for command and control will certainly be vulnerable, but as the use of AI develops and drones become more and more autonomous, that vulnerability will decrease greatly. It also needs to be remembered that todays manned aircraft are also susceptible having data links jammed and attacks from other forms of electronic warfare.. I see live bodies in cockpits for many moons to come I tend to agree, but the switch to autonomous drones will come, its just a matter of time.
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Posts: 4,851 Likes: 1
Campfire Tracker
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Joined: Feb 2009
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Taking the human out of the cockpit/tank degrades the psychological aspect of war at many levels and in my opinion increases the threat of escalating to nukes much faster.
For every firewall of security there is a guy in china/russia/n.korea/isis/iran etc. working to break it. They've already broken into the whitehouse, the pentigon.......Putting all your eggs in one basket will lead to major negative consequences. History has proven this many times over
“Some ideas are so stupid that only intellectuals believe them.”
― G. Orwell
"Why can't men kill big game with the same cartridges women and kids use?"
_Eileen Clarke
"Unjust authority confers no obligation of obedience."
- Alexander Hamilton
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 5,499
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Joined: Nov 2004
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Eggs in one basket? The Maginot Line comes to mind.
There is no way to coexist no matter how many bumper stickers there are on Subaru bumpers!
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 4,851 Likes: 1
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 4,851 Likes: 1 |
Eggs in one basket? The Maginot Line comes to mind. A good example, however the Maginot might have held if command didn't have it's head up its butt. German mil. build up had been going on for some days before the attack but French leadership were still so torqued over the losses during WWI, by the time they realized it was starting all over again it was too late, the blitzkrieg had already happened. Looks to me like this strategic switch to "all" drones has as much to do with our $18+ trillion debt as to a "new era" of fighting wars. The pentagon has priced itself out of its own blasters. Only time will tell, unfortunately.
“Some ideas are so stupid that only intellectuals believe them.”
― G. Orwell
"Why can't men kill big game with the same cartridges women and kids use?"
_Eileen Clarke
"Unjust authority confers no obligation of obedience."
- Alexander Hamilton
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,748
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Until they can be made to function without a data link, they have too big of an Achilles heel to put all your eggs in that basket.
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,145
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2010
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I think it premature to rule out pilots in future platforms, but the issue is more limitation of the human body to survive the issues of acceleration then anything else, as the technology improves.
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 14,316
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Question, are all 3 versions of the F-35 going to be called the Lightning II?
Phil
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Joined: Jul 2011
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453 |
Drones will follow commands and fire upon whomever is doing the programming or running the joystick.
Ponder that for a few moments.
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Joined: Nov 2004
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2004
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Think Ft Hood shooting but on a much grander scale.
There is no way to coexist no matter how many bumper stickers there are on Subaru bumpers!
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 30,980
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 30,980 |
Curious on how you'd preprogram a drone for CAS... You just program it to deploy itself to the loiter point, so the kid with the xbox controller can take it in for it's run. After it's out of fuel and ammo, he just pushes triangle, (or is it circle) to send it back to rearm and refuel as he picks up control of the next CAS drone to continue supporting our ground troops and killing bad guys.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,625
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2011
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Well, continue to stir the pot to no good end. SecNav is here today, gone tomorrow. Irrelevant as a tick on a dog's butt. Just as knowledgeable as McNamara. Over half a million Americans plus their friends and families would disagree about Robert McNamara being irrelevant. How do you sustain your energy sans Bluedreaux's COCK these days? Protein bars? Clark Why does it bother you that McNamara had so much control over the lives of so many?
"My message to my troops is if you see anybody carrying a gun on the streets of Milwaukee, we'll put them on the ground, take the gun away and then decide whether you have a right to carry it." - Milwaukee Police Chief Ed Flynn
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 30,980
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 30,980 |
I like this idea. You could cut back the manned aircraft back =by half and replace it with twice the number of unmanned drones.
You'd still have to keep pilots and conventional transport and combat aircraft, because there are just some missions that couldn't be done any other way. Correct. There are things drones do very well. long endurance Intelligence Surveillance and Recon (ISR) are sweet spots for sure. When it comes to boys in green in trouble though I want a guy looking down with eyeballs on, transport troops? No CO wants to tell a parent his child was killed by a robot aircraft software glitch. Don't think drones are cheap and they still have a lot of issues. Predator loss rate run about 10/100,000 hours. This compares to the overall Navy rate of less than 1/100,000 hours in manned aircraft. That's class A's so it doesn't include combat losses. Numbers like that mean that the technical and operational maturity of drones is still quite low. This is much closer to reality. We will continue to expand the role of drones, but the traditional pilot is not going away anytime soon. As for machines choosing target, we've all seen too many terminator movies for the American public or military leadership to me comfortable with automatic target selection being employed beyond the close in point defense role (think CWIS shooting down incoming missiles)
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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