For you guys buying at a little longer distances with .223/5.56 for stuff other then small Varmints ( southern whitetail )and down what are y'all liking as far as bullets ?
And look if you don't like .223 or whatever that cool fine not asking about that or other cartridges . .223/5.56 300yd to like 500yd max just wanna hear what people have or do use and why.
Thanks

https://rokslide.com/forums/threads/223-for-bear-deer-elk-and-moose.130488/

Almost 300 pages of hunting with a 5.56/.223.

I was thinking of that thread myself-Thanks.
Besides what has been mentioned above:
Barnes 77 grain LRX and the 80 grain and 88 grain ELD-M.

One of the biggest things is determining what your impact velocities are going to be at whatever max distance you are desiring.
All bullets have a minimum impact velocity

Including match bullets? Where do they provide this info? (e.g. ELD-M)

I have a dead coyote at 750 with a 223ai and 70gr RDF. instantly flopped and spun for a second.

Including some match bullets.

77 grain TMK - I have not personally used on big game.

88 grain ELD-M, I have used on big game.
The ELD-M will perform well down to a 1800 fps impact velocity, and there will be a group of folks who have used the ELD-M's more than me that will say it goes down to 1600 fps minimum impact velocity

I don't personally get the fascination with heavy-for-caliber bullets, but that's just my position. Having said that, the heaviest I have/use in my AR556 is the 62gr Speer Gold Dot. Haven't shot any deer with it, but it does work on pigs. My self-imposed limits is 300 yards with my AR.

I used Sierra 69 OTM in my Bushmaster Predator on Prairie Dogs, rabbits. I liked the Hornady 68 OTM in the two 22-250s (one was faster twist and Ackleyed, = Best one!) on Coyote, Prairie dogs, Marmots, etc. I used a 75gr Scirocco in a fast twist Lilja barreled .224 TTH (22-6mm) on a big hog and varmints. Those were plenty heavy for me!

I really like the 69gr SMK, for varmints, paper, and steel out to 600 yards. You are asking about out to 500 yards, so that bullet will suffice. Another good one is the 77smk, and it will edge out the 69 further out. The 88ELD match will edge out both, but further out than your asking about. Especially if you are running a 7 twist barrel in your 223 rem. Speaking of that, one of my more accurate AR's runs a 9 twist barrel, so I mainly stick to 69's in that one:


That's more than accurate enough to knock the schidt out of varmints at 4-500 yards.



In general, or just for the .223 rem? There are multitudes of reasons to go heavy for caliber/chambering bullets. It's not always about shooting far out either. It could also be for shooting close up, and destroying less meat. I knew about that when I was 12.

The OP wants to shoot deer, so I'd pick the 77TMK or the 88ELD match, if wanting to go heavy for caliber.

what twist does it take to stabilize 88's at 5.56 velocities 8? 7?

7 is what it says for me.

I use a seven twist

Wolfie, what twist ya running?

I have shot a few deer with a 77 TMK. If you are looking for a reliable bullet for deer, they are impressively effective. I’d second the Rokslide thread above, there is a significant amount of real world information there. That thread led me to the 77 TMK. I wasn’t disappointed, I don’t think you will be either.

Good luck.

Frank

How much expansion are you getting in the critters with 69gr SMKs? Looked into 140gr SMK in 6.5, but all reviews were negative for hunting.

I've used the 69gm SMKs for chucks, but had a few runners compared to bang flops

I've killed deer, hogs and yotes out to almost 500 with 62gr SP's

I've used the 75 Amax quite a bit out to 450 on a bunch of deer and black bears (just by virtue of how the shots presented, didn't stop at that range for any particular reason) and it was exceptionally effective. That was from a 1:9 223AI. Typically bust a shoulder on the way to or from the rib cage.

I've been using the 88 ELD m the last couple of seasons from 223AI's, spun 1:7. Built two for me, and one for a buddy. He used his on a big muley this fall on the last day of the season at 404 yards, quartering away. Bullet hit at the last rib, was under the hide just behind the off side shoulder. Buck managed to stagger 15 yards sideways and fell over and died.
I've shot a couple moose and a black bear with the 88 ELD m, but none of those were all that far - 151 to 170-something yards.

