Found guilty with a summary judgement of repeated fraud in New York, ordered the immediate dissolvement of trump enterprises and the taking of all of trumps business licenses and certificates in the state.
Found guilty with a summary judgement of repeated fraud in New York, ordered the immediate dissolvement of trump enterprises and the taking of all of trumps business licenses and certificates in the state.
Found guilty with a summary judgement of repeated fraud in New York, ordered the immediate dissolvement of trump enterprises and the taking of all of trumps business licenses and certificates in the state.
Phil
Be careful, rubbing your clit too much will give you a blister.
Why do you support the party of abortion, child trafficking, grooming and drag queen story hour for children? Maybe you participate in one or more of those things yourself?
Found guilty with a summary judgement of repeated fraud in New York, ordered the immediate dissolvement of trump enterprises and the taking of all of trumps business licenses and certificates in the state.
Phil
So this gets appealed and goes to a higher court. I doubt this was a surprise to Trumps legal team.
The really funny part about it is that trump personally asked the court for the summary judgement, thinking he would get the case dismissed... just (lol).
The really funny part about it is that trump personally asked the court for the summary judgement, thinking he would get the case dismissed... just (lol).
Found guilty with a summary judgement of repeated fraud in New York, ordered the immediate dissolvement of trump enterprises and the taking of all of trumps business licenses and certificates in the state.
Phil
Be careful, rubbing your clit too much will give you a blister.
Fool, trump asked the judge to make a summary judgement, and he did... trial if trump still wants it will be Monday. But the judgment has already been made at trumps request. That stays in effect.
A few, and been to Ricks... had a few up to the gun club... and have been a Republican all my life, until the tea party came into being and they tried to put Pallin into office. And even then, I just became and independent I thought on a temporary basis... But the right had gone way too far by then... a bunch of treasonous mfers now. Want no part of them. Would like to see this site get back to the way it used to be though.
Fool, trump asked the judge to make a summary judgement, and he did... trial if trump still wants it will be Monday. But the judgment has already been made at trumps request. That stays in effect.
A few, and been to Ricks... had a few up to the gun club... and have been a Republican all my life, until the tea party came into being and they tried to put Pallin into office. And even then, I just became and independent I thought on a temporary basis... But the right had gone way too far by then... a bunch of treasonous mfers now. Want no part of them. Would like to see this site get back to the way it used to be though.
Hunter Biden received $250K wires originating in Beijing with beneficiary address listed as Joe Biden's home Money came from Hunter's China-backed business partners
Fool, trump asked the judge to make a summary judgement, and he did... trial if trump still wants it will be Monday. But the judgment has already been made at trumps request. That stays in effect.
Phil
Then why did Trumps lawyers sue the DA and judge to delay the start of the trial?
Hunter Biden received $250K wires originating in Beijing with beneficiary address listed as Joe Biden's home Money came from Hunter's China-backed business partners
Wonder why the OP didn't post this story?
Isn't it funny how all these alleged "Independents" can always find something to run down a Republican about and never say anything about the Democrats?
A few, and been to Ricks... had a few up to the gun club... and have been a Republican all my life, until the tea party came into being and they tried to put Pallin into office. And even then, I just became and independent I thought on a temporary basis... But the right had gone way too far by then... a bunch of treasonous mfers now. Want no part of them. Would like to see this site get back to the way it used to be though.
Phil
F uck you, seriously. You talk chit on republicans but you gladly support pedophiles.. go play in traffic
Hunter Biden received $250K wires originating in Beijing with beneficiary address listed as Joe Biden's home Money came from Hunter's China-backed business partners
Wonder why the OP didn't post this story?
Isn't it funny how all these alleged "Independents" can always find something to run down a Republican about and never say anything about the Democrats?
Yup, they are all lying sacks of dog puke. They support pedos and commies. All of them are enemies of true americans
The left doesn't care if he's convicted of anything or not. They know full well this onslaught of litigation is utter BS. Their biggest goal is to relentlessly and vehemently hammer on his time and money, and hope that keeps him from campaigning, and thus winning in 2024. They CANNOT afford to let that happen. There are trillions of dollars at stake. Not to mention that a bunch of them will probably go down in flaming litigation themselves if they lose control.
It's lawfare. It how the commies try to delete people. It's never legit, they just hope the process breaks people mentally or financially. Trump wins cause he can't be broken.
Fuggin idiots from coast to coast. Trump has already wiped the field of Republicrat challengers, as evidenced by his conspicuous absence at the gatherings of those with 1% support to ambush him(aka debates), and democommie rags like WaPo trying to spin their own polls showing him stomping a mudhole in Biden. Everywhere Trump goes, people line up to see him, Biden has to wait until he knows where a crowd is, and try to get there before they leave for a picture.
Who gives a fug what some bullschit court in NYC says. Every empty suit in DC has done so much heinous schit, Trump looks like a choir boy by comparison. Hilarious watching Menendez try to say all y’all did the same and worse without saying it. Even more funny that he’s right. The Democrats are the party of criminals and freaks. Republicrats are just spineless greedy sops. Trump makes them all look like what they are, stupid and useless. I am voting for him if I have to write him in and he is sitting in jail accused of murder, because everyone I hate hates him, and me. So fug them all, They can eat a bag of dicks. Or a bullet when he is President again. Do us all a favor. We are so tired of your schit. Suck start a double-barreled shotgun and save us the trouble.
A few, and been to Ricks... had a few up to the gun club... and have been a Republican all my life, until the tea party came into being and they tried to put Pallin into office. And even then, I just became and independent I thought on a temporary basis... But the right had gone way too far by then... a bunch of treasonous mfers now. Want no part of them. Would like to see this site get back to the way it used to be though.
A few, and been to Ricks... had a few up to the gun club... and have been a Republican all my life, until the tea party came into being and they tried to put Pallin into office. And even then, I just became and independent I thought on a temporary basis... But the right had gone way too far by then... a bunch of treasonous mfers now. Want no part of them. Would like to see this site get back to the way it used to be though.
Phil
You are perhaps a “republican”, but damn sure no conservative.
You’re a Republican the same way the OregonZero is a moderate.
Found guilty with a summary judgement of repeated fraud in New York, ordered the immediate dissolvement of trump enterprises and the taking of all of trumps business licenses and certificates in the state.
Phil
Be careful, rubbing your clit too much will give you a blister.
A few, and been to Ricks... had a few up to the gun club... and have been a Republican all my life, until the tea party came into being and they tried to put Pallin into office. And even then, I just became and independent I thought on a temporary basis... But the right had gone way too far by then... a bunch of treasonous mfers now. Want no part of them. Would like to see this site get back to the way it used to be though.
Phil
Good deal, Gayghost and very logical. Nothing much more patriotic than Zero starting the illegal importation of alien kids and then flying their relatives in and giving 2200 fully automatic rifles to Mexican cartels, leasing out many of our seaports to Chynese businessmen without doing federally required due diligence, giving contracts to China for inferior quality steel to be used in construction of our navy's ships, releasing $155 billion to Iran to help them build nukes, or behind the development of ISIS to build the muzzy Caliphate, building internationally illegal Bioweapons Labs in Ukraine, helping Killery build Ukraine baby making centers to sell kids and organs, entering the ISIS war against Syria to topple it to the Caliphate, giving Qatar $5 billion to take 5 Taliban Generals off our hands, .....
You're too stupid to connect the dots it was increasing red tape and taxes and federal hiring/firing programs that forced the closing of 67,000 manufacturers in the US with a loss of over 600,000 mfg jobs, most of which went to Chyna.
You seem to forget the unparalleled theft of $870 billion for Zeros Work ready projects of which there were none. He confiscated $50,000 in GM stock from my teacher father in law to give to GM union people to buy votes.
You and scum like your Neonazi buds are traitors of the highest order.
Of course Trump was an ass for raising tariffs and forcing many of those businesses and their jobs back to the America your commie buds hate.
Or doing like Biden and giving the Taliban an $87 billion army, enforcing Constitutionally illegal lockdowns, masking and jabs. Letting your traitorus BLM and Antifa buds burn and riot and kill with impunity in the summer of love. You're too stupid to realize between all the failed businesses from the events above the Rothschild NWO banksters were able to buy hundreds of billions in property for pennies on the dollar.
Noting more patriotic than Bidet's Constitutionally illegal open borders programs or violation of Federal law by illegally enticing millions of illegal aliens to break US laws by entering this country illegally, actually using US money to finance an invasion to take advantage of his and Zeros Fraudulent Election rigging system and supporting the Chynese fentanyl trafficking and enabling the drug induced deaths of over 100,000 US citizens annually and becoming the best friend the MS 13 ever had for their human trafficking and Pedophilia programs.
