For those you would say there is no reason to carry a handgun while hiking, one hiker killed and one wounded by machete attack on Appalachain Trail in Virginia.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...attack-leaves-one-hiker-dead/1184619001/

I start the rhetoric, Glock 23 with 180’s😂

I'll add P226 40 cal with 200gr XTP's, so many guns, so little sense.

My wife and I hiked portions of the trail in every state except Georgia last year and made one of the most difficult hikes I have done in a long time to the top of Katahdin. I carried my Kahr CM9 the entire time. We encountered a lot of hikers, both in groups and loners and never felt uncomfortable except for an encounter in Vermont at a secluded scenic overlook with two dude who gave me the feeling they were wolves looking for sheep. They appeared to be sizing us up and made the little voice in my head scream "Danger Will Robinson, Danger!" They seemed to change their demeanor once I moved away from the edge of the cliff and oblique to them, slipped my hand to my waistband under my shirt and gave them a hard look. They decided they had a better place to be and headed up the trail. Maybe they were just trail weary and wanted the place to themselves, but those dudes looked and felt like trouble and I was glad I had a gun.

Perry

I always carry a J when hiking. I got that "danger" feeling once and was glad I had it with me, although I didn't have to pull it.

There is a lot of the AT in "No Gun Zones" where something like a NAA Mini Revolver or KelTec .32 could be hidden without much worry of being found but there when needed. There have been a lot of rapes and murders along the trail that never make it to the press as the locals don't want the area to get a bad name....

Many people carry OC...any woman who hikes with no gun or at least OC is out of their minds....(see my signature line)

Bob

Wow! I didn't know that there were "no gun zones" on the trail. Was the attack in one of those?

you run into some strange people from time to time, I have run into a couple of them over the years, no problems so far but I don't look or act like a sheep.

I believe that he was referring to it running through MD, NJ, NY, CT and MA.

Oh yea, I forgot about that. Living in Oregon I forget what the eastern US has to put up with.

It's no better out there. You have CA to the south and Oregon doesn't recognize any out-of-state carry licenses.

Oregon is a picture of a gun freedom loving state!

What's crazy to me is that I dare say, most, hikers are so against guns that they would almost rather be raped or chopped into pieces than carry a firearm for protection.
Foolish in the extreme.

I don't think I've ever not been armed hiking/backpacking. Just one of those basic things.

This occurred in Virginia. No excuse for not being armed.

Agreed, it's crazy, that said, I'm no Yule Gibbons corn nut eating hiker, but damn, I pack more for two legged vermin than four leggers.

Same here. And if my permit was not recognized, well, concealed is concealed.

Ever see videos of someone being chased on a street by someone wielding a knife?

Arm yourself.

I would love to run into the likes of a "Sovereign" in the woods. [bleep] came from taxachuchitt , who would have thunk.

Over the years I've warned quite a few people about hiking in the desert: enough water and a firearm. Some listen.

J frame with a couple of reloads always has been a comfort on the trail. I have been hiking the AT for longer than many folks here have been alive. Not a single time have I been unarmed.

the j frame is a lw and great reliable choice.

I get it that serious backpackers are understandably very weight conscious. But, even a 7-shot, 10 ounce S&W 351PD in 22WMR would have easily saved the day. A few spare rounds of 22WMR ammo is lightweight and fairly weather resistant as well.

AMEN!

I carry my G43 in a Hill People Gear chest pack when hiking and don't even notice it.

I know folks who have said they would prefer such treatment who then were victimized. In every case they changed their minds after surviving their victimization.

Yep. Hiking sticks don’t work well against a machete.

I don’t go anywhere without a gun. If I can’t take my gun, I don’t go. Some may label it as paranoid, but I just call it being prepared.

It makes a great deal of sense to carry a defensive firearm when you’re on a remote trail. For most of my backpacking years, in Canada’s mountain parks, firearms weren’t an option. I got into the habit of carrying my hand axe on the trail. Nobody batted an eye, and only once I was asked by a stranger why I carried it. I smiled and said it was for chopping firewood, but it kept falling off my pack. The person (a European tourist) seemed to accept that.

Nowadays on the trail I have a small defensive pistol in a waist pack, and I still carry the axe. It does keep falling off my pack, you know...