I've been happy with the 88 ELDm, and the 75 Amax as far as holding together well enough to break femurs on stuff, but I might try the 77 TMK just for giggles, after reading the entire Rokslide thread.

I guess the old rule for remaining energy ft. lbs. for deer is about useless now. Ya'll seem to have no trouble dropping deer at long range with a .223. And I'm sure you know that there's not a lot of energy left at 500yds. in a .223

It never was particularly useful. Put a bullet, that expands, in the right place and things tend to die pretty quick.

The only big game animal that I ever shot and lost was a pronghorn antelope that I shot with my .22-250. That was many years ago, and it was an expanding bullet, HP or soft point, not a FMJ.

My first shot was maybe 150 yards and it knocked him down, but before I could get to him, he got up and ran over a ridge. When I got to the top of the ridge, I shot him again, and again he fell down, then got up and ran over the next ridge. By the time I got to the top of that ridge, he was nowhere to be seen. I spent the rest of that day searching for him, but never found him.

I knew and hunted with @scenarshooter when he still lived in Bozeman. He and 2 of our other friends killed a pile of deer, elk, black bears and even a few buffalo, Pat with his .220 Swift, and Bill and George with their .22-250s. They were always proud of the animals that they killed with those rifles, but never said anything about the ones that they lost.

At one of our gun club picnics one year, the club had set up some steel ram targets at the 400 m berm. Bill and I were shooting them with our .22-250s and we could hear the bulllets hit, but they didn't have enough energy at that distance to knock them down.

The heavier for cal bullet's especially in something like a 223 do have a place I think. Heavier for caliber slows down the bullet helping maintain it's ability and heavier at any velocity helps increase penetration. Lighter bullet's at higher velocity will tend to shed weight reducing the penetration and increasing damage. I think if your sure you want to use something like a 223 to hunt with then you should consider getting a custom barrel with a fast twist. I've never tried anything heavier than 55gr in a 22 of any make. But I'm certain a 77 gr bullet is gonna work better in say a 223 for no other reason than a heavier bullet at lower velocity is going to hold together better and penetrate better giving you more options for shot placement!

People seem to over look and many over think, what the bullet actually does. They go lighter to increase velocity thinking increased velocity kills, and heavier to shoot farther with a better BC. My truth is the value of the bullet is it is the most important part of killing, only the bullet can kill! Choose the bullet wisely!

I believe even a 22 RF will kill very well most animals in North America but, make that BUT, it must be placed right to do its job and the shooter must be willing to get close enough to make the shot needed! That said even though I say that it would not be my choice to use any 22 cal for any big game. I don't often even recommend a 243 for even deer. A 25cal gives a better selection of bullet's and a 6.5 even better without going to heavy into recoil! But I have killed a few deer with the 243 and all with one shot but felt it necessary to get close enough to shoot for the shot placement I knew would take the deer right down. You may have a very accurate 243 but shooting a small group at longer range and field position is much harder than shooting a 1" group at 100yds and a bench rest! I have never seem anyone shoot a 1" group at even 200 yds even from a bench rest! So the range of the shot is going to make a difference in how well you place the bullet.

I agree with you 100 percent, buffy.

Ok?
So you touched an animal with a couple of bullets that you don’t remember the specifics on, at an unknown range, but didn’t recover him? That makes it the cartridges fault? Or the bullets?
I’m just not clear on your point.


Also not clear on your assessment on scenarshooter either. You state that he/they were proud of the stuff they killed with 22cf’s - from the pics I’ve seen here of Pat’s critters, he could be proud of them even if he’d shot them with a Barret 50. He’s killed some BIG stuff.
Wouldn’t it stand to reason that killing something and being able to hold it in your hands would be more satisfying that shooting and losing it and then keeping it quiet if you were using something that didn’t work? Wouldn’t it make sense to change up your equipment so you didn’t lose more critters if it didn’t work?

I chose my words carefully. Putting the expanded bullet in the right place means that it gets put in the vitals, not splashing on the hide or humerus without penetrating to the vitals.

