Best Father’s Day gift ever. Not that I’m a connoisseur, but probably my favorite bourbon right now.

I bought it for myself but what-da-[bleep]-ever….

Yep. It’s my new found favorite

Great bang for buck bourbon.

Jack, I got a couple bottles I’ve never tried from my dog son, Danner Boot for Dad’s day.

You tried either of these?....I’m still a smidge rough from all day and night libations.



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It was readily available here for awhile then disappeared. Local has it again. Think I’ll go back tomorrow and by whatever’s left in stock.

How much are you paying for it?

Not had the pleasure Beav. Im still a fan of Bulleit and definitely Woodford. I like four roses for an every day easy to find too.

I like the WP but BH needs more proof for me

I’m a Pendleton 1910 for every occasion pours. Tried some 8 Seconds last night...actually drunk a half bottle of the stuff, but with coke. Wasn’t bad.

Drink Scotch when I’m trying to maintain some dignity.

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80 proof is for pussies...I like your thinking

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They're not bad, but I haven't found either of those to be worth their price.

$32.95.

I hate Scotch worse than a 20 year old white kid with a man bun.

Which Scotch whiskys have you tried and how have you tried them?

You start eating Miracle Whip and peanut butter sandwiches and he will tell you about his Scotch experience.

I'm thinking his scotch experience may be the whisky equivalent of Miracle Whip. Maybe some guidance would be useful.

That’s about the going rate. First bottle I bought was about 2006. It was 1999 vintage for $23. Was crazy good at the old prices. Russell’s reserve rye used to be $30 at about the same time....now up over $50. ☹️

Nah.


Sometimes you just gotta let em do thier own thing.


Like Famous Grouse with a splash of water.

Just a splash.

Scotch=diesel fuel

I’ve sampled several Evan Williams offerings, and haven’t been disappointed yet. I beleve their products are way under priced. Black label is my usual. Bottled in Bond is pleasing as well. Single Barrel is yet another under rated product from this fine Kentucky company

What if somebody tried something like Ten High and on the strength of that experience decided all bourbon sucked? Should I just let that ill informed dog lie?

Sometimes, sure.


One of the wealthiest people I know LOVES 10 High.


I am okay with that.






However, I learned an awful lot at a wine tasting once.


Never hurts to learn.




Fire away Mathman.

I have certainly seen that wealth is not equivalent to taste.

Yeah, but he likes what he likes, and we get drunk together and have a riot.

[/quote]



I’ve sampled several Evan Williams offerings, and haven’t been disappointed yet. I beleve their products are way under priced. [/quote]

Friend of mine, no into his 90's, can afford anything he wants. For years Evan Williams has been his bourbon. Sometimes takes his "gentleman's gentleman" along on hunting/fishing trips to cook and look after stuff. Rags on him about wasting his money on Makers or similar.

I like green label better than black velvet.

Of course he likes what he likes. That's not where I was going with the Ten High example.

If he hated it and therefore declared all bourbon sucked then that would be the ignorance I mentioned.

I tried listening to rap a few times.


It sucked. I hated it.


I wont listen again. Some jabroni called me a bigot.

It still boggles my mind that roadrunners can fly.

Speaketh the words, mm

Nothing wrong with leading some to the water fountain in a desert....except the price for sipping from the fountain can be mighty expensive.

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PS

I like ice...a cube or two. Hahaha

Here’s ya some music Jack...



“... black label Evan Williams from the liquor store....”

Ice is part of the problem when it comes to the appreciation of sipping grade whisk(e)y.

Is it kind of like saying a Tiparillo cigar is a high cotton burner ?

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I’m not familiar with Whistle Pig but I do like Basil Hayden, it’s a very smooth bourbon.

Love some Cody Jinks. Hate me some rainbow flagged Scotch “whiskey”. Brit Phaggs.

Tell us why.

I burned a few Middleton's Black and Mild before I found the real hand rolled, long filler cigar world.

The EV single barrel was my go to for over a decade, and then it disappeared locally. Fortunately, last time I went to Cali, I walked into Costco and they had the big bottles of Pendleton (my second go-to) on sale for $20 bucks off two bottles. So I loaded up the buggy. If'n it disappears, I'm going to be good for awhile.

Why? Cold retards the evaporation of aromatic compounds, hence suppressing the nose of the whiskey. Cold also anesthetizes the palate, dulling the sense of taste.

Kind of like when you decant a wine?