Can’t imagine that Doc. A good axe or Bowie knife would damn sure beat nothing though.

This won't keep me off the AT. Be Well. Rusty

That's it--my thoughts exactly ! Going without preparation is total ignorance. Dozens of times these pilgrims on the trail have asked me with contempt in their demeanor, "What's that gun along for?"

We've hiked and climbed hundreds and hundreds of miles over the past 38 years, and never once have we done so without protection along.

Once, while hiking in the rugged, remote Taylor Hilgard wilderness, we were back in about 8 miles, just shy of the base of Imp Peak. There had been no other cars at the trailhead. Yet up ahead, I saw two guys bring their horses up on the trail, forming a "V" shape on the trail, blocking our path. From appearances, they looked like trouble--dirty, scruffy--imagine the dopes in the movie "Deliverance". We were about 50 feet from them, when one of them said a nasty comment to us. We had a peak in mind, and kept going forward, and when we were about 15-20 feet from them, they saw my .44 magnum on my hip, and for lack of a better way to put it--it was all over. They got out of our way, but I had eyes on the back of my head that whole trip, not knowing if they would show up again, or if they had a rifle back at their camp.

When one goes into places like this, you're on your own--and in a potentially difficult spot if something occurs and your wife is along.

While weight might be an issue for some, we take two rigs along--the second one concealed--just in case one gets hurt and has to leave--each are still armed.

i like the AT. but one has to recognize it's been discovered by all kinds of folks. some of whom might be running from the law for whatever minor or major reason.

i try not to stare or glare at anyone suspicious in my mind, but there's more dangers on the trail than just an occasional aggressive blackbear.

local communities realize the economic impact of the trail for their community, and do their best to offer assistance as necessary.

I can believe it.
What a hard way to learn the lesson that our personal protection is our own responsiblility.

No AT for me, but the axe idea isn't bad. Cruiser's axe, double-bit, is fearsome in determined hands. Wouldn't want to use one to fend off someone with a machete, though .. much rather have a firearm.

Tom

I don't glare or stare but, growing up in Detroit, I've got the "I see you and know what you're thinking but don't try it with me" glance down to a science. I normally carry my J with the BB +P Outdoorsman load in the gun (on the trail) and two speedstrips of Corbon DPX in my pocket. I also carry a Griptilian clipped to my other pocket.

very good. makes perfectly good sense.

the AT is important, but one has to be careful.

This girls murder after being abducted while hiking on the AT here in GA was the reason GA finally started making carry much easier.

https://www.google.com/search?q=mer...420j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

I have no idea if she would have carried if legal, but at the time, due to nonsensical laws carry was all but impossible where she was hiking. The section of trail cut across the back corner of a state park where guns are not allowed. The rest of the hike was on National Forest BUT... since that area was also part of a Wildlife Management area only hunters with a permit to hunt the area with guns suitable for the season could carry a gun. Since it was small game season she could have had a 22 or shotgun with #2 shot or smaller if she had a hunting license and avoided the state park.

After this incident the laws were finally changed, Now if you have a permit you can carry almost anywhere.

She was beaten and kept alive in the back of a serial killers van for 4 days. She refused to give up the correct PIN for her ATM which helped catch her killer. He kept trying false numbers and was seen on a lot of video which eventually led to his capture. Unfortunately too late. The state, with permission of the family promised to waive the death penalty if he took them to the body. GA kept their promise, but they had already uncovered evidence in his van linking him to similar murders on trails in Florida and NC. GA sent him to FL to stand trial and get the death penalty.

I had an encounter with a couple jackazzes around here a couple years back. Up in the Avalanche Gulch for those familiar with the area.

Passed a couple dudes in a parked pickup at the mouth of the gulch as we drove in. We went in a mile or two then went hiking up the road a few miles. On the way back out, these two had stopped their truck on a culvert where the creek flowed under the road. One of each of them was on either side of the truck. It was a choke point.

I summed up the situation from about 100 yards out. I could tell by their body language that something wasn't cool.

That day I didn't have the typical Glock on my strong side. I appeared unarmed from the front, from a distance. But I wasn't unarmed. I had an AR carbine slung on one shoulder, riding along my back. They couldn't see it.

