I might have an opportunity for a used ULA/NULA at some point here, or to have something built. I’ll probably ditch some other, ‘good’ rifles to get one ‘great’ rifle. Thinking 280AI for all-around, or? Light enough gun to like carrying, good enough stock to not care that it’s so light. Accurate, dependable, and something you want to pick up every day for a deer stand or 5-days in the mountains, for everything short of big bears. Suppressor ready is best idea, but might live without it for the right gun.

Anyhoo, question is: would an ULA/NULA be ‘THE’ rifle for that mindset, or some other build?

Years ago, I apprenticed under a rifle builder….but could never afford something like that. I’ve always bought quality firearms, shot a lot, and have some very good stuff. Honestly, never believed in a ‘need’ for a true custom. Still not sure there is any need. Just have a hankering to have one top tier hunting rifle to wrap up the dance over the next however many years/decades God gives me.

I'd stay S/A and 8" RPM 7-08,is without peer. Hint..............

Nula/ULA in 284 Winchester is what is stuck in my mind as being my all around perfect gun. But hard to find and would take selling several others that I might like too much to part with so I still don’t have one.

I could see the 284. As much as I like the 7-08, the 284/280 offer more with heavier stuff, on game… in my mind. I don’t need heavies and fast twisted barrels for my hunting ranges. I need the occasional heavy in something like a 7 for bigger animals. I’d probably lean 308 over 7-08, as well….if I was stuck on a short action. I could always throw a 7-08 or 308 on my Adirondack action, and live with the mag box, as well. That’d work to some degree, also. I have some rifles I like. There is just a NULA 280 AI around that is starting to temp me. I’m not bent on seeing how much I can stuff in an action to have less bolt cycle or 1/2” in length. I’d rather have an 18-20” barrel for suppressor use on a long action than 22-24” of non threaded on a short action. JMO.

I've killed a lot of bears and deer with Savage 99's in 284.

If I weren’t so old and creaky, I’d have a 8” 7-08 barrel fitted to my Heym 98 that’s currently a .308, and go forth and slay…

but I am, so I won’t. It’s a fine thing to contemplate though…. geezer daydreamin’🤔

If "THE" rifle is a NULA for you, get it. For some, it may be a pre 64 model 70, or even a classic model 70 or a Tikka. To each their own in that department. I'll guarantee the Tikka is going to shoot better, but be a little heavier than a NULA, and cost a schit ton less. I have a lot of "THE" rifles in the safe..

If you have an 308win Adirondak I'd reckon that is an very good place to be.

Can't think of a better one-rifle solution. Go for it!

When I put together my "nicest" pre 64 M70 a few years back I chose 280 AI, I have no regrets.

If I were buying (1) "good" rifle, it sure as heck wouldn't be a NULA.

If there’s no ‘why’, there’s usually no ‘what’.

The OP's trying to figure out what one perfect rifle to buy, and you spew some philosophical bullshit!

Oh . . . Wait . . . you are the OP!

You`re going to get 10 thousand "opinions". None will be the answer you`re looking for. Get what floats the boat, and be happy with it.

If you don't handload, the 308 is a solid choice with lots of ammo options.

Just read the comments. I’m okay with someone saying to not lean towards a rifle make, but at least tell me ‘why’.

I’ve kinda always wanted an ULA/NULA, so that’s part of it. If it’s not that, I’d lean more to something 3-lug, for clearance.

That's my kind of "THE" rifle.

Well, I'm not getting any younger so maybe finding a NULA in the cartridge I want just might be the best option. Since getting a full blown custom these days made the way I would like it is something I just don't think I'd live long enough to happen. The rifle would be based on a commercial Mauser action, most likely an FN. Barrel would be 24" with the original 8.25" twist. Wood would be a fine piece of fancy walnut. The components would be turned over to someone like Darcy Echols, preferably him but if too busy to one, to a builder he might recommend. Did I mention that if that were to happen I probably would not live long enough? PS, I'm currently 85 and fighting my way toward 86. What are the odds?????????????? What cartridge? A 7x57 of course.
PJ

Before you sell a bunch of rifles to fund an ULA/NULA, make sure you handle one. The stocks don't work so well for some people, and the rifles themselves have some idiosyncrasies. Also, you're talking about setting it up for a suppressor and yet also taking it in the mountains - those are two different things and should be two different rifles. A regular 22-24" barrel plus a suppressor kinda sucks for everything. But packing even a shorter barreled rifle with a can up a mountain isn't great either, as it's unnecessary weight and if you're worried about your hearing for a single shot at mountain game, a pair of foam ear plugs is a lot lighter proposition.

