locally we have canned goods, gardens, fruit, neighbors willing to share.

but to drill down a level or layer or two just for discussion.

we know times are changing. the drones are coming.

in general and average are cats or dogs the best?

i've never eaten either one, but i didn't have to.

whose closest behind the mormon planning?

we southern baptists have no problem with possums.

It all depends on how short things get and whether the problem is distribution (most likely) or production. If there is a serious problem with distribution then the military will get involved almost certainly. It will federalize.

If there is a genuine problem with production, well that is a whole'nother can of worms. Self production is the answer there.

The answer will never be wild game long term. Our population would decimate the game population in a blink of an eye.

Remember the wild game and wild lands we have are a luxury only possible because of our wealth. Poor countries destroy wild animal populations mercilessly. China vacuums up all furry, feathery, scaly creatures in land, air and sea.

My next-door neighbor has a couple of those little Asian piggies. I kinda like the little bastards, but well, you know.....

I have several months of chow stored in the cellar, will finish wiring up the generator here soon, and will get the freezers stocked with venison soon, also.

The boomers preoccupied with silly threads will starve.

I have my now food. Then I have about 25 canning jars of homemade stew and chili in the freezer. And there's a month of Mountain House dehydrated camping food in the garage. After that, there's the 30 pounds of lard on my body...

Depending on events potable water might be the short thing.

yes!! we need a system or process here on the fire as to how best to differentiate the real from the majical, unreal, imaginary or what's waiting just behind the curtain?

a hungry session, or breakdown in the food supply system is just un heard of.

native americans can survive on bark, tree leaves, grass etc.

that fact has already been proven, so it's true.

jim, if you were drafted by the powers that be, would you serve?

you already volunteer for the benefit of your local community, yes?

Just 30 pounds?

Amateur.....

I tried dog my 1st time in Korea.
Drunk as heck ate about half skewer of it.
Probably 3 bites.....
Char cooked over wood coals .
Had like a red colored spicy sweet sauce on it.
Dog taste like a wet dog smells......

Still regret it to this day......

I have heard that before.

well, there it is. a first hand account of the actual truth.

some discussion that the italians ate cat during ww2 when food/protein was scarce.

so, none of it is a new thing, not at all. down here in georgia ya can't just go out & be unlawful.

Good point. Some places it will be true and some places not so much.

Water is easily to deal with since there are many ways to make bad water potable, as long as it is not toxic.

Puppy dog Indian tacos.

A person will do what they need to.

You mean like bell bottoms and tie dye shirts. Hunger will disabuse them of that quickly enough.

now that i have contemplated your post for another couple of minutes, it occurs they may have fed you the incorrect variety of dog?

man alive in wildlife suppers the game can taste quite differently dependent upon the year, the game location, the cook and the recipe.

Just in case......

they were in stock w/free shipping.......

I bought 500 185 gr HP 45 ACP boolits..........

buy now !

oh yea...bought some bathroom tissue today too.........

just in case a wild hog can be captured, there should be nothing left but the grunt. and all of it should be well cooked?

Heard somewhere that Filipino like the dog allot.

Native Americans can not digest cellulose any better than any one else.

Starvation foods do not stop starvation. They will fill an empty gut and may offer a small amount of calories in certain situations, like the cambium under the bark, but for the most part you will still starve.

?????

So did ya???


Watched a Navajo roast a giant desert gerbil over a trash fire after desert storm was over .

Burnt the fur off it.
Roasted it.
Popped its belly scooped out the guts with a Mre spoon.

Broke off the legs , ate the meat off em.

It was a big too do for the 15 of us in that chalk
( 21 days in PZ posture waiting to leave Iraq)
Watching it was fascinating.......

no vegetarians in my family. all meat eaters and survivors.

if we're here today on this page to discuss the issues, we're descendents of the ancestors.

if one is here, one is a descendent of a long line of dead men? yes.

Short term, I carry a can of cheap spam, and a can of evaporated milk.

Yes

Good choice.

One of my granddaughters is a very picky eater. I'm always telling her that if she gets hungry enough, she'd be surprised at what will taste good. We have a lot canned and froze, and I have cows, chickens, raise a large garden. In addition, I have no qualms whatsoever about defending what's mine, not to mention the means to do so.

Also, I have Mennonite neighbors who wouldn't mine sharing..........even if it meant at the point of a gun. The point is, I don't aim on starving to death.

Self production very good. A person good at production will also be a valued member of any stable and organized group.

When times get bad a lone wolf philosophy will fail miserably. The Warrior Poet has some good videos on this.

They raise hounds in chain link pens .
Watched azzhole ROK soldiers( after I ate dog several months before) down in Son juri( mid 80,s playboy list of VD capitol of the world)
Outta the ROK Tiger brigade in the western cooridor tie cinder blocks around the hounds rear legs , tie off a rope to a bridge gaurd rail and the hounds neck and throw em off a bridge.