When we got to about 50 yards, they were just watching us, with tense body language. I slipped the AR carbine off my shoulder and held it in my hand just ahead of the receiver letting it swing naturally as we continued toward them.

When they saw the hardware, and my eyes on them, their demeanor changed instantly. They got in the truck, started it up and slowly came our direction looking sheepish, and they continued up the road, while we continued down.

I gave them eye contact and a little head nod as we passed.

Imagine a country without guns, strong molest the weak with impunity.

Same here. There are a lot of places I'd love to see, but if I can't go armed, I won't go. One example.....the Baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown NY. I cannot legally carry a concealed handgun in that state, so I'll never see it. Same way with visiting Niagara Falls, and going across to the Canadian side.

Admittedly, I've carried here into buildings that had a no firearms allowed sign posted, but I figure that on the slight chance that I'm caught doing it, I can probably figure out a way to get out of it. A state like New York would most likely not be so easy to deal with.

I believe in that old saying......I'd rather be judged by 12, than carried by 6.

James, I agree with you totally. A lot places I would like to see. The Smithsonian is one. Can’t see myself traveling without protection.
Hasbeen

IME the security guards at every Smithsonian don't care at all if the metal detector goes off. I carried through several of them and they just waved me on through.

The National Archives is completely different.

The area around Cooperstown is about as rural as anywhere you'll find in the northeast, so the probability of running into trouble with human predators at or near the HOF seems pretty slim to me.

Probably not as rural as the Appalachian Trail.

The only places I've actually had to reach for my gun have been rural. One was even wilderness. I don't see where population makes any difference.

It sure is.

Yup. I don't go anywhere that I have to go unarmed.

Same, this thread is bumfuzzling the chit out of me, I wont even walk the 350 yards down to the mailbox holding my Wifes hand without a pistol and spare mag in my back pocket, I will forever never understand what folks are thinking that wander off down a trail for 10's of 100's of miles unarmed.

"without a pistol" gotdamn spellcheck!

Normally on any walk, I'll have either a S&W M&P .40 with a mag or two extra or a Governor AND an M&P 9mm Compact. Along with either carry "package" I'll have a big knife concealed in addition to my normal Buck folder.

I spend a lot of time in the mountains by myself, or with just my dog, and I always have a pistol, one or two spare mags, and sometimes an edged weapon along with me.
Can't see ever doing otherwise.

You bet EE and 340, I guess we's thinking men! anyone with a least two functioning brain cells knows we're not much use for our women, getting them to work if they want in bad weather conditions and PROTECTION! that's about it, I just can't get there from here on what people have ranging through their empty skulls when out and about.

The wife's sidearm is a Colt Magnum Carry (Detective Special) in 357 Mag. and the daughter has an old Detective Special in .38 Spec. I just told my fourteen year old son, after reading your post about an hour ago, that we are shooting pistols more this summer. He'll need one soon.

Good deal EE, looks like you have your ladies set up nicely, your son and you will both enjoy the hell out of that shooting, and the Sprout will benefit greatly.

VaHunter: I think I see what you are getting at?
There are so many drug addled mentally deranged cretins out there looking for "their 15 minutes" of fame that maybe we/I should carry guns all the time.
Probably good advice in this day and age.
Sad that the young people were victimized by this drug addled murderous scumbag!
I hike in areas where I am much more liable to come across a Grizzly than a meth head.
If and when I decide to carry (family members along!) I will go Glock in 40 S&W with high capacity magazines and Gold Dot hollow-points.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Part of the AT through Shenandoah National Park is pretty close by. See a lot of strange people up there , but like others have said arm yourself. I feel safer on the AT or in the woods than in any bigger city.

4 buddies and myself hike the AT in north Georgia each September ,
Usually just for 2-3 nights. I’m the gun nut of the group, so I always carry(in a hill people gear chest pack that allows easy access to
My pistol will your pack on). Two others in our group carry as well . On the Georgia portion of the trail you will quite a bit of open carry, and it seemed to go largely unmentioned, even among your more
“Granola” hikers. There’s no way you’ll catch me out hiking in an area where I’m the only one responsible for my own safety unarmed.

