so on temporary hiatus to ft.irwin, due to some obligations to uncle sam, long story short i have plenty of time to dream about home and what i wanna pack when i do make it back. so heres my thoughts, ive used a m70 ewss in 300 wm and a ruger hawkeye alaskan in 375 ruger both with sucess, imo the rugers a better round and the m70 was a better rifle, in fact i really like 375s and leupold vx3i 2.5x8s, id like to get a stainless montana action, stainless 3 contour 24 inch kreiger barrel fluted brown precision kevlar poundr, necg sights sourdough style front, with a vx3i 2.5x8 in talley lw,s 375 wby or rum, with a generous length mag box, intended projectiles would be 250 grain ttsx or gmx, but perferably the 270 grain lrx, or perhaps one of the cutting edge options, if the mag box would tolerate it, metalwork would be done in a dark tungsten gray, with black in the flutes,with stock done in a dark forest green with speckles, hopefully hopefully 8.5 lbs scoped loaded slung ready to hunt.
Sounds like a very nice rifle. I personally would stick with the 375 Ruger for my cartridge choice. I have an Alaskan 375 Ruger that I had re-barreled, was suppose to be 23" but turned out 23.5", McMillan Ruger Classic stock, barrel band NECG front sight, factory rear sight, Spec-Tec trigger. I like the rifle, but use more often a 20" factory Alaskan with a McMillan stock and Spec-Tec trigger. I have been using the 270 grain TSX for moose and no complaints with them. I do have some of the 270 LRX that I want to load.
The 375 WBY has been temptingly. I still occasionally think of rechambering a M70 stainless 375 H&H to it. But, with equal barrel lengths, I don't think that I would gain much over the Ruger cartridge.
Sounds like a sweet pkg.! That’s about 9 ounces lighter than my .375 AI. A very doable shooting and carry weight. If you get that....you can rid yourself of all the other rifles you have! memtb
im kinda workin on the 4 rifle battery idea, general purpose the 375 along the lines of what i mentioned in my op, then a fast 6.5 for for bou in the winter, a 30 cal set up as a mountain rifle, and a real fast 22 probably a 22-06 ai setup for the longest heaviest highest bc .224 projectiles i can find, other than that id like to have a pair of 22 mags 1 rifle 1 pistol, and a pair of 22 lrs 1 rifle 1 pistol, my xframe works great as a fishin pistol, gotta couple of semi small 9mms for when i go to town, and im ambivelant about shotguns any 12ga pump or auto that goes bang works for me, ideally all the main rifles mentioned would be built on the same action same scope etc, and other than the fast 22 id like them to all have the same parent case, ie if i built a 375 ai or wby id go 6.5 300 wby and 300 wby, and so on and so forth, so whats that make 10? , but yes i could skip the 6.5 and the 300, and make due with a 22 mag rifle and a 22 lr pistol the xframe ive already got, and skip the 9mm and the shotgun altogether
Or......you could build a rifle as you described, in the AI or Weatherby, and forget about the others. Except maybe.....the hot rod .22 ! It makes life simple! I realize that what I suggested is “blasphemy” to the “rifle looney “.....but, it’s worked for me since 1990! memtb
i dont disagree, honestly even the 22 centerfire is really optional, truth is my observations are something along the lines of its little so use a 22, or its fairly big and or the bears are awake so a big riffle is totally appropriate, fact my favorite combo is rifle for whatever is primary and pistol for secondary, ie 375 and a 22 pistol, or a 22 wmr rifle with the ole 500 smith on my chest. really like the 22 wmr with fmj,s center punched many a spruce hen with no real meat damage.
You make an especially sound choice with the option of either a scope or irons. The only thing I'd change in your plans is forget the .375 RUM and stick with the H&H, Ruger, or Weatherby for brass availability.
most likely course of action is the ruger, throted to tolerate 3.7 or so col, with a wby style freebore, read a very interesting article on real guns, where the author setup a cz 550 and got some impressive velocities out of it.
Personally if I wanted to use lighter then 300gr. bullets in a 375 caliber I would of went with 35 caliber or 338 caliber. I load Nosler 300gr. Accubond and Woodleigh 350gr. PP bullets in my Ruger 375 Guide Gun. I have killed deer and elk with the Nosler 300gr. Accubond bullets and very happy with results. With Nosler 300gr. Accubond bullets chronographed at 2590fps average velocites in my 20" barrel. Woodleigh 350gr. PP bullets are 2391fps average. I haven't shot any game with the 350gr. bullets yet. But I don't need anymore velocity in shooting in the 375 caliber. I get less blood shot and wasted meat with the heavier lower velocity bullets. Like a sledge hammer compared to a ball peen hammer. Just my 2 cents worth.
having used the 250 gr gmx on several eatin critters, they behave just like the barnes good expansion high weight retention and 2 holes, i too would prefer more weight but what ive used so far works great
im kinda workin on the 4 rifle battery idea, general purpose the 375 along the lines of what i mentioned in my op, then a fast 6.5 for for bou in the winter, a 30 cal set up as a mountain rifle, and a real fast 22 probably a 22-06 ai setup for the longest heaviest highest bc .224 projectiles i can find, other than that id like to have a pair of 22 mags 1 rifle 1 pistol, and a pair of 22 lrs 1 rifle 1 pistol, my xframe works great as a fishin pistol, gotta couple of semi small 9mms for when i go to town, and im ambivelant about shotguns any 12ga pump or auto that goes bang works for me, ideally all the main rifles mentioned would be built on the same action same scope etc, and other than the fast 22 id like them to all have the same parent case, ie if i built a 375 ai or wby id go 6.5 300 wby and 300 wby, and so on and so forth, so whats that make 10? , but yes i could skip the 6.5 and the 300, and make due with a 22 mag rifle and a 22 lr pistol the xframe ive already got, and skip the 9mm and the shotgun altogether
Probably should get a 45-70 Lever Action of some sort.
Probably should get a high quality Loaner.
Probably should get a general hunting rifle for your significant other.
Probably should get a EBR just because it makes lib pinkies on the Coasts go Apoplectic.
Probably should get four 22lrs for various elements(10/22, Marlin 60 or a Browning auto) for rabbits.