You're assuming that they did lose critters shot with those rifles?

After using a variety of cartridges and bullets on game over the years, came to that same conclusion and I've mentioned it to others "Put a good bullet where it belongs, and go notch your tag."

Smallest I've shot deer with was a 55 gr soft point from a 223. Largest bullets have been either the 405 gr Rem soft point from my 45-70 or the 385 gr 50 cal "Great Plains" bullet from my traditional muzzle loader. In between were 6mm's, 25's, 7's and 30's. Use 'em well, they work.

Regards, Guy

Same camp as Guy. I love to use them all, but good bullets seem to make them all work pretty well.

Jordan;
Top of the morning my friend, I hope that you and your fine family are well on this first weekend of February.

One of the reasons I've long respected what you post about is that, in my experience, you absolutely do make a practice of choosing your words carefully.

Sincere kudos for that by the way.

To be clear, I have zero experience with anything bigger than a coyote with a .223" bullet and don't really do much long range shooting for game, but that's a personal choice and I respect others who choose otherwise.

That said, in over 35 years of processing our own game plus helping family and friends process theirs, so somewhere north of 175 deer mostly but a few sheep, black bear and moose thrown in, I too have formed similar opinions about projectile energy.

Two key things brought that about for me, the first was how well a broadhead worked, that is to say how much tissue damage it did with basically no "energy" to speak of.

Secondly was that similarly constructed bullets, of similar diameter and construction, created noticeably more tissue damage with more bullet rpm, even if the initial velocity was slower.

I did a thread on that way back in the day and emphatically not everyone agreed with my findings, but that's perfectly acceptable too Jordan.

But humoring me for a moment, while I'm sure you can come up with a mathematical formula to calculate how rpm affects projectile performance, we went off of broken bones, tissue damage and the reaction of the buck when said bullet landed.

Anyways as always sir, there's many pack trails to Mecca and this is merely where I'm at on my journey.

All the best to you all.

Dwayne

What are people's thoughts on the 69 Scenar at .223 Rem velocities? Out to 500ish yards on deer sized critters?
After a few bad experiences with the 62 TSX I got some scenars but haven't played with them yet.

Ted, you really should try the 77 TMKs, At least grab a box of 100. I’m sure Scenars are good but I know the 77 TMKs will work.

Thanks, Dwayne. We are all good over here. I hope you and yours are all well.

I've seen the same thing with increased rotational speed causing more tissue damage. Expansion and sufficient penetration seem to do the trick, regardless (within reason) of other factors.

Have a great weekend!

👍

I’ll keep my eye out for some.
They seem a bit heavy/long for my Kimber’s 1/9 twist but I’ll give them a go if I find any.

Thx!

75 eldm and amax are killers. Seen 4 kills with the 75 eldm (bucks) this fall and it was impressive.

The Hornie 75gr HPBT is King there. Hint.

As RPM is added,the 75 ELD M is easy to love and the 88 ELD is bested by only the 90gr Beer Can. Hint……..

Holy hell, I have some 75 HPBT sitting around. I forgot about them and just dug them out. I'll load those up with the Scenars once I get a chance.

Calvin, right next to those HPBTs I also had a mostly full box of 75 AMAX that I'll send your way if you'd like. I could never get them to be real accurate in my Kimber at .223 speeds. I love the AMAX but they just weren't jiiving with this rifle.

Did you see much difference between the Amax and the ELD m as far as wound channels and penetration go? What twist were they spun from?

Just curious.

4 kills with the 75 ELD here as well this past fall. 2 coyotes, a doe and a buck. Only got an exit on one very small coyote, but only the buck ran off 20 yards or so. The doe was an unexpected shot at about 15 yards, and she dang neer cut a backflip upon impact. That being said, I'm dubious about using it again next year. Maybe I'll test it some more on hogs, if I can stop blasting them with 00.

Edit: I'm very curious about the 75 Scirocco. Any experience with those from the group?

Let me correct my statement a bit. I killed two with the 22CM, 75eldm. They worked fine. Was with the ‘horn a week later and he killed 2 with the 75 amax and 22CM. Worked fine. Didn’t really see any difference with that small sample.