You'd want to be sure you want a very light rifle (if in 280AI, .308) with a blind magazine.

ULA, NULA, and Current Wilson Combat NULA's are all nice firearms. I did not care for the stock on the ULA and NULA rifles but others like them. Tulsa Gun Show is this weekend and that would be the best place to find one to check out the stock etc.


Good luck in your search!

Same here.

Pappy, do it. Something new to play with will keep you young!

300 has a great point .. Up until his death, Elmer Keith was building and designing cartridges. I am convinced that helps keep us going.

Yeah….probably wasn’t clear about barrel length vs suppressor vs ‘mountain’ stuff: I’m not likely suppressing any barrel over 18”. If it’s not threaded, I don’t care if it’s 22-24”. I doubt I’m climbing/packing myself in for any backpack hunts. I might do horses or hunt some other way, one day. I can hike the terrain, I just can’t carry the load on my back anymore, thanks to Uncle Sam. Western hunts would all be one offs from normal use. I might just need a 280/7-08/270 or such and a 9.3 safe weight.

That’s what the China Doll is for. Works pretty well except for this damn knee….

It sure does. Even though, I have many "THE" rifles in the safe, that does not stop me from looking for more. Life is too short. Most of us here enjoy our hobby with a passion. Some of us are damn lucky, from the sounds of it, that we know what we like by now.

That’s where I’d be, too, except I might go 7CM.

7mm-08 will stabilize Barnes 171 grain match burner and, better yet, a 160 grain TSX. If I needed anything bigger a 30-06 would be in order.

I like the 7-08, but if I’m not restricted to a short action, why wouldn’t launching 160s and heavier 7mm pills be better if launched faster? I see zero reason for a 7-08 if I’m not stuck on a short action for a build. I’m not. I’m also not worried about what something does past 4-500. I’m more concerned what it does from 0-300. Even if I screwed a 7-08 tube on my Kimber, it wouldn’t feed heavies seated out without a lot of work. I wouldn’t care, either. I’d be perfectly happy with 120s-140s and letting it do 7-08 stuff. A 308 might make more (all around, hunting) sense, if I’m constrained to a short action, most days. As it sits, in 6.5 it’s no slouch for deer work and only gripe is it needs some smoothing out on the bolt/feeding vs other stuff.

Buy a Cooper

Why should I?…..vs other stuff? Are the really Cooper anymore, or Nighthawk of Arkansas, Kinda like Wilson? Not that it matters, but just trying to figure out why I’d spend $3k on one vs other stuff.

Even more reason to go 6.5 CM or 7 CM over something that burns more powder. JMO, but for 0-300, you'd be better served by something that is more fun/inexpensive to shoot than something with more displacement. Having said that, logic only goes so far here, and if you just simply want a NULA in .280AI, then get it.

Running suppressed, 308 vs 7-08 vs 6.5 recoil difference is negligible to me. More displacement would broaden my game spectrum that way….but I do agree it’s fun to shoot lighter stuff more and 6.5 is pretty cheap right now. My loading bench and gear is packed away in a shipping container until I can get my farm renovation done and shop built. I live with over the counter until then, which does suck in a lot of ways.

@OP, do you like the ULA/NULA ergonomics? At one point in time I had both NULA 270 and a Kimber Ascent 270. Strongly preferred the ergonomics of the Kimber. Unfortunately Kimber swore to never build another left hand rifle. Eventually sold both of them. Currently five Ascents on GB in 280AI. If I were right handed that would be my one and done factory rifle. As above, JMO.

I do like the Montana stock….original gray one is what’s on my 18” 6.5 Adirondack. Recoil with or without a suppressor, recoil is negligible for a very light rifle.

I actually like your idea of a 280 AI. Might be hard to find in a ULA or NULA but certainly worth loking for.

simple answer: Because you asked for "The rifle". Cooper is the easy answer and I've had 3 NULA's (all returned for warranty).