Probably should get a CRF 458 Win mag because it goes with your Xframe.
Probably should get a fly weight rifle, a medium weight rifle and a truck gun all in .284 or .308 caliber.
If you can find old school savage 24, ruger deerfield 44 Mag or MIA 30/06 get for trapline.
having used the 250 gr gmx on several eatin critters, they behave just like the barnes good expansion high weight retention and 2 holes, i too would prefer more weight but what ive used so far works great
If you are getting exits, why would you feel better more weight ?
Have been designing, building and using "the perfect" Alaskan big game rifle for over 40 years. I will say it's hard to argue against the 375 Stainless steel Ruger M77 and 270 gr TSX bullets. It works superbly on everything
having used the 250 gr gmx on several eatin critters, they behave just like the barnes good expansion high weight retention and 2 holes, i too would prefer more weight but what ive used so far works great
If you are getting exits, why would you feel better more weight ?
Have been designing, building and using "the perfect" Alaskan big game rifle for over 40 years. I will say it's hard to argue against the 375 Stainless steel Ruger M77 and 270 gr TSX bullets. It works superbly on everything
NH M-70 .375 H&H instead of Ruger 77, but specs are similar. 21" chopped and fluted barrel. Weight not too different.
Around 9#'s with Victory 1.5-6x50 T*, but it's great in low light. Weight would be in the mid 8# range with a VX-3 1.5-5x20.
DF, I have a very similar G series M70 .375 H&H in my rack as well and often choose it. I do like the 4 rounds down in the magazine over the 3 in the Ruger.
DF, I have a very similar G series M70 .375 H&H in my rack as well and often choose it. I do like the 4 rounds down in the magazine over the 3 in the Ruger.
so on temporary hiatus to ft.irwin, due to some obligations to uncle sam, long story short i have plenty of time to dream about home and what i wanna pack when i do make it back. so heres my thoughts, ive used a m70 ewss in 300 wm and a ruger hawkeye alaskan in 375 ruger both with sucess, imo the rugers a better round and the m70 was a better rifle, in fact i really like 375s and leupold vx3i 2.5x8s, id like to get a stainless montana action, stainless 3 contour 24 inch kreiger barrel fluted brown precision kevlar poundr, necg sights sourdough style front, with a vx3i 2.5x8 in talley lw,s 375 wby or rum, with a generous length mag box, intended projectiles would be 250 grain ttsx or gmx, but perferably the 270 grain lrx, or perhaps one of the cutting edge options, if the mag box would tolerate it, metalwork would be done in a dark tungsten gray, with black in the flutes,with stock done in a dark forest green with speckles, hopefully hopefully 8.5 lbs scoped loaded slung ready to hunt.
Sounds like a nice build idea. Post some pics when it is done. Sounds a lot like my 338wm, sans the irons and color scheme...
I prefer M70's over Rugers also. The only thing I would change is the Talley LW's and go with detachable mounts since you are putting iron sights on it.
I like Weaver style steel bases and Warne rings with QD screws and not levers. I just carry a wrench in my hunting pack. Talley's QD's work fantastic, but are too high for my liking. I do not like levers as they seem to catch stuff while out hunting.
My system is not a foolproof return to zero, but then I have never needed to remove a scope to use open sights in an actual hunting situation. The zero is never far off when I have tested it at the range.
DF, I have a very similar G series M70 .375 H&H in my rack as well and often choose it. I do like the 4 rounds down in the magazine over the 3 in the Ruger.
Phil,
Which one has the slickest action?
DF
The Ruger !
Once a Ruger is polished I think it's probably the quickest to operate. My MkII that Bill Atkinson rebarreled to 375H&H operated with a quick flick of the wrist as the bolt stop spring gives the bolt a little forward assist as you are chambering another round.
DF, I have a very similar G series M70 .375 H&H in my rack as well and often choose it. I do like the 4 rounds down in the magazine over the 3 in the Ruger.
Phil,
Which one has the slickest action?
DF
The Ruger !
Once a Ruger is polished I think it's probably the quickest to operate. My MkII that Bill Atkinson rebarreled to 375H&H operated with a quick flick of the wrist as the bolt stop spring gives the bolt a little forward assist as you are chambering another round.
Why did you go with the .375 H&H over the .375 Ruger?
Looking for you thought processes on that decision.
I have two of each ! A stainless M70 .375 H&H and the Ruger Mk II 375 H&H , and a standard Ruger Hawkeye 375 Ruger and a Sisk custom FN Mauser 375 Ruger.
All receive use by me, my guides and clients .
The Ruger MkII .375 H&H that Bill Atkinson built was a single prototype as Bill A was Bill Ruger's go to gunsmith and my rifle came out a few years before the 375 Ruger was developed.
I recently purchased a Ruger African grey laminate stock in SS without a muzzle brake in 375 Ruger. It has the wonderful Ruger open sights and barrel mounted sling swivels. I looked and waited a long time to find this rifle. I hope to one day take this rifle to Alaska. So far, I am very impressed with it.
not alaskan but my favourite so far is my left handed 375 ruger stainless steel short barrel alask llc qd rings and a leupold vx3 2.5-8x36 with duplex that may become german 4 soon ...
LJ-That may be the most practical rifle seen for Alaska use in a long while. I have a pre-64 Model 70 in 375 H&H and owned an Al Bisen earlier Model 70 in 375 Weatherby. The strong action,375 Wthby cartridge, and SS combine to cover the pragmatic bases. The 375 W case allows more room for powder & bullet choices while using available brass. Good choice across the board.
_______________________ 5th Special Forces Gp(ABN) MACVSOG-Khe Sanh-(71-72) SF-Lifer SOA
I have a 375 Whelen AI (Mauser 98 action) and a 375 H&H AI (pre-64 Win). I like them both. The Win has a muzzle break and it's a mild kicker. The Mauser has a large and soft but pad and it's not hard to shoot too.
I'm not sure if there's many animals that require more than the Whelen AI version. But like I said, I like them both.
I built the 98 Mauser mainly for cast bullet shooting, but with proper jacketed bullets It does very well.