You call this criminal.
You must be a plant. If you believe as you say, you're almost too stupid to walk across a street.
You prove drug use prevents logical thinking and you prove the validity of GODs word.
A few, and been to Ricks... had a few up to the gun club... and have been a Republican all my life, until the tea party came into being and they tried to put Pallin into office. And even then, I just became and independent I thought on a temporary basis... But the right had gone way too far by then... a bunch of treasonous mfers now. Want no part of them. Would like to see this site get back to the way it used to be though.
Phil
You're what everyone refers to as a California Republican. I'm nothing like you. People like you are the reason mountain lion hunting is illegal in California, the reason coyote hunting contests are now illegal.the whole wolf hugging religion. The reason that semi automatic rifles are so demonized. You're more liberal than you are conservative, you just don't get it.
A few, and been to Ricks... had a few up to the gun club... and have been a Republican all my life, until the tea party came into being and they tried to put Pallin into office. And even then, I just became and independent I thought on a temporary basis... But the right had gone way too far by then... a bunch of treasonous mfers now. Want no part of them. Would like to see this site get back to the way it used to be though.
Phil
You're what everyone refers to as a California Republican. I'm nothing like you. People like you are the reason mountain lion hunting is illegal in California, the reason coyote hunting contests are now illegal.the whole wolf hugging religion. The reason that semi automatic rifles are so demonized. You're more liberal than you are conservative, you just don't get it.
And, his kind have flooded NV with their superior attitudes, destroying the once freest of all States.
Hunter Biden received $250K wires originating in Beijing with beneficiary address listed as Joe Biden's home Money came from Hunter's China-backed business partners
Wonder why the OP didn't post this story?
Isn't it funny how all these alleged "Independents" can always find something to run down a Republican about and never say anything about the Democrats?
Hunter Biden (private citizen) should probably be in jail. Democratic Senator, Bob Menendez should be in jail. And Donald Trump should be in jail.
A few, and been to Ricks... had a few up to the gun club... and have been a Republican all my life, until the tea party came into being and they tried to put Pallin into office. And even then, I just became and independent I thought on a temporary basis... But the right had gone way too far by then... a bunch of treasonous mfers now. Want no part of them. Would like to see this site get back to the way it used to be though.
Hunter Biden received $250K wires originating in Beijing with beneficiary address listed as Joe Biden's home Money came from Hunter's China-backed business partners
Wonder why the OP didn't post this story?
Isn't it funny how all these alleged "Independents" can always find something to run down a Republican about and never say anything about the Democrats?
Hunter Biden (private citizen) should probably be in jail. Democratic Senator, Bob Menendez should be in jail. And Donald Trump should be in jail.
Hunter Biden received $250K wires originating in Beijing with beneficiary address listed as Joe Biden's home Money came from Hunter's China-backed business partners
Wonder why the OP didn't post this story?
Isn't it funny how all these alleged "Independents" can always find something to run down a Republican about and never say anything about the Democrats?
Hunter Biden (private citizen) should probably be in jail. Democratic Senator, Bob Menendez should be in jail. And Donald Trump should be in jail.
Fuggin idiots from coast to coast. Trump has already wiped the field of Republicrat challengers, as evidenced by his conspicuous absence at the gatherings of those with 1% support to ambush him(aka debates), and democommie rags like WaPo trying to spin their own polls showing him stomping a mudhole in Biden. Everywhere Trump goes, people line up to see him, Biden has to wait until he knows where a crowd is, and try to get there before they leave for a picture.
Who gives a fug what some bullschit court in NYC says. Every empty suit in DC has done so much heinous schit, Trump looks like a choir boy by comparison. Hilarious watching Menendez try to say all y’all did the same and worse without saying it. Even more funny that he’s right. The Democrats are the party of criminals and freaks. Republicrats are just spineless greedy sops. Trump makes them all look like what they are, stupid and useless. I am voting for him if I have to write him in and he is sitting in jail accused of murder, because everyone I hate hates him, and me. So fug them all, They can eat a bag of dicks. Or a bullet when he is President again. Do us all a favor. We are so tired of your schit. Suck start a double-barreled shotgun and save us the trouble.
For a poster that rarely posts you came out with both barrels. Well done, AP.
Fool, trump asked the judge to make a summary judgement, and he did... trial if trump still wants it will be Monday. But the judgment has already been made at trumps request. That stays in effect.
Phil
Why are you so happy to have a DOJ that is biased? That is the definition of dictatorship. Trump probably knew he couldn't get a fair trial and wanted it moved to a different court.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
Funny how it’s always us who are the Fascists, but the left does the censoring, election fraud, weaponizing govt agencies Against their political opponents, takes bribes from our enemies, and opens the borders to “migrants” and drugs.
Hunter Biden received $250K wires originating in Beijing with beneficiary address listed as Joe Biden's home Money came from Hunter's China-backed business partners
Wonder why the OP didn't post this story?
Isn't it funny how all these alleged "Independents" can always find something to run down a Republican about and never say anything about the Democrats?
Hunter Biden (private citizen) should probably be in jail. Democratic Senator, Bob Menendez should be in jail. And Donald Trump should be in jail.
Happy?
The jury is still out on you. Once you have some posting history here I'll render my verdict.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
Funny how it’s always us who are the Fascists, but the left does the censoring, election fraud, weaponizing govt agencies Against their political opponents, takes bribes from our enemies, and opens the borders to “migrants” and drugs.
Who are the real Fascists? It’s easy to see…
excellent response TimZ !
His quote is full of rhetoric and no substance. Just unsubstantiated emotional BS.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
Funny how it’s always us who are the Fascists, but the left does the censoring, election fraud, weaponizing govt agencies Against their political opponents, takes bribes from our enemies, and opens the borders to “migrants” and drugs.
Who are the real Fascists? It’s easy to see…
Respectfully, 75% of this is BS from the Right-Wing Rage Industrial Complex. The election fraud portion, 100%.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
Funny how it’s always us who are the Fascists, but the left does the censoring, election fraud, weaponizing govt agencies Against their political opponents, takes bribes from our enemies, and opens the borders to “migrants” and drugs.
Who are the real Fascists? It’s easy to see…
Respectfully, 75% of this is BS from the Right-Wing Rage Industrial Complex. The election fraud portion, 100%.
Respectfully, sure, just keep telling yourself that, and give us some more CNN talking points.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
Funny how it’s always us who are the Fascists, but the left does the censoring, election fraud, weaponizing govt agencies Against their political opponents, takes bribes from our enemies, and opens the borders to “migrants” and drugs.
Who are the real Fascists? It’s easy to see…
Respectfully, 75% of this is BS from the Right-Wing Rage Industrial Complex. The election fraud portion, 100%.
More unsubstantiated dribble from your head commissar, go away payed troll.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
Funny how it’s always us who are the Fascists, but the left does the censoring, election fraud, weaponizing govt agencies Against their political opponents, takes bribes from our enemies, and opens the borders to “migrants” and drugs.
Who are the real Fascists? It’s easy to see…
Respectfully, 75% of this is BS from the Right-Wing Rage Industrial Complex. The election fraud portion, 100%.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
Funny how it’s always us who are the Fascists, but the left does the censoring, election fraud, weaponizing govt agencies Against their political opponents, takes bribes from our enemies, and opens the borders to “migrants” and drugs.
Who are the real Fascists? It’s easy to see…
Yep. This POS would have gladly put MAGA folks in the train to the Gas Chambers during Hitler’s reign of Germany. And are proudly supporting the criminal Traitorous Lying Hiden Biden who Weaponized the DOJ against conservative PTA parents, while championing Drag Queen shows for preschoolers at Pubilc Libraries. GAYghost, CalledScum / LostC.unt60, Suckamore, and SuckAssCharlie all approve.
As I’ve said many times before, The Hypocrisy of The Left Knows No Bounds.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
Funny how it’s always us who are the Fascists, but the left does the censoring, election fraud, weaponizing govt agencies Against their political opponents, takes bribes from our enemies, and opens the borders to “migrants” and drugs.
Who are the real Fascists? It’s easy to see…
Respectfully, 75% of this is BS from the Right-Wing Rage Industrial Complex. The election fraud portion, 100%.