As does ethanol in high concentrations. Anyone who sips anything over 80 proof is enjoying the burn of the alcohol, but it overwhelms any ability for the palate and nose to distinguish subtleties. Like with beer and wine, the best temperature to TASTE the liquid is between 45 and 65 degrees, depending on which aromatics you want to volatize, and which ones you don't. A little water or ice to bring the liquid down in temperature and proof to a more optimal point are required if you are sipping for the flavor. If you're doing to measure your d***, by all means drink it warm and above 80 proof.

Bullshit.

EW Single Barrel is good. Dont overlook EW Bottled in Bond as a value leader. Cheap enough for a good mixer, and good enough to drink straight if you run out of better stuff.

You're the "expert".

I happen to think 80 proof washes out many whiskies, whereas you don't. Fine. That's a conversation, even a friendly debate.

We may have differing opinions but you're the one who started with the "dick measuring contest" line of conversation. So, in your manner of discourse, GFY.

Just got a bottle of Belle Mead Reserve. Definitely not the 80 proof mule piss!

you're into math, not language, so I suggest you look up the word "irony" in the dictionary.....

I'll find irony in the dictionary, you'll find dipshit in a mirror.

I doubt I'll be at your house.....

lol

mathman and Dutch giving her a go was a nice repartee. Almost poetic.

Thank you and Cheers !

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Beaver,

That Basil Hayden’s is a fine pour. Makes a great daily drink and one I’ll go deep on if/when my others dry up. As it stands, I can still get Blanton’s about once a week, although I’m paying more than I’d like these days. Regardless, the Basil Hayden’s is a good drink, and their 10 year old offering is even better, if you can find it.

Crack into it, you won’t be disappointed.

Not sure a cube, or two, would bring the temperature of the bourbon down enough to anesthetize the palate. I’m unfamiliar with the specific heat of the various bourbons in question, so I can’t calculate offhand, although I suspect if you did, you’d find the results to be negligible, at best.

You could also just pour it and let it sit for a few minutes so some of the alcohol evaporates without diluting the constituents of the bottle, in fact, concentrating them further. There are several ways to sip/taste a higher proof whiskey without compromising the flavor’s integrity. But, if you feel that it must be diluted in order to enjoy it, do as you wish. I couldn’t care less how someone enjoys his bourbon, as long as he enjoys it. Hell, I use some of my best bottles to make cocktails. Just understand that, in spite of my impartiality, you’re wrong. I personally don’t enjoy the burn, yet I thoroughly enjoy a barrel proof offering, can taste the subtleties, and the nose has never been compromised.

The deleterious effects of ice in sipping grade whisk(e)y are clear upon careful tasting, never mind the particulars of thermodynamics.

Some whisk(e)ys do well with a small addition of cool, not cold, still water. It is interesting however that some of the heaviest stuff, cask strength Laphroaig for example, is not well served by the addition of water while other lighter whisk(e)ys are.

Lately I've been enjoying a bottle of Old Tub. Are you familiar with it?

So we toss out empirical evidence to judge with anecdotal data? Fair enough.

That said, what constitutes a sipping grade whiskey? Anecdotally, of course.

That’s to say, how does one draw the line between when the addition of ice to a bourbon/whiskey may cause deleterious effects and when it might not?

You’ve captured my interest, so I’ll play.

There are no hard lines. BTW, I'd say my evidence was empirical, having been obtained by experience rather than theory.

Examples? Ok. Sipping grade whiskey would include something like the non chill filtered, natural color Glendronach on my bar. There is nothing to be gained, and much to be lost by adding ice to this gem. If it's a bit much for the unaccustomed palate then a small addition of spring water may make its appreciation easier at first. Increasing familiarity with its charms will lessen the desire for dilution. OTOH, the $9 and change Ancient Age bourbon is perfectly fine for an "on the rocks with some water" drink as I'm enjoying it at this very moment.

Horses for courses. I understand tastes vary, but pouring something like 18 year old Highland Park over ice is a crime against nature.

So price = quality? Your own taste is far too subjective to amount to empirical data, in my opinion. As are all tastes.

Not only will I put an 18 year old Highland Park on ice, I’ll cover it in Coke and Charlie Mike.