As far as Ruger 77's I've found that the stock comb is too low for me and the stock slaps my face upon firing. However, I restocked a 7mm RM mag Ruger and it works fine now. My 416 Ruger still has the original stock and it is fine also, but I don't have a scope on it and I can hold my face down to the comb.
LJ-That may be the most practical rifle seen for Alaska use in a long while. I have a pre-64 Model 70 in 375 H&H and owned an Al Bisen earlier Model 70 in 375 Weatherby. The strong action,375 Wthby cartridge, and SS combine to cover the pragmatic bases. The 375 W case allows more room for powder & bullet choices while using available brass. Good choice across the board.
_______________________ 5th Special Forces Gp(ABN) MACVSOG-Khe Sanh-(71-72) SF-Lifer SOA
450Fuller,,,,, Thanks for the Kudo's,,,, the other part of the Equation is, .375 H&H Rounds still Function and Perform Great...... LJ
I have a Ruger Alaskan in 375, Leupold VX-3 2.5-8x36 shooting 250 grain Barnes TTSX's. It shoots great, I haven't killed anything with it but if I get back to New Foundland, that's what I'm taking.
I have a Ruger Alaskan in 375, Leupold VX-3 2.5-8x36 shooting 250 grain Barnes TTSX's. It shoots great, I haven't killed anything with it but if I get back to New Foundland, that's what I'm taking.
I’ve shot three bull moose with the exact same rifle, scope, bullet combination. It will work.
well....after reading literally every single post in this forum pertaining to 375s...and gaining an awful lot of inspiration from mr dobrenski, dirt farmer and toads builds....i think ive settled on a recipe.. or shall i say recipes, 1st one is what i deep down feel is literally perfect.......second one is close enough to where i can take my time on the 1st.....so here goes pre 64 action that started out as an h&h, and its gotta have that lil dimple in the bolt knob, get her blueprinted, etc reciever coated in some kinda silvery/grey anti corrosive bolt in od green, lilja#3 with deep flutes finished at 23, chamber 375 wby throated for the 270 grain lrx at 3.7 while still retaining saami freebore, cerakote or whatever coating scheme same as action, sunny hill x-long high capacity stainless bottom metal, trigger set at a crisp 3lbs, brown poundr green with black speckles, necg backup sights, talley lw,s leupold vx3i 2.5x8x35.......now for the make do rifle, used but good shape stainless classic, chop it to 23, get factory barrel lathed down or fluted, reuse factory sights, have a weatherby reamer ran though it....bed factory stock, skip fancy bottom metal load to saami spec, slap small leupy and talleys on it call it good....alternate #2 find a pre muzzle brake ruger alaskan in a pawn shop leupy in stock rings, call it good enough for now.....also as suggested by memtb i think it was...ill just skip the rest of the centerfires....and shoot everything with the 375.....
Pretty nice rifle! The "Classic Stainless" rifles are my favorites of the Mod. 70's. I tricked one like you have out a bit and gave to my son-in-law.
I have the bolt sleeve welded to the bolt on our Classic's as it is pressed onto the bolt body and I have heard of a couple that came loose from the bolt body. The one I had used stamped steel for the follower spring and extractor so they were replaced with spring steel ones. The local gun smith ground off part of the follower and the rifle then held 4 rounds in the magazine. Iron sights from New England Custom guns and barrel cut to 22 inches.
I am a fan of the Leupold 2.5-8x36 and when I was on 2.5 power shooting the brown bear at 30 feet late one evening was really a very simple matter, fast sight picture and press trigger. Is it Mag-Na-Ported or my eyes tricking me?
One thing is for sure, you are well armed for any Alaskan critter.
HaHa, I fixed it, not 30 inches, about 30 feet. Darn old brain and key boards.
Hi Josh! Some decades ago I picked up the below-photos Sako 375 H&H, carbine new in box. Such with a companion same-model in .270 Win. Giant, Great Western Gun Show of early nineties in SoCal. (Excellent price & x 2 happily deeper discount approaching 25% OTD.) In Mannlicher stock configuration, these Sakos a bit stubby-clunky aesthetics, but guess I'm weird... Really like the barrel band effect! Now if they just incorporated "handguards"...
I'd fired a converted mauser 98 in same barrel length & 375 H&H. Recoil of course 'substantial', but 20" barrel, noise bothered me more even with protection! A "SAY WHAT?" sort of evening following. Such configured heavy caliber rifles may be great carry & brush guns, but not for casual afternoon 'fun' at the range. Not for me anyway! It appears your nice Win 70 is with integral barrel brake. Can't imaging what that must sound like... "SAY WHAT..."
AK: I'm lost concerning your remark about "pressed on" bolt sleeve. Maybe my misunderstanding your nomenclature definition. In every one of my bolt rifles, the bolt sleeve is screwed into the bolt body and rotates about 90 degrees or less to remain vertical as bolt is rotated into/from battery. My image of a welded bolt sleeve is a non-functional gun! Such certainly not the design of any of the Models 70 I've seen up into the early Millennium! Can you clarify/educate me?
I am not sure when it came about and I am sure it was done to save money. The Mod. 70 bolts used to be one solid chunk of machined steel, at some point they put a collar on the bolt handle and pressed it on to the bolt. If you look close you will see it and that is the place I had ours welded. My pre-64 rifles are one solid piece. Any way, after reading a couple times of those pressed on collars spinning loose on the bolt body and hearing of a well known gun shop that uses "Classic" actions for their expensive rifles welding theirs up, I followed suit.
Hey Josh, I have been using Mag-Na-Ported rifles and hand guns for over 30 years to help control muzzle jump.
I am not sure when it came about and I am sure it was done to save money. The Mod. 70 bolts used to be one solid chunk of machined steel, at some point they put a collar on the bolt handle and pressed it on to the bolt. If you look close you will see it and that is the place I had ours welded. My pre-64 rifles are one solid piece. Any way, after reading a couple times of those pressed on collars spinning loose on the bolt body and hearing of a well known gun shop that uses "Classic" actions for their expensive rifles welding theirs up, I followed suit.
Hey Josh, I have been using Mag-Na-Ported rifles and hand guns for over 30 years to help control muzzle jump.
