Excellent video....EV's emitt more pollution than petroleum powered cars....

Well yeah but they're so cool, huh. It feels so good.

Then there is this.

Electricity Shortage Warnings Grow Across U.S.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/electricity-shortage-warnings-grow-across-u-s-11652002380

And he is wrong if he thinks "renewables" ("unreliables" actually) will or can power EV charging. That can only happen with massive batteries for storing electricity given the intermittent production from "renewables", assuming the technology is even available to produce such batteries and make them efficient. So you still have the same problem, the industrial input required to manufacture massive battery storage to capture the energy produced by "renewables" is probably larger than that required for engines consuming petrol.

On a road trip from Denver to Cascade Locks, OR, I didn’t see any Tesla's on the 70, 15, or 84 once we got 50 plus miles away from any cities.

Not to mention the environmental impact of lithium mining (in Afghanistan by China) which is extraordinary.

I am pretty sure many pushing this agenda are assuming that only the richest will be road-tripping or traveling once the reset has taken its toll.

How long is their range when -20 and you need the heater on
Or 120 in the desert and you want cool driving?

Status toys for rich and idle urbanites...a few years back it was lookalike humvees. The USPS fleet replacement buy brouha tells us all we need to know about EVs at this point of development. USPS just flat out said they can't afford it. Got the numbers to prove it. I predict a new branch of violent crime, as the obviously affluent EV owners sit around charging stations for a half hour waiting for enough electrons to make it to the next recharge.

Word.

Gas/electric might be okay. Total electric, no thanks.

The “problems” with them, cost of the vehicle, cost of energy, and range of the vehicle per charge, just to name a few.
Gonna order me a 23 Silverado next month, and it will be 6.2L gas.

Said another way, electric vehicles have a long way to go before the technology is really mature.

Internal combustion has been refined for many years and is about as good as it will ever be.

That will change over time. I doubt that my next vehicle will be electric or hybrid, but someday maybe.

I'm of the opinion that EV is the latest revenue cow for the investment/fed/state tax money handlers. Just like ethanol was/is.

I do not believe that investors/.gov give a chit about my health through clean air or climate change. Follow the money always.

They can’t pull a fifth wheel trailer up a hill.

Hard Pass …

The Bucketheads will have all of Africa dug up taking all their rare earth minerals. All the Worlds Eco warriors will not say a thing about it either.

There is no “problem” with an electric vehicle.

There is a problem with dumb fugks like Tarqueen and the people he votes for thinking they understand a single fugking aspect about energy and it’s consumption at a national level.

Well, duh!...


95% of e-vehicles are still on the road... The other 5% made it home....

The problems are numerous & beyond the ability of resources to practically solve them right now, but facts just don't matter to the idiots pushing them.

At some point, reality will set in but by then, the plug on oil based systems may have been pulled.

By then, there will be not real working economy left to save.

MM

Electric vehicles are a very old idea. The current iterations have come a long way since the lead-acid versions of 100 years ago though and can actually make sense in certain driving situations such as a commuter vehicle. They need batteries with a much higher energy density than the Li-ion batteries provide and charging solutions that aren’t so time consuming.

My biggest complaint is there’s a year wait for a Tesla but at the same time, we’re subsidizing buyers $12k to buy one. Why the hell are we subsidizing a product at all; let alone one that is completely sold out?

Well, hell- we just need to pull all the tri-lithium out of the Enterprise and her sister star-ships and put it into car batteries.

Hey stupid. Take it up with the guy in the video. I'm just the messenger. Retard.

Stop whining you Biden loving kghunt.

Good morning Clark.
Pretty sweet here in the Glades this morning.

Sitting here at Skunkape Headquarters enjoying my coffee.

Only thing disrupting the perfect solitude is the gas guzzling cars I hear in the distance roaring across the Tamiami Trail.

To bad their isn't more silent EVs on the road, maybe some day.

One of the earth's biggest threats, that no one is mentioning is clear cutting the tropical rain forests of the world. Creating a large gap in the CO2 cycle.

I'm pretty sure someone said that about computers a couple of decades ago.

My money is staying on something that burns.