As the ‘horn had told me, the 75s kill faster than about anything with bucks. It crushes them from what I witnessed and they pretty much go down with lung shots. I will do my alpine season next year with 22CM/75s and probably take it goat hunting too.

Thanks. I am using the Eldm bullets but I appreciate the offer.

The A-Max/ELD M are same/same as terminal effects go,but the ELD M is slicker and arrives the scene with higher impact velocity,while slipping atmospherics better. Win/win. Hint.

Given a choice,I prefer the 88 ELD M over everything,as they dig even deeper. Hint.

I don't care for the 75 Scirroco 1 or 2 and prefer the 'Max/ELD M there. Hint.

7" RPM in 223 SALAMI is a nice place to be for 88's. I shoot same in 8" RPM Speedmires,less issue. 9" in 22-250AI or Speedmire will handle 75 'Max/ELD M's. 9" in 223 SALAMI,is strictly 75gr Hornie HPBT Country,especially in Winter. Hint.

I LOVE 75's,but the 88 is fhuqking KING. Hint...............

I know two folks that have a 90 deer per annum state of Florida agricultural predation permit, beteeen them, for peanut fields here in NW FL. They use fast twist barreled 223 Rem 700s with 80 SMKs and VN powder to 800 yards. They have built two heavy wood picnic tables that are setup with sand bags, spotting scopes and 32x scopes with repetitive windage and elevation adjustments. They also use range cards nailed to stakes set at 50 yard increments on both sides of the fields with wind ribbons and laser range finders. The 80 SMK at 800 yards wii, according to the two shooters, penetrate end to end on a WT deer. They are not sport shooters at all. And under FL law all predation animals must be tagged immediately then turned in to specific receiving points, for distribution as meat for state food banks, predation game animals can not be kept by the permit holders. Now small predation permitted areas anre allowed for shooters to keep some animals, on recent changes.

This shooting deer with a 223 and heavy bullets is in line with the subject. Only noted for information.

The 80 SMK is a Goat Fhuqk. Hint……….

Yeah, I was just curious. I’m a couple dozen deer/bears deep with 75 Amax’s ala 223AI, and have a “few” on hand to tide me over. Haven’t shot anything with them in a twist faster than 1:9 though. Or faster than 2900 and change.

Preaching to the choir here… The three 223AI’s built in the last 18 months (2 Faux Ti’s and a rebarrel on my Montana) are all twisted 1:7.
I’m only 2 moose and a good bear deep so far, and a buddy smashed a good muley at distance with 88’s. Zero complaints on terminal performance and bone breaking abilities.

Almost wondering if I neeeeed a 22 Creed though….

It's counterintuitive to some,how "less",really is MORE. The 223/88 melding is simply fhuqking sensational,because one can't drive it fast enough,to get into trouble up close on Big Critters and less than ideal angles. They dig nicely and reliably. hint.

As impact velocities increase,there are diminishing returns in those regards. I think I have (7) Speedmires now and LOVE everything about them,but they are tougher on cup/cores,than chamberings of less case capacity. The 88 is my default in most of them,though I've a couple set up expressly for 90gr Beer Cans. I have them in 7,7.5 and 8",all of which 88. Hint.

I've shot jaziliions of 75 'Max/ELD's in 7,7.5.7.7,8 and 9",via 22-250AI's and Speedmires,with 3500fps being the typical ceiling. No doubt they hammer schit,but I find 88's even warmer/fuzzier,which THE highest of praise. Hint.

A recent 7" Montucky Speedmire has jumped to a FAVORITE and will be tough to leave setting idle. If I can make a Nightfarce 2.5-10x track/repeat and hold zero,it'll get the call. Hint................

I think you do.

The 77TMKs shoot well in my Montana (sub MOA) but I’ve only shot them to 100 yards. They’re worth a try.

Kodiakhntr what barrel did you use to rebarrel your Montana? Did they match the original contour, and if so, how close was the match?

Thanks.

Frank

Frank,

Kodiak might be using Canuk barrels but I'm curious to hear his reply as well.