Thanks much for the clarification! "Bolt handle collar" versus "bolt sleeve", better description for dummies like me! That simplification makes perfect sense compared to whittling down one solid right angled mass! Such, of course if it doesn't beak loose! Best! John!
Mines a stainless Model 70 Classic that I had the barrel turned down and chopped to 22". NECG sights and an old McMillan winlite stock I picked up here added to it. It's quite handy set up this way compared to how she left the factory. It was my main guide gun for years and its still my go to for most hunts up here.
waterrat has been lucky enough to see it in person! How's the lake life these days Jim?
I like the 260s and 300s. but that is shot out of a Steyr SBS in 376 Steyr. Have thought about a 375 Bee but had the same thoughts. You may not get enough return on investment. Be Well, RZ.
Mine is a Leupold 2-7 topped Model 70 in .458 with tuned action and fine tuned trigger with all metal except the open sights electroless nickel plated and sitting in a custom painted synthetic stock with decelerator pad and loaded with 350gn TSX's.
It is ready for a knockout punch on anything, even deer lol.
Lol. I heard once, the 458 Winchester with a premium 400 grain might be the better 416. No doubt the 458’s can fill many roles. I am trying to find motivational interest in mine.
I am still a user of the 270 TSX in the 375’s. Easy to shoot and very effective on moose in my experiences. From others’ experiences, it seems to work very well on bear also. My preference for the cartridge propelling it is the 375 Ruger.
I am liking my Ruger Alaskan (pre barrel band sling stud). The action is slick! Alaska Arms QR rings and a Leupold 4x at the moment. Dropped it into a Zytel stock added a Limbsaver and I could not be happier. 7.5# bare and 8.5# scoped. This particular rifle is the 416 Ruger but the same could be done to a 375 Ruger. The investment cost was well worth the return! I have also established that 400 grains at 2400 fps out of a 7.5 pound rifle is about my limit for comfort and control
I don’t disagree... I plan on finding an accurate load with the 350 TSX around the same speed. That should tame it down. That said I have zero doubt that the 375 Ruger in a similar platform would be close to perfection for usefulness and comfort, at least when compared to the 416.
I don’t disagree... I plan on finding an accurate load with the 350 TSX around the same speed. That should tame it down. That said I have zero doubt that the 375 Ruger in a similar platform would be close to perfection for usefulness and comfort, at least when compared to the 416.
Yeah, but you’re a young, hoss of a dude.
My .375 H&H M-70 goes around nine with Victory scope, in the eights with lighter scope. It’s about as light as I’d want.
Good catch DF! It is an aftermarket, the release is inside the trigger guard and it appears dropped. I'm wondering of that's the original "tupperware" stock? I haven't handled it but can if someone's serious about it, they're about 5 miles away.
Good catch DF! It is an aftermarket, the release is inside the trigger guard and it appears dropped. I'm wondering of that's the original "tupperware" stock? I haven't handled it but can if someone's serious about it, they're about 5 miles away.
I think that's all aftermarket, looks like Williams or Sunny Hill bottom metal and an aftermarket stock.
If so, that's a screamer of a deal. Some of that bottom metal goes for $250- 300, drop belly stock, who knows. And the scope.
Very possible someone doesn't know what they have. Scope and aftermarket parts could just about be worth the ask for the whole rig.
You may want to sneak back over there, check it out. Just don't ask too many questions....
I agree that is looks like Sunny Hill. I was trying to identify the stock... look at the forward sling stud location compared to DF’s rifle. Was poking around earlier on the seller’s website. They have a couple that interested me greatly. Too close to the holidays for me to jump on it.
I'd have already bought it........if it were left handed. As it is, I already have 3 too many LH .375s, 2 Winchesters and a Ruger, but the Stainless Classic always tripped my switch but Winchester chose to stop at .338 in lefty.
I'd have already bought it........if it were left handed. As it is, I already have 3 too many LH .375s, 2 Winchesters and a Ruger, but the Stainless Classic always tripped my switch but Winchester chose to stop at .338 in lefty.
If that is the New Haven Classic with 24" barrel, it's probably barrel heavy. A chop and flute job would really liven it up, as it did mine. Scroll back and have a look.
This one with the drop belly stock and bottom metal is worth a heap more than mine, and I'd be hesitant to take the ask on this one for mine.
Closer comparison. The factory Tupperware will not fit the dropped bottom metal. That's all aftermarket. Stock doesn't look familiar. McM makes some drop belly stocks, may need to check their web site. That gun, chopped and fluted would be just about ideal. With that scope it would weigh in the mid 8's, again about ideal for that round. I'd probably swap out the rings for Tally or Warne QD's. I'm not sure if those irons are OEM or NECG. Mine are NECG, front, fiberoptic and windowed hood.
Well I took a run over to take a better look. Bad move, I put it in layaway. As DF brought up, there's more in extras than what the asking price. Drop magazine, glass stock matching the bottom metal, (not sure the make on either) German #4 reticle in the Leupold. Everything put together nicely and in mint condition. Sorry guys, someone shoulda jumped on it when I first posted it.
Well I took a run over to take a better look. Bad move, I put it in layaway. As DF brought up, there's more in extras than what the asking price. Drop magazine, glass stock matching the bottom metal, (not sure the make on either) German #4 reticle in the Leupold. Everything put together nicely and in mint condition. Sorry guys, someone shoulda jumped on it when I first posted it.
HA!
Good score, glad you got it.
I could have bought it, put my barreled action in that stock with that bottom metal, put that barreled action in my factory Tupperware and got almost that much for a factory SS New Haven .375 H&H. Thus, the pick up of those extras would have cost little or nothing.
But, I'm even happier you got it, as I didn't really want to tackle another project right now.
Not sure who made that stock, don't remember McM having a drop belly that looks exactly like that.
Anything you find out about the bottom metal, stock, etc, pass it on. I'm curious.
Congrats, again. I'm thinking it would probably cost around twice the ask to put it together. Not sure if it would sell for that, but for sure it's worth a bunch more than you paid.
And, IME and from what I've heard, those guns do shoot. Mine sure does.
I like Cutting Edge bullets, have posted and written about them. I'm currently trying the 150 gr. and 160 gr. Raptors in my JES bored .358 Win Pre-64 Fwt.
