All:

Last week, it was virus. Now, it’s our economy.

People all around me are losing their jobs. I feel that we are going to collapse, or at least go way down in my town. In the last 2 days, 11 people I know from five different employers are out of work.

Are things getting that bad by you?

RAS

By far the economy.

I guess it just depends on what kind of skill a guy's got. Plenty of folks will still be working, and making a good living, even in a bad economy. Skill can't stave off death though.

A bad economy isn't lethal.

My greatest worry might be the folks that don't believe in the Corona.

Geno

Both, hopefully they can get the test out............so people who have had it can go back to work.

My parents.

Things will go back to what they were.
Just a matter of time.
How much stress, stupidity.............can happen before then?

Looks like drugs and violence are ramping up in my burg
2 weeks and some folks are losing their control.

I doubt folks, even if they weather this mess without much $ damage, are going to be loose with their finances.
Proly take 6 months to recover to normal spending habits.

My biggest worry is my plan to retire in 3-6 years. I think my 401k will recover but am concerned this is a big enough set back, I won't be where I need to be.

There a WalMart in Helena?


They be hiring......

Im stocked up w food n stuff but have been hitting the drive throughs pretty hard, putting money into those channels.

The economy will come back fast as soon as we ditch the democrats. Maybe send them to china they like communism.

I’m more worried (right now) about the economy, the national debt increase, wasteful spending, misinformation, the precedent being set and about the loss of freedoms.

Like Jim I am also more worried about losing a parent to this invisible chit than losing money.

I haven't gone in a store or been around anyone other my wife or parents in the last 11 days.

Still working though of course. 60-70 hour weeks currently so there is no time to sit around and mope about my precious 401k....



I feel bad for the working class people who have no savings and currently no way to make income. They are in a hard place no doubt.



And if I were to catch this chit WTF would I do? No sick days or time off to be had, it would be a disaster work wise.


Barring massive inflation my wife and I could live for 12-16 months on savings. But we won't be upgrading a wore out feed pickup or 37 year old farm tractor either, proceeding with caution as the commodity market is our bread and butter. Hell back in early February this virus already gave us a hit on our yearly calf sale. And it was hard enough to make before, gonna be even tougher now.

Economy. Starting to hear some are running out of money here. PD is reporting more vehicle breakins.

In 5 or 6 years the economy (while damaged through debt) should recover. Think of this time as an opportunity to keep saving and investing for the inevitable growth.

Economy. Corona, while it exists and is taking lives, will eventually be under control. This BS happening now has just set our economy back 20 years at least.

I'm turning 60 in July and thinking about retiring in a year or so. Mine is the only pension in the household so am very concerned about that.

Freedom 75.

The virus is way worse, on a personal level.
When your loved one dies/you have lung function destroyed,
that's the whole sheban, for you.

Big picture as a country, if 100,000 people die? No big deal.
We have 330,000,000. Very few are important enough to have
losing them matter. The effects of this thing though...
The deaths might be a footnote, the effects of the economy,
along with the social effects, could last decades.

The hoarding and shortages were short lived, thank God.
My first fear was people running out of food.
Nothing, no-damned-thing, will turn a society upside down
faster than a man with a hungry family. Many here talk about
"Living off the land". Brag they would be fine. It doesn't work that way.
All those guns, all that ammo? Don't mean [bleep]!

People worry about 20% drop in a 401!
I worry about my country turning into the Balkans or Somalia.

I'm not worried about anything, everything is great.

Coronavirus is the immediate problem. KYHillChick and I are both at risk. My mom's 91 and stuck in a quarantined facility. We're in a major metropolitan area and there thinking about closing the bridges out of the state. My BOL may end up off-limits. However, Krogers is delivering to the house once a week, and we've got a freezers full of venison.

The economy? Yeah, it's a bad deal, but the infrastructure is still sound. We can bounce back rather quickly. I'm working for a company that manufactures a key part used in refrigeration and AC. I can hold off retiring and stay working.

What worries me is the next thing. I used to know an archeologist. She was an expert on Crete and the Minoans. Yes, Thera blew its top and screwed up everything in the eastern Med. However, the Minoans were already in decline. She was not sure what it was, possibly a plague or some other such thing. It turned a bad volcanic explosion into a catastrophe. Similarly, I'm not filled with existential dread over either of these current dilemmas. I'm worried about the kick in the teeth that might hit us while we're down.

The virus!!

The Socialists taking the Senate and the White House in November.

The economy.

Haha. Poverty will lead to death and great human suffering.

There is not, in my opinion a definitive answer to this. It depends on what the individual values more. A question I can't really answer at this point in time..

Nothing snarky here, but I'm curious as to what you mean by collapse.


But to answer the question, it's the economy and the long term value of our dollar that spooks me more than the virus.

My folks have been bunkered in for the past 2 1/2-3 weeks, they're doing well. It's my in-laws I worry about, they are still out doing their regular routine claiming they're "being careful".

A dine, nor a dollar, makes a dead man any richer. This is a no brainer !

I'm like nancy pelosi, all kicked back with drink in hand, sunglasses on.
"Crisis...What crisis?"

There were 2,800,000 deaths in America last year. Do you think that had an effect on those families? Of course it did and does, but there is no focus on the loss to those families as there is to CV-19.

Somehow in all this “sky is falling” pandemic, people have forgotten the fact that isolation can prevent infection, but the economy has no boundaries and the net negative effect harms and can destroy way more people and families than the virus will.

No, just the opposite. Out of about 300+ employees. on March 27th, Friday morning most were sent home to work remotely. Mostly engineers and various office workers. They are all upstairs. Downstairs we have SIX people left in the production area out of close to 100 people. All but 6 were laid off about 3 months ago. Last Monday they were all told to go home for 30 days, either use vacation time of take it without pay. All 6 stuck together and defied the company. All are STILL working. In the machine shop where I work the company put us on 50 hours. Actually, the engineers are putting out WAY more work from home that they did in house. Hardly NO traffic. I was taking me close to an hour each way to travel. Now it is 30/35 minutes. So far so good. Who knows what lies ahead. Don't get me wrong. I am 75 years old. No underlying conditions. NO medications. How long will I survive. WHO KNOWS.

Now for you people that live in large metropolitan areas, you are so F~cked, my neighbors are my friends, they will defend what is mine and I will defend what is theres, that Williams guy said it best " A country boy can survive" , for you city folks , Labor day is going to be a welcome sight !

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS.

Being self employed this is a tough one...without the virus the economy can/will come back, with the virus still a concern, the economy will spiral down as if we don't have confidence as a country we're in year's worth of trouble.
5-10 years from now I'm not sure what normal will look like. AT 53 I'm much more concerned about my 3 adult kid's futures than mine.
We can't simply print more money at throw it at our problems.

I agree that printing money is huge issue. Money printing is more of a power grab than a solution to the covid. Covid is an excuse to steal the future.

Not for me personally, but a LOT LOT LOT of people are really hurting... Ergo - the economy situation's paramount IMHO..

I don’t see how I can have a greater concern over either. However, one concern is personal and the other societal. I live in the hope (not wishful thinking hope) or the resurrection. I don’t want to leave terra firma any time soon. I have 15, 13 and 11 yo children at home still, two adult children and two young grand sons. However, I live with the realization that every day could be my last, Covid or no Covid. This is the fate for each of us. I believe that C S Lewis said it best when speaking about the potential for nuclear war.

If the economy breaks down we run many great risks. We are already seeing power grabs by politicians with the willful response of of the masses following them with little question. This seems to be happening at every level of our federal, state and local governments. Our culture and society has been harmed by social distancing. Fear of the unknown, a natural human response, has deliberately or inadvertently become a catalyst driving selfishness. We see this in the unfounded impulse of the masses to hoard. A lot could be said about the many societal responses that we are seeing.

It is undeniable that these months are filled with uncertainty. However, most of this uncertainty seems to be driven by fear rather than sound reasoning. It could be argued that we are acting in a penny wise pound foolish way. Destruction or crippling of the economy will impact an exponential number of people in comparison to the deaths occur because of this virus. We know this because of the number of people still alive compared to mortality rates in countries hardest hit.