Really made me hate bucketheads even more after seeing that.


I got em back during that training event.
The whole fugging brigade standing around their crushed pea gravel soccor field.
I was PZ control calling in 4 blackhawks to pick up 2 platoons from a line company of the 2/ 503rd.
18 per bird seats out in a black hawk....
They was all down below a slope around the field knowing to advoid getting blasted.
I was a scout squad ldr with CSC 2/ 503rd.

Me and my Rto calling in those 4 birds to our VS 17 panels.
Laying down with our feet to the PZ.
No need to stand up and assume guidance.
Common sense to not get blasted by the gravel....

Lead pilot seen all the ROKS standing around about 2 mins out on a slow approach.
Asked me to move em so they wouldnt get blasted.

I told him real quick how they killed those hounds.
All 4 of them black hawk pilots said we are landing and screw them ROKS, let em get blasted.

It was a pricless moment when those azzholes got sandblasted and tried to run away from it all.

Lead black hawk pilot Laffin on the radio.

Birds loaded up.
Took off.

Got in my Hummer with the driver and my RTO.
Last time I ever seen them ROK azzholes in the Tiger Brigade.
AMF.........

They got what they deserved far as I was concerned.

Never heard a mention of it from the line company commander
The Bn cmdr or CSM.
They was all on the same PZ freq monitoring it while it all went down....



American soldiers love dogs............
And know when payback is a mutha pfhugga......

No.....jeebus....no I didn't.

We have been near the stories of starvation.

Grandpa worked for the big sheep outfits.

The Indians would sift through the dead lamb pile outside the lambing sheds.

Great Uncle Mart was hired to haul the dead ones away from the Fort and toss em in a coulee.

Dead Indians.

Thats the last story of starvation in the US.

Silly country mouse, I have a swimming pool full of water and lots of plump neighbors. As soon as the last can of chili [with beans] is gone it becomes time for Long Pig. A suburban boy can survive.


mike r

Ha!

Chlorine is good for your toofs.

Or is it fluorine?

I'm not above eating my dog. But I can kill a lot of other protein before it comes to that.

The lose of the Bison is one of the saddest stories in American history.

I've eaten with a lot of Baptists. Eatin' is one thing Baptists do very well. Their women usually know how to cook. I've never seen a Granny Clampett possum stew on the table.
I knew an old lady who took in strays and farmers dogs that ran loose. She was like the humane society adoption shelter. Then she'd eat them. She lived near a beautiful WV river. She got saved on that bridge and don't suppose she eats dogs anymore. I don't know what the Lord serves in heaven. 😄

Cannibalism is a thing.

Meh, that’s just the ones Buffalo Bill shot from his dining car 😃

I dont know if that was it or not. Could have been.

I think reservation living had as much to do with as anything. Uncle Sugar could cut em off at his pleasure.

but do you have a can opener??

The sane and organized survivors will exterminate the cannibals.

There are two kinds of cannibalism: ritual cannibalism and survival cannibalism. Both are abominations to civilized men.

humans are doing our best to move forward. good heavy duty shotguns helped feed the cities with wild ducks, etc.

we're slowly beginning to wonder if we can feed ourselves without digging into the wild protein supply?

i suspect we can, given enough effort, luck, and application of scientific method.

is it even possible to consider the relocation of wild animals to their original location on the earth?

and who would decide, pray tell?

That's about right.

What do you reckon killed all those bison?

They couldn't adapt. Putting wild buffalo Indians on reservations is like dropping New York yuppies in the Yukon.

Lead poisoning.

The Donner party woulda made a stew out of you.

Jeebus....a fantasy.

We are feeding the world three times over with one hand tied behind our back........and you guys want to talk about wild game........

If a diet of grain, and vegetables were followed, as Jim just said foods would be even more abundant.

waterfowl market hunting was done wit 100 pound punt guns. Pack'em in barrels and ship to the cities. The flocks disappeared pronto. Same with the pigeons. Wild protein is never a solution.

Donner party had poor leadership.

Falling and rolling block rifles.

Stories say they could pick them off one by one and hardly scare the herd. The animals could defend against wolves bears and Indians, but were helpless against long range weapons. What a time to be alive!

nothng to be sad about, the species is alive and well, and inhabiting areas with sufficient carrying capacity. there is nowhere to put historical numbers of them

They survive like penned animals. I'm grateful they do, but the loss of wildness of the huge herds that are their natural condition is deeply saddening. Just because the species exists does not mean they fully survive.

They are built and adapted to survive in herds that stretch across the horizon.

Have the buff been replaced with cattle? Sure, they're privately owned, but a rancher with a herd spread over 30 or 40,000 acres is gonna have a lot of losses or have a hell of a security team. Either way some enterprising folks get fed, through poaching or security team employment.