Respectfully, sure, just keep telling yourself that, and give us some more CNN talking points.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
Funny how it’s always us who are the Fascists, but the left does the censoring, election fraud, weaponizing govt agencies Against their political opponents, takes bribes from our enemies, and opens the borders to “migrants” and drugs.
Who are the real Fascists? It’s easy to see…
Yep. This POS would have gladly put MAGA folks in the train to the Gas Chambers during Hitler’s reign of Germany. And are proudly supporting the criminal Traitorous Lying Hiden Biden who Weaponized the DOJ against conservative PTA parents, while championing Drag Queen shows for preschoolers at Pubilc Libraries. GAYghost, CalledScum / LostC.unt60, Suckamore, and SuckAssCharlie all approve.
You couldn't be more wrong about that, at least from my end and I'm sure from those guys too. Trump was and is the wrong answer to the right questions.
Strange, a guy gets found liable for fraud and all the stupid [bleep] come out, pissing down their legs, protecting fatso.
I’m curious. What’s it feel like to be a full-blown cultist? The type of man (?) that would drop to his mother flicking knees and gag down chota to protect his savior.
Your man is a piece of garbage. Your man is a failure. Your man is stupid. Your man is corrupt. Your man doesn’t know where he is. Your party is filth. You are also all these things listed. Go get yourself some more pink hair color and another piercing in you face, you lousy pos.
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
Funny how it’s always us who are the Fascists, but the left does the censoring, election fraud, weaponizing govt agencies Against their political opponents, takes bribes from our enemies, and opens the borders to “migrants” and drugs.
Who are the real Fascists? It’s easy to see…
Respectfully, 75% of this is BS from the Right-Wing Rage Industrial Complex. The election fraud portion, 100%.
Respectfully, sure, just keep telling yourself that, and give us some more CNN talking points.
Fool, trump asked the judge to make a summary judgement, and he did... trial if trump still wants it will be Monday. But the judgment has already been made at trumps request. That stays in effect.
Phil
Based on what you’ve posted I don’t think you understand the circumstances and machinations regarding this situation at all.
I'll bet you (one in ten) that you won't post your name or address on here. Cuz if you did I'd bet you one in 100 you'd get punched in the face. Wanna take that bet?
Skank, just another keyboard warrior. Big blowhard and tough talker buried in a little cubicle in a corner of the house that his cousin owns. Wait, is it your brother. They are one and the same aren’t they? Man, you all need to stop that in-breeding. Any of you have 7 fingers or toes?
Hunter Biden received $250K wires originating in Beijing with beneficiary address listed as Joe Biden's home Money came from Hunter's China-backed business partners
Wonder why the OP didn't post this story?
Isn't it funny how all these alleged "Independents" can always find something to run down a Republican about and never say anything about the Democrats?
Hunter Biden (private citizen) should probably be in jail. Democratic Senator, Bob Menendez should be in jail. And Donald Trump should be in jail.
Found guilty with a summary judgement of repeated fraud in New York, ordered the immediate dissolvement of trump enterprises and the taking of all of trumps business licenses and certificates in the state.
Phil
That all you got? NY?
Laughing. Like you're going to change a lot of votes here, dumbass ass-sucker.
And another child phugger appears. No wonder Tump,wanted to increase prison sentences for pedophiles like you
Originally Posted by Eric308
Originally Posted by chlinstructor
Originally Posted by TimZ
Originally Posted by Eric308
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
Funny how it’s always us who are the Fascists, but the left does the censoring, election fraud, weaponizing govt agencies Against their political opponents, takes bribes from our enemies, and opens the borders to “migrants” and drugs.
Who are the real Fascists? It’s easy to see…
Yep. This POS would have gladly put MAGA folks in the train to the Gas Chambers during Hitler’s reign of Germany. And are proudly supporting the criminal Traitorous Lying Hiden Biden who Weaponized the DOJ against conservative PTA parents, while championing Drag Queen shows for preschoolers at Pubilc Libraries. GAYghost, CalledScum / LostC.unt60, Suckamore, and SuckAssCharlie all approve.
You couldn't be more wrong about that, at least from my end and I'm sure from those guys too. Trump was and is the wrong answer to the right questions.
I just wonder what the Genius Crew thinks would happen if their leftist traitorus heros prevail a destroy the US with the CCP and the globalists take over and start methodically reducing the world's population to their 500 million in their Agenda 2030 Plan.
Do Jell-O and Gayghost and Houston_2 think they are so valuable their lives will be spared?
Talk about stupid. Does Gayghost feel that because he is such a valuable asset he will be allowed to keep his guns and eat meat and get more than 2 beers a week and not be restricted to insects for dinner?
OP is a dumbass. This will be overturned on appeal. Not one of the banks or entities involved in these deals has complained. The value of loans is based on appraised values, not claimed values, and loans are underwritten accordingly. As to the tax angle they are trying to play, the city and state are supposed to have appraisers going around establishing the value of property for tax purposes. These appraisals are not tied to anything in the loan process and the appraisals happen year round year after year. Look what happens to your own property taxes, they fluctuate from year to year based on appraised values.
OP is a dumbass. This will be overturned on appeal. Not one of the banks or entities involved in these deals has complained. The value of loans is based on appraised values, not claimed values, and loans are underwritten accordingly. As to the tax angle they are trying to play, the city and state are supposed to have appraisers going around establishing the value of property for tax purposes. These appraisals are not tied to anything in the loan process and the appraisals happen year round year after year. Look what happens to your own property taxes, they fluctuate from year to year based on appraised values.
But the OP is too clueless to grasp any of this.
Good post....
Stupid fuggers like Phil believe a business owner can just declare any value he see's fit and get loans based on that? dumbazz's Hey Phil what ever happened with Trumps tax returns? if they could just get ahold of his returns they would have him.... well? You stupid sons a bitches couldn't read nor understand a return like Trumps, a hint, he has a team of accountants and lawyers preparing those returns, licensed professional's .... you leftist define ignorance!!!
DJT a fraud? In other news, water is wet. How you guys could ever pick this huckster as your Savior is beyond understanding. He is a narcotic, an irresistible high to those addicted to hearing from the Oval Office what they once could only mutter in private. He was always the wrong answer to the right questions, the choice for those who would willingly embrace Fascism to save the Country from Socialism but don't know the definition of either.
Funny how it’s always us who are the Fascists, but the left does the censoring, election fraud, weaponizing govt agencies Against their political opponents, takes bribes from our enemies, and opens the borders to “migrants” and drugs.
Epstein’s house on Palm Beach was just a little to the north of Mar-a-Lago, it sold for $25.8 million as a tear down.
Rush Limbaugh’s nearby estate was sold to the Este Lauder executive for $155 million, and has been torn down. Guess it was too modest.
Trump’s lawyer Chris Kise, who called the decision “outrageous,” said it “seeks to nationalize one of the most successful corporate empires in the United States and seize control of private property .
On the bright side, imagine how many illegal immigrants NY can now house. They can turn golf courses into giant tent cities, convert Trump Tower into a giant immigrant housing project, etc.,
OP is a dumbass. This will be overturned on appeal. Not one of the banks or entities involved in these deals has complained. The value of loans is based on appraised values, not claimed values, and loans are underwritten accordingly. As to the tax angle they are trying to play, the city and state are supposed to have appraisers going around establishing the value of property for tax purposes. These appraisals are not tied to anything in the loan process and the appraisals happen year round year after year. Look what happens to your own property taxes, they fluctuate from year to year based on appraised values.
EVERYTHING that is being done to [try to] stop TRUMP is about protecting the many, many treasonous actions of the Obama cabal during it's 8 years of attempted annihilation of the greatest country ever.
F*ck every one of the bastards here that are clearly opposed to saving this great CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC!
OP is a dumbass. This will be overturned on appeal. Not one of the banks or entities involved in these deals has complained. The value of loans is based on appraised values, not claimed values, and loans are underwritten accordingly. As to the tax angle they are trying to play, the city and state are supposed to have appraisers going around establishing the value of property for tax purposes. These appraisals are not tied to anything in the loan process and the appraisals happen year round year after year. Look what happens to your own property taxes, they fluctuate from year to year based on appraised values.
But the OP is too clueless to grasp any of this.
Expecting a liberal or Democrat for that matter to know anything about the real estate,banking sectors or the economy is a pipe dream. They do know the business of corruption though and know how to fleece people.
Curious, how many of stupid hillbillies use toilet paper after a dump? Serious, this is a pack of cretins.
Man, clearly I went to bed too early last night. One of the disadvantages of having an actual tax-contributing JOB.......