What will we do the next time the sky begins to fall? Is this the new norm, self isolation and economic and social destabilization? My concern is that we will begin to willfully destroy ourselves out of fear of the always next unknown. At some point we just need to live our lives.

People will ask this question in hindsight for years to come, but right now I don't think any government beside china is willing to cull the population. Outside of the political power rape, I think the economy has to take a hit.
My wife is a RN, so I think we will get sick. Naturally death is an outcome, but so is being a cripple sucking on a machine for the rest of a miserable life. That is bleak. My 401K will come back, body maybe not. That is my view from my kitchen table.

the virus killing one of my kids or wife.
as for myself, i have lived a good and full life with many blessings and am prepared for it to end and will leave my family in good shape.
we can work our way out of an economic downturn given enough time.

I admire you for thinking the way you do. I just worry that when I am gone, and I AM prepared for that, there is not one single person that will be there to help my wife. For years there has been a literal line of people with hands out and she was there for them. It will NOT work the same when she needs help. THAT is my concern.

Economy !

+1

The economy

Things are going to come and go.. I worry about life and health..

Economy mostly.

The virus in and of itself - not so much.

The overreaction to it - yep. Which is directly impacting the economy.

Tough call. I am very concerned about my parents and in-laws as well as my daughter and wife who both deal with auto-immune issues. Get past that and the economy getting on track again is a big unknown. We personally are positioned pretty well but this is going to be a turning point for the country, just not sure what the new direction is going to look like. Lots to be concerned about in these times.

The economy, and the fear the MSM will succeed in getting a socialist elected.

The so called pandemic of CV-19 has got people running scared and hiding behind walls of toilet paper. Hitler killed 6,000,000 Jews during the Holocaust and America has killed more than that in the past decade due to abortions. If people really cared about saving lives why don’t they do something about abortion, it is a bigger killer than this predicted virus ever thought of being.

FWIW, the Governor of Utah just signed a bill outlawing elective abortion.

Short term the virus, it will pass soon enough, and I pray with as few deaths as possible.

Longer term, I think the economy will rebound fairly quick in general. I am concerned about my business. 99% of our work is on the oilfield and I see another down cycle of a couple years.

We sell construction materials, so my company is still open. We're pretty busy, but not as busy as we normally are this time of year. I'm always concerned about the economy. However, if the virus hits my company, we'll have to shut down. Not to mention the fact that I don't want anyone here, or their families, to get sick and possibly die. The economy will come back eventually, but it might take a while. We'll just have to tough it out. Been there, done that.

The economy is by far the more scary and dangerous. I think we should have toughed out the disease instead of the economy.

Economy for sure, but also the long term ramifications of this new “button” that powers-that-be can press to get us to ask with urgency “how high?” When they say “JUMP!”

Both of these issues, particularly given the media’s devotion to Leftist authoritarianism, are disturbing to me.

The disease will be cured. The economy and these social changes will haunt us for a long, long time.

The economy.

One hundred per cent in agreement. What EVER happened to the land of the free? Where are all these "patriots"?

I’m thinking the economy will recover much faster than 5-6 years, less than half that.

I worry about several things:

- Economy long term, how long can we keep shutting things down, laying off people, then expect it to magically come back on? Small businesses owners may have no choice but to close permanently, USA can't survive without the small businesses. So essentially the local economy over the national/world economy.

- Health for family. My dad is about to turn 80, in laws not far behind. I worry for them. Also now have a 1 week old grandson, I haven't met, would like to meet him before he's old enough to have a drink with!

- Politicians, how many BAD THINGS will they shove into any stimulus bills? they will use it to get the pet projects in that can't pass on their own.

- Future, I've never really worried about national debt, figure it's just a fact of life and we owe but others owe us, all a big money shuffle. Starting to wonder if this mess is going to actually have a real effect. If the world economy is down, where exactly would we borrow the money from?

Economy, without a doubt. The ramifications of giving the federal glutten even more power.

...and of course the political fallout come November could swing the country even further left.

Another worry is that we the people have allowed the government to further control our lives. Shut down businesses, churches, set curfews, and tell us we cannot leave our homes.

While this government control may be for a good reason this time, it is setting a terrible precedent nationwide. Already, I have seen it here after the hurricanes. But when we the people expect government to take care of every need so nobody is uncomfortable we get what we deserve.

We are a nation of wimps.

Thanks for input. Lots of interesting points. Some I haven’t thought about. Good thread.

For the individual that asked me about what I meant when I wrote ‘collapse’, let me explain.

I will set the table about my town of 12K. Middle class. Super low crime. Lots of sportsman. Schools close for opening day of deer season. My point is good people. The kind of people who pull over when you get a flat. Everyone waves at each other.

Now, there are 3 pretty big employers here that are doing well and historically have weathered the storms. But after seeing 6.6 million jobless claims come in today, who knows where this is going. That is a massive amount. Anyways, if those 3 employers were to close, my town would be devastated. Good people all around me would be in trouble. They don’t want a stimulus check, or unemployment. They want to go to work. A town like this just doesn’t come back like NYC.

Right now today, I don’t give a F about my 401K. I am thinking about my neighbor who has 4 girls all in K-12 school, with an ill wife. Always worked and carried himself honorably. And people just like him all across the country.

There HAS to be another way than just friggin closing the country. I care about my mother and in laws too. BUT, I also know they care about the future of their grandchildren too.

The central bank is reaping a fortune off of this situation. Maybe Trump will surprise them after this and say "sorry boys, but you aren't in charge of the money anymore and we can't pay".

Idiots that are panicking and making things worse.

Panic buying. Not staying home and spreading the Chinese flu.

No need to make it worse than it needs to be.

For every Citizen in America, the most existential enemy is government. At all levels. Government’s existence is antagonistic toward the Citizens.

For the folks on this site that know, I would like to hear their opinion. After this is over, where does all this contrived money go? Will money as we know it now be devalued by inflation? I have been believing the stock market run-up for the last 3 years was fueled by increases in the money supply and not a real increase in value. Are consumer goods next for a run-up in order to absorb the money?

By far I'm more worried about the economy. This virus will pretty much be a memory in a year. But the 2,000,000,000,000 is forever. And they're talking that this is just the beginning of emergency spending.

I'm saddened by all the people dying, and would prefer that no one close to me dies from the virus, or anything else. But most of the people dying from this are at the end of their natural lifespan. The people who will be paying interest on this debt haven't even been born yet.

I'm also concerned about the people who think the economy will just bounce back, like it did in ww2. Then, the US held vast reserves of gold, and became the world reserve currency. Almost the entire world had their manufacturing capacity destroyed, and had to turn to the US for everything. Very few people were dependant on the govt for a living, and the work ethic was much greater. Govt regulations were a much smaller part of every day life.

All of that has changed since then. Our economy is basically a house of cards. But it's a big house, and won't topple easily. But the foundation is constantly being under mined. Trump was doing a good job of shoring it up, but this virus has set back a lot of what he has accomplished, and it only will take one Democrat victory to destroy it.

Money is much like a glass of wine, if you dilute what is in the glass, you devalue the contents.

If most people have not figured out that the stock market is just another ploy for the wealthy to take your money you should ride the short bus..yes some normal people make some money in the market for a short period of time but then the big boys do there thing and it all goes to hell again. Do you really believe only a couple senators sold with inside information? Ed k

So living on the gulf coast most of my life we deal with tornadoes, hurricanes, floods, drought... businesses and jobs come and go. A good hurricane can wipe out an area for 6 months to a year or more.
Guess what? It always comes back. Sure the local mom and pop grocery store may go by a different name. Burger joint to. And so on.

But the sky is not falling. Not yet anyway as we know about hindsight and even I can be wrong from time to time though my wife says I'm perfect... LMAO.

Anyway its like a pothole in a road. Or maybe a flood that washes a bridge out... it will come back. Just a matter of time. And people will not sit idle on their azz waiting on handouts. Wait, maybe they will, but I think most will make the most of it. I mean if in the end this year all my work in Alaska equals none, I may be looking to Walmart to stock shelves when I come back in the winter. You know it doesn't matter what we do. We must do.

That said to answer your question.

The economy bothers me more since if I get the 19, I'll survive it and carry on. Or I'll die and won't have to worry about 19. Pretty dang simple really.