As for the $3,000 comment you made, I would rather spend it on a Cooper than a NULA.

Hope I answered your questions.

Actually, you’re making me want to run away from Cooper.

You’ve given zero reasons why a cooper is the answer, except for ‘NULA bad’, and that it’s marked ‘Cooper’.

I’m no more and just as suspect of Cooper’s quality or service as I am a newer version of the NULA, due to changes in origin, owner, service, etc.

I know should probably just have something built. I’m just getting input on other options.

You have a PM

That’s where I would disagree. Bullet technology has made all the difference in terminal effectiveness. In the last few years, we’ve been killing game from pronghorns, WT, and MD to elk and moose with the 6.5CM, 7-08, etc. As long as it arrives with enough velocity to expand, it’s all about the bullet selection and placement. IME, more velocity will extend the effective range of bullet expansion, but it won’t make the bullet kill bigger critters.

Cheap, fun practice leads to greater bullet placement effectiveness.

I haven’t played with a NULA, but I much prefer the Montana ergos to those of the FC. I would want to play with whatever you decide on before committing to it as your “one rifle.”

My formal NULA is a 284 with a 22” barrel. It’s pretty much a do-all.

I have guns setup to accept a suppressor, but not this one. The fangs things increase OAL and add weight. It defeats the purpose of a light, compact, packable rifle.

I have a NIB CLR 30-06 I bought recently that I’m kicking around ideas with because I “think” I might want it to be a Whelen. For a one and only, though, going with a Model 20 or 24 in 284/308/270/280/30-06 is not a bad move at all.

Oh, I ‘can’ make stuff dead with lighter stuff and picking the right bullets/placement. I’ve done that for years. I’ve got light stuff that’s fun to shoot all day. The lighter stuff with good bullets/placement wasn’t as good as bigger stuff, all else equal, for how fast stuff died, how easy it was to find, and less mental gymnastics on shot angles to get to vitals or get an exit. I get it. I just don’t consider the results to be ‘identical’, nor the versatility….at least the bigger stuff gets. It’s just a minor difference, as I run 6.5 & 7-08 for deer, among others. I think they’re great in that role. I think they’ll work well on some bigger stuff. I just don’t think you can logically say they’ll work better than something ‘more’ if all else is equal….other than having less recoil.

Agreed. A long action cartridge for a short barrel suppressor ready rifle doesn’t jive either. Use a SA cartridge that can still perform out of a 18” ish barrel. I believe I’d be a 7-08, 6.5 CM, or a 6mm flavor.

I thought about doing that with my CLR until I shot it. It's one of the most accurate rifles I've owned

I'm sure you can.


Having been in on the killing of a few boat loads of BG animals, using all sorts of cartridges and bullets, based on my experience and observations I would disagree with the bolded statement. The influence of caliber and cartridge on terminal performance and killing effectiveness is negligible (within reason), compared to bullet selection and placement, IME. As mentioned, I've killed and seen killed a bunch of big critters like caribou, elk, bears, and moose, with 6mm to 7mm SA cartridges and bigger LA cartridges. Animals shot with similar shot placement and bullet performance all seemed to die about the same, regardless of caliber or cartridge.

IME, the killing effect is similar, but the likelihood of practice with smaller rounds is higher, and the likelihood of better shot placement is also consequently higher, so I do say that the smaller rounds typically work better than larger rounds, all things considered. I've observed a higher ratio of effective kill shots by guys shooting smaller rounds and a higher ratio of poor shot placement and ineffective shots by guys using larger rounds.

Seems I've heard someone say before that bullets matter more than headstamps, and IME, that is very true.

BUT, as I mentioned before, logic sometimes has little to do with rifle choice. If you simply want the .280AI, I get it. If our rifle choices were purely based on logic, we would each have one rifle, chambered in something between 6 CM and .30-06, and we would proceed to put meat in the freezer.

Maybe the 22 Creedmoor is his best choice? Have the big bears have been ruled out?

It's not like he's wanting a 300 Ultramag. The 280AI is a very manageable round that is easy to master.

By his "logic" maybe a 284 bullet moving 300fps faster will offer more expansion to damage tissue and/or will penetrate deeper for larger animals or difficult shot angles.