Well ya know h13, that TP did run up in price during the COVID panic, but luckily we gots us lots of corncobs down here on the pig farm. I just hate it when MeeMaw hogs the outhouse though......
Back to the topic of the thread, I bet you think the MSM, DOJ, and FBI are neutral, impartial and balanced, right?
Who was damaged by Trump’s alleged fraud? The banks made money and so on and so forth. Even if he did everything of which they accuse him, who was damaged? And that isn’t an academic question. Damages are an essential element of any suit. For instance the guy who ran a red light and missed you by inches was just as negligent as the guy who ran it and smacked into you at 40 mph but you don’t have a suit because there were no damages. Who was damaged by Trump’s alleged behavior? How does the state have standing to assert itself into private contractual details except in a regulatory manner? And this did not seem to be a suit or action by a regulatory agency. And what about the legality of a state AG announcing while campaigning that she would specifically go after a private citizen while campaigning and therefore, before she had any reason to know if any crimes or torts? And then how does the court’s actions remedy anything?
Those are just questions I have off the top of my head. Admittedly, I haven’t paid much attention.
Oh, and to make this big of a ruling on summary judgment? Are you phugging kidding me? Fraud, regardless of facts before a court at summary judgment requires an element of intent, the courts are loathe to make rulings on that sort of thing and will almost always let a jury decide. This is just ridiculous on many levels.
OP is a dumbass. This will be overturned on appeal. Not one of the banks or entities involved in these deals has complained. The value of loans is based on appraised values, not claimed values, and loans are underwritten accordingly. As to the tax angle they are trying to play, the city and state are supposed to have appraisers going around establishing the value of property for tax purposes. These appraisals are not tied to anything in the loan process and the appraisals happen year round year after year. Look what happens to your own property taxes, they fluctuate from year to year based on appraised values.
But the OP is too clueless to grasp any of this.
Good post....
Stupid fuggers like Phil believe a business owner can just declare any value he see's fit and get loans based on that? dumbazz's Hey Phil what ever happened with Trumps tax returns? if they could just get ahold of his returns they would have him.... well? You stupid sons a bitches couldn't read nor understand a return like Trumps, a hint, he has a team of accountants and lawyers preparing those returns, licensed professional's .... you leftist define ignorance!!!
And the IRS audits him every year. And the stupid fughks thought the IRS was wrong or cut him some spack and they were going to nail him on tax fraud. You can't make this schiett up, yet the stupid suckers do.
Like how did the MAL raid go? They forgot the 70s Presidential Record Act was law or something? And it leads to Hiden having stolen Classified Documents from when he was a Senator.
Hey Gayghost, how much do you think Comer is going to find Chyna paid for those and for the Classified Documents Zero and Kilery sold. They didn't have to hack her illegally unsecured govt bathroom computer, she sold them access. Gayghost and Jell-O are too stupid to remember Chynagate - where Bill had foreign equipment sales moved from Warren Christopher who wouldn't approve the sale of Loral Space Missile Guidance Technology to Chyna so Bill had it switched to his bud Ron Brown who did let tge sale go through.
Then when the Feds started sniffing Ron Brown Slick semt him on an Eastern European fact finding trip where his plane blew up in midair with about 28 innocents on board.
Then the dimocommies wanted to show their compassion by naming Houston International for Ron Brown.
Jell-O and Gayghost and Lostinhell and Houston_2 think Ron would appreciate it. The joke in Houston was that the scumbags wanted to name in Knicker International.
Gayghosts and Jell-Os definition of treason is very selective.
And the dumbasses are too stupid to know Trump has Kilerys 33,000 emails to Slick discussing their grandkids when Slick doesn't do emails.
They are too stupid to know Comers investigation of Pedo Peter Hendersons emails are going to lead straight to Zero and Killery and they are going to expose them for the traitors they are and they are going to hang.
And all the while Gayghost and Jell-O are going to say Trump collided with Putin and he needs to hang.
Gayghost and Houston_2 and Jell-O, you should Remember this clue from Q, "We have it All" and " It's coming" and what else is coming, "Checkmate".
Trump is playing 5D Chess and he's winning because the Patriots are in control.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
A few, and been to Ricks... had a few up to the gun club... and have been a Republican all my life, until the tea party came into being and they tried to put Pallin into office. And even then, I just became and independent I thought on a temporary basis... But the right had gone way too far by then... a bunch of treasonous mfers now. Want no part of them. Would like to see this site get back to the way it used to be though.
Phil
Care to enumerate how the right went too far, and any examples of the rights treasonous acts or do you stupidly think we should just believe your lying lieberal drug fried brainwashed commie BS.
Now call me a liar and then turn around and prove me right by not replying or by saying you can't remember and of the rights Treasonous acts.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
JoeBob Esq, don't you know you're talking to a WarAdmiral? LOL
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
JoeBob Esq, don't you know you're talking to a WarAdmiral? LOL
He seems about as smart as the original WarAdmiral was, but I doubt he is as fast.
Fool, trump asked the judge to make a summary judgement, and he did... trial if trump still wants it will be Monday. But the judgment has already been made at trumps request. That stays in effect.
Phil
Why are you so happy to have a DOJ that is biased? That is the definition of dictatorship. Trump probably knew he couldn't get a fair trial and wanted it moved to a different court.
He’s a Bolshevik collaborator who must think by spreading their propaganda he will receive a higher social status after the great reset. Lol
A few, and been to Ricks... had a few up to the gun club... and have been a Republican all my life, until the tea party came into being and they tried to put Pallin into office. And even then, I just became and independent I thought on a temporary basis... But the right had gone way too far by then... a bunch of treasonous mfers now. Want no part of them. Would like to see this site get back to the way it used to be though.
Phil
First: You never were a Republican, second maybe you moved left and finally this site won’t change. It’s a shame you have an issue with God loving / Patriotic people, that’s what you are saying Phil. Don’t let the door hit you in the a$$, we won’t ever see eye to eye with libs like you.
its just 35 pages and shouldn't take you all more than a few moments.
Enjoy!
Phil
Now lie and tell us you've read and understand it. You can't even remember any of the treasonous acts you accused the Rs of doing and you don't have the guts or brains to respond intellectually to my charges against the soon to be proven criminal acts by your traitorous acts by members of the soon to be extinct DNC.
You can't even come up with a logical reason to support open borders.
Found guilty with a summary judgement of repeated fraud in New York, ordered the immediate dissolvement of trump enterprises and the taking of all of trumps business licenses and certificates in the state.
Phil
So this gets appealed and goes to a higher court. I doubt this was a surprise to Trumps legal team.
It is nice to see someone actually discussing the matter rationally rather than the preponderance of childish name calling. This is exactly what I expect will happen, but the real question is what happens at that higher court.
Boom! Trump doesn't need to campaign, he'll be the Rep candidate. Poor Lostinhell
He's polling overwhelmingly to win the nomination and that is not likely to change no matter what happens in court. The challenge is that he's polling about even with Biden, who's a pretty weak opponent in a lot of ways. The real question is how swing voters react come election time.
Ol bone spurs got his azz handed to him in 2020 by the worst presidential candidate ever. If and a big IF ol spurs is the nominee in 24 he will lose bigly again.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
63(12) does not have a scienter element. Scienter means intent.
Appellate courts rarely grant appeals on findings of fact, and the judge is the sole finder of fact in this case. Only errors in law are surefire grounds for appeal.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
JoeBob Esq, don't you know you're talking to a WarAdmiral? LOL
He seems about as smart as the original WarAdmiral was, but I doubt he is as fast.
Please post again when Trump loses the appeal. Should be fun.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
JoeBob Esq, don't you know you're talking to a WarAdmiral? LOL
He seems about as smart as the original WarAdmiral was, but I doubt he is as fast.
Please post again when Trump loses the appeal. Should be fun.
What was the total number of errors the DOJ "accidentally" made on the Trump FISA applications? Answer that question honestly if you dare. If it is not yet apparent, people will do anything to try to get Trump, and the law won't stand in the way.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
63(12) does not have a scienter element. Scienter means intent.
Appellate courts rarely grant appeals on findings of fact, and the judge is the sole finder of fact in this case. Only errors in law are surefire grounds for appeal.
Quit throwing around terms you don’t understand. I merely repeated your statement in the last post and told you it was a textbook definition of fraud and fraud requires intent. And yes, the law does require intent because it repeatedly mentions fraud. Fraud is a legal term requiring more than mere misrepresentation or being wrong on a valuation.