Now if death bothers you, then you have a big issue and are likely depressed with nothing to do and not doing a thing. I get that.

Of course we have faith that once we die a better place awaits. And in that faith, none of this bothers me much. I'd be outright lying if I said nothing bothers me at all. I mean I worry about the bear charging a client or a moose. What if I miss... I worry about what if the fish don't bite... actually I worry more about the boats and the river and hitting an unseen rock, loosing engine power at the worst time, having a client have a serious medical emergency in the bush even though I'm a trained EMT. What about me dying or passing out while driving clients.. But really all that is small stuff, I think about it, try to plan for it, just like planning for this.
Nope we are not what I call preppers. But from what I read we may be closer to than further away. Pretty sure unless the power goes out we can live 6 months pretty easy, if not a year. If the power goes out I am a bit short on salt this is true, to cure what food we have frozen. BUT that will be solved today as I'm going by the feed store to get an 80 pound bag of feed salt... just in case...

Anyway, long as I'm alive, tommorrow is another day the Lord has made and if he lets me through this one and gives me the next one I'll be back up doing something around the house or farm even if I'm not getting paid. And I have a few small jobs coming up that will pay me a bit so its all good.

Now, to what I do worry about the most.

Liberals. Democrats. Socialists. Communists. RUINING. THIS. COUNTRY. They are working hard at it and getting close. Time to load a few more rounds of ammo.

They say that 70% of U.S. citizens don't have even $400 cash on hand for an immediate need or emergency. Most people here live as 3rd world slaves and depend on their Master for help. They wouldn't know a depression from a market boom.

I feel bad for the people retiring next year. Their 401k sucks now. I have over 15 yrs. to go but it'll happen again.

As far as the virus goes, I don't know. They know too little. Is it seasonal? Will it come back every year?

That's my big question.

Me too. This sucks. This sucks for the economy, shutting schit down isn’t free and that’s a big deal. Gotta work to eat. This has been lousy and it looks like it’s gonna get lousier. But if you ask me would I rather sacrifice the economy for awhile or my dad? Well, hell, maybe I’ll stay away from people and give up some stuff while my wife is out of work for my mom and dad and grandma.

Hell maybe even my brother or sister. It was a younger crop we admitted yesterday. The more people that get this is more throws of the dice and it’s easy to think it’s just stupid political nonsense until it’s your family’s turn to roll

Great point about hurricanes rost, I hadn't ever looked at it like that.

Covid 19...[bleep] the economy. Lives are most important...an economy can be rebuilt.

I was taught-----"If you have your health, you have everything. If you don't have you health, you have nothing." It's in Matthew16:26-----"What does an man gain...…………."

Talking to people - none of them blames Trump for any of this. They have their issue with him but they also don't blame any of this on him and are generally ok with how it's being handled.

Most heartburn is basically around local leadership. Governors and city admins.

For me and my family its covid. I'm at very high risk so it concerns us.

Economy will rebound. Yes some folks will be hurt and that's bad but it will come back. I know I've been broke before and pulled myself out of it, I'll do it again if need be.

The economy.

The economy. It might take years to fully come back, virus will be over in a couple of months.

False dichotomy; economic downturn is going to cost lives. In this case it isn’t far outside the realm of possibility it’ll cost more lives than the disease.

Gotta look big picture and not just at the media hype.

The economy and how quickly so many bought the panic and immediately turned their entire lives and futures over to the government. I will laugh at all future SHTF threads.

I think Trump knows best how to handle this and as he has said, the economy will soon come roaring back.

You fail to distinguish between the previous administration and the new one.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/gene...efend-our-country-regardless-of-the-cost

Fear-mongering tyranny and loss of freedom

Well, you're supposed to be happy to give it all up in the hope of adding 8-10 months to the life of the overweight chain-smoker who is already dying of diabetes and COPD. His poor choices are much more valuable than your hard work and good choices. It's easy for others to make that choice for you.


I failed to indicate any administration at all, since that is not what I was talking about.

Of immediate concern is the virus and it's potential to harm our families and friends. Of slightly less concern is it's potential to harm me. Although I'm of advanced middle age (70), I don't feel all that vulnerable. In addition, we are pretty isolated. We have family members though, who are vulnerable. We may not see our parents (in their 90's) again. Other family members with health issues are definitely at risk. Too many of the guys I shoot with are at risk.
Going forward, the economy has to be of great concern. Devaluation of monies is certainly possible. This means our cash in the safe, our savings, our pensions may all be devalued. In addition, a significant source of our income is a small business which depends on disposable income and I suspect we will take a hit of at least 50% this year and can't guess what might happen next year. We won't get this back. It will be a while before real estate values get back to where they were. GD

This shutdown nonsense will end far more lives than the virus. People will turn to drugs--and suicide--in despair. Depression will grow. Many jobs will never come back. Those who dreamed of starting a small business will have their dreams shattered.

They're already talking about nationalizing the airlines and Boeing. The alternative is the airlines and Boeing will go out of business. This crap will wreck our country.

You are going to see massive default on all forms of debt. The banks may not be able to survive the hit.

There were 6.6 million new unemployment filings last week. The previous record, the week before that, was 3.3 million. Since 1967, there were never more than 600,000. They are wrecking our country and our people because of some disease that "might" be as serious as the 1957-58 or the 1968 flu, both of which killed 100,000 people. Nobody knows.

The shutdown panic makes as much sense as abolishing automobile driving. After all, traffic accidents claim 40,000 lives each year.

So stop it!

Reality.

Economy.

The problem I have with the decisions being made now are that there is no checks or balances, you basically have one person or one school of thought. I don't think anyone had seriously considered the long term implications of a prolonged economic retraction when the decisions to shut the economy down were made. We are basically being drove off a cliff and the driver is there to ensure us that, trust me, this is the only way.

^^This^^

If you were asked to define life, would you define it as life = work, or life = income, or life = ‘any’ material thing...?

Very well said!

Actually it is. The 2007-2009 recession caused 5,000 more suicides than would otherwise have occurred.

I admit that destroying our economy will save "some" lives.

And outlawing motor vehicles will save "some" lives.

And outlawing guns will save "some" lives.

Where do you stop?

The immediate concern is an out of control virus. Wife is on oral chemo at 47 and I had some previous lung issues. We still have kids at home. We need to be around for a while longer. I'm thinking 90 days - July 1 and this thing will be under control. There will still be social distancing and masks being worn everywhere much like just about every Asian in every airport you've seen since H1N1 hit. We have the smartest people in the world working around the clock to get a handle on this thing. I think you'll see treatment therapies in 60 days or less and a vaccine by time the leaves start turning.

The economy is solid in the short term. There's a lag before it actually hits the fan. America has been here before. We WILL bounce back. The market peaked on 12FEB. Bear markets usually last 206 days. However, we have DJT driving the ship now. NO other President has been so uniquely prepared to handle this sort of economic crisis. I think you'll see critical manufacturing return to our shores. I believe there will be a swing from Globalism to Nationalism. I believe this will carry him through the election. Churchill wasn't the smoothest PM the UK ever had, but he wasn't a pussy like his predecessor. The parallels here are strong. I've said it before, I think this will be DJT's finest moment. He ain't no pussy either.

My concern with the virus has dropped. I believe that we will have about 60,000 deaths this year to the Covid 19 pandemic. This is from my earlier estimate of more than 250,000. I believe that Trump will cut through red tape and get chit done. I believe that after NY and the various chit hole cities have it it will decline. I have noticed a great change in people's behavior in the last week. People are getting serious and I think that we will soon have herd immunity with enough ventilators to help nearly everybody. I believe that the economy will bounce back quickly. Trump needs to make sure that people understand that our nation's fundamentals are strong and that we have a global energy glut that we need to capitalize on. We need to use some of this money falling from the sky to build new manufacturing facilities and the government needs to re-train those in sectors that are falling apart.

Trump needs to come out with ( We won't tolerate CCP crap anymore). We are going to form a trade alliance with nations screwed over by CCP and we are going to get better. He can tighten monetary policy later on but he needs to smile to the public and say Xi needs to be gone, WHO needs to be restructured and he is going on a victory tour.

