Any ideas?

It was aliens.

That is was, in a way.

Comet?

I believe it traveled with the wise men and lead them to Jesus. It was overhead, so a comet would be a good guess.

who taught wabi how to post pics ?

DeFlave ??

Just a web image Tikka.

Maybe it was a supernatural occurrence. It is said the
star moved before the Magi and stood over Bethlehem. Normal stars…or any other normal celestial object…don’t typically move in the sky and then stand above (and mark) a particular location, which allowed the Magi to find the newborn Jesus and present Him with gifts. Doesn’t sound like a normal phenomenon, but more like a supernatural sign.

My thoughts as well Antlers.

It was Boddington in a space lab testing out one of those flashlights he shills for.
RB

I wonder how long it would take to get from Persia to Bethlehem on a horse or camel? I wonder what connection they (Magi) had to the Jewish religion. You reckon maybe the Zoroastrians were the parent religion of Judaism? I love the history in the bible but there are a lot of gaps and things left unexplained.

"Faith."

Angels bearing God's light to show the way.

Believe with all the faith you got in one hand, [bleep] in the other. Which one fills up first?
RB

Faith is one thing I’m envious of. Unfortunately I’m too cynical to embrace the concept. Seems like Life would be simpler with it than without it though.

No indication the "Magi" were Jewish. What would be the reason God notified them of the birth of the birth of the prophet and messiah Jesus? They were likely non-Jewish gentiles and most likely adherents of Zoroaster. That is not explained.

Just ask for, 'IT", you may be pleasantly surprised.

Divine providence.

It's easy to understand that it's very difficult for many to surrender one’s life to a God that one has never seen. It's easy to understand that it's very difficult for many to surrender one’s life to a God who speaks to one’s heart, who speaks through ancient literature, who speaks through one’s conscience, and who speaks through the Holy Spirit. And it's easy to understand that it's very difficult for many, basically, to write a blank check for one’s whole life to God for the reasons above.

Even some of Jesus' own followers...those who were with Him while He was here on earth...didn’t fully believe until 'after' the resurrection. They didn’t fully believe until they saw with their own eyes. It is. It changes one’s perspective for the better. Big time.

What's more likely, it was a supernatural event, or a fairy tale?

How fast are flying carpets ?

Place holder for Happy Glamper


🦫

If Jesus rose from the dead, then GAME ON…! If He didn’t, then we are wasting our time. My faith is anchored to that single, solitary idea that Paul introduced us to over 2,000 years ago: “And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith.”

The event of the Resurrection launched Christianity. It is the very foundation. Not the virgin birth, not the star of Bethlehem, not Jonah and the great fish, and not anything else from the Bible.

Something snapped in Caerars' head ,it may have been a nagging wife but he had to know how many subjects he ruled over in his vast empire so he sent out word that all were to be taxed and to return to their nativity .All in the empire were on the move ,traveling to their place of birth to be taxed recorded and counted.
That's how Jesus birth was recorded just like ours is by the government . The star was the Eastern Star also called the star of the morning.

All other religions worship a dead savior only Christians have faith in a man ,the son of God who is here alive with us in the Spirit of The Holy Ghost, and will return in the form of a man at some forward date, similar to how he was expected in Bethlehem by the prophets of the Old Testiment .

It was the Germans ( Protestants) who stood up to King Charles V of Spain that brought about the freedoms and liberties we enjoy today Especialy in the United States. In 1520 Charles ruled the newly discovered America, all of Spain Europe and Italy. Charles was a Catholic and liked to obey the disgruntled Pope Clement who of late he had defeated in war yet who together at a place near Rome, planned to eliminate the heretic Protestants by burning them at the stake because they wouldn't any longer send their gold to Rome for indulgences ; payments to rescue their dead wailing relatives from purgatory that the catholics apparently could hear ( and release ).