Apparently his experience with headstamps is different than yours. It doesn't make his choice illogical.

I still need to scope it and out some rounds through it.

My "The" rifle is a 03A3 Springfield in 280AI. Hardly use it.

Throw up a pic.

I was debating the generalized statement that I bolded.

Yes, I understand and agree about his thought process.

I’ve killed a bunch of deer, elk and antelope with nothing more than a 30-06. My dad guided elk hunters back in the golden era of hunting before fast twist and hyperbole took over. He used a 30-06, so that pretty much set me up for what I would be using due to the experience and influence of a father.

Fast forward a few decades, and my evaluation would be a bit different. It depends on what game you hunt and I find most of my game would be easily dispatched with a 270 Winchester and 130 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips. The 6.5 Creedmoor has nothing on the 270 and fast twist is for insecure shooters that will always claim bullet placement is the most important aspect of shooting game, but still rely on fast twist and cutting edge ballistics.

I prefer a 300 WBY for elk, but have killed elk with the 270 and know also, that tons of elk have died at the hands of a rifleman and a 270 Winchester.

KIS is the principle and 270 is the ruler…

I’ve caveated the caliber discussions wit ‘all else being equal’. I’m not sure I’m conveying the point adequately?

Folks love the ‘bullets over headstamps’ mantra, and it IS true. However, is also true that if the bullets are EQUAL in quality, (hence, a ‘better’ bullet is moot) then the other performance on game factors such as velocity, weight, expansion, and penetration lean towards whichever BULLET has more velocity, weight, expansion, and penetration.

I also never said short actions won’t work, OR that practice isn’t important. I merely stated that not restricting ones self to a short case, means you don’t have short case restrictions. It’s far easier to load for less recoil than it is to exceed case capacity. I get the lighter recoil/cheaper to shoot angle, and that’s why I have lighter recoiling calibers that I shoot a lot. Just because my 223 and 7-08 or 6.5 might be a smidge more fun to shoot, doesn’t mean I’m less accurate with something larger or that I’m gonna shoot crappy bullets at game with it.

….and I do have an early stainless 700 Mtn in a Ti stock, in the dreaded 270 sitting around. I guess I already have ‘the rifle’, according to some?….or the most worthless cartridge ever devised, short of the 30-06, according to others. At least it seems to like 140s.

So did you have those .30/06's rebarralled to slow em down a bit, since you don't need a fast twist?

Not arguing but curious what makes a .270 superior to a 30'06? Seems like a 30'06 can do everything a .270 can but not vice vera.

A 270 with a 130 grain ballistic tip is easily a 3150 fps bullet. Very flat and more than adequate for deer and antelope sized game. More time hunting smaller animals than elk, makes the 270 a great choice. If I was going elk hunting, I would take the 300 WBY. If I was hunting deer with my 270 and saw an elk, I would shoot it with the 270…

You don’t understand ballistics or cartridges enough to answer. 30-06 barrels were never designed with fast twist in mind…

How did I open this up and know I would find the 300 Weatherby mentioned?

Yet they were, and are. 1:10 IS a "fast" twist for 30 cal. Hence the reason that it shoots all bullet weights from 110-220+ grainers. Just like the 6.5x55 and 7x57 with their 1:7.7 and 1:8.6 twists. They had it right way back when, because they KNEW it was needed.

Have you considered the Merkel K5 in 7x65R?

I don't know what you mean about insecure shooters or cutting edge ballistics, but Nosler load data for the 120 BT from a 6.5 Creedmoor essentially matches the 270 load with 130. The 7-08 with 120 BT exceeds it. BC is similar for all three bullets.

lol….had not considered a Merkel….or any other break action or single shot. I’ve got an encore. I could dig a straight pull, Helix or other stuff like it, as long as it was within reason on $ and didn’t weight 10# and feel full of gravel like the Savage abortion.

On another note: apples to apples, while you can do a lot by handloading the 7-08 or the 6.5, you can do more by handloading a 270, as well. I’ve got all three. For deer, there’s little difference in any to my mind. For factory fodder and handloads, the differences between all three is splitting hairs overall, but probably leans 270 at TYPICAL hunting ranges with comparable bullet weights. Just no way around displacement for horsepower, though you can argue over fuel economy and turbo BCs all you like.