Here's a target my .375 shot. I know, just three shots, but it was pretty neat when it happened.
I have a 375 ruger in the African mdl. (open sights and 23 inch brl.) I had Gary junk do the arcticcote finish. Put the action in a MPI Kevlar stock. I also have a Sako 75 in 375 H+H just stock rifle stainless synthetic. Both good rifles but the Sako action is very smooth. Now I have as much in the Ruger as the Sako would be new. Just don't use the Ruger much ever since I got the Sako at a Fairbanks pawn shop.
I could have bought it, put my barreled action in that stock with that bottom metal, put that barreled action in my factory Tupperware and got almost that much for a factory SS New Haven .375 H&H. Thus, the pick up of those extras would have cost little or nothing.
But, I'm even happier you got it, as I didn't really want to tackle another project right now.
Not sure who made that stock, don't remember McM having a drop belly that looks exactly like that.
Anything you find out about the bottom metal, stock, etc, pass it on. I'm curious.
You have more self control than I do DF. That would've been icing on the cake for your barreled action, not that there's anything wrong with it's present configuration. As you mentioned it could benefit with a little less barrel weight and I just happen to have a set of Talleys like yours that fit this action. I did some online searching with McM, Manners, MPI, B&C and H-S P and McM does offer a drop belly stock for Sunny Hill bottom metal, but the shape and the checkering pattern is slightly different. I'll have a better idea when I pull it down for a closer inspection but it might be a couple months before I bring it home......way too many expenses this month that stress my checkbook and credit card.
Not a McM Safari. I have a McWoody Wby Express on a MkV 7RM Brux. When I bought it, they called it the Sako Express, Wby inlet. Now, it's the Wby Express. The Safari has drop box, the Express is the same shape, same cheek piece without the drop belly.
Prob won't take that long to run thru the list of drop belly synthetic stocks out there.
Kampfeld Custom is where you need to go for chop and flute. Karl’s work is legendary and his prices are reasonable.
IMO you’ll be glad you did, as those 24” barrels are too heavy. They used the same contour for .458 and .416. Of course the .375 ended up with more metal and barrel weight than the bigger bores.
Chop and flute won’t affect the forearm fit. My 21” fluted gun handles much better now.
Congratulations! I couldn’t find the price, and am curious. Whatever it was, from all of the comments......it appears ya done real good! 👍 memtb
Around $1,150. It would be hard to replace the custom drop belly stock, custom bottom metal and scope for that.
It was and is a great deal. Considering a basic SS Express New Haven gun at around $1,100 or so, plus that much again in aftermarket parts, you’d have two grand or more invested. Maybe one could sell the OEM stock and bottom metal for a few hundred. You’d still have way more than ask invested.
Would be interesting to know the story in this one. Reminds me of a shooter’s nightmare. He dreamed he had died and his widow was selling his guns for what he had told her he paid for them.
Some way the real story on this one got buried. LGS obviously didn’t know what they had. They probably don’t handle enough express rifles to be in the know. They evidently looked up the used value on a Win M-70 NH .375 SS Express and filled out the tag.
They just took the rifle in so wouldn't discount it much. I gave $1100, but as DF pointed out, there's more than that in the stock, bottom metal and scope. It had to be a "shooters nightmare" type scenario, I can't imagine the guy who had it put together would sell it for what this shop paid for (<1K). The shop doesn't care what it's worth, only that they turn a quick 10-20%. I still haven't found a stock that matches the one on this rifle exactly, but it'll be a bit before can I give it a closer look. What with Christmas, a 2K repair bill and a new 3pt inverted snowblower purchase, this month is a money pit. Probably won't get it out of layaway till after the holidays........IF I can wait that long.
Checking on line, seems Sunny Hill drop bottom metal may be more like $450-$500, a good bit more than I was guesstimating.
It includes the extended box, follower spring, the whole assembly. There are other drop bottom metal makers, just not that many, none cheap. That’s pretty much custom work.
Stocks like that can run $600. I paid around that for an Echols Legend and it wasn’t a drop belly. And, I did the fitting myself. I’m not including custom smithing, just parts.
DF
Edited to add, you may get to $1,100 aftermarket parts without the scope.
Had a thought (I know, dangerous). When you pick it up, take it apart to get better pictures of the bottom metal. If it seems to be Sunny Hill like we all think, I'd send photos of that stock to Sunny Hill, ask them what they think it is. You'd think they'd know, at least have some thoughts.
I've checked around, no one seems to know from what we can see. It doesn't appear to be a McM, but looks like a nice stock.
Can't be that many companies making drop belly, synthetic M-70 Express stocks..
There was a seller on eBay within the last year who had some express stocks for sale. They were unfinished but he swore they were McMillans. I’ve been trying to figure out where I have seen this stock before; perhaps that was it. At the time I couldn’t find anything that matched in the current lineup, but maybe that one (and this) are an old pattern? Perhaps McMillan would know if sunny hill doesn’t.
HaHa! You guys are gonna prompt me to get it out of hock sooner than later! Hopefully there may be some markings that clue me in, but barring that, I will post more detailed pictures that someone here may recognise. Another thought I have is this *might* have been a product of the Winchester custom shop? I've seen pictures of CS rifles with drop belly magazines in wood stocks and in my Google search read a reference (no picture) to a synthetic drop belly. I did not notice, or look for, any markings on this one to signify a CS rifle just the "G" six digit serial number and "Classic Stainless" on the barrel. The mystery continues till I free it from its present confines. Thanks for all your input.
HaHa! You guys are gonna prompt me to get it out of hock sooner than later! Hopefully there may be some markings that clue me in, but barring that, I will post more detailed pictures that someone here may recognise. Another thought I have is this *might* have been a product of the Winchester custom shop? I've seen pictures of CS rifles with drop belly magazines in wood stocks and in my Google search read a reference (no picture) to a synthetic drop belly. I did not notice, or look for, any markings on this one to signify a CS rifle just the "G" six digit serial number and "Classic Stainless" on the barrel. The mystery continues till I free it from its present confines. Thanks for all your input.
Maybe they'll let you look at it, if you don't drool all over it... .