And then there is this. I had a friend that new him personally. He said the oil companies bought him out and cave him a new car. Tom, was told no more inventing…. Well he couldn’t leave it alone. My late friend said, we all warned him. He ended up dead in the desert…

https://elpasotimes.typepad.com/morgue/2008/04/200-miles-on-tw.html

Brah!

I was in North Port and Venice all weekend.

Lot more white people out that way!

(Not that it matters of course)

Yeah.

I’ll take coal and candles any day over this stupid battery/electric schit.

This place is dead, all the tourists are gone.

Funny thing, zero flying insects, no skeeters..

This pond outside my door is chock full of Pecock Bass and they are hiting flies...

Nice.

I got a little Gheeno I should give you for that thing.

No title but it doesn’t look like you need one. Lol

Teslas don't get a tax incentive.

It's pretty simple. It will work when somebody figures out how to make electricity from electricity without using more electricity than they make making electricity.

We dam near brought a Gheeno with a 10hp down with us.
We'd have had to either left the bike or drove two rigs.

Decided We'd just bring the bike.

I want to get back out in the 10K Islands for some flats fishing and camping.
Looks like that will happen in November now.

Maybe put a windmill on top of the car? Perpetual motion machine baby.

Yes BUT after we have gone to 100% renewable, then they do make emissions sense because you can't otherwise power a car with wind, solar, or whatever else they have in mind.

EV's have their place, but obviously not everywhere. And no I don't have one or see one in my future.

I see a lot of EV’s around Charleston and, for personal transportation in an urban or suburban environment they make a lot of sense. Are they at a point in their development where they can meet everyone’s needs? Of course not. Neither were IC vehicles ten or 20 years into their common usage. My Uncle Earnie was still farming completely with horses until he got his first tractor in 1947. He still used horses after that as well.

My wife’s next car may well be an electric. It would make a lot of sense. She seldom drives more than 10 or 15 miles from home. If we go further, we take my truck. If she travels for work the airport’s 15 minutes from here. I’m hoping she decides to get one. I’d like some long-term, first hand experience with one so when the topic comes up on here I can have an informed opinion.

Our SIL recently got a Toyota Rav4 plug-in hybrid. He charges it at night and it'll go 42 miles before the engine kicks in. Most days, unless he runs around after work, the engine doesn't start at all. Their power rates are 2/3 lower after 10pm so plugging it in just before bed saves them some $$. It works for them.

Not directly, but Tesla makes a TON of money from selling the "carbon credits" it earns from the government to other automakers. Like, billions of dollars worth. All set up by the government to transfer wealth.


https://carboncredits.com/tesla-regulatory-carbon-credit-sales-jumps-116/

Electric vehicles are to control your travels. Right no power, no charging, you stay home.

People who buy them do.

Haven't seen that, but I have seen plenty of guys walking down the road with a gas can in their hands.......

A 240v generator will charge them a lot faster but to get that, you need one about 4k watts or bigger.

My question is, what the hell are they going to do with all of the dead batteries after they expire and quit working? They're going to need a hazardous waste dump just for batteries.

The other question I have is, how much will it cost to replace the batteries in a car? How many miles do you get out one set of batteries before you have to replace them?

They recycle them.

Thanks, I was wondering about that. I wonder what it costs to replace them. It's got to be pricey.

Tesla recycles all Tesla’s batteries, with about 94% of the contents reused. Because the whole Tesla battery thing is only really 10 years old (Model S), there are very (VERY) few post consumer batteries that are even available for recycling. Almost all of those come from “taxi-like” vehicles, according to Musk in an interview this month.

With Cobalt at $80,000 a ton, there’s some monetary incentive to recycle, there.

There are no Federal tax incentives on any Tesla sold for at least the last several years. Local and State jurisdictions may still have incentives.

EV is part of the energy/transportation section.

NOTHING MORE... a small piece in a very large puzzle.

.GOV manipulations (i.e. $$$ incentives, ethanol, carbon credits et al) are trying to prop EV up as a much bigger piece... but it is NOT.

NOR will it be for quite some time.

FAR TOO MANY LOGISTIC PROBLEMS TO SOLVE.

MD, NJ and Southern Cal have Federal incentives for certain vehicles (i.e. Prius PRIME et al)... Teslas also? Not sure.

The point is moot however... Dealer's mark up the MSRP by $5k and that vaporizes the $5k incentive.