I bought into that kind of thinking years ago. I am the only one responsible for my safety. No way, do I go out without a gun. It just doesn't make sense.

While I don't mind if others open carry I prefer to keep my gun out of sight. The problem with carrying with a pack if you carrying on your right hip is that the pack waist strap covers the gun. I have been thinking about a chest holster of some type that could go under a loose fitting short sleeve shirt, but other than "thunderwear" which looks like it would be hot and get soaked in sweat had not hit on anything. Thanks for posting the hill people info the snubby kit bag looks very interesting for a small 9mm.

The snubby model is the one the I have, usually with a sig
P938. It is a great place to keep your keys, phone etc as well as your
Handgun. These chest packs also work great while kayaking or cycling.

They are very handy. I had a single use in mind when I got my first one. I had no idea I'd use it as much as I do.

that is great info JM and Hotweather.

This is a good chest holster. https://www.diamonddcustomleather.com/products/guides-choice-chest-holster

The A/T runs through the town where I went to JR/SR High School. Lots of interesting people passing through. I don't think that any of the local people bothered, or were bothered by, the hikers on the A/T.

My Mother and some of her coworkers and friends would set up an aid station by the trail every couple of weekends from late May thru to the end of October to help hikers with health problems. I recall that we had a single woman named Velma stay with us for a week or so in October 1967/68. She was a through hiker who got sick with a case of pneumonia. I remember that my Mother made her take about 5 showers and a lice treatment at the hospital before she allowed her in our house. She didn't have very good gear, so my Father, in a rare show of kindness, set her up with a nearly complete new set of kit before she left. I remember that she had a huge appetite and enjoyed my Mother's cooking, which was surprising since cooking wasn't one of my Mother's strengths. One day I came home from school and Velma was gone, never to be seen or heard from again. Some people collect stray cats and dogs, my Mother collected stray people.

Yep a lot of people must damn near live on the trail.

What's your mode of carry at the nude beach?

Great thread-some useful information here.

If I were to own one of those scary gun things, then I'm betting no one would know I had it until they convinced me they needed to see it.
I see open carry as letting an opponent know part of one's game plan!
In an area where four legged critters were the only concern, if I would need a gun then open carry may be more the first choice.

I always open carry while hiking.

But then, one never knows!!!

I never open carry, anywhere. The hill people snubby is my next acquisition.

A club! ; ]

Good plan.

In my area, bears commonly are present at or near trailheads.

Near interstates, so are other predators.

I always carry me club at the nudist beach.

And that ladies and gentleman is a small part of our 2nd “to keep and bear arms”



Good natured folk going about their biz is now construed by Hollywood and liberals as bad ?


Utter bs and in direct violation of our Constitution as I see it

About 15 years ago I went to an amusement park at a Georgia county fair. We were all active LE at the time, but all of us from out of state. We were all carrying our off duty BUGs. Mike had brought his wife along on the trip, one of several wives as it happened. Anyway, as we were entering the fair grounds, we all saw (and ignored) the sign declaring that no one could enter the fairgrounds if "armed".

Mike's wife grabbed him by the arm and hissed, "Mike! You're armed! We can't go in!"

Mike laughed. "C'mon, I ain't armed. All I'm carrying is a little J-frame."

We all laughed, because we were ALL carrying "little J-frames". We all knew what a 38 Special snub can do.

I'm inclined to agree... I carry a sidearm openly when I'm hunting hogs/deer and bigger game, but it may be out of sight under my coat; it's not there for show. But I also carry a second handgun, typically a light snub revolver, in a concealed location. On the hiking trails I typically have my handgun(s) out of sight. No point in scaring the sheep, and no point in giving a bad guy the advantage of knowing.

I've had a couple of similar incidents.

One of them was at a remote gas station in southern Arizona... I recognized a robbery/kidnapping/murder in progress with myself and my ex-wife as the intended prey. Instead of displaying my firearm, though, I simply pulled the spare Glock 23 magazine from my pocket and held it up as though checking to see if it was fully loaded. Funny thing, the 3 guys advancing on me stopped in their tracks, paused, and without a word turned around and got back into their truck and drove away.