The Bible ,like computers today at first rare and prohibited , wasn't printed in German (or English ) only Latin until the printing press allowed Luther of Germany to print it for the common German who once read became enlightened and soon most of Germany was aware of a way to shed Rome and the religons of superstition.

Charles was afraid to take on the Germans because the Turks (Moslem Hoards ) were there at the Eastern gate to enter the gap if war broke out in Germany as they had already butchered the King of Austria ,the husbad of Charles sister Queen Maw.

Well....yea.....As uncomfortable as it is for you, that's something you should consider.

This^^^^^^^^^^^

That ain’t the friggin’ Christmas star Grizz....

It’s not a doubt. It’s clearly a positive affirmation from Apostle Paul. Paul, who was a Pharisee, he knew the Law and the Prophets inside and out, and he loved it. And he arrived at the conclusion that it all rises and falls on the death and resurrection of Jesus. Period. He didn’t say this about anything else…!

If you carefully read the gospels for details about it, you will see several things that is is NOT.
It moved ahead of them so it changed position in the sky. As they traveled toward Jerusalem, it was in the west ahead of them. From Jerusalem to Bethlehem, it was in the south, again ahead of them.
It was very low in the atmosphere. In Bethlehem it was low enough to mark 1 specific house to tell them where Jesus was.
So, it wasn't a comet, a conjunction of planets, or anything out of the atmosphere. What it was, nobody can say although many believers think it was likely an angel.

Be careful about the scripture passage where it says they saw the star in the east. That's a translation problem that should have been corrected centuries ago but is still with us. The star was in the west. A better translation would say something like "We, in the east, have seen his star."

To find the prophecy concerning the star the wise men followed, one must connect the following scriptures--Genesis 49.10 (scepter will not depart Judah), Numbers 24.17 (star of Jacob), Isaiah 7.14 ( a sign of Immanuel) Isaiah 9.1-2 (a great light), Micah 5.2 ( a ruler in Beth-lehem Ephratah), Daniel 9.25 (coming of Messiah), and Psalm 72.10 (kings bring gifts to the son).

Especially when all religions are based on faith.

Astronomical article about it.

https://www.space.com/star-of-bethlehem

Bruce

Chariots of the Gods

I can humble myself enough so that accepting things I don't understand of God is not so tough a thing to do. The older I get the more I see the less I really do know and that's fine with me. Things like why does the big dipper empty itself every night and other stars don't move like that. Maybe science has some answers and maybe not. This I do know is that we are not able or meant to understand everything. That's why I have faith in God. The God of creation.

LOL

So an entire religion is based on a big game of telephone.

LOL

When faced with what a democrat wants me to believe, or what the basic tenants of Christianity are. I believe the choice is quite clear. Will your heart go left, or right?

Anybody think it's a parable for navigating via the stars?

Wasn't just gold, frankincense and myrrh they were hauling.

Curious also about their security entourage. High ballers don't go about like that without protection,

The Bible doesn't say how many of there there were. There were 3 gifts and somewhere back in history, it got assumed that there was 1 man for each gift. Considering what they were hauling, there were likely dozens of them with many being well armed. Then there were their servants.

And what happened to the gifted gold? Sure, the frankincence and myrrh had "best before dates", but the gold could've been saved as a college fund.

Yup, a lot of beliefs are based on traditions of men, songs and even nativity scenes.

The Star that guided them was a physical light that was created for the purpose of directing those who sought the Lord.
What it was is not relevant IMHO. Astronomers and astrologers speculated and I think that's what has proven so far..... it's just speculation. By faith we believe it to be true and it certainly is reasonable. This makes the record of it a blessing to those with faith in the Son of God.
God did something akin to this for forty years. A pillar of fire and a pillar of smoke to direct His people through the wilderness.

I've read, it paid for the Flight to Egypt.

If they had followed the coastline instead it would have taken them only 2 weeks

Good video... https://www.ebay.com/itm/141819304201

Cheaper other places.

Detailed math of the actual Star.