You sure about that?

https://electrek.co/2022/04/15/which-electric-vehicles-still-qualify-for-us-federal-tax-credit/


I know they wee still giving tax credits in December 2019 when my wife bought one.

Again Teslas don't qualify for tax credits.

I stand corrected. Seems like Tesla no longer needs tax credits to sell their vehicles.

Just for comparison on a much smaller scale.

8, quality 6 volt batteries for a 48 volt golf cart will run close to 1k$ with taxes included.

Nothing wrong with electric.

Especially if it saves some gasoline and diesel for the rest of us that rely on it.


Bring on the electrics...bring on the hybrids.

Bring on diesel electric.

wait till they make you buy electric tractors and combines.and pick up trucks to haul it to town.You know its coming

No, I don't know that's coming.

We aren't going to get rid of oil. The military industrial complex and big oil would never allow it.

Ha. The mythical 100 mpg carburetor. Bigfoot has a stash of them, but he won't share. My uncle's neighbor had a second cousin whose friend explained it all to him in a bar one night.


Jerry

When we see Musk’s Space X launch an electric rocket or when NASCAR starts running them, then it’ll be game on.

Until that time pack a generator with you if you ain’t just daily commuting and sign up for AAA towing services.

Hybrids make sense for the 90+% of us who don't haul giant horse trailers up Pike's Peak every weekend. We use my wife's as our travel car because it's so comfortable and uses so little gas. Toyota technology is so good that they now say the battery in their hybrids is probably good for the life of the car. It's only "probably" because they're still quite new.

Rocky, our Minister has one and last we talked about it months back (I asked) he was coming up on the 200k mile mark on his Toyota and with only regular mechanical maintenance items.

Do they ever charge their batteries with solar panels and wind turbines?

victoro, you "charge" a hybrid at the gas pump. You obviously have not a clue what a hybrid vehicle is.

Jeebus...you guys are "forced" to buy internal combustion now. Forced to pay 4.50 for gas.

Forced to pay for oil wars in the MidEast that accomplish nothing but transfer your wealth around to Wall Street, Big oil and terrorists.

Having the choice to go electric or hybrid makes your water break?

Fugg.

I could buy a electric car but up here in the middle of northern ND. But I couldn’t get out of the state. Edk

Gonna vote this year?

I still think a small turbine engine to power a charging system is viable and potentially more efficient than the 4, 6, and 8 cyl IC engines we’re using in conjunction w/batteries currently.

What would power the turbine engine?

I've driven over 800 miles in the past 36 hrs seeing clients and doing marketing calls. How does that work with them batteries?

Obviously EV’s are not for every situation. But if your EV had a fast charging system and you lived in an area with a good charger network 800 miles in 36 hours is very easy. Most quality EV’s can go from 20-30 to 80% in the time you stop to take a leak and eat a meal.

Why do you think Tesla buyers are getting a $12k subsidy?

I am seeing more and more EVs in my area. I live in suburbia. 95 percent of the folks in my neighborhood could easily use an EV for at least one of their vehicles. They likely never drive more than 20 miles each way to take care of their daily needs. They fly on long trips. Not one of them owns a horse or pulls a heavy trailer. Driving a truck creates more issues than it solves for them. They are the greatest percentage of drivers these days. I don't fit that mold as I need my pickup for towing and hunting trips. But I recognize that people have different needs.

I see more and more charging stations at shopping and restaurants so thats already happening. EVs are here , charging stations are here and the option to buy one is here. Heck I had friends and older relatives that still thought the internet was a fad in 2001. The hell if they was buying one of the computers to collect dust in a few years. Some of you guys are old enough to remember when self service gas pumps started showing up. I hear many times how foolish that was as women would never pump their own gas.

Many of us on here live differently than 95% of the rest of the population. We are the odd men out not the norm.

Tesla is increasing production at roughly 50% per year, and expects to be at 5 million cars a year by 2025. It is also back ordered well into 2023 and expected to stop taking orders for a while. They just let it slip they expect to expect to double the size of their Shanghai complex and increase production there by 500,000 cars per year. That’s on top of bringing on Berlin and Austin.