Ron Spomer says it well…

https://www.ronspomeroutdoors.com/blog/6-5-creedmoor-versus-270-winchester

Picked up a stainless M70, so maybe it’ll turn into something.

Worth reading as many times as it takes for one to understand it !

Shrapnel said it best. Also he has the EXPERIENCE with those cartridges. I came to the same realization with a 270 win after being a die hard 30-06 guy. That 270 with a 130 is wicked. It behaves like a 264 win mag or even a 7 rem with 140s. Everyone can CM this and CM that, the 270 win a superior hunting cartridge. It's really not a debate.

I’d go Pre 64 in a 270 or 30-06.

"Safe Weight"... that's the quote of the month! Thanks for the chuckle.


As most know here, I've owned a pile of Kimber MT's, and also had two Fieldcrafts. I've handled several ULA's. I definitely prefer Melvin's stock to the Fieldcraft, but I prefer the Montana to either those.

Also, I'm not a fan of the Fieldcraft/NULA "bolt gap"... the bolt is shrunk to save weight and is a nice entry port for all manner of devilment. Not what I'd want on a "THE rifle."



I'm beyond anyone advising me on what I should do. I've bought, built, owned enough rifles to have definite likes and dislikes. However, I'm not so stuck that I can't learn a thing or two; and I do, often.

For me (NB "for me"), a THE rifle should be in a standard chambering (6.5CM, 270, 308W, 30-06, 7mm RM, etc). A cartridge that can be found in any gas station in Montana, so forget about stuff like the 280 ai. If I wanted to use a suppressor, I'd lean toward a long action since with a 17- 18" bbl it will essentially end up equaling a SA with a 22-24" bbl. Speed still matters. Otherwise, I like SA cartridges, with the 308 Win being my all-time favorite. Logic has nothing to do with it, I just like it. The trick is YOU need to know what YOU like and do that. Just like no one can pick a wife for you, no one can tell you which cartridge should trip your wire. As the kids say, "you do you." In your shoes, I'd take your Kimber Adirondak and rebarrel it in something that speaks to me with a 22-23" bbl. I'd dupe the factory contour, but have it heavier from the forend to muzzle, finishing up around .625."

Here in Montana, if a new hunter asks, I tell them get a Tikka T3 in 270 Win, and put a 3-9 Burris Ballistic Plex on top. That's all you need to know about rifles for the rest of your life (could also add, 6.5 CM or 308).

Aside, I own three 308's, two 6.5 CM's, a 270 Win, and a 257 Rob. I could easily do everything, deer to elk, with any of those.

If it’s truly a “300 yards on in” rifle the vast majority of cartridge sturm und drang is basically moot. So it really just comes down to what’s going to make YOU happy? Seems from here that the type of game, terrain, and how *you* prefer to hunt would be the defining elements there. Most of my big game animals have been blacktail, around 30 of them, and ironically (given how much $$$, time, hair-pulling, and effort I’ve poured into long range stuff) what rocks my huntin’ world is sneaking around in the PNW rainforest, whacking blacktail with my .358 Model 7. I mean, heck, in truth a .358 could even be a 300-yard rifle… not a very good one, lol, but it’d do it.

I’m personally a fan of short actions… but then of course the ol’ brain gets to thinking about how to maximize things within that constraint… so the last decade or so I’ve been exploring the short-fats. The issue there is usually brass availability… at any rate, my Kimber MT is a 7 WSM and that’s a great rifle right there. I have (3) 7 WSM’s and IF a guy could get brass, that would be my slam dunk recommendation. But you can’t get brass. The other one I’ve been having fun with is 6.5 GAP4S, aka 6.5 SAUM… GAP offers decent Hornady brass for it off and on but… really, 6.5 PRC would be a safer bet and is basically the same thing.

My Kimber 7 WSM bore the brunt of my long-range learning and is due for a new barrel. Since I’m set up for 6.5 GAP (including reamer and gauges) I’m inclined to retube it to that, just for grins. And that’s how I’ll wrap this up: it’s ALL just for grins. To thine own self be true, as the wise bear once said.