As for a determination of fact, meh. Maybe it was. Maybe it wasn’t. Maybe the court incorrectly applied the law to make it’s determination of “fact”. For instance, he apparently relied upon a tax appraisal and took the lowest value it could possibly be. Did he consider other standards? Were they presented? Was error preserved? What standards have been applied in similar cases? What evidence of fraudulent intent was presented?
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
JoeBob Esq, don't you know you're talking to a WarAdmiral? LOL
He seems about as smart as the original WarAdmiral was, but I doubt he is as fast.
Please post again when Trump loses the appeal. Should be fun.
If your bot ass will post when it is thrown out by the federal courts.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
63(12) does not have a scienter element. Scienter means intent.
Appellate courts rarely grant appeals on findings of fact, and the judge is the sole finder of fact in this case. Only errors in law are surefire grounds for appeal.
Quit throwing around terms you don’t understand. I merely repeated your statement in the last post and told you it was a textbook definition of fraud and fraud requires intent. And yes, the law does require intent because it repeatedly mentions fraud. Fraud is a legal term requiring more than mere misrepresentation or being wrong on a valuation.
As for a determination of fact, meh. Maybe it was. Maybe it wasn’t. Maybe the court incorrectly applied the law to make it’s determination of “fact”. For instance, he apparently relied upon a tax appraisal and took the lowest value it could possibly be. Did he consider other standards? Were they presented? Was error preserved? What standards have been applied in similar cases? What evidence of fraudulent intent was presented?
From what I saw discussed by the "experts", what you're describing is the difference between a civil and criminal case & charges.....yesterday was civil, much lower level of burden of proof needed.
But the appeals process will start, and go on for years....all the while his holdings will be idle.
Ol bone spurs got his azz handed to him in 2020 by the worst presidential candidate ever. If and a big IF ol spurs is the nominee in 24 he will lose bigly again.
Keep on believing that PedoJoe won without collusion from multiple jurisdictions & 3 letter agencies.
BTW-I missed the reason you changed your username, can you drop that tidbit again?
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
63(12) does not have a scienter element. Scienter means intent.
Appellate courts rarely grant appeals on findings of fact, and the judge is the sole finder of fact in this case. Only errors in law are surefire grounds for appeal.
Quit throwing around terms you don’t understand. I merely repeated your statement in the last post and told you it was a textbook definition of fraud and fraud requires intent. And yes, the law does require intent because it repeatedly mentions fraud. Fraud is a legal term requiring more than mere misrepresentation or being wrong on a valuation.
As for a determination of fact, meh. Maybe it was. Maybe it wasn’t. Maybe the court incorrectly applied the law to make it’s determination of “fact”. For instance, he apparently relied upon a tax appraisal and took the lowest value it could possibly be. Did he consider other standards? Were they presented? Was error preserved? What standards have been applied in similar cases? What evidence of fraudulent intent was presented?
From what I saw discussed by the "experts", what you're describing is the difference between a civil and criminal case & charges.....yesterday was civil, much lower level of burden of proof needed.
But the appeals process will start, and go on for years....all the while his holdings will be idle.
Yes, and no. The standard for a civil trial is preponderance of the evidence instead of beyond a reasonable doubt. However, the basis for making the determination is still the same. You still have to show “intent”.
You don’t just get to say, “The tax appraisal said $18 million, and you said $250 million, therefore I say you committed fraud.” It shouldn’t work that way.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
63(12) does not have a scienter element. Scienter means intent.
Appellate courts rarely grant appeals on findings of fact, and the judge is the sole finder of fact in this case. Only errors in law are surefire grounds for appeal.
Quit throwing around terms you don’t understand. I merely repeated your statement in the last post and told you it was a textbook definition of fraud and fraud requires intent. And yes, the law does require intent because it repeatedly mentions fraud. Fraud is a legal term requiring more than mere misrepresentation or being wrong on a valuation.
As for a determination of fact, meh. Maybe it was. Maybe it wasn’t. Maybe the court incorrectly applied the law to make it’s determination of “fact”. For instance, he apparently relied upon a tax appraisal and took the lowest value it could possibly be. Did he consider other standards? Were they presented? Was error preserved? What standards have been applied in similar cases? What evidence of fraudulent intent was presented?
From what I saw discussed by the "experts", what you're describing is the difference between a civil and criminal case & charges.....yesterday was civil, much lower level of burden of proof needed.
But the appeals process will start, and go on for years....all the while his holdings will be idle.
Yes, and no. The standard for a civil trial is preponderance of the evidence instead of beyond a reasonable doubt. However, the basis for making the determination is still the same. You still have to show “intent”.
You don’t just get to say, “The tax appraisal said $18 million, and you said $250 million, therefore I say you committed fraud.” It shouldn’t work that way.
I think the real issue was that no jury was needed, just a judge makes the decision and you are supposed to swallow the pill...like it or not. He obviously had an agenda, with his post trial statements and fines issued to attorneys for "frivolous filings".
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
63(12) does not have a scienter element. Scienter means intent.
Appellate courts rarely grant appeals on findings of fact, and the judge is the sole finder of fact in this case. Only errors in law are surefire grounds for appeal.
Quit throwing around terms you don’t understand. I merely repeated your statement in the last post and told you it was a textbook definition of fraud and fraud requires intent. And yes, the law does require intent because it repeatedly mentions fraud. Fraud is a legal term requiring more than mere misrepresentation or being wrong on a valuation.
As for a determination of fact, meh. Maybe it was. Maybe it wasn’t. Maybe the court incorrectly applied the law to make it’s determination of “fact”. For instance, he apparently relied upon a tax appraisal and took the lowest value it could possibly be. Did he consider other standards? Were they presented? Was error preserved? What standards have been applied in similar cases? What evidence of fraudulent intent was presented?
From what I saw discussed by the "experts", what you're describing is the difference between a civil and criminal case & charges.....yesterday was civil, much lower level of burden of proof needed.
But the appeals process will start, and go on for years....all the while his holdings will be idle.
Yes, and no. The standard for a civil trial is preponderance of the evidence instead of beyond a reasonable doubt. However, the basis for making the determination is still the same. You still have to show “intent”.
You don’t just get to say, “The tax appraisal said $18 million, and you said $250 million, therefore I say you committed fraud.” It shouldn’t work that way.
I think the real issue was that no jury was needed, just a judge makes the decision and you are supposed to swallow the pill...like it or not. He obviously had an agenda, with his post trial statements and fines issued to attorneys for "frivolous filings".
Read the link a few pages ago. The tax assessor said Maralago was worth $18 to $27 million. Trump said $600 million. It is twenty acres and grand castle like home. A developer said it might be worth $725 million. Forbes magazine said conservatively $350 million. A neighbor’s five bedroom house on less than half an acre sold for $75 million. So, naturally the judge said it was only worth $18 million. Upon what basis does he make his finding? Upon the tax assessor in Florida? Did the assessor testify as to his reason for the assessed value? Did they ask banks if they relied upon assessed value or market values? In previous cases, what have New York courts said about the difference between market values and assessed values?
All of that is needed to determine if a) Trump overestimated his value, b) if said over estimation was intentional; and c) if it was fraudulent.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
63(12) does not have a scienter element. Scienter means intent.
Appellate courts rarely grant appeals on findings of fact, and the judge is the sole finder of fact in this case. Only errors in law are surefire grounds for appeal.
Quit throwing around terms you don’t understand. I merely repeated your statement in the last post and told you it was a textbook definition of fraud and fraud requires intent. And yes, the law does require intent because it repeatedly mentions fraud. Fraud is a legal term requiring more than mere misrepresentation or being wrong on a valuation.
As for a determination of fact, meh. Maybe it was. Maybe it wasn’t. Maybe the court incorrectly applied the law to make it’s determination of “fact”. For instance, he apparently relied upon a tax appraisal and took the lowest value it could possibly be. Did he consider other standards? Were they presented? Was error preserved? What standards have been applied in similar cases? What evidence of fraudulent intent was presented?
From what I saw discussed by the "experts", what you're describing is the difference between a civil and criminal case & charges.....yesterday was civil, much lower level of burden of proof needed.
But the appeals process will start, and go on for years....all the while his holdings will be idle.
Yes, and no. The standard for a civil trial is preponderance of the evidence instead of beyond a reasonable doubt. However, the basis for making the determination is still the same. You still have to show “intent”.
You don’t just get to say, “The tax appraisal said $18 million, and you said $250 million, therefore I say you committed fraud.” It shouldn’t work that way.