Volkswagen just piped up and declared their goal is to make more EV’s than Tesla by 2025..... Ford’s F150 Lightning is sold out for the next three years.

EV’s have their problems, but there’s going to be a LOT of them in the very near future. And city slickers are going to be just fine with them.

Got gas twice. Didn't see a charging station at any exit I got off.

You weren't looking for one, either. It's like me claiming I went to a truck stop and didn't see a single hooker.

The problem - as many others have said - is not the number of charging stations, it's where we're going to get all the electricity. Unless we install massive numbers of the mini-nuclear plants they are now developing, there's absolutely no way to support the numbers of electric vehicles they say they're going to build.

Yeah but, wind and scheitt. LOL

From what I've seen, the hybrids are a much better way to go than an electric. People I know who have them have very good luck with them. Toyota has really worked the kinks out of them and for many people, they're great. No, a hybrid won't tow your 35' 5th wheel but you can load the kids in your roomy Highlander hybrid and go cross country while getting 35 mpg.

Exactly what we have, RC. 2020 Highlander Hybrid. Fabulous road trip car. We fill up every 300 miles. With eight gallons.

Have u ever ridden in a Prius or bolt? Me neither and I’m not into a short wheelbase rough riding car
The Tesla would be the first choice if I ever was to go Electrc
The tech will get better but for now it isn’t a player

This country has WAY more generating capacity than it needs.... except for on a few hot afternoons in July. On average, the grid has more than 30% of its total capacity idled (shut down for maintenance or off line for lack of demand).

A first year engineering student could rig up a charging system that stopped charging EV’s when there is peak demand. A second year engineering student could rig up a system that would allow EV’s to send power to the net when there’s more demand than supply in the grid, and then recharge the EV during low demand periods. A third grade engineering student could figure out how to allow the EV owner to sell that power at peak rates, and buy it back at low rates.

The Ford Lightning already allows owners to use it as a backup power source in case of power failure. It’ll run the average house for three days.

Our daughter lives in Portland, OR. Their peak use power rate is 5x the off peak rate. Simply charging your car after 10pm can save you a lot of money over time.

Hey Dutch, are you an EE? Seems Iike you know this stuff pretty well.

Nah, I started paying attention to this stuff a few years back, and it’s become kind of a hobby to watch the technology develop and change. My primary interest is in the economics behind it.

Posting about it on the ‘Fire and watching the grumpy old farts shake their fists at these new fangled inventions while yelling “buy a horse” is a guilty pleasure....

LOL!!

And you believe that? I do not..

When I can drive where I drive without having to worry about charging I'm in. Guessing I'll be dead first.

I don't have a clue why anybody would want a hybrid.

I don't believe it, I can do third grade math. Try it, if you dare.....

Why is everyone so angry with EV's?

Every single city dweller that buys one decreases the demand for fuel, and limits their own range to 300 or so miles from home.

Right?

OK...





Please correct my math...

Thanks

But... if that Musky dude gets to doing 3rd grade math...

Maybe... EV is part of the equation... for urbanites that don't do no long hauling of heavy loads...

Buying an UAW built EV is like buying a Ryobi sawzall with a 1.0 Amp-hour battery.

Just saying...

His idea about how a horse emits CO2 that recycles back to plants and then back to oxygen, but the Corvette’s CO2 doesn’t recycle, seems a bit selective by plants that don’t know the origin of any CO2…

And don't forget about horse and cow farts.

Oh, happily.

The Ford extended range battery is rated at 131 KWH (https://insideevs.com/news/559064/ford-f150-lightning-battery-comparison/). By your numbers, the average house draw is 1.25 KW.

131/ 1.25 = 104.8 hours. Which is more than 3 days, but let me know if you need help with that math, too?


In case you're curious, the numbers you quoted are max charging RATE, not CAPACITY. Other than that, nice cut and paste.

What I'd like to know the straight truth on is how and who is going to pay for all the necessary increase in electricity producing facilities nation wide to keep up with the ever increasing demand of electric vehicles? Tax increases? Usage rate increases? Or...?

The same way new facilities have been paid for the last 50 years and more. The companies (sometime municipalities) issue shares or bonds or use private funds to build the facilities, and get paid back by selling electricity. Those who generate cheap will return the most money to investors (which explains the increase in wind and solar generation, and the dearth in new nukes). Solar in the south is currently the cheapest way to generate electricity (though the Trump era tariffs have bumped that cost up a fair bit, TINSTAAFL).