I have two safes full of "the rifle" and will probably ad more.....

i've come toreally be impressed by my model 70 fwt in 280 shooting 140 gr Nosler partitions

i gave up worrying about "best" rifle, I hunt with a 375 Ruger Alaskan.

Seems to work.

BMT

A rifle problem,
On one hand you want one for every occasion.
On the other you keep searching for The One, that's perfect for everything!



Not an uncommon syndrome!😁😁

Some might consider it a sickness.... I have embraced it .....

You could have saved a few keystrokes and just told everyone you didn't understand exterior ballistics or SAMMI dimensions controlling chambers and ammo.

If one is going to use 130grs of bullet (and I do very, very often) then it's proper to reap the bennys of .264 inches of diameter and the Creedmoor case.

Less recoil, better bullet performance, much better accuracy, and more retained velocity at range meaning more REACH.

You are right in that it's not a debate, it's just objective facts.

Burns is right for once

Someone finally came along and said it! A 270 might have worked for 80 years, but once the Creed showed up, it started bouncing off game. Deer, elk, squirrels. You name it. A 130 grainer in .270 can barely even penetrate cardboard well enough to sight in. Why can't you losers figure this out? Stick has been trying to teach you for years. But he can't do it alone! Now John Burns is carrying the torch, too! THE MOVEMENT IS GROWING! ALL THAT MATTERS IS ENERGY AND DROP AT 1000 YARDS. IT DOESN'T MATTER IF YOU'LL NEVER SHOOT THAT FAR. OR HALF THAT FAR. IT'S JUST WHAT MATTERS.

John, I've seen you make some bombs and I know you get it. But come on, that CM is a man bun dude. If I'm running a 6.5, it'll be a 264 wm or a 6.5x284, and i have. But THE RIFLE, needs more than 6.5 in my opinion. I like that 270, always will. A 280 and 06 will always get it done. They aren't cool, I get it, but they are proven. Over 100 years of proof.

Exterior ballistics. Lmao. Who gives a schit.

WHO GIVES A [bleep] ABOUT EXTERIOR BALLISTICS?! Apparently you haven't tried to kill a large game animal with a 270, 280, or 06 lately. At 4000 yards, the 270 is carrying ZERO foot pounds of energy, which clearly means any cartridge invented before 2001 is an obsolete toy. WHY WON'T YOU LISTEN?!

I know. Hold still deer while I get out my kestrel and level my rifle that shoots a 140 grain bullet sub sonic. Or. You can just set that bi%ch 1.75 inches high at 100 and zap stuff to 250. Then guess what, if you do have to make a longer shot, like 500 or so, you give you scope about 30 clicks and drill it.

Among all the ideas and feelings of adequacy, Bob Hagel still makes a good point that few people recognize…



You should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everything goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." -Bob Hagel

Once again. The truth.
People forget that 06 not only covers the continent from Prarie dogs to bears, it also ended the Jap and Nazi B.S.. , who by the way used 6.5s and 7mms. But they had exterior ballistics....

I am just stirring the pot a bit in good 24hr CF tradition.

That said if you want to proclaim the .270 Win is "superior" you should be prepared for a bit of stirring of your pot.

All in good fun.

Same here. I was kinda hoping stick would get in on this one.
For what it's worth, I don't think the 270 is the best ever, I just think it's a better application for hunting big game. I like a 264 wm, 7 rem, 300 win, stw, rums, and did I mention I like a 30-06?

The rifle for different species, I could do it all with an 06 improved and a fast twist 243 win. At least for the states I hunt.

Stick doesn't have time for this. He's too busy trying to EDUCATE EVERYONE BECAUSE PEOPLE LIKE YOU WON'T LISTEN AND LEARN. Back in the 80s I worked in a saw shop with a guy who cut off his thumb trimming hedges. Best hedge trimmer in Alaska. And that's why if you aren't dialing your scope at least 50 clicks on every single shot your rifle is a POS. Think about it: a 30-06 drops 342 feet at 3000 yards. I've even seen a 30-30 round start to move backwards at 500 yards. Any animal you see "killed" with one of these imagination pretend "cartridges" is AI generated. You literally can't make this stuff up. It's science.