Now on the way to me. Not particularly big bore, but too good not to shoot as it is. I appreciate everyone's support.
That is a great deal with Shilen barrel and in a great round. The Shilen would cost around $600 fitted.
Is that 13 1/4" LOP OK with you? I guess you could add a thicker pad for 13 1/2" which would be my ideal LOP. But with winter clothes that LOP may not be too bad.
this has been an informative topic as I have a .375 and I hunt in alaska from time to time with my son. However, I now realize that my rifle is woofully inadequate as it has way more negatives than positives and I don't want to spend the additional couple thousand dollars to make it what it should be. Here is what it is with all its deficits:
1) 1953 M70 with the original barrel (25") 2) the original wood stock although it is bedded 3) it weighs somewhere around 10 lbs. or maybe a little more 4) the scope is a lowly old 3x leupold 5) its not stainless steel 6) it has no rear sight
I was actually going to take it with me on our brown bear hunt last april but because of the covid it got postponed. At least now I have another year or more to either get another rifle or spend the big bucks to have this one so modified. I have no doubt that the perfect .375 as described is a much better tool for the job, but I just don't want to spend the money (2K?) to make it what it should be. Recommendations?
this has been an informative topic as I have a .375 and I hunt in alaska from time to time with my son. However, I now realize that my rifle is woofully inadequate as it has way more negatives than positives and I don't want to spend the additional couple thousand dollars to make it what it should be. Here is what it is with all its deficits:
1) 1953 M70 with the original barrel (25") 2) the original wood stock although it is bedded 3) it weighs somewhere around 10 lbs. or maybe a little more 4) the scope is a lowly old 3x leupold 5) its not stainless steel 6) it has no rear sight
I was actually going to take it with me on our brown bear hunt last april but because of the covid it got postponed. At least now I have another year or more to either get another rifle or spend the big bucks to have this one so modified. I have no doubt that the perfect .375 as described is a much better tool for the job, but I just don't want to spend the money (2K?) to make it what it should be. Recommendations?
Assuming you generally like the rifle, and assuming it shoots minute of bear/moose...
Could be inexpensive to do minor mods. Live with #1, #2, #3, and #5. Keep it dry as best you can, and give it some TLC every night.
If the (#4) scope mounts aren't already some kind of QD system, maybe change to that. If there's a front sight, get a bolt-on peep sight (#5) that mounts on the rear base when the scope is dismounted and that works with your existing front sight.
Unless all that interferes with your real desire to make major modifications or buy a new rifle...
Now on the way to me. Not particularly big bore, but too good not to shoot as it is. I appreciate everyone's support.
That is a great deal with Shilen barrel and in a great round. The Shilen would cost around $600 fitted.
Is that 13 1/4" LOP OK with you? I guess you could add a thicker pad for 13 1/2" which would be my ideal LOP. But with winter clothes that LOP may not be too bad.
You did good.
DF
LOP should be good. If not, a minimal adjustment. EZ.
this has been an informative topic as I have a .375 and I hunt in alaska from time to time with my son. However, I now realize that my rifle is woofully inadequate as it has way more negatives than positives and I don't want to spend the additional couple thousand dollars to make it what it should be. Here is what it is with all its deficits:
1) 1953 M70 with the original barrel (25") 2) the original wood stock although it is bedded 3) it weighs somewhere around 10 lbs. or maybe a little more 4) the scope is a lowly old 3x leupold 5) its not stainless steel 6) it has no rear sight
I was actually going to take it with me on our brown bear hunt last april but because of the covid it got postponed. At least now I have another year or more to either get another rifle or spend the big bucks to have this one so modified. I have no doubt that the perfect .375 as described is a much better tool for the job, but I just don't want to spend the money (2K?) to make it what it should be. Recommendations?
It would take a lot to make me believe the internet more than my actual rifle. Always worked well, didn't it?
#2 son recently built a 375 Ruger on a stainless M700 action. Apparently he figured that if my 20" Ruger Alaskan is good, an 18" Remington would be better. I fired it exactly once, off sticks. Fire-breathing dragon wearing steel horseshoes, I thought. He rationed maybe 10 shots, full-house 235 Speers, and 250 TTSXs, over five months or so. Actually took it on an elk hunt as a backup for his 7 mag. Latest is that the action is now wearing a .264 WM bbl., but he indexed the .375 bbl, just in case his job takes him far north. But he left all the 375 ammo he had on my shelf. Funny thing is that I would have given him my Ruger if he had asked...
#2 son recently built a 375 Ruger on a stainless M700 action. Apparently he figured that if my 20" Ruger Alaskan is good, an 18" Remington would be better. I fired it exactly once, off sticks. Fire-breathing dragon wearing steel horseshoes, I thought. He rationed maybe 10 shots, full-house 235 Speers, and 250 TTSXs, over five months or so. Actually took it on an elk hunt as a backup for his 7 mag. Latest is that the action is now wearing a .264 WM bbl., but he indexed the .375 bbl, just in case his job takes him far north. But he left all the 375 ammo he had on my shelf. Funny thing is that I would have given him my Ruger if he had asked...
My idea of a perfect Ak 375. Winchester 70 classic, 20” barrel, featherweight wood stock, 2.5-8 leupold in Talley Q/D rings
The last time I saw Jim Harrower's Model 70 375 H&H it was kinda that color. Both the steel and wood. Scope and rings weren't tho. Iirc he had an old Vx2 2-7 on it. Of course , his rifle kinda resembled his hat. Most all the rifles original finish had been wore off by decades of working. To the best of my knowledge his rifle had never let him down.
this has been an informative topic as I have a .375 and I hunt in alaska from time to time with my son. However, I now realize that my rifle is woofully inadequate as it has way more negatives than positives and I don't want to spend the additional couple thousand dollars to make it what it should be. Here is what it is with all its deficits:
1) 1953 M70 with the original barrel (25") 2) the original wood stock although it is bedded 3) it weighs somewhere around 10 lbs. or maybe a little more 4) the scope is a lowly old 3x leupold 5) its not stainless steel 6) it has no rear sight
I was actually going to take it with me on our brown bear hunt last april but because of the covid it got postponed. At least now I have another year or more to either get another rifle or spend the big bucks to have this one so modified. I have no doubt that the perfect .375 as described is a much better tool for the job, but I just don't want to spend the money (2K?) to make it what it should be. Recommendations?