I love all these “the sky is falling” EV discussions. Just grow up and stop trying to paint a perfect situation where they won’t work. Because for a lot of people they do work, and work well. Especially as a second vehicle in the household.
For us, our daily mileage is 40 miles unless we run to Knoxville.Then we drive 160-180. Any decent EV would handle that. We own other vehicles for when we tow or road trip.
Plenty of companies now offer free charging to workers. Making it another win.

I’m in no hurry to buy one since what we own are all in good shape. But when the time comes I’ll have no remorse about joining the club.

There are many reasons that I don't care for electric vehicles. I would venture that some dislike them solely because they don't use gasoline.

I remain confused...

My link came from Ford...

https://media.ford.com/content/dam/...tning/pdf/F-150_Lightning_Tech_Specs.pdf

Your link came for a source outside of Ford...

https://insideevs.com/news/555338/ford-f150-lightning-battery-capacity/

So does this one...



https://www.forbes.com/wheels/cars/ford/f-150-lightning/

Interesting that Ford does not make that easy to find.

Actually had to build a truck to find specs (kinda... STILL NOT CLEAR)... this is their CHEAPEST MODEL with the extended battery.

Base level Ford Lighting with the better battery is only $72,500.



Please teach me more...

Thanks

"Solar in the south is currently the cheapest way to generate electricity"

"Green energy" wouldn't exist in the USA without Federal subsidies. The Federal subsidy for Electricity generated by "green energy" is about $125.00 (I don't remember the unit of power) and the Federal Subside for electricity generated by petroleum products is $0.39.

Because they wouldn't exist without taxpayer's subsidies.

If your a fan of history, battery powered vehicles were on the design floor when autos first came out. Plenty of people knew beyond a shadow of doubt it would be impossible to find gasoline on every street corner. Now the debate has switched to chargers.

Solar and wind take thousands of acres of land and kill birds. Currently those wind turbines and solar panels plus the LI batteries are made in Chyna. How is that environmentally friendly? EV's cannot perform to their expectations, and we have no infrastructure to support them on a large scale. If that's your bag then good for you just don't try and make it mandatory for everyone.

What taxpayers subsidies exist if I buy a Tesla and charge it at my house or commercial charger?

You see a lot of the same mentality here that, at various times in our history, opposed rifled bores because they took longer to ram a ball down and the injuns might get you....those steam engine railroad things will never work because the human body cannot survive sustained speeds of greater than 20 mph...yeah, those new-fangled percussion-cap guns are great until you run out of percussion caps 30 days from the nearest trading post... cartridge firearms???? what happens if they stop making the cartridge you need??? smokeless powder??? blows up shotguns...horseless carriages??? they're not reliable...you can't get fuel everywhere... they're dangerous...they won't go through snow....flat tire every five miles...Get a horse! What do I need a GD computer for?? Electronic ignition? No thanks, I want to be able to replace my points and set the gap and timing myself....fuel injection? give me a good ole carburetor I can adjust and rebuild on the kitchen table if necessary....cell phone? what do I need a cell phone for, there's too many dead spots in my AO...besides, who needs an electronic leash? Smart phone?? all I want to do is make phone calls, I'm not a GD teenager.

EV's aren't perfect, no technology is. They've evolved faster than anything I've ever seen. They're not currently the answer to everybody's vehicle needs, but neither are four-wheel drive pickup trucks. In fact, I'd bet there are a lot of people driving around in four-wheel drive pickups who'd be just as well served with a Tesla. News flash: there are a lot of people out there who don't pull trailers, don't travel in snow and don't go off the road with their vehicles. I would be very surprised if my wife didn't get an EV for her next vehicle and that will work out just fine for us. She seldom goes more than 20 miles from home with her current car. I am just as sure I will go to my grave in a full-sized, four-wheel-drive pickup.

Cash, you're looking at marketing materials created by graphic design majors who probably don't understand the numbers they are given.