The economy, by an order of magnitude.

Consequences of Economic Self-Sabotage and Poor Leadership
1. Economic Destruction
2. Anarcho-Tyranny
3. Profound Social Unrest

Despite:
1. Wife's profession placing her and the family at greatly elevated risk of exposure.
2. Parents all aged and with some issue that would put them under if they got a nasty upper respiratory infection.


Economic Destruction
Thing is, "the economy" is not just retirement accounts and slimy hedge fund managers. The scum in the financial sector will be made whole. That is what the stimulus package was all about: prioritizing Wall Street over Main Street. That is what tthe Federal Reserve and Treasure Dept take as their #1 mission.

"The Economy" is real men & women working, producing things, and making things happen in our world. People who work real jobs rely on exchanging their productivity for pay. Our ruling class has just decided to torpedo that and expects all the real people who work to do the damage control while they and their financial sector buddies on the sun deck sip fancy cocktails and bang waitresses in their cabins. Hanging's too good for them.

When "the economy" tanks, decent, productive people take it in the face. The ruling class, their financial sector paymasters, and the worthless sponges will hardly feel a bump. Real people, MY people will suffer. And more of them will die in the ensuing recession/depression that will die directly(1) from the Kung Flu. Many more will suffer needlessly because our ruling class is filled with corrupt fools from front to back.


Anarcho-Tyranny
"...a definition of the system of government I have called "anarcho-tyranny": a combination of anarchy (in which legitimate government functions—like spying on the bad guys or punishing real criminals—are not performed) and tyranny (in which government performs illegitimate functions—like spying on the good guys or criminalizing innocent conduct like gun ownership and political dissent)."
----Sam Francis
https://vdare.com/articles/mass-immigration-feckless-feds-anarcho-tyranny

We yipyap on this site about staying in and avoiding contact due to unconstitutional orders by governors & others. Other gov't pooh-bahs are enacting even more tyrannical rules. Some of the ruling class's enforcement goons (LEOs) are even enforcing them...against MY sort of people. Meanwhile, the swarthy sorts go about having block parties, hanging out in the street in close proximity, etc. They are generally less hygenic than my sorts and are better disease vectors. Yet, LEOs are not stopping it.

And if we think gov't will give up its "emergency" powers, you are mistaken.

Profound Social Unrest
Our ruling class is not capable of dealing with existential threats anymore. And they are not smart enough or moral enough to discern between an existential threat to our society or nation and an existential threat to the ruling class. The combination of ruling class incapability, incompetence, and immorality are an almost sure recipe for social unrest.

Our ruling class (and now Trump, too) have screwed this pooch so hard that they have nearly set up the conditions for a civilizational upheaval.
1. Media hyped Kung Flu to meme it into a weapon against Trump, despite it being of similar threat manitude to SARS, MERS, or Swine flu.
2. Trump political enemies piled on
3. Attention and fund-seeking medical/political types like the liar Fauci turn up the heat.
4. Trump bends to the will of his weak-spined advisers and now owns the economic torpedoing.

Trump has placed his bet and now owns the Kung Flu issue and its later fallout. He is doing well in the moment, but I recall GHWB with 90%+ approval ratings during Gulf War I and then losing to a slick weasel from Arkansas.

Thing is, severe economic pain makes a lot of people who have nothing to lose, many of who are generally capable and employable (unlike welfare sponges). They now are hurting and have time on their hands and are looking for someone to blame. They may blame Trump. They may blame the ruling class. The amplitude and direction of the unrest is not knowable. Folks on the left think the disaffected will drift to the fringe left. Folks on the right think the disaffected will drift to the fringe right. I suspect that our ruling class will not have what it takes to keep the USA together.





(1) The folks who die despite having no co-morbidity.

I think we should also include on the economy side of the ledger all the consequences of the other decisions being made to "flatten the curve". Some localities are releasing inmates to slow down the spread. At the same time, the cities are announcing that they will no longer be enforcing minor violations like theft and such. How long before people start protecting their goods with violence? And when that happens, who will the police arrest?

Now you have a bunch of criminals free to act without govt intervention, citizens desperate enough to shoot people over property, and then those desperate people being saddled with more debt to hire a lawyer.

Once this is sorted out a bit, I wonder if rural real estate prices will spike, as people with the ability to do so get out of urban areas. This has already been happening, but may really accelerate.

For me personally? Quality. Sitting in a wet diaper with no visitors is not appealing to me in the least. That is why I choose not to smoke, drink excessively, participate in exceedingly dangerous activities - especially when I had kids at home who needed me. I try to stay fit (not as much as I would like), eat well, etc. Does that make me think that I am better than anyone else? No. I just tried (and often failed) to make decisions that made sense for me and my family. I see those decisions being duplicated by my kids, just as bad decisions seem to be passed down.
Those who have spent a lifetime doing the opposite have already made their choices many times over the years. Choices have consequences. If I chose to smoke for 40 years, I chose COPD and cancer and the fun that goes with it. Some people get hosed, no doubt about that. But overall, we choose our outcome, to a large degree. I guess that makes me pro-choice.

Does that mean that I don't have empathy for those who chose differently? Absolutely not. I have family members, whom I loved dearly, who are no longer with us because of the habits that I laid out above and more. I can't control that. And honestly? I wouldn't want to. Others either didn't engage in self destruction or stopped many years ago, They are still here, for the most part.

Implying (if you were) that being concerned about business and career is selfish or materialistic, I would argue that it isn't. It's how we feed our families. Choosing to build a business that will impact my family for years to come, or a career that can give them more options for how they live their lives, seems to be good thinking. Poverty offers much fewer options and forces many to make choices that are far from ideal. Had I chosen an easier path that gave me more time and less effort, my family would have fewer options. That would have been selfish and focused solely on my comfort. Choosing to use the power of government to dictate what others are forced to do with respect to the fruits of their labor is much more selfish, in my opinion. Using the power of government to confiscate the fruits of others in the hope that you will be thrown a scrap, is about as materialistic and selfish that one can be. Just my opinion. I would argue that some of the panic can be chalked up to schadenfreude and the excitement that it generates. Again, just my opinion.

It seems to me that a more sensible approach would have been for those who are at risk to shelter and protect themselves or be protected. If I were deathly allergic to shellfish, I wouldn't eat shellfish. That doesn't preclude you from chowing down on shrimp.

I sincerely hope that this runs its course with the fewest lives lost as possible and hope that we have fewer casualties, both lives and livelihoods, than have been guesstimated. - Be safe

Economy!!!! memtb

Collapse of the Economy, hands down, is the big issue.

The nation can survive with a fewer people, but it sure can't without a viable economy.

Poverty has killed infinitely more people than this virus ever will.

Good post

Let's revisit this in November.

How healthy will the economy be?

How many deaths and weakened people will there be?

At what levels will the financial markets be?

Where will real estate markets be?

Will there be a vaccine readily available?

If you/we don't live, it doesn't matter about the economy !

^^This too.^^

So you survive the virus but have no money. Show here that is better.

I would not worry about things I can't control. I have faith in the American People, I think they can hold out for about three months.

If you/we survive, the markets will eventually bounce back, just like they always have.

If you've got nothing to show for yourself, that's hardly anyone else's problem

Get your head outta the sand !

If you prefer death to having no money, that your prerogative.

Kinda beat me to it - & you definitely said it in a nicer way.

Rather be dead than broke.............yowsa!

You can be quite happy and be broke. Look to me for your paradigm of hope.

I'm with you Brother !

You have never been broke or hungry. If you want to see total anarchy, take the money away from people and watch what happens. You are also assuming the worst conditions of the virus. You seem to believe that there will be millions of people will die from this. That isn't going to happen. Millions of people will be affected by the downturn in economics, and that has already happened. Meanwhile you people seem to hope for the worst in the virus and ignore what is already happened in people's lives without jobs and much of a future.

As I said before, I think the economy will come roaring back. Unemployment will fall drastically, new industries will spring up as a response to this thing as well as more coming back onshore. The lone caveat is that it will take a leader that understands business to see this through. We cannot endure more "stimulus". If the White House turns blue in November, our economy, ergo our country, is well and truly fuucked. Elections matter now more than ever.

and that's a fact jack

The Democrats!!