I've used 2 of liljas kimber contour dupes and they were spot on. One from x caliber and one from rock creek were close but a little heavier.

I’ve Montucky dupes with PN,Rock,Bart’,Brux and Lilja. No biggy to simply replicate OEM contour and lose some shank. Hint.

Just sayin’………..

That's what I've done lately too Stick. Greg usually has a barrel that will work. Plus Shaen just loves to recontour them for me.

Dude is correct. K. S. Arms out of Edmonton.

Frank, as near as I can tell putting it side by side with the one that was pulled off it is absolutely identical. I didn’t put a caliper on it to look that close, but length/contour is bang on.

‘Stick, I *almost* forgot why that little Montana was my favoritest rifle ever, but as soon as it came back from the ‘smith it was real evident once again that it’s The One.

I’ll try to shoot for a coupla days,before I make a cast,so I don’t get sidetracked. Hint.

Need to stretch out the newest Montuckies and am yarding yet another 8” 223 S/S Teeker home. Hint……….

Tikka….. never thought I’d see the day….(grin)

I only have (5) in 8” 223. They should be 7”,but when sipping from CTR mags,they make sound Loaners. Fixin’ to be a herd for The Spring Fling and I took the month of April off. Hint.

There will be a bunch more 223’s pointed at Mooseses,after that dust settles. Hint.

Good times. Hint……………..(grin)

GOPHER GUNS?!?!? For MOOSES?!?!?






I hear good things……(grin)

An inch or so off the shank?

Good timing on this thread for me.

I have been playing with a Lilja barreled .223 (7 twist) in a 700 and an AR15 with a 7 twist as well. I get to stretch their legs out to 900yds at the end of March so I will be doing a lot of shooting until then. It has been fun working on paper with the 75grELDM, and a couple of Berger's offerings...a 75gr VLD and a 85.5gr Hybrid. It sounds like I need to grab a box of 88s too. I have only worked with CFE223 powder so far but I have Varget, H322, H335, I4895, A2230, A2460 and LeverRevolution currently on the shelf.

Any suggestions on which powder(s) to try next?

Gopher Guns for everything,mainly because folks tend to shoot best with same and placement matters more than a "smidge". Hint.(grin)

I get asked fhuqking near daily about "Bear Pistols" and I'm a proponent of hits,not misses,thus my 22LR affinity for same. I've stomped/lived everywhere the Scary Schit lurks and have yet to see a Bear lead with something other than it's head. Heads are big to boot and there ain't much to it. Proficiency can't be purchased and there's a connection to wares that are FUN to shoot,seeing the most trigger time. It is hardly a "fluke",to do better than very well with said wares. Hint.

As to Shankology,I'm happy to skin 'em back and inch don't aspook me none. Hint.

As 223,223AI,270,22 PPC AFI,243 Grendel,6 ARC,22 BR and 6 BR go,my powder preference is:

1) Lever'
2) Lever'
3) Lever'

And roughly in that fhuqking order,in dozens of spouts. Hint...............

AAC 77gr OTM has been working for me. Getting slightly better performance than IMI 77gr for 60% of the cost.

Why do you like that bullet in a fast twist 223?

Who doesn't like that bullet in a fast twist. 223? It's about the best you can fit in an AR, and they shoot just as good as the ELD in my Tikka, if not a hair better in group size. Of course that bit of difference is gained back plus some in the wind with the ELD, but I digress.

My question was why?

Accuracy?
LR performance?
Performance on game?

For me, all three in an AR. Plus cost/performance, which is really why I love em.

Thanks

Yeah man, no problem. Like I said, it's really a cost for what you get type of thing, for me at least. Seems like a lot of folks love the SMKs, but Sierra is waaaay to proud of em, MK262 be damned.

The 75 hornady hpbt does a lot better on flesh than the 77 smk as well in my experience

I've been using the Hornady 75g hpbt as an all around bullet in my arms and 8 twist tikka for about a dozen years. I used to buy them bulk pretty cheap. I tried some new rmr 69g and then went back to the Hornady. I might try the rmrs again when they get the polishing media out of the tips. I'm not sure if it effects expansion but I know the Hornady 75 works.