God provided everything that young couple and Jesus needed for the time they were in Egypt in safety from the mass extermination that Herod carried out. I'm glad He put that in the Bible for us to know that He takes care of His own in times of need.

He's just as happy to smite the living shit out of any of his other creations.

It's not a huge area. They must have been going in circles for 39.5 years.

He will save you if that's what you want.

Trump did it. I.e. lit it.

Bible Way to Heaven

https://youtu.be/dLKJYC5nY-E

It did only take them a short time to get there. However, they sinned badly and God condemned them to stay in the desert until the current generation of fighting age men died off. When they finally went in, it was a young army. They did more or less move in circles. There was a couple million of them and it took a lot of provender for all their livestock. God provided food for the people for the entire time.

I did read somewhere that scientists said there was a supernova which would have been visible in Bethlehem around 3 or 4 BC.
Here’s another article I read a while back and had bookmarked.
The Christmas Star
7mm

What’s the over/under on how many times that guy has ever gotten laid? Set the line at +1/2?

They were much the same people before, during and after the exodus. Human nature doesn't change in 40 years. Beliefs are passed from generation to generation. If you could take a baby from that period and raise him in our society, he would be like one of us. It's a matter of environment and education. Something that an omnipotent creator of universes should be able to handle.

I will never impose MY God on another man... nor will I tolerate another man imposing his god, himself or his ideals upon me.

"Faith" to me (and me alone)... is knowing that when I stand alone against ANY adversary... OR fall down exhausted and helpless as a broke leg kitten... that I am NOT alone.

The power that provides me... to regain my footing has been lived for many years.

Sincere good luck to any man in HIS search for HIS "Faith"... and HIS God.

YMMV

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Happy Camper... in regard to Isaiah 9:3... reaps his harvest with a bush-hog... and thus the crop is lost... there is no joy... and there is no rejoicing.

Happy Camper worships a very different god than I.

The Jews have had an attitude as long as they've been Jews. They bitched and moaned from the day they left Egypt. When they refused to enter the promised land, God had had enough and was going to kill them on the spot. However, Moses begged him not to so instead God condemned them to wander in the wilderness until the current generation of men had died off. It was punishment for those who had sinned. It wasn't a change in their nature. Numbers 14 relates the event but it's too long to post here.
The people who had left Egypt had lived with the Egyptian gods for 400 years. They were given the law shortly after the exodus but they hadn't lived under it. After 40 years, the new generation had grown up in the law and were more used to how God wanted things done.

I don't buy that "Shining star" and depicted for one minute. They were Magi and there for were astrologers. They were following a planetary alignment, Jupiter, the king planet, in conjunction with the movements of Mars. If it was a shining star then anyone could follow it. The Magi did not go to Bethlehem as depicted, and were not present at Jesus's birth. They went to his house in Nazareth as much as two years later.

No, they went to Bethlehem. Apparently after Jesus was born, his parents stayed there rather than going home. Right after the Magi were there, Herod killed all the boys in town which caused them to flee to Egypt. After Herod died, they returned and then settled in Nazareth.

Matt 2:7 Then Herod summoned the wise men secretly and ascertained from them what time the star had appeared.
8 And he sent them to Bethlehem, saying, "Go and search diligently for the child, and when you have found him, bring me word, that I too may come and worship him."

Whatever the star was, it was low enough to sit directly over a specific house and point it out to the Magi. Nothing above the atmosphere could do that.
Matt 2:9 After listening to the king, they went on their way. And behold, the star that they had seen when it rose went before them until it came to rest over the place where the child was.

Sounds like a good relationship with Him.

Paul.....who never met Jesus in the Flesh....writing at least 40 years after the alleged events.....again, not a great source.

Faith is not a pathway to truth.

Then why the need for masks?

Except the part where none of it ever happened. Modern Biblical Scholars accept that Moses never existed, and the exodus as portrayed in the Bible never happened.