A herd of thirty to sixty million could hardly be killed out by human predation even with modern rifles considering the harvest could hardly have been more than a million a year. And that is a generous estimate on the kill. Need to look for another cause. There are plenty of accounts of dead bison covering the landscape. Indians died of introduced European disease. Bison overpopulated. Domestic cattle were introduced and driven into bison territory. Most likely cause was something like Texas tick fever or anthrax. Hunters couldn't have very well killed more than the natural reproduction.

Bison don’t calve enough to replace human predation

I don't know. I can sit here and think of quite a
few that prepare a goodly part of the year, spend
thousands of hard earned dollars on state of the
art equipment and location, but still can't put a
decent- sized game animal on the ground with
one shot. If they do manage to bring one down,
quite a few can't dress their quarry and reduce it
to edible portions without having to pay someone
to do it for them. Many more can't preserve their
harvest for later consumption.

All of this with no real pressure to bring home
what may be the only thing to eat for days
while competing with others for that same
bite of food

I dare say that thirty million (low estimate) would calve five to seven million (another low estimate) per year. Reckon humans were killing that many?

Why do you capitalize Gus, gus?

hmmm. great question. and i don't know the answer.

maybe the meme run by the sysops has a input:? i don't know.

by the way, there's lot's i don't know but i try to not let it slow me down.

btw capitalization is a really strange way of addressing the written language.

but i have no problem with it if that's what an individual chooses to do on the 'net.

Years ago, I used to work with a very savvy database designer.

He had a funny saying, a word is just a word.

Okay, maybe kilos lol.

It is all moot...we have plenty of toilet paper.

Resourceful people won't starve.

Your numbers are wrong. By the time the market hunting started the numbers had already dwindled to much less 30-60 million which are just estimates anyway.

Those figures are estimates that include the tall grass prairies as well as the short grass. The tall grass herds were gone long before the railroad ever pushed into the short grass prairies.

Know one knows the real numbers.Woodland herds were the first to go in places like Kentucky circa 1700s, Next were the tall grass herds in the early 1800s. Next the Southern short grass herds. Then the northern short grass herds were the last to go.

Hunters can easily kill more than natural production. There was natural predation going on at the same time. The herds were already in balance. Indians, wolves, bears and natural causes were also taking animals. The market hunting was on top of that, The government intentionally killed the herds to starve the wild Indians.

The disease scenario does not hold water because the big herds were not around cattle. The cattle did not come into the short grass until the Indians were passified and the herds were gone.

Again your numbers are wrong. The short grass herds were already greatly diminished. There were not 30 million buffalo by the time market hunting started.

Also, natural losses continued while the human hunting was in process. The hunters themselves document the herds dwindling while they hunted and there were no cattle in the field at that time.

2000 hunters killing 500 animals each is 1 million animals.

The killing occurred over a decade and half or so. Very often it was just tongues that were taken. The 4 - 8 million in the northern short grass herd could easily have been killed by a few thousand market hunters.

A couple things don’t quite sound correct. Cattle and oxen pulling wagons west were some of the first critters to hit the west with man. If you ever raised critters you should know how fast an untreated illness can kill just about every critter swiftly. Usually only the ohthe poor Indian types fall for the white an killing all the buffalo.
According to the lead and powder shipments out west there is no way they could have been shot out.
Also if numbers are guesses then maybe there was 120 million. Edk

The bison were not exterminated by bullets.Well now you argue against yourself. What diminished the herds prior to market hunting? How did white hunters, few in number kill all the bison? Why were dead bison reported laying dead scattered around like pumpkins on the plains? Try Google. You give white hunters too much credit. All they did was deliver the coup de grace.

You are right. Disease can spread very quickly and travel long distances. Especially with millions of vulnerable animals in contact with one another.

I thought partridge Tastes like a wet dog smells...

But boy R D is ok...

You’re confusing me

Soylent Green will probably taste okay with hot sauce. A little Tabasco makes a lot of stuff taste better.

Can I see the powder shipment records please?

Maybe there were 500 million and maybe they lost the paperwork for the powder shipments. Maybe ...

You are correct, I made a post a month or so back and a yr or 2 back about saying that partridge does also.
Hungry as heck as a teenager out partridge hunting and I decided to eat one out hunting

Plain breast shoved on a green stick cooked over an open fire.

Also made a post several yrs back about eating dog in korea and the ROK Tiger brigade azzholes....

It's not uncommon for posters on here to relate stories/ experiences over again over time.

Many of us enjoy sharing them with others on here.

What is R D ?
roasted dog????
If so..
No....
It's not "OK"
thought I layed that out in what I typed.
Dont see how you "are confused" really.