I also really like the 88 eld in my 22 Creedmoor. I've got a couple of rem700 all 223s I picked up years back at a Walmart closeout. I need to get some 18 or 20" 7 twist barrels for them. I thought about just doing some criterion remage from northland and started that route but got distracted with Arcs and other projects. My boys are 11 and 8 right now and I want them to start shooting more long range. Some 7 twist 223 700s slinging 88s seems like the perfect things for them to learn on.

Bb

I’m a fan of the 75 ELDM from a 1-8” Tikka.

Energy is stupid. Velocity matters.





P

What's the top velocity any of you get with a 88 ELD out of a 5.56?

I single fed them (88’s) in an 18” barrel and dope at long yards led me to believe 2600 start.

Not been disappointed yet on 77gr tmk.. but for sure they aren’t as ez to get to shoot as 75gr

And the more I shoot the less I believe in “tuning” loads for anything let alone an ar15.. that’s influenced by stick and form and a bit of regurgitating, but man my life’s a lot easier when it’s good bullet, case full of stable powder. Lapua brass.. bullet at max mag box length.. find pressure then back off half a grain… gun 5 shots. If it’s small and round.

If that doesn’t work make a change. If a 223 won’t shoot 75gr eld-m, 77gr tmk or 75gr bthp then it’s a tomatoe stake or a bullet hoser for 55gr fmj.


Mass produce.. Shoot a 10 shot zero. Shoot DOPE. Fill the freezer.

Haven’t seen with my own eyes 75gr bthp at distance.. the low bc means it’s a sub 400 yard gun if we think bullet upset isn’t happening below 2000fps from a vanilla 16” ar15.. that’s not a super useful rifle for me.. so 77gr tmk or 75 eld-m.

That’s all I got.. I gotta get off the wallet and finally just buy 10-15,000 black hills TMK and never touch the reloading handle before hunting season.

Yes, it sucks. It's only won more 600 yard Service Rifle matches than any other bullet.

Old info I know... But the hornady 75 bthp never was the most accurate bullet available. It certainly did not do well with lots of pressure on its base.
OTOH its pefromance on game was really not bad at all.

Cost vs bullet performance on game is a non issue with us. Simply cannot kill enough game that the cost matters. Use a bullet for its performance not its cost.

That said we still have a few thousand rounds loaded with 75 bthp and they are kept in the trucks and houses ready to go.

These days I would almost think one could find better. But you never know.

And yep Tyrone. Both are correct. Its far from the best. But its won so many matches its not even funny. So many more. matches than a person that runs his mouth constantly could never win.

You CLUELESS Crying Dumb Fhuqks are a hoot,as you vindicate your Professional Victim status,via perpetual Hurt Feeler Reports...you "lucky" kchunts. Hint. Congratulations?!?

Neither of you Fhuqktards can remember the last time you fired a live round,or went Outside,as you Whine from your Couchbound Kchunts. Hint.

Fhuqking LAUGHING!...................

I shot a 50 BMG yesterday. No, I'm not giving you pics.

That must be VERY exciting,for someone like you...you "lucky". Hint. Congratulations?!?




Keep stealing pics and "living" vicariously,you Lying Piece Of Fhuqking Schit. 75 BTHP Hornie here,to fuel your DREAMS. Hint.



Fhuqking LAUGHING!.................

I get a chuckle every time I see that picture. Thanks. It reminds me of what a know-nothing idiot you are.

It's VERY "surprising",that besides being a CLUELESS Lying Piece Of Fhuqking Schit,that you just "happen" to be a thief,up to and including your avatar...you "lucky" kchunt. Hint. Congratulations?!?

Fortunately for you,Imagination,Pretend and Stolen Pics are free,so even YOU can "afford" to "contribute". Hint.



Fhuqking LAUGHING!..................

Anyone kill anything with the Nosler Custom Competition 77 grainers? I bought a bunch years ago, worked up an unspectacular load and moved on.
Good enough accuracy for hunting and informal long range bombing.

I could never get the Nosler 77s to shoot like the Sierra 77 either.
However, the Nosler 69s and 80s shoot very well. Some rifles even prefer the Nosler 80. I went D on Nosler 80s.