The measure for battery capacity is KWH, Kilo-Watt hours. One KW is about 1.34 HP. One KWH is one KW for one hour. 100 KWH is one KW for 100 hours, or 100 KW for one hour, or 1,000 KW for 1/10th of an hour, and so on. All that is limited by the KW limitation that the battery can put out, of course. Similar to the HP capacity of an engine. You can only get out so many HP (KW) at one time. The more HP (KW) you draw, the faster you empty your tank (battery).

The capacity of the standard range battery is 90 kWH, the extended range is 131 kWH (and that sucker weighs over 1,800 lbs!).

Now, the RATE at which these charge is the second number in the ad. The higher the charging rate, the faster you can load up the battery. More amps means more KW going in (think of amps as the size of the nozzle). Like going from a standard diesel nozzle at the pickup fuel isle to a high-flow nozzle at the semi truck isle.

The 19.6 number they are quoting is the MAXIMUM KWH rating of the Ford designed 80 amp circuit for home installation. It'll charge that 131 KWH extended range battery in 131/19.6 = 6.4 hrs. It'll cost a few bucks to put into most houses, because it probably means installing an additional panel.

The range is about 3KW per mile...... so at 80 amps you get about 50 miles per charging hour. That works for almost all people to charge either at work or at home.

The kicker is that a standard 110 outlet to charge this thing will give you about 15 amps.... at most, and that whittles it down to about 2 miles per hour..... better have that beast plugged in all the time!

At a standard 240 circuit (like for your washer / dryer), you get about 200 miles overnight, which also works for a lot of people. Few people run more than 200 miles a day on a regular basis, so the truck would be almost always full when you grab it in the morning. No more stopping for fuel on your way to work.

Fast chargers are a whole 'nother level of charging, and draw 200 amps or more. This thing's battery is so big that the current "fast charge" networks will still mean you need to take a nap while filling it up. Not so fast chargers, really.

And in case you are curious, 131 KW for 300 mile range at $0.10 per KW (retail electric price) is $13.1 for a fill up. If you get discounted night rates, you could fill up the truck for under $10.

"EV's aren't perfect, no technology is. They've evolved faster than anything I've ever seen."

Another whole electric grid that will be required for all the electric vehicles the Communist Democrats are mandating won't evolve so fast and the expense will bankrupt all of us. You EV lovers must not realize that the Communist's goal is for all vehicles to be electric. Will trains, ships and airplanes be next?

That's actually a very fair statement, but not in the way you intended it.

The original photo voltaic cells were developed, in large part, to support the space effort, and were mind-numbingly expensive. Tens of thousands of dollars per watt. Development was subsidized, and applications were limited.

Like with computers. The first ones were heavily subsidized for military and government purposes.

Like with computers and "More's law" in computers, which says the cost per computation cuts in half every couple of years, there's an equivalent in solar generation, and costs have CONSISTENTLY dropped by 10% per year over the last three decades. Like with compound interest, 10% per year means doubling very 7 years. So the cost of solar has dropped geometrically, and continues to drop geometrically.

The push for that development came through the availability of subsidies, which created the economies of scale for research and manufacturing needed to create that drop in costs.

Today, photovoltaic generating cost has dropped below the lowest competitor's cost of generating electricity, natural gas. It has passed coal, oil and nuclear years ago. It is competitive in the electric market without any subsidies in any form. Generating costs in the South are as low as 3 c/KW.

There's a similar curve in wind, but it has been far less steep than solar, in the order of 2 to 3% per year.

Combined, that is the reason why just about 20% of the US generating capacity is now wind and solar. It's now pure economics, not anything else.

"You EV lovers..." I'm not an EV lover, I'm just trying to take a rational look at the technology.

"Another whole electric grid...." So far the electric grid seems to be keeping up as well as it ever has. What's the current optimal capacity of the electric grid? How will it need to be improved by how much capacity? How long will that take and what will it cost? Won't that cost be covered by the increased usage?

EVs are by necessity pretty much limited to city dwellers. Since many cities already have power supply problems, that will only get worse and I can see some large cities having to limit car recharging.
Hybrids, however, I think are a great idea for anyone who doesn't have to haul a load. They use far less gas and the technology has come far enough to make them highly reliable.

"I'm just trying to take a rational look at the technology."