I think we will be better in the long run, but it’s going to hurt getting there.

And if I kind of know you from around the fire, I"m willing to be common sense is in full swing. High risk folks generally have months of supplies on hand, 6 months typically. They know when its time to close the front and back door and just hibernate so to speak. And they have the ability to disinfect what they might need to get like mail possibly. Or packages. And they have the sheet plastic and tape and such to really seal off if they had to.

So you will survive this. I'd be willing to bet on it.

And if you don't, your day was that day, not sooner, not later. Kinda gruff I guess but we will all have our day.

November? Nah, when a major hurricane hits the coast you look at things a year later to see if its heading back to normal. I'm willing to bet November will be positive but no where near where we will be in a year out from this.

BUT the only way to know is let er rip. And there is no way to stop it anyway.

Think of it as the Spanish Flu and the Great Depression rolled into one.

False argument and just plain stupid... hint it's not an either or

I'll survive the virus and my family will survive the economic impact. I dont live paycheck to paycheck. I'm still working. better than most around here.

I posted on my own beliefs, as a community I would say economy.

For all you people that thinks the sky is falling go into deep quarantine... stay there until it's over.... let free brave men be free instead being forced to cower to the propaganda gods feeding you horseschit.

If you have a paradigm, you's not broke.

Ha!

Twenty cents won't get you very far even with oil at $25/bbl.

I am very worried about BOTH!

Dillobuck I think you have a good grasp of what is and what could happen.
Cheers NC

The future of the virus is unkown, they have been feeding us BS statistics in order to implement an agenda. As all pandemics humans will survive!
Keeping the economy shut down is a known outcome.... looters and rioters when the people get hungry. Marshall law kiss your guns good bye. Kiss your source of income good bye, get in the government bread line.
I don't care to go with you

The left has told everyone " let no crisis go to waste" if we could collapse the economy to get rid of Trump we will.... HELLO

I don’t think the sky is falling ... but I’m also acutely aware of the reality of the present situation - medically and economically.

I think most people are hysterical over this.

All you have to do is get an IV infusion of 20-30grams of vitamin C and you'll be over it in a week or less.

CV -19 first and foremost. The economy won't do us any good if we are dead.

The leftist have said nationalize the airline industry, then the hospitals, when the food supply chain breaks down nationalize that. When the natives get restless and the looting and killing starts, give up your guns.. it's a national emergency. The list goes on and on.... they have found the perfect tool to get everyone to go along willingly and so you are.....

Because of fear

Another fool, you do realize it's doesn't have to be one or the other?

So it's never coming back then because you ain't going to ditch the Democrats. That's the largest political party in the US.

Yeah I have underlying health issues so I'm more worried about Covid.

My biggest worry is that people will forget what is most important in life when things return to normal. Spending piles of money on entertainment and eating is restaurants is gone right now. Spending time with the ones in your house is more important then what some star or celebrity is doing. Money and economy concerns are less important when we are all in the same boat. I am staying away from people , not for my sake , but for the sake of my wife that has janky lungs. With the Russians and Saudis trying to out do each other and the world wide economy faltering why worry about little things. I spent my retirement by taking life easier and now have minimal bills. I may have to work til I die , but I can mix in a lot of fun stuff til then.........

At this point, Coronavirus deniers are falling into the same category as the flat earth society.

Ok Bristoe..... I am kinda surprised you have joined the sky is falling crowd, didn't take you for being an overweight COPD, diabetic train wreck?

Explain this


https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/20...pitalized-yesterday-actual-number-31142/

11 coronavirus deaths in Kentucky today. Several coronavirus patients at the hospital where my wife works.

I don't need to read anything. I know what the situation is for me and mine.

Again for all of you that are afraid .. quarantine yourself, if you don't have the means have friends and family help. Keep your head down until it's over.... don't worry the S.S. checks will still arrive.
Let the young healthy and strong go to work so they can support their families and our country.... and you in a round about way.

Key words Bristoe ... me and mine.... I am talking about the bigger picture ... our country , our freedom, the future generations

The question that the OP asked was clearly one “or” the other.

How can this be a serious question?

missing possibly 2 months of work, while collecting UC,

or death......

YGTFKM..........

Shortly this will pass, And America is going to party like Rock Stars.

The economy will sag under the huge demand of services and materials that will be needed to catch up.....

The glass may be half empty, but you just watch us fill that mutherfucker up again........

^^This.^^

Yup

Collecting UC sure sounds nice for a 9-5’er. What about the people that don’t get a check?

Yep... what about the small business owner? I read dairies are pouring out milk... next they have to slaughter the dairy cows.... killing your money maker, hard to bounce back.
Thousands of unintended consequences......

followed by......





Now we're slaughtering the cows?

I think you just like hearing yourself talk.

Umm, you aren't so good at connecting dots are you? Let me help you, if you allow people to go to work, kids go to school , they will buy milk, therefore the dairy farmer won't be in a tenuous position of having to feed a cow that produces no value, a net loss.
I am no dairy farmer but my understanding is you have to milk them everyday? so therefore Mr. dairy farmer has to make a decision.
Kill cow, sell meat or go broke.
Once the cow is killed even if the economy comes back you have no more cows.
You are a stupid fuug aren't you? and people like you think your opinion matters?

So when do you guys think the unemployment numbers will be back to pre virus %

If the letf wins this war ... never

If you can't sell food right now, you must suckity suck at selling food. Go to the grocery store and see how many non-dairy alternatives there are. The writing has been on the wall for the dairy folks for a few years now.

Bean farmers in the south are tilling into the ground millions of pounds of beans..... the supply chain is broken....

At this point, it's apparent that, with a few exceptions, those that consider themselves in the higher risk category, or those with relatives or close friends in that category, are going to fall for the hysteria, no matter how inane it gets.

And they don't want to hear or read any input to the contrary.

They "believe" that 21 million chinese died because 21 mm telephone numbers aren't in use.

But, they "don't believe anything coming out of china".

Response to a personal threat causes different reactions.

Those that aren't threatened, or DGAS if they are, are reacting differently, so there doesn't appear to be a way to reconcile the issue.

Especially when there are essentially no facts available.

How many patients have you seen in CVICU on ECMO from influenza with their face swollen twice normal and their eyelids so edematous they are inside out? So hypoxic they die without being on life support. No amount of vitamin C will cure that. This virus ain't your average flu.

And you have been thoroughly vilified here at the fire.... this makes perfect sense... hmmmmm

Again, the OP clearly asked an either “or” question. Seen right off by HitnRun, New_2_99s, myself, and every other poster here, except you.

Now we're going to run out of cows,,,ok dokie....

And I'm the stupid fug.........

When we start killing cows, feel free to bump this thread up,

when we run out of cows, Call me, I'll figure something out....

Wow, You went from bowing down to the propaganda gods to no cows,

And thanks for the business 101 education, I was always a bit confused on that till just now.

Like I said, you just like hearing yourself talk.

What is a greater worry to you? CV-19 or Economy?
Cv-19 is my main concern. Because it, or more precisely the temporary measures to contain it, being forced upon society will do great damage to the economy.
The duration of the containment efforts does not matter, if transmission rates return to normal when they end, and mortality rates have not improved. This is simply because as long as a large majority of the population remains uninfected, lifting containment measures will lead to an epidemic almost as large as would happen without having mitigations in place at all. Basically the virus needs to 'wash over' the populace. Then antigens will be formed in most. By implementing social distancing and self-quarantine they are not allowing this to happen. When you lift these measures you are going to see a natural spike in infections again and the same amount of people that will die will equal the the number of people that would have died with no mitigations in place. The one thing the mitigations does is buy you some time to possibly upgrade the hospital capabilities.
These mitigations themselves are not saving lives ; instead, it is what we do with the time that gives us an opportunity to improve the outcome of the epidemic.

I am sure you are comfy with your government check......

Typical conversation on the campfire,

Would "you" prefer, to forfeit a couple of paychecks, or forfeit life?

Ken: couple of paychecks.....I'm a Plumber.

Ifubar: Dairy farmers will run out of cows.....