The only pot you're stirring has a flusher on it. You know as well as I do that at +700' sea level and within 300 miles of a Peruvian polar vortex the .280 loses roughly 89.57% of its penetration. Putting green tape on the scope will recover 11% of that but the other 78.57 is gone forever. And you think you're going to draw blood with it inside of 200 yards? WHY DO YOU KEEP SPREADING MISINFORMATION? Stick can't keep doing this all by himself.

Your hunting and shooting is parametric, you can pick something that works or you can pick something that works, is low recoil and shoots ballistically efficient bullets. Either way I suggest something mainstream and not something that resides down a rabbit hole.

Want to know why the Japanese lost, grab an arisaka and work the bolt. They were never gonna win with that pile as their main rifle. I have one, took me about 15 seconds to figure out why there are no notches in the stock.

[quote=hh4whiskey]I might have an opportunity for a used ULA/NULA at some point here, or to have something built. I’ll probably ditch some other, ‘good’ rifles to get one ‘great’ rifle. Thinking 280AI for all-around, or? Light enough gun to like carrying, good enough stock to not care that it’s so light. Accurate, dependable, and something you want to pick up every day for a deer stand or 5-days in the mountains, for everything short of big bears. Suppressor ready is best idea, but might live without it for the right gun.

Anyhoo, question is: would an ULA/NULA be ‘THE’ rifle for that mindset, or some other build?

For me it is "The" Kimber Montana. My favorite is a .30-06. I find the NULA stocks do not fit me very well where the Kimbers perform very well. Also, I prefer the Kimber 3-position safety on the bolt and a floated barrel.

I pondered one in .280 AI and it appears capable of performing very well. However, I do find a 165 grain .30 caliber handload comes close enough to any .280 AI load I am aware of to keep me happy. Also, some of the 200 grain bullets work very well in an '06 elkish game. Frankly, the main rason I prefer the '06 is availability if I run out of ammo.

I do have two other Kimbers, a Hunter in 6.5 Creedmoor and a .375 H&H Talkeetna. Their stocks also fit well.

The Japs lost because the were communist sacks of schit and tried to mess with America.

Tell that to Charles Sheldon, who was using a 6.5 Mannlicher on brown bears, moose and sheep before the 30-06 was generally available. Or all the dead moose slain by Norwegians and Swede's using the 6.5x55 which appeared in 1894. Killing is about a quality bullet in the right spot - it's just not that complicated. It's the platform that holds the cartridge, and the optic that sits on it which more defines "THE rifle" than what it's chambered in, though I'd still be inclined it be chambered in a widely available round.

Uh, ok.

😉😉😉
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Buford,

Joining in November, you have a unique understanding of Big Stick for only being here a couple weeks or so…

I am pretty sure there is even more to that executive summary.

Dancing Bear makes some excellent points about the Kimber in .30’06,
but for my preference at that recoil level , I would choose the Kimber Mt in plain 280 Rem for the panache and smooth feeding

bbl 22” / 24” Lilja twisted and throated to suit. Magazine length dictates a lot.

Hand loaded of course, there’s just not much factory 280 Rem on the shelves , Ha

In the NULA 24, I’d most definitely choose a 280 AI / 24”.

Not sure how a suppressor would impact this build,
might change things to a 7 PRC on a NULA 28 w / 20” bbl for similar down range performance

First of all, I've been lurking here since the late 80s. Used to cut big timber with a guy who invented WiFi. I never thought things would get so bad that I would have to make an account but Stick can't do this all by himself anymore.

Second, how many rifles does Stick have to throw in the creek before you'll listen? HOW MANY SCOPES HAVE TO BE TAPED? HOW MANY STOCKS HAVE TO BE PAINTED HIDEOUS COLORS BEFORE YOU'LL SEE THE LIGHT? He does it all for you guys and you just won't learn.

You do have a lot in common with Big Stick.

He knows how to ruin a rifle and brag about it.

Liars do lie, this site hasn’t even here since the late 80’s

Logger that invented Wi-Fi had to be Al Gore.

And I’m sure he is proud to have you as a comrade in harms…

Listen. You've clearly never run a 1200cc saw 800 feet up in a slash pine in southern Wisconsin with 20 other loggers pounding hard ciders and singing Christmas carols in German. STICK HAS DONE THAT. That's how he knows a 257 Roberts became a pellet gun when the 6 Creed came out.