I guess they figured that if a guy has a Glock magazine on him, he probably has a Glock pistol on him, too.

This sort of thing happens MILLIONS of times annually in America. It's got a name in the criminology literature: a DUG (Defensive Use of a Gun). Armed citizens rarely fire upon would-be perpetrators of crimes, because they can avert the criminal activity simply by showing themselves to be armed.

Back in the 80s I went to a boat ramp ... I was driving truck w/ boat trailer, dad was bringing the boat to meet me. Only rig there so I parked on the ramp, then walked up the shore throwing rocks 'n' stuff. A truck pulled up and parked. No trailer so I didn't go back to move out of the way. There's a pile of heaped cobbles ... basketball sized rocks ... in the center of the parking lot making it a sort of circle drive. I was a third of the way around, them a little closer to our truck than I was. 3 guys got out. They came toward that "island" of rock ... one went on each side (thus one of them clearly cut me off from our truck) and one right over the top. I wasn't looking right at them, just keeping an eye out. When they got to about 15 yards, I reached down and pulled the S&W .357 which was shoved cross-draw in my belt out, thumbed the hammer back, and started as if I was drawing a bead on a sea gull. They swapped ends and went back to their truck. That 8-3/4" barrel looks mean. (It is.) Before I could walk back to the truck, dad motored down with the boat. As he was lining up on the trailer they headed for him. He jumped over the side onto the ramp with the anchor rope in his hands and his S&W K frame swung out into view. They turned around and went back toward their truck. As they passed about 30 feet away from me I heard one of them say "that mother f**ker has a gun. all these mother f**kers have guns. What are we going to do?" They got in the truck, sat there a couple minutes and I kept an eye on them as we tied our boat down to the trailer, then they drove away.

I always wondered what would have happened to me minus that gun, or to dad if I hadn't been there and he hadn't been armed himself. Beating? Robbery? Murder?

Made a believer out of me.

Tom

Well now - that's another reason to carry a spare mag.

Wife and I were stopped on our trail bikes on one of the semi-remote mountain dirt roads near here. A beater car came around the corner and passed by me on the left, then stopped. As the guy in the passenger seat started asking wife about a "party they were looking for", I was thinking, "yeah, right" and watching another get out of the opposite back seat and head for the trunk. I put my hand on my gun when it became apparent he wasn't taking a pee break. He noticed that move and hesitated there at the trunk. He actually began to reach for the trunk lid and stopped himself a couple of times before he gave me another sideways glance and jumped back into the car, upon which they immediately sped off. I wasn't about to let him reach into that trunk, and he apparently figured that out.

Just because you left the pavement, doesn't mean you left the dirtbags behind.

this is exactly what i do as well.

i came to that conclusion because in the event of injury, the other person--if having to walk out alone--is also armed.

an additional incentive for me was the idea of being in a remote wilderness location--and having the primary rig experience some type of damage or failure, etc., which might potentially render it inoperable--a second rig, such as a small, powerful snub, can carry the day...

Human predators are not much different than the animal varieties.

They target the lambs, and avoid the lions.

After my first solo trip to the mountains I open carried. Amazing how friendly and polite people get when you have a pistola handy.

Have diffused similar a couple times Gents, as innocent as grabbing a couple spare mags from a back pocket to get to a tin of snuff. you can feel their wheels start to spin.

I wonder what the victim would have given for an airweight .22 revolver as machete guy showed his intent?

Great incident report after so many years.

Brother, you ain't kidding. Old dirt roads and trails, remote campsites, etc., are targets of opportunity for the scum out there who think what you have, belongs to them.

I'm old fashioned so I do not have a newfangled Glock. I figure if push comes to shove, I'll just have to call on my old and dear friends, Col. Colt and his Nine Little Sisters for assistance. Something about facing a Colt's Lightweight Commander .45 ACP that can make a cretin think seriously about taking up a different profession. At least in my experience.

L.W.

LW, those Commanders can be comforting and handy. I know I wouldn't want you shooting at me. I hope you are doing well.

I love those old 70 Series LW Colt Commanders. Carried one for years.