Cool. Then stay out of the grocery stores. Don't need you contaminating the old folks food, that has to get to them somehow.

The total disregard for the others in the world baffles me.

Did you stop taking the Zantac?

If it was as simple as a couple paychecks this would be no big deal. Forfeit your life savings and a business you have spent your life building are two very different things.
Now go do what your boss tells you and pray he can make payroll

You’re right a one thing, you’re no dairy farmer.

I think the dairy man has been producing at a loss for some time now.

Did you miss the part where I said get friends and family to help? Hell I would support tax dollars helping these vulnerable people quarantine if they have no help.
Oh and dumbass, I use use online shopping and pick up at the grocery store , I don't even go in..... in the interest of the collective..... I am sheltering in place.
Left home twice in three weeks... you?

Educate me

I don’t know why you had to lump the literate in with the old and frail.

Also dumbass I advocated a couple of weeks ago that seniors should have a senior only shopping hour... in the morning... with a fully stocked and disinfected store... your solution?

Greater concern to me are Mosquito borne illness.

I washed it down with a Jim Beam and a healthy dose of I don't give a fuuck anymore.....

It sounds like you need to go get a [bleep] or have a wank.


This is not a joke.

irFubarski

Well, for starters,

Cows have the ability to make more cows,

Just a little lost on your business model of "no more cows".

I can also explain how cows are made if you need help in that area.

I would GUESS mature dairy cow has more value producing milk than makin meat... a net loss.... many small business work on a pretty tight margin. I did stick my neck out and use an example I have zero experience with, the story was in the headlines. My small business expertise resides elsewhere. The same principles apply .
And you Kenneth? can your boss still make payroll?

Us fubars have to stick together when the heathens attack......
Damn that guy is a lightening rod......

Payroll?

They haven't told me to stop coming in yet...

Regarding Farmers, I'd imagine they've seen losses a time or two before......

Ain't their first rodeo.

The economy is my biggest concern, people die every day. If your out of shape (fat) your at a higher risk than a healthy old person. We can do a lot to ensure our health and safety, but there's nothing I can do to pay the bills till the restaurant's open.

Damn right they have a hard job and the fuugin politicians have no right making it harder....

Thank a good business man that your check still cashes

I'm retired.

The good news here is,...as mentioned,...this house has job security because my wife is a hospital nurse.

The bad news is,..job security might kill both of us.

I got little sympathy for coronavirus deniers.

If y'all need a job,..apply at your local hospital. People there are quitting en masse.

,...when we got married, I didn't realize that the "'till death do us part" stuff was going to entail a pandemic.

But here we sit.

It's part of the deal, I guess.

Nobody is a corona denier. We reject the panic the MSM has created... get a grip man... highly unlikely you will die. Now you may get run over by a semi on the way to the liquor store......

Only thing that worries me about Covid-19 is the fear of losing my parents and other older people I love. The economy will come back.

Anything can happen.

But, sooner or later, ya gotta come outta your house.

Can the rest of the country quit ignoring the Constitution when you do?

And when you come out, guess what's gonna be waitin?

Mr. Covid.

Or are you gonna wait inside until a vaccine is developed?

They're still workin on the one for SARS, from 2002.

At great risk of losing credibility I agree with this^^^^^

Flame away ...... woohoo

While I'm nervous as heck about my Dad, who's a lung-cancerous 85 year old staggering train wreck, my biggest concern by far is how badly this might wreck the economy. That said, my attitude might change depending on the actual fatality rate in this first wave. But right now, the cure is looking way more dangerous than the disease.

Economy

Freedom is a job at your local hospital.

Shut up and go get one.

Seems like they go hand in hand. So I’m worried about both.
I think people wouldn’t care about staying home if they new the banks wouldn’t be expecting theirs at the end of the month.
I’m not looking for a freebie and I think most hard working people are the same. Or at least I think.
Just extend my mortgage, or rent or what ever contracts for the month or two where we can’t work.

Actually,...there's plenty of freedom out there these days.

No traffic,...very few people out and about,...the cops are afraid to mess with anybody.

The world is wide open!

Freedom these days will result in a horrible death, of course. But it's there for the taking!

Go get it.

Yes, freedom.

Like havin a backyard barbecue.

Or a funeral for a loved one.

Or baseball.

Or a beer, in a bar.

Or a church service.

Baptism for a newly born baby.

Or just goin outside, in some places.

Thanks for alla the freedom you've graciously bestowed upon the US.

Yeah a .1% percent chance of dying.... best hide.... jeeesus..... I bought a dirt bike at 45 yrs old and rode like a possessed mad man , I imagine my odds were way more.

Oh and Bristoe don't drink before you mosey down to the super mart for your frozen lasagna... ups the odds dontcha know.... best hide

I wouldn’t say worried, but concerned certainly. About the virus, yes, and it’s here forever now, or it’s mutants. We need drug treatments that work and a vaccine. I think we will see that relatively soon.

Over the longer haul, the economy concerns me more, and tied to that is the $2 million millions bill the Dems hijacked. I’m very concerned about the idea of maintaining a form of the economy by going horrendously into debt, even more debt. But they might do this bill thing again and the Dem’s will be looking to load it up with “green” stuff again.

Which leads me to the third thing — the Dem’s, who are bound like a bulldog clamped down on the neck of a republic, of capitalism to cripple it. They have no answers other than wrong ones and they are in the main, evil. Trump will be hounded until November and then another four years (I hope he has another four).

The fourth thing, again, is the Dem’s and what evil they’ll bring down upon us, our children and grandchildren.

Are you posting from home?

Is anybody forcing you not to go out and find a crowd to mingle with?

,....I didn't think so.

My wife was a RN, she has seen SARS,MERS, Aids , H1N1, ebola, she is still alive and so am I.... man up Bristoe

I don't believe you.

Don't believe that I am alive? hahahaha

She had a 30 yr career, was a nursing manager at a major S.F. bay area clinic in charge of a staff of 30 + plus nurses. also worked in several hospitals.
Don't know how to prove it to you and am not sure if I could that it would be prudent on the WWW

Also Bristoe, I may sling some schit here in fun... but if you can prove where I have talked out my ass on serious issues I am all ears

You need a pill. Figure out which one,..then eat it.

Diana has risk factors as do I. We decided to act accordingly but not allow it to imprison us. If and when we get it we live or die, Gods hand. Not tempting Him but refusing to live in fear by his grace.

I more worry about the economy. Shelter those who need shelter, help the sick, but get on with life.

I can live comfortably in a crashed economy. Odds are well in my favor I’d survive a Covid infection just fine.

Still, I’d like the threat of each gone and one has a much higher risk of death.

Fear knocked at the door.

Faith answered.

No one was there.

I tried a blue on once... it worked great....

Do I detect a bit of anger? you need to chill, you were much more fun when you weren't so up tite.......

I think there's a way ta get Bristoe outside.

Post up a fake link that says President Trump's invadin some foreign country.

He'll run screamin into the night.

It's for his own good.

The only thing he’s said in 5 days that I also agree with...The VID is here to stay, and eventually we all will be exposed to it.

I’d just prefer that my hospital has calmed the fûck down and has a ventilator with my name on it when I catch it.

Figure I’m helping my odds at the ventilator roulette table by staying away from the masses for another 30 days.

Brother, is Jim Bean is all that’s left in the bunker, and how much blow is there? I may need to make a Hail Mary run into the city for supplies.

😎

Brother Beav, the campfire has me a little stressed, so the Beam & blow is going at an accelerated rate..... you may have to brave the "covid" for more provisions.... Bristoe volunteered to ride shotgun...
he found his balls.... uh oh... gonna pay for that.
Oh and if you see MCH when you are out and about tell him Fubar says..... he is a lying sack of schit.......

Cause those are the people who die when supply side economics fail. The history on that is rock solid.

Supply side economics fail and people will forget about the "covid"

Copy all that...Bris is riding shotgun? Umm, no he’s not...He’s making 800 proof shine in his basement and splashing his wife with it when she walks in the house from work.

If I see MCH tell him he’s a full bag of shît....Gawd, I really hope I don’t see him...Can I yell it at him from my truck as I race by him?

Last thing....Can I borrow your Sled? I think I found a way to transport weed, blow, booze, hookers, and food all at the same time via water...Thank me later!