Taste is too subjective to place such boundaries on the situation. Who cares HOW you enjoy it, just enjoy it. Hell, even master distillers will give you the same advice. This idea, that anything other than drinking it neat detracts from the value of a liquor, is asinine, at best. The folks who put the clear liquid into the barrel do it so that it might one day create pleasure for someone. The opinion that ice makes someone’s experience worsened is irresponsible. To call it a crime against nature is unwise. Better ingredients make better pizza. If you want an insanely good Old Fashioned, use your finest bourbon. Don’t mix with trash in order to reserve the “good stuff” for sipping only, step out of those confines and into the world of what could be...

OK, so you're a Philistine.

TFF!

I’ve been called worse by better!

There’s a reference to an oak tree and a reed here, but I’m too busy enjoying this Blanton’s Straight from the Barrel (the one that isn’t available in the US) over both ice and ginger ale to go looking for it. For what I paid for these two bottles of it, and based on your assessment above, it falls squarely in the sipping only category.

Slainte you no taste havin' bastid!

To you, the same!

But, I have taste. Don’t get it wrong. It’s just that I can also understand how much a solid whiskey can contribute to a cocktail. I’m not yielding to this ostensible truth that to drink it any way but neat is somehow diminishing it.

To each his own. Enjoy it as you will. Just remember, there are several viable ways to skin a cat.

Now I’m on to this 18 year old Glenlivet I pulled from a barrel, myself, at the distillery, made into an Old Fashioned. Because, why not?

That was said in friendship, as I believe you appreciate, with a wink and a virtual clink of glasses.

I think our disagreement is a matter of degree. I quite enjoy Old Forester 100 proof rye neat. I can see it as an excellent addition to a cocktail calling for rye. I also have 18 year old Sazerac rye on my bar. Where I believe you and I differ is I do not believe the cocktail would be elevated enough by the difference to offset the loss of the enjoyment of the Sazerac served straight.

An Old Fashioned with malt whisky?

Why not? It beats the one I made with beer yesterday...

I haven't been to Glenlivet, only Glenturret .

Now you're screwing with me.

100% to all. Which brings it full-circle to my comment that it all remains too subjective to apply such rigid boundaries. If someone wants to make a Manhattan with Pappy, good for him! I’d rather him have, enjoy, and drink his Pappy any way he likes than chide him for his preferences. To each his own, and to me, more bourbon!

I just feel that the human palate is far too obscure for assertions involving guidelines. If you like it, do it. Full stop.

Correct.

Is that 18 year Sazerac from the BTAC?

I'm enough of an opinionated bastard in these matters that I'd tell Julian Van Winkle to his face that he's mistreating his namesake whiskey the way he drinks it. I'd shake his hand and do it with a smile, but I'd still do it.

It's in the tall. narrow bottle. I've had it for quite a while, it may have been from the Antique Collection though I don't see that on the label on quick examination.

You just cost me 15 seconds of my life. I’m not a sophisticated bourbon drinker like you twos so I had to google the name. Damn philistines…

And that’s your right!

Don’t you have some fish to not catch?

I’m jealous, regardless. Never seen anything but the plain Jane Sazerac rye up here.

It sits next to my similarly tall, narrow bottled unfiltered, uncut 143 proof George T. Stagg bourbon. You need to be ready when you sip that one neat.

Stagg, in any expression, is worth having. Stagg Jr. makes an incredible mint julep.

Christ. You’re a derbyphile too?

Perhaps. Who knows? I’ve had exactly zero mint juleps ever. That last comment was purely conjecture for purposes of trolling. Something you should be doing right now, literally.

I'm totally with Ducksanddogs on this.

I get more pleasure out of sharing my whiskey with others and watching them enjoy it than drinking it myself. If that means they add ice, water, coke, or anything else that's fine by me. -tnscouter

This x 1000. Rather them find some happiness in that bottle than force them into some ill-begotten rule system.

I've been a fan of the EW's 'white label' 100 proof now for some time.. YMMV..

Me too.I like others,but when it's time to buy more,I have a hard time not buying E W Bottled In Bond 100 proof.At about $23 for a 1.75l bottle,I still cannot believe the price is that low for a whiskey of that quality.

Hell I got all excited. That this was about an English shotgun.

This is a good Evans Williams, but only available at their gift shop or overseas. It is a bit pricy so I don't get it often.

Dang - I've never seen nor heard of that one... Would love to get a sip of that........

Mixed with diet Mt Dew poured over frozen hot dog water ice cubes. Anything goes, you don't want to be hemmed in by some ill-begotten rules.

I like to simmer my whiskey on the stove top, light it with a match and shoot it down. I don't understand all this ice talk.

😀

Side benefit: No longer need to trim nostril hair.