I’m not a big “hiker” per se, but I do a fair amount of woodswalking as I hunt upland bird and whitetail. So I put my time in scouting etc. Always strap a big N frame 44 mag open when I do. Never had to use it or even pull it in defense against anything on four legs nor two. However, I have over the years found all kinds of ‘sign’ from the 2 legged variety of predators in places I least expected. More so than bear sign. Up to and including a pretty extensive cannabis farming operation. That’s got my pulse up. At least once, I have felt eyes on me. If you’ve ever had that sinking, certain, feeling, you know what i’m Talking about. It’s unmistakable. In that situation, i’m Quite sure the obviousness of that honking big revolver on my hip kept the situation to eyes-only. That’s why I like it visible, in the thick stuff. I could care less about any eyebrows it might raise among the more innocent types I occasionally encounter. I mean them no harm, and none comes from it. In Town, I believe in CC. But in Country, It’s OC.

^^^^^^^
That is a thoughtful post.

Over the years, the discussion of concealed vs. open carry has been pretty well laid out by many. But I don't know that there are many statistics, nor do i know if there could be. After all, it is hard to prove that open carry changed the dynamic of a situation either for the better or the worse. Sometimes the facts are clear, but often not. The statistics/facts of concealed carry are likely even muddier waters.

I do find it interesting that you prefer one over the other based on where you are. It doesn't seem to me that should make a difference, at least not with respect to the usual arguments.

If everyone else would do so, I believe I'd be happy to open carry. But only if there were a lot of people open carrying. hell, I'd just as soon go about my day with a lightweight AR slung over my shoulder, mag full, chamber empty. Can you imagine how little trouble there would be if that were common practice? Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think so.

You'd get tired of carrying an AR all day, every day. You say you wouldn't, but you would.
OC is more natural in the wild than in the city.

I can imagine what a wild eyed machete toting nut case would look like after threatening you.

Hmmm...

DF

^^^^^^^
I think I could learn to live with it. That said, I would purpose build a light one.

I agree OC in the wild is more common and draws less attention than OC in the city. But do the arguments change with regards to the advantages/disadvantages of each type of carry? If you choose to carry concealed so that "city scum" don't know you are armed, why is it different for "trail scum" to see you are armed?

I agree the disparity seems illogical - shouldn’t matter one way or the other CC/OC Town/Country. Maybe it’s just the lower frequency of human interaction in the sticks that makes it seem more ‘appropriate’ or less likely to draw UNWANTED attention and reactions. Maybe it’s because in the sticks I frequent, it’s more common to observe people OC’ing. Maybe in town, people use people as camouflage, and it’s easier for a human predator to close distance. And in the woods, they gotta hide behind rocks and trees and make assessments from further away. And I don’t have to let them close distance. I dunno. Maybe it makes no sense at all and that’s OK. It’s just how I roll and so far so good. But to each their own.

^^^^^^^
Thanks for the thoughtful response. I agree, to each their own. I was just wondering if I was missing some key point. I often OC when on private land. Not sure how I would roll in a rural but public environment.

What's really interesting is how to roll in a public hunting environment. There, a guy walking up to me with a long gun might not raise much suspicion. But should he suddenly point it at me and disarm me, I'd really like my handgun to be concealed.

There must not be much going on in your life.



Of course the arguments change. I take it you don't get out much? #1 reason against OC in cities where it's legal - the gun grab. You in the habit of letting people get that close to you without knowing it in the hills? If not, then OC makes more sense.

If one is most accustomed to a climate controlled environment, it might be a little hard to think of other differences...

Very valid point. And I do walk and hunt through rural but public property. If someone else is carrying a long gun, it’s because the season is open and I’m carrying one too. Otherwise, it might be a cause for alarm. Either way, I approach any visibly armed human in the woods with a prudent measure of caution. Actually, I generally try to give them a wide berth. Hunter’s courtesy. Kinda goes back to that “distance closing” point. Now if someone wants to stalk and shoot me like a game animal, they’re gonna do so. You can’t hide from the possibility of any eventuality. I do see your point about having a ‘surprise’ in store, with a concealed weapon, if held at gunpoint by someone else. But i’m Kind of accepting the fact that could happen, even though I find it highly unlikely it would. In pubic rural land off of hunting season. If i’m Visibly OC’ing a sidearm, i’m Counting on it as a deterrent to dangerous but non-firearm carrying people. Again, if they draw on me and hold me at gun point, well I guess i’m too far up the river to get out.