😎

My sled is at your disposal if you bring back the goods.....

We may have to do a wellness check on Bristoe.... he seems to be cracking under the pressure.

As far as MCH I wouldn't stop either ... do a drive by with your little friend... he will be duckin and dodgin and have a permanent twich....... bam

I believe about half of that. SARS 27 cases in US. MERS 2 cases in US. Ebola maybe 12 cases (none in California)

Aids, H1N1, totally believable. Probably dengue fever and Chikungunya too. Not to take anything away from your wife for helping so many people for so long.

Not too many Docs at the CDC have seen SARS and MERS and Ebola.

Reading this thread I get the impression a lot of posters don't realize that getting the virus doesn't equal dying. I guess the media won this round.

I see that, wow dude!



I suggest 10-12 hours of outside time today.

I see that my question created a lively debate.

Until we discover something that either cures it or stops from becoming a serious illness, our country leaders are going to have to decide between the economy and the virus.

I am in the camp that says, protect everyone as much as possible, keep THE MOST vulnerable locked away, and go back to work.

Will some people die from that course of action? Yes. But I think going into a depression would put even more human misery on the country. And last longer than 1.5 years, which the common answer for a vaccine.

We could have surrendered right away to Germany and Japan in 1941. We didn’t. We decided that not surrendering was worth 400,000 American lives. It was an acceptable cost. We didn’t like it, but decided it was best for the future.

Why is this any different?

No worries Sam.
I do need to go outside for a bit, but it is snowing again, still winter here. I am a little grouchy because I had plans to be at Lake Powell, Az. fishing and soaking up sunshine.
But no.... due to the PANIC over the "covid" I had to cancel.
So I am stuck here at the fire listening to the chicken littles.....
Where have all the men gone? snowflakes gonna be the end of us......

Really, & you know, or can prove this how ?

Where did I write this ?

Don't believe I can find anything, in regards to this, either in what I stated. Can you show me where please ?

My wife & I have worked our asses off, to get to where we are, from simple High School graduates.

Do we, are we not suffering from the economic down turn, fuggin oath we are. We own a small business, that has/is being severely effected.

You want to know what my biggest worry is ?

Holding my oath/commitment to my employees, that I will continue to support their families !

Your doomsday attitude is your's.

Man up, or own it !

Exactly Joel.

The point of social distancing is to mitigate the number of hospitalized people at one time, Look at the custer f NYC is now. Wyoming only has 150 confirmed cases, but they are truly testing only the sick and high risk showing signs. There are over 600 in Quarantine in one county, and 200 in another with what they believe is COVID 19, but save the testing equipment for the same people that get the good elk tags apparently......
How many hospital beds do you think are in this state????? There is less then one medical facility per county and barely enough doctors to go around for the regular flu season. A regular Doctors appointment takes a month and a half. and car wrecks of any serious nature get you a helicopter ride to Billings or Denver( which ain't gonna happen now)

How do you expect a level well thought out response to stoke social discord? Are you sure your poor enough to comment?

Amen on that! Many victims of left wing propaganda.

I am deeply impressed by everyone's concern for their money....er, I mean fellow man.


Deeply impressed.

I know you normally go all week without seeing anybody outside your family, but the rest of us have a decision to make.

The risk is NEVER going to be zero.
When do you resume life? No matter when that is, you are going to risk killing someone's grandma.

When are you not a selfish bastard?

In the real world, what are your chances of getting the virus, probably near 0%. 100% chance you will be negatively affected by this monetarily. Obviously the naysayers are more concerned for you than you are.

Geeze guys I said I was deeply impressed.

All good cogent thoughts and I agree with your final assessment.

I have taken the “down time” as an opportunity to read a couple of books that I’ve wanted to read for a long time but didn’t get around to. One was Viktor Frankl’s Mans Search For Meaning which is a fascinating dive into a psychologist’s first hand account of life in a Nazi concentration camp. In it he repeats Nietzsche’s famous saying “He who has a Why to live can bear any How”. The opposite is true as we see from those in our culture who think everything from cell phones to internet connections are an entitlement, and wither if they don’t get their way.

We have lost any semblance of a collective “Why”.

My 12 yo daughter was out in the driveway coloring yesterday and this morning I found her picture which I think captures some of the cognitive dissonance we all feel in this situation:



It says “we are in this together but... stay 6 feet apart”

Weird times food thread man thanks for starting it.

When the authorities say it’s ok.

I sent you a PM with a link to an article you might appreciate.

Have at it fellas.


They got armed guards outside your doors yet?

I am worried that all the fugging personal debt that we all gathered up during the "good times" before this virus, during the "booming economy" is gonna cause trouble....sooner than later.



Sooner now. Jeebus...look at what you have to sacrifice to keep the economy "booming".

A short term shut down gonna cause us to become a third world schit hole?



Man! Talk about resilience!


What a fugging house of cards........

Covid 19. I've lost a lot of money (paper losses) but I'm still okay and that can come back. Losing my health or life is much more serious.

As long as the pension check shows up all is well.

If they keep this up the coming food riots will make covid irrelevant....

Thats how I feel about it too.


We can apparently dismiss all known scientific reports about the virus and its potential impact......but have to believe every economist who writes an article.



I dont know........are the Keynes types in lock step with the Friedman followers? Do 98% of economists agree?


I just think we need to do what we can now....and remain cautious.


Otherwise we all go lick a shopping cart and hope that a Gin in Tonic saves us?

Food riots? The hell you say!



With all the dead people around there will be plenty of Soylent Green in the pipeline.......

Always a ray of sunshine...... oh and I have suspended my plans for coming your way with the whoop ass....

How come?


I realize that the Hi Line is no fishing trip to AZ, but we have many other things to offer.


Nalivka's pizza for one! Its zee best in zee vorld.

All I am "worried" about is what I will get drawn for this fall's hunting season.

You saving it for the Creek Hunter?

i wonder how many days I will miss the Antelope deadline by this year?


For the past 15 years my average has been 4 days.

Yes.... I am hoarding my cans of whoop ass , me thinks I will need several for that bonehead.....

I will know the results of the New Mexico draw in the next couple weeks....I hope.

Hehehehe! Whoop Ass mixes well with Thunderbird too.





Back on topic....I am glad we are where we are in this situation.


I think Trump and co are handling it well. Honestly I do.


Imagine how bad it would have been with Obama or Hillary at the helm.


We would have been in jail for hate crimes for not licking a Chinaman like the Italians did.

I think the Covid is serious.....and warranted a serious action. I see it as taking steps to protect the economy rather than steps to destroy it.


JHMO.

Good luck!

This one size fits all approach is wrong.... Trump needs to use his good sense and quit listening to the "experts"

Thanks!

I am waiting on my tax refund so I can send some money to Dakota Firearms for their Dakota Varmint in .22 PPC. Already have the brass and dies ordered.

What would you suggest?


Wouldn't the long incubation period make any wait and see action difficult?

Trump : Hey Covid, GFY 😎

Everyone should lower their BMI except Conrad. He is exempt like all farmers.

Generally you want to fatten up for winter. I am prepared for winter all year long.





Who knew it would be a detriment against Covid?? (scientists......probably)

Plus, the European wimmins are so skinny they grow hair like a dude to keep warm...I’ll take a voluptuous gal without hairy legs, feet, and nether regions.

😎

Jim, we are starting to see patterns emerge... what works in NYC isn't what will work in Havre... etc...

We need to identify the vulnerable and take appropriate action, even if that means quarantine or isolate....

The strong , young and healthy need to be allowed to work and keep the economic engine alive for everyone's sake.

Another part of the pattern is the experts models have been wrong.. spectacularly wrong! we need to apply some common sense solutions.

Academic's , civil servants, bureaucrats , bureaucrat scientist & doctors etc.... are never to be trusted in the circumstances....

When you lose your virginity, you'll realize that hairless women aren't really hairless, they just shave. A little body hair never hurt anyone...unless you're embarrassed because you don't have any.

Yes, this is the first time I've have ever seen this country commit economic suicide based on a level of risk , that changes daily and NOBODY can quantify ...imagine if people in this day and age were asked to storm the beach at Normandy....we are softer than baby sheet....