The technology of electric vehicles has been improving rapidly but that's not the answer to our energy problems. The problem is that the goal of the "green energy" lovers is to destroy the petroleum industry. If you want to take a rational look at how much more energy it would require for an all electric USA it's easy to find. I don't remember all the figures but it would require twice as much electricity and a new electric grid with double the capacity. My home is all electric and electricity is dirt cheap in the summer when I run the AC (we have HOT summers). In the winter when I have to turn on the heat my electric bill is at least 4 times higher (we have very mild winters).

If all cars in Texas switch to electric, the total energy demand increases by about 30%.

"if virtually all passenger cars in Texas were electrified today, the state would need approximately 110 more terawatt-hours of electricity per year — the average annual electricity consumption of 11 million homes. The added electricity demand would result in a 30 percent increase over current consumption in Texas. " (https://www.inverse.com/article/51486-electric-cars-demand-better-infrastructure).

Given that the vast majority of EV users charge at home, at night (when electric demand is at it's lowest), and that those chargers are exceedingly easy to program to respond to highs and lows in supply, the reality is that very little additional generating capacity would be needed, and there will be a lot of time to add the required capacity.

Now, add trucks to the equation, and the picture changes substantially.

Cold air has a tendency to lay low in a home, hot air rises to the ceiling.
You may consider upgrading you attic insulation, it can be considerably less expensive than paying a high ongoing monthly heating bill.

I thought someone said earlier in this thread that I could full charge a vehicle while I stop to take a piss?

Given the age of most of these guys, they might dribble long enough to still make that true


Fast charging a little Tesla battery and this 1,800 lb hunk are two different things. Add that Ford has limited the charge rate a bit (likely to protect the battery from deterioration or failure) and the "fast charge" rate from 20 to 80% is about 45 minutes. So not fast. Most cars are about a third to half that.

2.5 percent of cars on the road are full EV. Imagine even 25% EV. We will have major major electric shortages. Oil is either consumed at the pump or at the power station making juice. The clean solution would be Nuclear but the green wackos don't want that.

Wind power made a few Chinese billionaires even wealthier. A 1.5 turbine that costs how much can only power 400 houses and a 2.0 megawatt can do 600-800, how much do these things cost and they can[t run in the winter in a lot of places.

Solar does neither.

In Arkansas if you own a electric or hybrid you have to pay a extra $200 a year personal property tax!

Thanks...

Most of that math I already knew, but the details you provided spell out much... especially for non-engineers in the crowd.

My challenge with the "Ford-Speak" is that I am not finding the math you reference anywhere... that is actually published by Ford.

Lots of "Targeted", "Estimated", "Depending on age and health of batteries".

This does NOT exude confidence... especially at a $75,000 - $95,000 price point.

Ford has burned many many people before (i.e. early 6.0 diesels and the whole 6.4 debacle).

In a nutshell, thanks for spelling out details as you understand them, but I do NOT trust Ford and what I personally perceive as bullchit in this product.

Time will tell... as in all things.



This is not a slam at you personally...

Sure enough, and for those who believe in never buying the first year model of anything, for SURE don’t buy this generation Lightning.

The Lightning is a plaything for the monied urban engineer, a substitute for the Porsche or the Beemer. They’ll geek out about optimum charging rate and pennies per mile fuel savings while marveling that they can put all five bags of Home Depot mulch in the bed at once.

It could be useful for those who carry around a welder / generator because they can run equipment and power tools off the huge inverter. No room taken up by the generator, no noise or generator fuel.

The rest will be sold to fleets for marketing purposes / virtue signaling.

Still, the thing is a step in the development of EV’s and interesting for that purpose alone. It’ll be a long while before those of us that use trucks as trucks will sell their ‘96 power strokes for an 8 year old Lightning....

"Given that the vast majority of EV users charge at home, at night (when electric demand is at it's lowest)"

If you use electricity for heat the demand will be higher at night and if you live where' its hot at night the demand may not go down at all. Solar panels don't work at night and wind turbines may or may not work at night. Wind turbines don't make more electricity when the wind is blowing hard because they are restricted to the current needs of the grid (they have brakes on them to decrease the output and to ensure the don't spin too fast and destroy themselves).

"If all cars in Texas switch to electric, the total energy demand increases by about 30%."

That's just "green energy" propaganda.