I shot my share of Sierra 69's, 77's and 80's on the Highpower Ranges. Hornady 75's didn't shoot quite as good for me as the Sierras, and the Nosler CC's were less "good" than the Hornady's. When I went on hiatus from competition I continued shooting 77's on critters. I could tell when BH was loading CC's instead of Sierras (at least I thought I could). They do just fine on critters. Now that I'm gearing up to compete again, I see that there are many more 224 options than when I left off.

I'm playing with 77 TMK's right now because my stash of MK's somehow disappeared (anyone interested in Moly Coated 77's?).

If you're not constrained by a 2.26 OAL, Sierra 80's are easy to get shooting. I didn't have as much luck with Amax's back then. Didn't group as well, and I thought the BC's were overstated. I'm hearing good things about the ELD's, so I'll probably give those a go. Nosler RDF's put up BC numbers that are tempting.

Nothing wrong with the old Berger 75 & 80 VLDs either. A lot of guys are shooting the 80.5 Fullbores too.

I'd probably skip the Nosler ELDs. I tried the 70s in a couple guns and couldn't put up the scores with them.

Also the 80gr smk’s you were shooting 10yrs ago are not the same 80gr smk of today. Sierra redesigned it and they now have a bc of .461 @2100 fps and higher if you avg the three bc they list for it, the avg bc of the 80 smk is .445 about the same as the 80.5 berger. Even though I only been once but at Perry there were two bullets that stood out among the shooters on the long line. 80.5 berger and 80 smk’s. For the short line it was 77 smk some were using the Berger 77 (these are hard to find). For long range in my SR setup I use 85.5gr berger for the 1000yd line. I’m no Carlos hathcock but when people see me shooting my SR setup at 1k using my 1-4.5 power scope they are blown away. I used 80gr eld-m for a longtime but the lot to lot inconsistencies are tiring and you are alway guaranteed a flier or two. The nosler rdf I have 1400 70gr nosler rdf’s I sell real cheap lol I cannot get them to shoot. I tried 77 RDF’s I thought I found a load, shot real well at 100 I went to a midrange match slung up and it was bad at 600. So I scrapped them and stuck with 80smk’s. If I were smart I would stick with 85.5 Bergers for the 600 and 1k yd line. But I have over 1k 80smk’s. I also just bought 1k 80gr nosler cc they were selling sps. I’m not sure if I will make it to camp perry if I do it will be a turn and burn. Fly in Saturday shoot President 100, EIC then fly out on Wednesday.

Thank you. Crap…I just got a few 70 RDF’s in to try. If they don’t shoot right off, I won’t be investing the time. It was easy to find a good shooting TMK load.

I cracked open the vault/time capsule. I’m a little fat for Sierra 80’s…and I’ve got a season or two worth of JLK and Berger 80’s. Didn’t realize how much of the 77’s I was shooting without the sling as I’ve only got a couple boxes left.

For the OP…the Sierra 77’s on flesh tend to break at the canellure which I think improves the terminal ballistics. I initially thought the cannelure was for manufacturing purposes…but maybe serendipitously they improve lethality. FWIW, I've seen more slick 77's exit with modest exit holes. I didn't see as many cannelured exits and they seemed to do so more violently when they did. Just my unscientific observation. I’d search those out if I was hunting 77’s.

Also Brian Litz from berger tested the hornady 75gr bthp that .398 hornady claims is extremely exaggerated. Litz got a true bc of .355 and thats the bc I use and it holds true for me when I shoot it at 600yds. Litz tested Sierra 77 smk it avg .369.

Yah…I think we all figured out that hornady BC’s were optimistic for the 75’s (and the A-max). Sierra is claiming .420 on the TMK’s and my come ups seem to support that so far. Need more rounds down range.

I didn’t know Sierra updated the design of the 80…I thought they just refined their measurement. I’ll have to dig a bit on that one. Today I’m shooting a box of 80’s I labeled 1994!!! I think I was 5yo when I marked that box. Definitely not the updated version.

.

Bumping this. Lots of info and high entertainment value!