Wait....Was that an attempt at a slam toward the Beav?

Umm, I realize my experience running a razor to trim up or skin a beaver to a soft as silk feel, has you miffed.

Why else would you be willing to roll between the legs of a floor mat that smells like piss?

😎

Boys last day was yesterday, loggin is just about all but done around here.. must have plenty of toilet paper and lumber stock piled somewhere.

Remember Beaver10......

If Beaver refuses to clean and maintain ... he will be required to self isolate.... the world doesn't want nor need an unkept beaver

Agreed,a dirty beaver is something this world does not need!

You are all safe....This Beaver maintains all hides, furs, and pelts to the highest standard set by The Association of Beaver Cleaners.

Thanks and feel free to hit a beaver hard...😂😎

I miss the days when beaver and corona was a winning combo......

Bro, don’t you worry...After this kills off all men with weak DNA. Those like us with superior genetics “Thank you Darwin”

Will have women lining up waiting to be bedded by us.

I’m already tired thinking about it...Corona beer anyone?

🤪😎

Ken, we need to talk...WTF is up with your Avatar on crack that keeps changing from this one to a dead like Roy buck?

You running from an ex-wife?

🤔😎

Doubt that Beav, Judy is Ken's rock !

Excellent point Paul...Judy is da bomb...But who’s running Ken’s avatar?

Elkslayer91 hack into our pards Fire account?

We must ferret this out...😎

You know dat fugger doesn't have the brains to do it !!!!!!!!!!

Back On Point . I didn't read, but did hear it quoted, some economists looked at the effects of the Spanish Flu lock down , the areas that did it , recovered quicker. It doesn't help you if they repossessed your pickup.

The economy.We can weather the disease.In fact I think that with out the shutdown and people practiced common sense,the death numbers would not be much different.Seems to be working in Sweden,but they don`t have a media and far left wing Government trying to destroy their Country and President.I think if we quit this bullchit commie shutdown by the end of April,we still have a chance.

Cabin fever.

Sweden is about three or four weeks behind, so it's a little early to judge. I'm guessing they are going for instant herd immunity , if they have a strong enough healthcare system, it might work. Depends on the ICU availability to make it work.

Covid - 19-- is the Economy

My worry is a far greater tragedy for our country than the two of those put together. And that's that somehow Cuomo spins this in a way that gets him into the White House.

Originally Posted by Bristoe

At this point, Coronavirus deniers are falling into the same category as the flat earth society.

You are innumerate and full of panic. Sadly, you have many fellow fools hooting about in abject ignorance and p!ss-fear.

Originally Posted by antlers

Originally Posted by Bristoe

At this point, Coronavirus deniers are falling into the same category as the flat earth society.

^^This.^^

As are you.

Originally Posted by moosemike

Originally Posted by antlers

Originally Posted by Bristoe

At this point, Coronavirus deniers are falling into the same category as the flat earth society.

^^This.^^

Yup

Too bad many decent folk will suffer for your intellectual and moral defects.

Originally Posted by Bristoe

11 coronavirus deaths in Kentucky today. Several coronavirus patients at the hospital where my wife works.

I don't need to read anything. I know what the situation is for me and mine.

I do not expect the following to penetrate those who parade their p!ss-fear and innumeracy, but others might appreciate some perspective on the state of the Kung Flu sweeping the great state of Kentucky.

State | Kentucky
Population | 4,467,673 Humans
Annual Mortality Rate | 929.94 Per 100000
Annual Absolute Mortality Rate | 0.0092994
Annual Number of Deaths | 41547
Daily Mean Number Deaths | 114

Sources
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kentucky#Demographics
https://www.worldlifeexpectancy.com/usa/kentucky-all-races-death-rate

========

And according to Bristoe, Kentucky had 11 deaths attributed to Kung Flu on 02APR2020. To put that into perspective, 02APR2020 Kung Flu attributed deaths are 0.096 of the total number of Kentuckians expected to die on any given day.

Yet Bristoe and his sort are running around like their hair is on fire and their @zzes are catching.

==============

For an easily-digestible breakdown of what kills Kentuckians on an annual basis, the following is handy:
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/states/kentucky/kentucky.htm

The economy. The longer we go, the more difficult this will be to recover from.

True, it might not be that dangerous. OTOH, it might be as bas as something like SARS, MERS, or the swine flu outbreak of a few years back.

FTR, pneumonia brought on by flu or other such infections is the commonest way folks on both sides of my family die. Beats out heart disease & cancer and trauma. Probably hte way I will die when I get old. So I have BTDT. But unpleasant reality and unpleasant past events where family dies and the emotions that produces is no way to run a country.

this lockdown on everybody needs to end soon...….lockdown those at most risk.....when people talk about their 90 year grand parents or 8o-85 year old parents …..hoping they don't die from covid 19


. just how do you want them to die?...….what can they die from that makes it acceptable?...…..reality is that its going to happen sooner or later.

bob

Jeebus.....glad there aint no world war on right now.



As a country we cant even stand a few weeks at home?

Exactly what I try telling my family about my almost 95 year old Grandfather. Been stuck in a wheelchair for over 2 years.

Mind sharp but legs and balance a [bleep].

He and I have had the talk many times and he is ready.

Nobody will go see him because they are scared of him getting the poon tang flu.

We have caretakers there 24 hours a day that are probably seeing other patients in their line of work but family won't go by there.

sure we can.....but there comes a point in time to get back on with it......I think more people are going to hurt by this lockdown over the long run …….than the few that are dead or dying.


I am not a heartless sob..... I am in the danger group.....its just reality...….bob

The economy will recover but it could take 10 years .

Now that everyone understands the seriousness of hygiene to prevent catching or passing the virus and social distancing from those most vulnerable, including those most vulnerable taking self responsibility to protect themselves. The extreme low risk age group of 0 to 44 need to get back to life, the low risk group of 45 to 65 need to get back if they are reasonably healthy. The high risk group of 65+ need to take personal responsibility for their own safety. Anyone at any age that may be high risk health wise should take extreme precautions including isolation.

Everyone get's it now, take all precautions of passing it on to older folks, by protecting themselves hygienically, physical distancing from older family members, Older folks must chose to isolate themselves.

At this point forward isolating all society isn't going to change the future enough to slow the deaths that will happen because of this.

Kent

I guess lets all get back to it then?





That must mean that we need to forget about the strangle hold China has on our economy.


THAT economy?? The one China owns?? Thats the one we need to get back to right away?????



Does China import ventilators?

Guess we know why now Trump has been talking about that strangle hold SINCE THE 80s.

Kinda reminds me of when we shut down Canadian beef over the mad cow mess they were in.



The Canadians were days away from establishing a much improved packing capability.


Once the big packers down here figured that out......the science became settled and we re opened the border. No need to build packing plants there Canada....we will continue to do that for you.

Great! Just in time for the next pandemic.

Remote isolation isn’t everyone’s steady state, neither is the live/work zoning you enjoy.

grins.

I worry most abut the economy.
I get the kung fu flu and I am dead. end of story and struggles.
if I don't catch the kung fu flu the economy will have me struggling for years. been there done that. to old and tired for it.

A lot of the people I hang with are in the medical field and/or government (teachers, cops, fire, etc).

So far the cops are calling out and using flex time comp time at high rates, as no one wants to be there.

Medical are obviously working plenty too, except for PT and OT and some aids who are getting hammered since all elective surgeries are cancelled. Chiropractor taking a beating. Teachers are home teaching. Sales guy is screwed. Karate place is going to go under.

Hotel business is devastated. Pretty high management friend got laid off. It was a huge shock, as he thought he'd be re-assigned.

Aside for my elderly parents, I am far more worried about the economic implications than for the WuHuFlu.

I am half hoping for a housing crash. We are in need of more house for our home and I'd love to catch one on fire sale. Only hoping a little though, as it'd mean a lot of pain for others.

Short answer, its bad and going to really suck in 6 weeks.

That is true.


I am used to watching everything go absolutely to hell from my porch.


We call this next year country........maybe next year'll be a good un.....

you called it Jim, around here normally things would have to improve vastly just to reach what most people call normal.