Does a fella need to read every romance novel ever printed to decide he doesn't care for them?

It just leaves more for you if we don't drink it. I don't see the problem.

There's not a real problem, nobody has to like something. It's just that as an enthusiast I'd not want to see someone miss out on something they would enjoy because of a hasty trial.

When my neighbor and great friend killed his first elk last fall, I went over to his house with an unopened bottle of Stagg Jr. And after we had a drink of it, I left the bottle with him. Yes, he's that good a friend.

His 21 year old son, a great kid whom I love like he was my own, mixed his drink with DR PEPPER, of all things. His dad made him call to apologize the next day.

That sounds like a winner to me. It’s like July 4th in a glass.

I Love Stagg Jr. Can't find a bottle of that anywhere around here!

Bourbon cocktails = Jim Beam

Sipping bourbon, neat, no ice, no still water.

Single Malt Scotch = "mostly" tiny splash of still water, to open up & help me really appreciate the subtleties !

*mostly* - does not include "light" single malts - ie: glenfiddich 12 & such styles.

Took the advice of D&D and went the low road with a mix of Cola and cubes.

Perfect!

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mathman and Ducksanddogs,

Enjoyed the back and forth banter between you too, immensely.

Well, done gents !

🦫

If you're going to drink it that way you can save a lot of money by using basic bourbon.

When you become a master distiller then I might start giving a chit how you prefer us to drink burbon until then this man has it right

Fred Noe is quoted as saying “I'm giving you permission to drink my bourbon any damn way you want to.” That includes using it to make a bourbon and coke. He said referring to Booker's, “If you take the best bourbon in the world and mix it with Coke, you got the best bourbon and Coke in the world.”

Mathman just in case you don’t know Fred Noe is Jim beams master distiller...

Best bourbon and Coke, that's real high flying right there.

But, then you wouldn’t say anything about it.

Nails on a chalkboard.

Grins

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Hell you are probably chugging down early times from a plastic cup right now..

Elmer T. Lee drank his with Sprite, and Julian Van Winkle has his on ice with a squeeze of lemon if I remember those things correctly.

I still say that takes away from what makes their spirits different and more involving than pedestrian stuff.

I have some Early Times bottled in bond bourbon that I enjoy neat in a Glencairn glass. Does that count?

I did enjoy a tumbler of 18 while reading this thread, and before placing surveying stakes this morning. Neat.



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It was a helluva day for Beave.

Cheers !

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Dang, Beaver, it won’t be too long before you’re shopping irresponsibly on the internet, at this rate.

Well done!

That's sig line material right there!
mathman, do you prefer a certain type of glass to enhance the flavor/aroma when sipping whiskey, like a Glencairn?

1910 is some good stuff getting hard to find up here..

I like to find a bottle of that stuff just to have, Evan Williams BIB is pretty decent stuff for $18 bucks

Plenty here...send me your addy and I’ll ship you up a few bottles.

As mentioned earlier. 1910 is my daily pour.

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J,

I got myself into some trouble with a bottle of 8 Seconds this past weekend. Good price point. You have that up North?

🦫

It's better than just to have, it's actually quite good. A very fine value at something like $23 for a liter bottle.

You probably know already but for those others who don't, the garden variety Early Times isn't bourbon, but a blended whiskey with some bourbon at its base. I've seen it speculated that the base bourbon *may* be the same as what eventually becomes the bottled in bond.

But it’s so smooth...

A Glencairn or anything with a similar shape is good.

I thought Kessler was the one that's "Smooth as Silk."

Clyde May’s any good? If so which one?

Had a damn good drink of lemon drop homemade yesterday. It was probably running 110-120 proof but smooth. Guy said he runs it through 40’ of PVC packed with charcoal.
No ice, but it was in the freezer for 24hrs. Good for a 90deg day working 9 hrs on Father’s Day. They legalized weed here but still won’t allow someone to make their own whiskey for personal consumption? That’s why no one takes the rule of law seriously any longer, there’s no rationale to most laws.

I've not yet tried the Clyde May's.

I couldn't hack drinking high proof stuff while working in the heat.

Well after the work was done. I never drink and work except a beer or three mowing the yard.

All this bourbon talk got me motivated to crack a McKenna. These are a gamble as they can run the gamut from hand sanitizer to exceptional. This one happens to be exceptional with butter toffee over dried fruit notes.



As for using the cheap bourbon for mixers, That Basil Hayden is a basic rye, and not very good at that. Perfectly fine as a mixer.