I think the real issue was that no jury was needed, just a judge makes the decision and you are supposed to swallow the pill...like it or not. He obviously had an agenda, with his post trial statements and fines issued to attorneys for "frivolous filings".
Read the link a few pages ago. The tax assessor said Maralago was worth $18 to $27 million. Trump said $600 million. It is twenty acres and grand castle like home. A developer said it might be worth $725 million. Forbes magazine said conservatively $350 million. A neighbor’s five bedroom house on less than half an acre sold for $75 million. So, naturally the judge said it was only worth $18 million. Upon what basis does he make his finding? Upon the tax assessor in Florida? Did the assessor testify as to his reason for the assessed value? Did they ask banks if they relied upon assessed value or market values? In previous cases, what have New York courts said about the difference between market values and assessed values?
All of that is needed to determine if a) Trump overestimated his value, b) if said over estimation was intentional; and c) if it was fraudulent.
I never disputed any of that, was just saying it wasn't a jury decision.
Found guilty with a summary judgement of repeated fraud in New York, ordered the immediate dissolvement of trump enterprises and the taking of all of trumps business licenses and certificates in the state.
Phil
And every dictator and megalomaniac control freak in the would is taking notes...and cheering.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
63(12) does not have a scienter element. Scienter means intent.
Appellate courts rarely grant appeals on findings of fact, and the judge is the sole finder of fact in this case. Only errors in law are surefire grounds for appeal.
Quit throwing around terms you don’t understand. I merely repeated your statement in the last post and told you it was a textbook definition of fraud and fraud requires intent. And yes, the law does require intent because it repeatedly mentions fraud. Fraud is a legal term requiring more than mere misrepresentation or being wrong on a valuation.
As for a determination of fact, meh. Maybe it was. Maybe it wasn’t. Maybe the court incorrectly applied the law to make it’s determination of “fact”. For instance, he apparently relied upon a tax appraisal and took the lowest value it could possibly be. Did he consider other standards? Were they presented? Was error preserved? What standards have been applied in similar cases? What evidence of fraudulent intent was presented?
I've been an attorney in New York State since 1993. I know what the terms mean. Common law fraud requires intent to defraud others for the purposes of depriving them of a thing of value. The Martin Act does not require this to be found liable for fraud. There is no intent to defraud element. All that is required is the act/statement that tends to mislead or deceive. The statute specifically states that there need not be a finding of common law fraud to have a violation of the Act. That is the whole point of my original response which was that it was unfortunate for Trump to be sued under section 63(12).
If you don't understand the law in this case you can't say the things you are saying without sounding buffoonish. Trump's intent was irrelevant, and thus the ruling on summary judgment.
“These are huge towers. I’ve lived in the city my whole life. You can’t just do this because the zoning allows it. I just can’t believe this is the case.”
— State Supreme Court Judge Arthur Engoron
Early in my career, I wrote about the backroom dealmaking that produces state Supreme Court judges. Now, at The Real Deal, I see the havoc these jurists wreak on the city and its real estate industry. It compels me to revisit the tawdry topic of how they get to the bench.
New Yorkers might assume their judges are top-notch legal minds who have reached the pinnacle of the profession. Um, no.
Many were middling, undistinguished lawyers. You’d almost have to be to subject yourself to the shady, debasing process one must endure for a shot at holding the gavel.
State Supreme Court judges, who preside over cases big enough to matter to the industry, serve 14-year terms and make $210,900. That adds up to $3 million, not including pension benefits, potential future raises and any additional terms. Beats hustling for clients in the backwaters of Brooklyn or toiling away as a law secretary.
These robed men and women rule on high-stakes real estate disputes and rezonings for projects and entire neighborhoods. Lately, some of their key decisions have been reversed on appeal, which suggests they are not doing a bang-up job.
Take the quote above by Engoron, who ruled that four towers proposed by JDS Development, L+M Development, CIM Group and Starrett Corporation in the Manhattan neighborhood Two Bridges required a rezoning, even though they complied with the zoning in place. If that sounds like sound legal reasoning, I’ve got two bridges to sell you.
The developers appealed and won. The Appellate Division also overturned recent anti-real estate rulings at SJP Properties’ 200 Amsterdam Avenue and in Inwood, where a sweeping rezoning had been temporarily invalidated because Judge Verna Saunders decided the land-use review process should — for the first time in its 30-year history — have included a racial impact study.
“Part of [the Appellate Division’s] job is to clean up the crap from the trial courts,” said one judicial system veteran. “Frankly, there’s a lot of it.”
All three reversals were unanimous. Do the judges care about being overturned? One would hope. But the court system does not keep track of their reversal rates and their jobs are as safe as houses. They nearly always serve until they hit the mandatory retirement age of 70 (at which point they can request up to three two-year extensions).
But wait. These judges are elected. Can’t New Yorkers just vote for better judges?
Again, no. These judicial elections bear no resemblance to democracy. The Democratic county organizations nominate as many candidates as there are Supreme Court openings. If your ballot in Manhattan, Brooklyn, Queens or the Bronx says “vote for any six candidates,” there will be exactly six Democrats. In New York’s Republican counties, the GOP does the same thing.
“This is an insider game where it’s a question of who you know, not what are your abilities.” Lincoln Restler, Brooklyn reformer
Under the state constitution, this is a partisan process involving a judicial convention. The local political machines have the infrastructure to control it, rendering the annual convention a Soviet-style affair.
“The whole system is so wrapped up in politics and patronage, there’s no incentive for anyone to relinquish authority,” said Ken Fisher, a land-use attorney at Cozen O’Connor and former City Council member. “Absent some miraculous burst of civic leadership out of Albany, there’s no reason to think the system is going to change any time soon.”
A candidate for judge must round up support from party functionaries. In Brooklyn, 42 Democratic state committee members — known as district leaders — elect a county leader. To keep their loyalty, the county leader fills the judicial slate with candidates who have garnered the most support among them. Candidates win that support by attending district leaders’ fundraisers and writing checks.
That is why in any interview about judge-making in New York, the phrase “chicken dinners” will come up.
“The idea that you can attend a few chicken dinners … and that determines whether you’re deciding cases of consequence is terribly disappointing and unacceptable,” said Lincoln Restler, a City Council candidate who has tried to reform the system. “This is an insider game where it’s a question of who you know, not what are your abilities.”
“The process is bizarre,” said the court system veteran, who navigated it years ago and spoke on condition of anonymity to protect professional relationships. “Oddly enough, the system produces some very good judges, [but also] a lot of mediocre judges and some turkeys.”
Lawrence Knipel, for example, became a judge because his wife, district leader Lori Knipel, “bulldozed him through,” as the source put it. Fortunately, Knipel turned out to be one of the court’s best judges.
Noach Dear did not. The late former City Council member, who failed the bar exam repeatedly before getting an exemption to take it untimed, got his judgeship without ever having tried a case. It is not clear that he had even practiced law.
“It’s not that good judges don’t come out of the system. It’s that the system is not designed to produce the leading scholars,” said Fisher, who once sat on a screening panel created to ensure judicial candidates at least had basic qualifications.
“In the years when I was involved in vetting them, I don’t recall a single assistant district attorney, a single law professor, a single partner in a law firm to even inquire about doing it,” he said.
Candidates rejected by screening panels can still make it to the bench. Some of them just blow off the panels, calling them rigged.
Besides judicial incompetence, a second problem is influence. This is where real estate gets hurt. Judges who come through a political process do not get a nod from a political boss in the back of the courtroom, but they tend to be “more sensitive to public opinion, more sensitive to the feelings of the people they garnered support from,” said Fisher.
He was speaking generally, but a case he is handling bears mentioning. Fisher represents a group favoring the de Blasio administration’s Gowanus rezoning plan, which is being held up by Judge Katherine Levine because its public hearings would be held on Zoom.
Early in the case, which is itself being litigated on Zoom, Levine seemed to be just fine with virtual hearings. “That’s life,” she told opponents in January. “That’s Covid.”
But she has since pondered the matter long enough that the rezoning might not get done before the mayor and Gowanus’ two local City Council members leave office. That would seriously jeopardize its chances, potentially denying developers the right to build 8,000 apartments and 20,000 people the opportunity to live in them.
“The whole system is so wrapped up in politics and patronage,there’s no incentive for anyone to relinquish authority.” Ken Fisher, land-use attorney
Emboldened, opponents of a Bruce Eichner project in Crown Heights are suing on the same grounds. Levine is on that case too. The judge’s beef with Zoom endangers dozens of rezoning applications and billions of dollars’ worth of development.