I am liking my Ruger Alaskan (pre barrel band sling stud). The action is slick! Alaska Arms QR rings and a Leupold 4x at the moment. Dropped it into a Zytel stock added a Limbsaver and I could not be happier. 7.5# bare and 8.5# scoped. This particular rifle is the 416 Ruger but the same could be done to a 375 Ruger. The investment cost was well worth the return! I have also established that 400 grains at 2400 fps out of a 7.5 pound rifle is about my limit for comfort and control
Yup, that would be lively. Weight is a constant. Recoil is temporary 😀
I remember what it was like dreaming up the perfect rifle for Alaska and the OP is in my opinion on a good track. In the medium bores. [ 8mm to 375] all my quests were solved with the 375 Ruger Guide Gun/Rifle. ( Marlin beat Ruger to the Guide Gun moniker) The M77 Mk2 stainless Hawkeye has all the bells and whistles on it . Out of the box , that we used to pay boat loads of money for.
The only thing it could use that it doesn't come with is a short Pic rail section for a light. Buy the rifle . Buy a good scope. Spend all the gunsmith money on ammo and components. With use the action will slick up so it slides like a hot knife thru butter. Maybe invest in a few spare front sight blades in case one gets broke off when the rifle get dropped hard.
I am liking my Ruger Alaskan (pre barrel band sling stud). The action is slick! Alaska Arms QR rings and a Leupold 4x at the moment. Dropped it into a Zytel stock added a Limbsaver and I could not be happier. 7.5# bare and 8.5# scoped. This particular rifle is the 416 Ruger but the same could be done to a 375 Ruger. The investment cost was well worth the return! I have also established that 400 grains at 2400 fps out of a 7.5 pound rifle is about my limit for comfort and control
Yup, that would be lively. Weight is a constant. Recoil is temporary 😀
I think Matt want's to be gunner500 when he grows up...
I am liking my Ruger Alaskan (pre barrel band sling stud). The action is slick! Alaska Arms QR rings and a Leupold 4x at the moment. Dropped it into a Zytel stock added a Limbsaver and I could not be happier. 7.5# bare and 8.5# scoped. This particular rifle is the 416 Ruger but the same could be done to a 375 Ruger. The investment cost was well worth the return! I have also established that 400 grains at 2400 fps out of a 7.5 pound rifle is about my limit for comfort and control
Yup, that would be lively. Weight is a constant. Recoil is temporary 😀
I think Matt want's to be gunner500 when he grows up...
I am liking my Ruger Alaskan (pre barrel band sling stud). The action is slick! Alaska Arms QR rings and a Leupold 4x at the moment. Dropped it into a Zytel stock added a Limbsaver and I could not be happier. 7.5# bare and 8.5# scoped. This particular rifle is the 416 Ruger but the same could be done to a 375 Ruger. The investment cost was well worth the return! I have also established that 400 grains at 2400 fps out of a 7.5 pound rifle is about my limit for comfort and control
Yup, that would be lively. Weight is a constant. Recoil is temporary 😀
I think Matt want's to be gunner500 when he grows up...
Late to the thread. I have the 20" stainless Hawkeye Alaskan .375 Ruger and .416 Ruger rifles with barrel bands. Bare/empty/dry weights in the Zytel canoe paddle stocks: .375 Ruger: 7.5 pounds .416 Ruger: 7.0 pounds The 23"-barreled, matte-black and walnut Hawkeye African .375 Ruger weighs 7.75 pounds.
The .375 H&H I used in the 1990's in Alaska and 2001 in Botswana: Pre-'64 M70 .300 H&H action 24"-long Douglas No. 3 sporter contour (as light as I go in .375-caliber) Brown Precision "Pounder" Kevlar and fiberglass stock with textured paint and 1" Decelerator pad NECG banded front sight Kimber QD scope bases Weight was 6.75 pounds bare/empty/dry
One cannot sensibly flute a No.3 sporter in .375 caliber that is 0.625" diameter at the 24" muzzle. Dan Lilja fluted his stainless No. 6 sporter contour .375 barrels for two of my other rifles. They weigh about the same as a No. 4 sporter. Simple No. 3 sporter contour, nonfluted is the way to go for light weight and usual 24" length. Then you need a really light stock like the Brown Pounder to make it balance properly.
I reckon Phil Shoemaker got Dave Scovill's Ruger M77 Mk II .375 H&H or one just like it ? Expert action opening to the rear and an RSM sheet metal box slipped into and some work on shortening the ejector ...
Late to the thread. I have the 20" stainless Hawkeye Alaskan .375 Ruger and .416 Ruger rifles with barrel bands. Bare/empty/dry weights in the Zytel canoe paddle stocks: .375 Ruger: 7.5 pounds .416 Ruger: 7.0 pounds The 23"-barreled, matte-black and walnut Hawkeye African .375 Ruger weighs 7.75 pounds.
The .375 H&H I used in the 1990's in Alaska and 2001 in Botswana: Pre-'64 M70 .300 H&H action 24"-long Douglas No. 3 sporter contour (as light as I go in .375-caliber) Brown Precision "Pounder" Kevlar and fiberglass stock with textured paint and 1" Decelerator pad NECG banded front sight Kimber QD scope bases Weight was 6.75 pounds bare/empty/dry
One cannot sensibly flute a No.3 sporter in .375 caliber that is 0.625" diameter at the 24" muzzle. Dan Lilja fluted his stainless No. 6 sporter contour .375 barrels for two of my other rifles. They weigh about the same as a No. 4 sporter. Simple No. 3 sporter contour, nonfluted is the way to go for light weight and usual 24" length. Then you need a really light stock like the Brown Pounder to make it balance properly.
I reckon Phil Shoemaker got Dave Scovill's Ruger M77 Mk II .375 H&H or one just like it ? Expert action opening to the rear and an RSM sheet metal box slipped into and some work on shortening the ejector ...