I cannot believe there was a band of 2,000,000 Jewish nomads wandering about. Think about it.

Paul met the resurrected Jesus. And Paul’s epistles were written between 17 and 25 years after Jesus’ resurrection, during the height of his missionary activity. They are the earliest surviving Christian texts.

Our best surviving biography of Alexander the Great comes from nearly five hundred years after his death...!

We have many contemporary references to Alexander, coins with his image etc. and no modern person making supernatural claiming regarding him, nor claiming him as they Lord, Savior, and believe in these supernatural acts as a pathway to an everlasting paradise. These are much different claims that as such are subjected to very different standards of evidence.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. In ancient times it's alleged Alexander's mother claimed he was half god, like Hercules. I find both of those claims, as they apply to Alexander and Hercules as lacking in evidence, as I imagine you do as well. The difference is I also find the supernatural claims attributed to Jesus as lacking in evidence.

I have thought about it. They started with 70 people going into Egypt. The Hebrews were known for being prolific and they had 435 years to breed with the girls often starting at age 12 or 13. The numbers are very credible. As far as 2 million nomads, they didn't need to find or grow food. It's told time after time that God himself fed them, a substance called manna in the Bible. Whatever it was, it was a complete diet.

The disciples spent 3 years with Jesus and witnessed what he did and witnessed his death and resurrection. Most of them died terrible deaths upholding Jesus' words. Why would they do that for a lie? Did Alexander's mother die that way? I doubt it. It's up to you to believe it not, your choice. My choice is to believe every word of it because Jesus proved who he is.

lol

But we’ve been discussing the historicity of Jesus, and whether or not He existed. Period.

Now you’re moving the goalposts.

shocker

Kind of like the yellow UN food rations packages dropped in Ethiopian and Somalia?

Yea, so believable. I'm going to punish you by making you lost...but providing all your food so you don't have to work. Sounds like your God invented welfare.

You brought Alexander into the argument, not me.

lol

You asserted that since “Paul…who never met Jesus in the Flesh....writing at least 40 years after the alleged events.....” somehow discredited his texts as being “not a great source.”

And I pointed out, in response, that our best surviving biography of Alexander the Great comes from nearly five hundred years after his death...! From an author who clearly never met Alexander the Great in the flesh…!

Where did you get the number 2,000,000? I'm guessing it must be in the Moses section?

Never mind, I found it. 600,000 fighting men plus women and children.

Nice masks, dick head.

You are correct they were Astrologers. They were Astrolgers from Persia and they could read the Signs (Gen 1:14, Psalms 147:4) so "following a Star" would not have been what they did. If you know anything about Astrology you know this single Star following would not be true. The chances of them boing to Nazareth or Bethlehem or Palestine or any of those places would have been Ludacris. Since the belief is this all took place in Dec. the Constellation Sagittarius, then what these Magi seen was the Sun being crucified on the Southern Cross on Dec. 21st the resurrected 3 days later on the 25th to begin its journey into the Constellation Aries the Ram/Lamb in the time of the Spring equinox starting March 21 to April 19. In this journey the Sun climbed upon the mountain to be tempted, Capricorn, met up with the waterman John the Baptist in Feb, Aquarius, then became a fisher of men in March in the time of Pisces, continuing across the sky into Aries to become the Lamb of God, i.e. the Ram.
This is what the Magi would have seen. If it was literal like many have made the story, then it is extremely interesting that the only ones outside the immediate family who had any idea of this birth were 3 Astrologers from Persia. This after all the alleged writings in the OT concerning this birth, teachings that all the Preachers, Pastors, Priests, Bible Scholars, Church leaders, ect. the ones called Pharisees, Lawyers, Scribes, ect. were teaching and interpreting for years and not one of them or their followers showed up or had any inkling of an idea it was happening.

A man, a charismatic Rabbi is a far cry from the 'Son of God' or as some have it, 'God incarnated.'