ALL STICK WANTS TO DO IS TEACH YOU WHICH CARTRIDGES WILL BOUNCE OFF OF DEER AND ELK. If you keep this up, he's going to have to post a picture of destroyed scope rings and a 4 point black tail. Why do you make him do it? Why won't you just throw a few rifles in the creek and LEARN FROM IT?!

Shrapnel - I do my best to stay out of Stick and Burns debates. That said, my read on Buford is that he's meant to be satirical. Unless scope tape really does increase penetration? 😂😇

THE ONLY THING SATIRICAL IS YOUR MATH SKILLS. A 30-30 drops 547 feet at 400 yards with -1300# of energy. Based on those numbers, and the fact that I ran a 900HP Yamaha with a 9 foot bar on a Christmas tree farm in Rockies cutting down 7 trees at a time, it's a scientific fact that a .270 can't kill deer past 17 yards. STOP RESISTING AND LEARN.

I don't think it increases penetration, but when properly applied it does make it harder to withdraw.

Not really. They bombed Pearl Harbor.
That makes them communist sacks of schit who messed with America. Then we kicked their jap azz. The end.

The Japanese had a fascist regime leading up to and during WW2. Fascists hated communists (think Nazis and Soviets...). So, yes, bombed Pearl Harbor. No on communism.

Hell yeah... trust the science

Comparison of the 6.5 CM and 270 Win reveals the 270 Win may still be the best big game mountain/alpine/field carry chamber around outfitted with 22-inch barrel. When both are loaded with 143 and 145 eld-x bullets the 270 Win outperforms the 6.5 CM well past 500 yards and at 300 yards is significantly more potent in velocity and impact energy. You can make the case regarding recoil between the two, but honestly the 270 Win is a pussycat and far from teeth rattling. Perhaps the 6.5 CM is more accurate at 1,000 yards, but a 270 Win is plenty accurate at any sane hunting ranges and certainly at 500 yards. The 270 Win has around 200 fps greater velocity and around 230 ft-lbs more energy at impact at 300 yards. The 6.5 CM has a 0.10” less WD at 300 yards.

At 500 yards with 10 rpm twist the 270 Win still hold the edge at 150 fps greater impact velocity, shooting 6” flatter and retaining 180 ft-lbs greater impact energy, while only being 0.50” greater in wind drift in comparison to the 6.5 CM at 500 yards.

After 100 years with the 270 Win, the most modern of chambers such as the 6.5 Creedmoor can’t get by the 270 Win until you get out to around 700 yards. Nothing new here to see except the 270 Win with 10 rpm can still hunt with best of them with power to spare on big animals no matter what bias is brought into the conversation.

A 6.5 lbs, 22-inch barreled 270 Win rifle makes for a great carry gun that is performing at magnum speeds without the barrel length and recoil of a magnum.

Yup.
Just a great American hunting round.

280 rem with a 140 is pretty impressive as well.

No, Ross. This isn't how math works. Back when I was cutting down giant sequoias with a 1400cc hawgmaster and a 16 foot bar, I watched a guy try to shoot a squirrel at 500 yards with a .270. The squirrel caught the bullet and threw it on the ground. Now, if we're talking 1500 to 1700 feet above sea level and ocean temps in the Atlantic are below their 100 year average south of the Titanic wreck, a .270 firing a 130 grain goya bean beer can slammer is going to drop 127.5609945897 inches at 300 yards and will only have 19# of energy left. Good luck killing elk with that, Ross. NOW do you see why Stick has to throw rifles in the creek? HE DOES IT FOR ALL OF US. BECAUSE YOU POST THINGS LIKE THIS. STOP AND LEARN SOMETHING.

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means

I also have trouble grasping the recoil argument from some folks. I have a Kimber Adirondack in 6.5CM. A 7-8# 270 isn’t much (if any) step up in recoil, and running suppressed, it’s even less.

I never noticed much difference between a 6.5cm M70 FWT and a 280 M70 FWT. But I could definitely see a 10 year old feeling the difference.

Running suppressed, either is somewhere between a 223 and a 243, to me. Suppressors solve more issues than just noise.

Ok , I gotta bite , 8” 7-08 ? Kenneth

8" twist