Dave gave me the Ruger Mk II .338 Bill Atkinson converted to a 375 H&H over 20 years ago and it has been a popular rifle with my guides. I like it a lot as well. It split the wood stock stock after only a few rounds when Mule Deer shot it, but I dropped it in an old Ruger canoe paddle stock and it is lithe and lethal ! It has earned the name "pointer" as everything it points at dies !
Saw Taj on MOUNTAIN MEN (History Channel) flying Mike Horstman around Kodiak in a Super Cub on floats. Do you know what chambering Horstman has in his lever action toted for brown bear guiding ? Looks like a Model 71 Winchester or 1886. Could it be a .348 WCF or .450 Alaskan ? .50 Alaskan ? All the TV reality shows would be put to shame by a show called "The Alaskan Shoemakers" and I do not mean one about a hipwader factory.
well after being made aware of the defiance crf actions, my plan is a bit different now, same basic recipe....just a defiance crf action.....and ill be usin a 375 ruger improved loaded to 3.6 or so and based of the sherman wildcat shoulder archetecture and add a wby style freebore a 375prc+p if you will.
Saw Taj on MOUNTAIN MEN (History Channel) flying Mike Horstman around Kodiak in a Super Cub on floats. Do you know what chambering Horstman has in his lever action toted for brown bear guiding ? Looks like a Model 71 Winchester or 1886. Could it be a .348 WCF or .450 Alaskan ? .50 Alaskan ? All the TV reality shows would be put to shame by a show called "The Alaskan Shoemakers" and I do not mean one about a hipwader factory.
Mike Horstman's M71 is a 348, or at least the last one I saw was. He tends to go through rifles faster than I do, Which may account for all the trading we do at the Kodiak gun show ! My son AK a nice long tang M71 .348 from him a couple years ago, but Taj still carries his 475 Turnbull.
After launching a 300 grain swift a-frame from 500 yds away, the long walk back to the dead bull moose proved something to me:
That fkn bullet drilled through the entire moose on a quartering away shot, barely expanded and found against off side hide.
The cz carbine was far lighter than my 375 Ruger carbine. This helped with alot with the mountain climbing.
Another instance on a winter caribou hunt. I rattled through five rounds on a running herd of caribou, till the gun was empty. One at 150 yds, one at about 300 yds, a coupla misses, and finally, the last bullet rang true on that 400 yd caribou. So much caribou meat, broke the dog sled. Had to bury one gutted caribou and retrieve it the following morning.
mainer, you got some valid points and i do share your admiration for the 9.3x62.........but brother im sweet on the 375.......truth is im quite certain i could have gotten all the critters ive ever gotten with a plain ole 06......probably could have gotten more.....cuase i would have had a better tent, better pack, and better boots with all the money i would have saved.......spent 5 yrs in the fairbanks area, went through about 35 rifles.....but the 2 i liked best were a pre barrel band ruger alaskan in 375 ruger, and an m70 ewss in 300 wm...the ruger round in the winchester and about a 1 lb lighter wouldve been perfect
Fair enough, local Alaskan and forum member swamplord's 375 rpm wildcat would be a slick set up. In something like a winchester 70, you'd probably end up with a 4 down gun, which would be slick.
Fair enough, local Alaskan and forum member swamplord's 375 rpm wildcat would be a slick set up. In something like a winchester 70, you'd probably end up with a 4 down gun, which would be slick.
mainer its funny that you.mention the rpm based wildcats, ever since they came out with that sweet lil ti, ive been droolin ober the possibilities, really deep down prefer 3pos safeties and long extractors......but i believe i could rock a mark v if the right one came along....its the only pushfeed i really like........its too bad mrc went under they were makin some cool stuff......or that fn m70s dont have the old style trigger......or that cz quit makin 550s.....or that ruger hawkeyes have itty bitty safety levers and short magazines
Fair enough, local Alaskan and forum member swamplord's 375 rpm wildcat would be a slick set up. In something like a winchester 70, you'd probably end up with a 4 down gun, which would be slick.
Fair enough, local Alaskan and forum member swamplord's 375 rpm wildcat would be a slick set up. In something like a winchester 70, you'd probably end up with a 4 down gun, which would be slick.
Fair enough, local Alaskan and forum member swamplord's 375 rpm wildcat would be a slick set up. In something like a winchester 70, you'd probably end up with a 4 down gun, which would be slick.
I have a Winchester stainless classic in 375 H&H with Mark Penrod right now. I had originally got it thinking I wanted a 300 H&H built out of it, but decided more or less last minute to keep it a 375. He is putting it in a legend stock with standard fill and putting in some Sunny Hull bottom metal. Also putting on one of his bolt handles and a clover leaf tang.
I left the barrel factory but wondering if I am going to end up regretting that given how heavy the factory 375 barrel is. However, that rifle will be the closest to what I am seeing discussed here for me.
I have a Winchester stainless classic in 375 H&H with Mark Penrod right now. I had originally got it thinking I wanted a 300 H&H built out of it, but decided more or less last minute to keep it a 375. He is putting it in a legend stock with standard fill and putting in some Sunny Hull bottom metal. Also putting on one of his bolt handles and a clover leaf tang.
I left the barrel factory but wondering if I am going to end up regretting that given how heavy the factory 375 barrel is. However, that rifle will be the closest to what I am seeing discussed here for me.
Keechi_Kid, That sounds like a real nice package. If your going to carry the rifle a lot, especially in hill country.....you may wish you’d taken some weight out of the barrel. My original .375 H&H ( Win. XTR), was just too much (and I was in fair shape at the time) weight when hunting in mountain country, when combined with all of the other gear (binocs, day pack with all practical needs, ect.) for an all day hunt! Dropping my rifle weight down to 9 pounds, scoped/loaded/slung, made a big difference in carry comfort! memtb
Yeah. I wasn’t sure what my final vision for it was as far as the barrel went. I saw someone mention chopping one of these and fluting the barrel to drop weight. That may be worthwhile here.
When the time comes for me to have another 375H&H, in all likelihood I'll follow DF's lead and go the M70 route with a shortened tube (20-21"). Alternatively, an Interarms/Whitworth with a shortened tube wouldn't hurt my feelings, nor would a Ruger 77 Alaskan in 375 Ruger.
memtb
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