It's amazing how some little known posters remember stuff about other posters at times.
Simply amazing........
And how some pop outta the woodwork and do so alot of times is entertaining/ revealing.
Even more flair when the poster adopts aspects of the persons posting stlye in their post, like my extra drawn out periods.
It adds mystery to things, which is nice......
LOL!!!

I need to get one of those dragon voice programs for a desktop and " write" a book.
Call it " My Life as a Rockstar who never made it to the Stage".


LMFAO!!!!

Hunting. The slaughter started in Kentucky in 1770s pretty much.


White hunters compounded losses on top of normal losses.


Because long range rifles made them easy to kill and the herd did not run. As I said 2000X500=1000000. The number add up very easily.

The army wanted them dead because they needed to starve the Indians and to clear the plains of bison so settlement could occur. We all know that wild bison CANNOT exist in settled areas. They had to go wherever farms exist. Humans always overkill when abundance exists. Always.

What historical evidence is there that disease killed the bison herds en mass?

Why aren't all the bison herds in America gone today?

Why did every single bison every where get killed except a couple very remote herds in the north. All herds in the east and south were killed.

Why were the killing fields in the same location hunters were and not off in the wilderness?

Why didn't Indians see remote bison herds dieing en mass far from the whites in the north short grass prairies?

To be honest I don't care what people believe about the bison. It matters not. I want to believe truth and the best evidence supports human rifles as the ultimate demise of the herds. Human rifles slaughtered all the cervid herds out west too.

I'm not antihunting. I love and support hunting. I'm just not going to lie to myself.

You mentioned the army wanting the bison dead. That reminds me of reading about Kit Carson. He lived for a time with the Apache, I think. This took place in the southwest. Carson became a scout for the army later on and it was his job to lead the army to the Indians. They always seemed to stay just out of reach. The Apache had planted fruit trees in various places and relied on them when they were on the run. Carson knew that and the army cut them down. They eliminated that part of a food source. In my mind Carson betrayed the Apache.

I'll will agree that human's rifles finished off what was left. But just like the European introduced human diseases raced ahead of the white people and killed Indians in huge numbers the cattle diseases got out there and worked over the bison. There is no other rational explanation. Texas tick fever just like anaplasmosis can take down a fat healthy bovine in short order. No way would taking even 3 million a year out of a healthy herd have exterminated the plains bison. You are an intelligent man. All it takes is a little arithmetic. So I am going to agree with you that yes hunters did finish off the bison herds. That would be the bison that had survived through some sort of natural immunity. African herds had some remnant that survived the great rinderpest plague and some humans had immunity to Black Death. So I would say had the surviving bison been left on the plains without being hunted they would have restored they would have restored their former numbers with naturally immune individuals.

Given enough time, ammunition and freedom to wander, I have little doubt you'd wipe out the dog population in North America single handedly.

Awesome. Thanks for sharing.

No, I can't even do that with hogs or dogs on a couple hundred acres. Even with high motivation and basically an unlimited supply of ammo.

#[bleep]

#poormarksman

Interesting, what people believe as long as it suits their agenda. Some back their thoughts with historical references, some believe what they want to. Commercial use and greed have been drivers of many wildlife population reductions and extinctions (passenger pigeon) were not sent to the frontier to be consumed . Demand comes from the hungry non productive masses in the cities hungry for the meat, the hides , the fur, the down and for some the money that can be made from it. Men shot game in large quantities to sell to people in frontier towns, forts, outposts and salted in barrels as well as smoked was sent east by the train load for money. When the Indians found out they could trade furs and hides for whitemans goods it started. When the white man found out he didn't need the indian to get the furs, hides and meat the Indian got factored out period. When a nyc jew named Lobenstein sent 200 green buffalo hides to Germany for development into commercial leather, success of this insured the buffalo's demise was going to happen. Leather made from buffalo hides used for power transmission of steam energy to lathes and mills for the industrial revolution of the US. Waste, lots of it, greed no small amount of that , total lack of respect for wild resource that can be exploited overwhelming. Don't need to mention the politics, or the thousands of dead buffalo that floated down the wests rivers every spring runoff, cattle born diseases and other natural mortality causes. An unprotected resource is allways doomed by human beings of all kinds , creeds, and races. That is why the second is wrote into our constitution to protect you and what is yours. I have spoken and if you don't like it GFY. MB

s.w. indians would plant seeds where when the rains came, they would get water, still do. Not uncommon to see little patches of green across the rez.

I heard Democrats taste like chicken...and I like chicken.

lmao. i wouldn't eat that finlthy thing if it was the last thing before dog poop.

I've eaten dog at a Korean wedding in China. Not sure I've ever eaten a cat though.

I've also eaten....
horse
donkey
snake
silk worm larva
etc.

Navajos had their peach trees cut by the army to bring hem into submission.

https://www.historynet.com/navajos-will-never-forget-1864-scorched-earth-campaign.htm