If you're a guest of mine, the better bottles come out, and it may be straight up, a Manhattan, or a whiskey sour from scratch, depending on the mood, and the whiskey.

Everyone else? you all can ruin your whiskey anyway you like, none of my business.

I would say not at its price.

The Heaven Hill 6 year in the pic would be a easy pic over the Basil Hayden for me, but thats my preference, I am a big Jim Beam fan, but more towards the Booker and Knob creek line. Not a fan of Basil Hayden.

That HH 6 yr is $14 a bottle and only available in KY. It is the same juice that goes into the fancy Old Fitzgerald decanters. The problem is the distillery is limiting the bottling of the 6 yr, so they can age it longer for the fancy Old Fitzgerald line. Getting hard to find.

Clyde mays not worth trying. If you like the trendy Pre - prohibition Era trendy stuff, you might like it. I prefer more depth.

I’m not sure what “Smokey, with hints of fruit, vanilla, nuts, old leather and tobacco notes” means, so pass the beam and a dirty glass with a bud light chaser for me. My wife does the cleaning and grocery shopping so YMMV.

What a bunch of alcoholics...

Hold into AA and Sheesh

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Fugging A Squadcar.

Ancient Age?

Y’all oughta make an Old Fashioned and sub in DANNYL’s syrup from NY for your simple syrup.

You’re welcome.

Do you also use Grand Cru Burgundy to make beef stew?

Only when I’m slummin.

The EW 12yo (red label) is excellent, don't know that it's available Stateside though.

I saw a couple of bottles of it but didn’t buy any. I have a bunch of good burbon but I hardly drink it after my gizzard (gall bladder) was pulled I get real bad heartburn drinking whiskey. No mo laying on a good one lol.

Unfortunately it sit with the rest of the bourbons. As mentioned really bad heartburn.

Some of you boys should do the bourbon trail for a couple of weeks. Fortunately, I live right in the middle of it.

Get down to talking about white oak trees grown in different soils.

Enjoy your discussions.

Big fan of the Evan Williams single barrel and Evan Williams period. Do not care for Whistle Pig Rye at all, but that's just my taster.. The Basil Hayden I've not tried..

Its usually available at their gift shop in Louisville, but runs $120ish.

I have a bottle of the McKenna which I haven't opened yet. Sounds like there's no way to tell how good it is until its opened...I've got an Old Fitzgerald in same condition. Hopefully that one is a winner.

Single barrel releases can and do vary. Some friends and I had several bottles of Blanton's open for one tasting and there were clear differences.

No kidding? I live overseas and can get it at my local grocery store for about $30!

Has anybody here tried Crown Royal Blender’s Mash...?
I think when it first came out it was called Bourbon Mash.

It has a mash bill of 64% Corn, 31.5% Rye, and 4.5% Malted Barley.

Did you just bring Canadian, maple syrup flavored dish water into this conversation?!

lol

I don’t think I did. From the sound of it, if it was made in America instead of Canada, it’d be bourbon. I do like Crown. And I’m curious about this Blender’s Mash...?!

Blended Canadian, produced in Canada.
C’mon man! That’s a bunch of malarkey!
www.breakingbourbon.com/review/crown-royal-bourbon-mash-blenders-mash

Well after reading that dude’s review...even though his palate appears to clearly be more refined than mine is...I’m no longer curious about it like I was. Thanks for that link. As for bourbon, my absolute favorite is Knob Creek Single Barrel Reserve. And I always have Bulleit on hand too.

I was given a bottle of Crown Reserve.

It lasted a weekend.

Sunday was a sad day.

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I’m guessing’ your guests aren’t the one’s who drank it all either...?

lol

Absolutely.....Correct


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[quote=antlers][quote=jackmountain]

Knob creek and bulleit?

Bulleit is fine but Knob Creek is more to my taste.

Knob Creek is tasty.
For $20/fifth, four roses standard is a treat.

$23 Old Forester 100 proof is a steal too.

Phouc !

26oz Knobber here starts @ $50 !

https://www.lcbo.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SearchDisplay?categoryId=&storeId=10203&catalogId=10051&langId=-1&sType=SimpleSearch&resultCatEntryType=2&showResultsPage=true&searchSource=Q&pageView=&beginIndex=0&pageSize=12&searchTerm=knob+creek&authToken=-1002%252CetYHJunN2fPHnqWYb6iXk2V4thGGKMCP7yRvypmsoac%253D