More on topic with the original post, and although I do not know the conditions or circumstances leading up to the machete attack on the hikers, I think some nut bag with a machete, or knife, or axe or whatever other than a firearm, is going to be somewhat deterred in choosing me as a victim to attack, if he can see I am visibly armed. From whatever distance or cover he’s observing me. And if I was to be bumrushed by some blade wielding freak, in the forest, I would hope I could draw and blast him first. Unencumbered by concealments, i would think it all the easier to do so.

Mr. Harry, good discussion. Thanks.

FreeMe, interesting points. But you assume a lot, incorrectly, and you are condescending as hell. Not to say I think that is news to you or that your care. Or perhaps you think you are witty. Maybe you are . . . to someone.

Open carry in the city allows too many opportunities for someone to grab your gun. I remember a guy sitting at a table behind me in a restaurant, his pistol was available for anyone to grab as they walked between our tables.

Someone gets that close to us out in the woods, we tend to get our guard up.

Most people won't carry an extra pistol mag all day, everyday much less an AR.

Yeah, I'll own that. It was deliberately condescending. Your flippant remarks invited it. As if people don't have valid reasons for carrying differently in different settings. And yeah - I'm still going to assume you haven't tried slinging that AR as you go about daily business, even in private.....or else that business is pretty limited.

Agree.

OC puts one at a disadvantage to a better armed assailant.

CC has the element of surprise, the only advantage one has in such a situation.

OC in the great outdoors, CC in urban settings.

IMO.

DF

^^^^^^^
In general, I don't do flippant remarks. I was trying to have a honest discussion. Apparently Mr. Harry understood my intent.

Of course people have valid reasons for carrying differently in different settings. I often open carry on private land. Repeating myself, but one of the the arguments for concealed carry is not about the gun grab. It is about a predator not knowing you are armed until it is too late. If I understand the argument as many people make it, the assumption is the criminal has decided to act whether you are armed or not, but that they might be less aggressive with their first move if they think you are unarmed. How many times have you heard something like "I don't want the SOB to know I am armed until he is staring down the muzzle"? I've heard it plenty. If that is the argument you make (not saying YOU make it, but many do), is there much difference in city vs. country?

I've never hiked the AT. How close can someone get to you who is overtaking you as far as getting close enough for a gun grab?

When hunting, I carry a rifle around all day. It is usually heavier than an AR. I'm often carrying more weight in a pack. A light AR weighs less than the extra pounds many of us would like to lose.

You can assume whatever you please about what my usual day is and how much time I spend in climate control. But I'll mow about half and acre today, and it won't be a riding mower. Maybe I'll sling an AR and see if it kills me.

I have spent the last week in Cody, Wy. and have been hiking the back country daily. We have seen only 2 small groups of humans but did see Griz tracks along Grace Creek. When I depart the car my G19 goes into an HPG recon kit bag loaded w/ BB 147gr hardcast. When I return I switch mags for 1 loaded w/ 124gr gold dots and the pistol goes into a AIWB holster. Different solutions to differing scenarios, none of which necessitates open carry for me.

I almost always carry a pack w/ an hipbelt and the HPG kitbag has been perfect for me.


mike r

Actually in the wilderness surround C-town he is probably correct. Large portion of that area are still very sparsely poluated

Were I contemplating a long multi state treck on the AT. I don't think something like a pistol caliber lever gun in a trapper configuration would be my choice

As per usual, this thread has wandered into rabbit trails and pissing matches.

I suspect that if the deceased victim had been armed with about anything from a good walking stick to an airweight pocket pistol, and been of a mind to use what he had, he'd be with us yet today.
I am saddened that so much of our society fails to grasp this reality.

Agree and well stated.

DF

LOL, well, there are several different kinds of holey, I believe they all would have been visited at games end.

one never knows what the Lord will bring to our doorsteps, but the Boy scouts had it right for a long long time. "Be Prepared".

Normally I'd want the concessions, popcorn sales, etc.

BUT, afraid it'd be over before I could sell tickets...

DF