As it happens, a politician whose Democratic club put Levine on the bench, Assemblywoman Jo Anne Simon, has demanded that the Gowanus rezoning be paused until in-person hearings can be held.
I’ve known Simon since she led the Boerum Hill Civic Association in the early 1990s. She later became a district leader and was considered a reformer. She would never call a sitting judge about an active case. Still, her connection with Levine undermines public confidence in the case.
“If the community is up in arms, opposing a development, does that impact judges? Absolutely. They are human beings,” a former Supreme Court judge told me. “But hopefully they are still ruling on the law.”
Judging by the reversals, some are not. While winning at the trial court matters, lawyers concentrate on getting all their evidence and arguments into the record because the appeals panel cannot consider new material.
Fisher is now less focused on swaying Levine’s decision than on simply getting her to make one. His enemy is time. Besides, as with most real estate cases, this one is likely to be decided by the Appellate Division.
By the way, appellate judges are also products of politics: They are picked by the governor, sometimes based upon who is whispering in his ear. But that’s a story for another day.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
63(12) does not have a scienter element. Scienter means intent.
Appellate courts rarely grant appeals on findings of fact, and the judge is the sole finder of fact in this case. Only errors in law are surefire grounds for appeal.
Quit throwing around terms you don’t understand. I merely repeated your statement in the last post and told you it was a textbook definition of fraud and fraud requires intent. And yes, the law does require intent because it repeatedly mentions fraud. Fraud is a legal term requiring more than mere misrepresentation or being wrong on a valuation.
As for a determination of fact, meh. Maybe it was. Maybe it wasn’t. Maybe the court incorrectly applied the law to make it’s determination of “fact”. For instance, he apparently relied upon a tax appraisal and took the lowest value it could possibly be. Did he consider other standards? Were they presented? Was error preserved? What standards have been applied in similar cases? What evidence of fraudulent intent was presented?
I've been an attorney in New York State since 1993. I know what the terms mean. Common law fraud requires intent to defraud others for the purposes of depriving them of a thing of value. The Martin Act does not require this to be found liable for fraud. There is no intent to defraud element. All that is required is the act/statement that tends to mislead or deceive. The statute specifically states that there need not be a finding of common law fraud to have a violation of the Act. That is the whole point of my original response which was that it was unfortunate for Trump to be sued under section 63(12).
If you don't understand the law in this case you can't say the things you are saying without sounding buffoonish. Trump's intent was irrelevant, and thus the ruling on summary judgment.
Now you’re just making schit up. It says no such thing. But, I’ll grant it does look like something an affirmative action New York attorney would write as that it says, “ The word "fraud" or "fraudulent" as used herein shall include any device, scheme or artifice to defraud and any deception,misrepresentation, concealment, suppression, false pretense, false promise or unconscionable contractual provisions.”
You’ve got some real brain surgeons up there. In the definition of “fraud” you use the term “defraud” in thr first sentence of the definition. lol New York says “fraud is anything meant to defraud.” lol
The state has alleged fraud involving two of Trump's residences, at Trump Tower and Mar-a-Lago.
Trump owns and sporadically lives in the triplex penthouse atop Trump Tower.
The AG has alleged, and the judge Tuesday found, that the former president fraudulently tripled the apartment's size, claiming it was 30,000 square feet, in five years of his annual financial statements.
The statements were relied on by banks to collateralize and maintain hundreds of millions of dollars in loans.
The judge also found Tuesday that Trump valued Mar-a-Lago as high as $739 million based on the false premise that it was free of any development restrictions. Trump had personally signed deeds giving up any residential development rights, collecting a tidy tax benefit by doing so, the AG and judge found.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
63(12) does not have a scienter element. Scienter means intent.
Appellate courts rarely grant appeals on findings of fact, and the judge is the sole finder of fact in this case. Only errors in law are surefire grounds for appeal.
Quit throwing around terms you don’t understand. I merely repeated your statement in the last post and told you it was a textbook definition of fraud and fraud requires intent. And yes, the law does require intent because it repeatedly mentions fraud. Fraud is a legal term requiring more than mere misrepresentation or being wrong on a valuation.
As for a determination of fact, meh. Maybe it was. Maybe it wasn’t. Maybe the court incorrectly applied the law to make it’s determination of “fact”. For instance, he apparently relied upon a tax appraisal and took the lowest value it could possibly be. Did he consider other standards? Were they presented? Was error preserved? What standards have been applied in similar cases? What evidence of fraudulent intent was presented?
I've been an attorney in New York State since 1993. I know what the terms mean. Common law fraud requires intent to defraud others for the purposes of depriving them of a thing of value. The Martin Act does not require this to be found liable for fraud. There is no intent to defraud element. All that is required is the act/statement that tends to mislead or deceive. The statute specifically states that there need not be a finding of common law fraud to have a violation of the Act. That is the whole point of my original response which was that it was unfortunate for Trump to be sued under section 63(12).
If you don't understand the law in this case you can't say the things you are saying without sounding buffoonish. Trump's intent was irrelevant, and thus the ruling on summary judgment.
Now you’re just making schit up. It says no such thing. But, I’ll grant it does look like something an affirmative action New York attorney would write as that it says, “ The word "fraud" or "fraudulent" as used herein shall include any device, scheme or artifice to defraud and any deception,misrepresentation, concealment, suppression, false pretense, false promise or unconscionable contractual provisions.”
You’ve got some real brain surgeons up there. In the definition of “fraud” you use the term “defraud” in thr first sentence of the definition. lol New York says “fraud is anything meant to defraud.” lol
And if you're confused why the Martin Act and NY Executive Law are used together, read this also, retard. https://www.jonesday.com/en/insights/2019/08/new-yorks-martin-act-restored#:~:text=Section%2063(12)%20further%20bolsters,enforcement%20tools%20in%20the%20country.
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
63(12) does not have a scienter element. Scienter means intent.
Appellate courts rarely grant appeals on findings of fact, and the judge is the sole finder of fact in this case. Only errors in law are surefire grounds for appeal.
Quit throwing around terms you don’t understand. I merely repeated your statement in the last post and told you it was a textbook definition of fraud and fraud requires intent. And yes, the law does require intent because it repeatedly mentions fraud. Fraud is a legal term requiring more than mere misrepresentation or being wrong on a valuation.
As for a determination of fact, meh. Maybe it was. Maybe it wasn’t. Maybe the court incorrectly applied the law to make it’s determination of “fact”. For instance, he apparently relied upon a tax appraisal and took the lowest value it could possibly be. Did he consider other standards? Were they presented? Was error preserved? What standards have been applied in similar cases? What evidence of fraudulent intent was presented?
I've been an attorney in New York State since 1993. I know what the terms mean. Common law fraud requires intent to defraud others for the purposes of depriving them of a thing of value. The Martin Act does not require this to be found liable for fraud. There is no intent to defraud element. All that is required is the act/statement that tends to mislead or deceive. The statute specifically states that there need not be a finding of common law fraud to have a violation of the Act. That is the whole point of my original response which was that it was unfortunate for Trump to be sued under section 63(12).
If you don't understand the law in this case you can't say the things you are saying without sounding buffoonish. Trump's intent was irrelevant, and thus the ruling on summary judgment.
Who specifically was defrauded, how and for what dollar amount? What legal precedents exist to show how value must be calculated?
This thread seems to have brought out the majority of our resident misguided libs…… believe we are still missing Jeff Obama though, am sure he’ll be along to tell us how Trump is going down this time….
Trump had the misfortune of being sued under NY Executive Law section 63(12), a fraud statute under the Martin Act. This is the most powerful anti-fraud statute in the nation and came into existence to combat fraud on Wall Street.
Once he was sued under this statute it was clear he was going to lose. Why? The Martin Act does not require fraudulent intent; it does not require reliance by the defrauded party; and it does not require damages to the defrauded party. The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them. That's it.
The penalties are wicked as we learned yesterday. Trump has lost his ability to operate in New York State and his corporations and LLC's were ordered to be dissolved.
Unfortunately, there aren't any grounds for appeal. He will try, but he will lose. As I said, the fraud statutes in New York are wicked.
Plenty of grounds for appeal. It requires “knowingly”. To decide that on summary judgment when there are multiple standards valuing property and relying on the absolute lowest assessed value, of a property in another state entirely I might add, is abuse of discretion.
And by the way it most certainly DOES require fraudulent intent. Knowingly providing false information to someone to receive something of value IS FRAUD as defined in every single common law jurisdiction IN THE WORLD.
I have no fear of AI if it is as stupid as all the bots are who show up on this board.
63(12) does not have a scienter element. Scienter means intent.
Appellate courts rarely grant appeals on findings of fact, and the judge is the sole finder of fact in this case. Only errors in law are surefire grounds for appeal.
Quit throwing around terms you don’t understand. I merely repeated your statement in the last post and told you it was a textbook definition of fraud and fraud requires intent. And yes, the law does require intent because it repeatedly mentions fraud. Fraud is a legal term requiring more than mere misrepresentation or being wrong on a valuation.
As for a determination of fact, meh. Maybe it was. Maybe it wasn’t. Maybe the court incorrectly applied the law to make it’s determination of “fact”. For instance, he apparently relied upon a tax appraisal and took the lowest value it could possibly be. Did he consider other standards? Were they presented? Was error preserved? What standards have been applied in similar cases? What evidence of fraudulent intent was presented?
I've been an attorney in New York State since 1993. I know what the terms mean. Common law fraud requires intent to defraud others for the purposes of depriving them of a thing of value. The Martin Act does not require this to be found liable for fraud. There is no intent to defraud element. All that is required is the act/statement that tends to mislead or deceive. The statute specifically states that there need not be a finding of common law fraud to have a violation of the Act. That is the whole point of my original response which was that it was unfortunate for Trump to be sued under section 63(12).
If you don't understand the law in this case you can't say the things you are saying without sounding buffoonish. Trump's intent was irrelevant, and thus the ruling on summary judgment.
Now you’re just making schit up. It says no such thing. But, I’ll grant it does look like something an affirmative action New York attorney would write as that it says, “ The word "fraud" or "fraudulent" as used herein shall include any device, scheme or artifice to defraud and any deception,misrepresentation, concealment, suppression, false pretense, false promise or unconscionable contractual provisions.”
You’ve got some real brain surgeons up there. In the definition of “fraud” you use the term “defraud” in thr first sentence of the definition. lol New York says “fraud is anything meant to defraud.” lol
And if you're confused why the Martin Act and NY Executive Law are used together, read this also, retard. https://www.jonesday.com/en/insights/2019/08/new-yorks-martin-act-restored#:~:text=Section%2063(12)%20further%20bolsters,enforcement%20tools%20in%20the%20country.
So let’s see. First, you state that in your post, “The elements of the statute are met when a person or entity provides knowingly false or misleading information to another person or entity in order to receive something of value from them.” I remind you that your statement pretty much encompasses the textbook definition of common law fraud.
Then you state that the statute specifically states that common law fraud is not required and is broader. I show you that isn’t so.
So finally you show a short treatise on case law that has developed around the law. Okay, fair enough. But you never said case law. You said statute. So, I’m the retard?
I’ll also note that the case law seems to mostly deal with securities. Has it ever been applied to real estate valuations like this?
Do a couple furlongs and get back to me on that.
Oh, and from your own link here is this gem: “But, unlike common law fraud or federal antifraud statutes, it has been interpreted by the Attorney General and some New York courts to not require proof of intent or justifiable reliance.”
NEW YORK, Sept 27 (Reuters) - The New York judge who found Donald Trump liable for fraud on Wednesday stopped short of addressing whether his scathing decision would force the former U.S. president to sell his prized real estate.
Justice Arthur Engoron at a hearing on Wednesday was asked by Trump's lawyer Christopher Kise about what he intended a day earlier by ordering the cancellation of business certificates that let some of Trump's businesses operate.
Engoron's ruling could force Trump to give up control to a receiver of properties including Manhattan's Trump Tower, golf courses and his family estate in a Manhattan suburb.
Trump's businesses "own physical assets like Trump Tower, like 40 Wall Street. Is the court under the impression those assets are to be sold or are they just to be managed under the monitor?" Kise asked.
"I'm not prepared to issue a ruling right now," Engoron responded. ...
NEW YORK (AP) — Does a judge’s fraud finding spell the end of Donald Trump ’s real estate empire? The former president seems to think so. He decried Tuesday’s ruling, which shifts control of some of his companies to a court-appointed receiver, as the “KILL TRUMP” decision.
But the judge himself isn’t so sure, telling Trump’s lawyers at a hearing Wednesday that he isn’t ready to discuss what the ruling — which strips Trump’s entities of their New York-issued business licenses — will mean for his company and the marquee properties bearing his name.
Judge Arthur Engoron, who will preside over a non-jury trial next week on issues remaining in New York Attorney General Letitia James’ civil lawsuit against Trump, acknowledged that the “contours of the case (have) changed significantly,” but declined to elaborate on the real-world impacts of his fraud finding. ...
NEW YORK, Sept 27 (Reuters) - The New York judge who found Donald Trump liable for fraud on Wednesday stopped short of addressing whether his scathing decision would force the former U.S. president to sell his prized real estate.
Justice Arthur Engoron at a hearing on Wednesday was asked by Trump's lawyer Christopher Kise about what he intended a day earlier by ordering the cancellation of business certificates that let some of Trump's businesses operate.
Engoron's ruling could force Trump to give up control to a receiver of properties including Manhattan's Trump Tower, golf courses and his family estate in a Manhattan suburb.
Trump's businesses "own physical assets like Trump Tower, like 40 Wall Street. Is the court under the impression those assets are to be sold or are they just to be managed under the monitor?" Kise asked.
"I'm not prepared to issue a ruling right now," Engoron responded. ...
NEW YORK (AP) — Does a judge’s fraud finding spell the end of Donald Trump ’s real estate empire? The former president seems to think so. He decried Tuesday’s ruling, which shifts control of some of his companies to a court-appointed receiver, as the “KILL TRUMP” decision.
But the judge himself isn’t so sure, telling Trump’s lawyers at a hearing Wednesday that he isn’t ready to discuss what the ruling — which strips Trump’s entities of their New York-issued business licenses — will mean for his company and the marquee properties bearing his name.
Judge Arthur Engoron, who will preside over a non-jury trial next week on issues remaining in New York Attorney General Letitia James’ civil lawsuit against Trump, acknowledged that the “contours of the case (have) changed significantly,” but declined to elaborate on the real-world impacts of his fraud finding. ...
That translates to the judge is yanking stuff out of his ass and has no idea what he's doing.
Ol bone spurs got his azz handed to him in 2020 by the worst presidential candidate ever. If and a big IF ol spurs is the nominee in 24 he will lose bigly again.
Keep on believing that PedoJoe won without collusion from multiple jurisdictions & 3 letter agencies.
BTW-I missed the reason you changed your username, can you drop that tidbit again?
CalledScum / LostC.unt60 is scared schittless she’s going to lose all of her Free .Gov Handouts when Trump wins again in 2024.
She’s going to be hiding in the Section 8 Housing basement shaking like a Chihuahua schitting a peach seed like she did in 2020.
Nothing to wonder about, very seldom is someone sentenced at the same time as the verdict is stated. In this case, Tuesday's announcement was one of seven counts in the case but the most important count. The other counts will be in trial Monday at which time or soon thereafter more will be discussed about the penalties associated with Tuesday's guilty verdict on the first count of the case.
But in another case, trump got hammered in court again today... trumps lawyers putting lies down in writing in a motion for the judge to recuse herself. More (LOL), big time...
Nothing to wonder about, very seldom is someone sentenced at the same time as the verdict is stated. In this case, Tuesday's announcement was one of seven counts in the case but the most important count. The other counts will be in trial Monday at which time or soon thereafter more will be discussed about the penalties associated with Tuesday's guilty verdict on the first count of the case.
But in another case, trump got hammered in court again today... trumps lawyers putting lies down in writingin a motion for the judge to recuse herself. More (LOL), big time...
Phil
Provide link to where the above quoted underlined bold script states as verifiable fact...
OR, ...
is it merely just another one of your overblown TDS exaggerations ???
Nothing to wonder about, very seldom is someone sentenced at the same time as the verdict is stated. In this case, Tuesday's announcement was one of seven counts in the case but the most important count. The other counts will be in trial Monday at which time or soon thereafter more will be discussed about the penalties associated with Tuesday's guilty verdict on the first count of the case.
But in another case, trump got hammered in court again today... trumps lawyers putting lies down in writingi. More (LOL), big time...
Phil
Provide link to where the above quoted underlined bold script states as verifiable fact...
OR, ...
is it merely just another one of your overblown TDS exaggerations ???
Where's the formal verifiable factual link expressly stating your, "Trumps lawyers putting lies down in writing in a motion for the judge to recuse herself", though ???
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