I have been hunting since the early 60's. In that time period to follow, I have done as many of you old timers, shot a truckload of bucks.

One time in the mid 60's, I shot a buck in the shoulder and never ever did it again. It was such a mess and totally uncalled for, except that it taught me I did not want to do it again.

When watching the so called pros on TV, I frequently see them taking shoulder shots. It makes me question their mentality. So what are your opinions? By the way, I always shot Hornady SP bullets and never the Nosler type.

i do so i dont have to go look for them, every buck or bull i have shot with a high shoulder shot required 0 tracking.....in some places i hunt an animal that runs 100 yards could mean a hell of a lot more time packing them out

I think the idea is to keep the deer from running and being claimed as a kill by another hunter.

As a kid I was taught to always aim behind the shoulder because it would ruin less meat and a bullet thru the lungs was a sure killer. This is the shot I try to take if possible. However if I had a booner quartering to me I wouldn't hesitate to put in the shoulder that I can see.

I only shoot behind the shoulder to conserve meat. If i have a shoulder shot to kill cleanly, then i will take it. Some meat loss is almost always going to happen regardless of where it get shot.

Its simply more loss when they are shot in the shoulder square on.

If I shoot a shoulder than means I missed and shot too far forward..No need to damage the shoulder meat. Some good burger and roasts in those shoulders.

A three legged deer can run as far as a four and you are hitting the same vitals (lungs) going through the the shoulder.

I have seen a lot of the TV folks shooting a really high shoulder, but that is to impact the spine and will drop an animal in its tracks. Disconnect the vertebra and it is down. Problem I see with that shot is you are not hitting the vitals and they can continue to live a while even if they can not move. Not a valid shot in my opinion.

I'm a shoulder shooter. The area I hunt, the South Texas brush country is THICK, and everything sticks, pricks, bites, or stings. I aim where the Scapula and Spine meet, when possible. If they are hit here they don't move from their tracks, not always DRT but don't get up.

I'm all about anchoring critters. There are no downsides to drilling shoulders.

Yea me to steelhead, front shoulder on deer are not what I call a favorite piece of meat so I don't care if they get banged up some, I save what I can. They don't leave the scene if popped in the shoulders and that's a plus hunting where I do. I have always just thought that people worrying about loss of meat so much that they change bullets even though the animals die quickly was funny.

Shooting in the shoulder tends to anchor critters better than shooting behind. I generally want to be 2/3 of the way up or so. If you shoot low, the meat is thicker on the shoulder so you lose more meat and it doesn't anchor as well. On smaller parcels of land, it is handy to anchor quickly, as it can be a pain in the ass to locate the adjacent landowner to get permission to retrieve your animal. In rugged country, especially on bigger animals like elk, it is handy to anchor the animal when said animal has the ability to make its retrieve much more difficult by running down a mountain with no road access to the valley, into blowdowns, etc. What many people would considered a shoulder ruined in its entirety can be salvaged mostly by separating the muscle groups and scraping the clotted blood off the outside.

90% of the time I hit high shoulder. I hate tracking or extra packing. I cut all my own meat, So loss is minimal. Clean it, Throw it in the grind, A Little blood shot is not an issue.

As a kid I was taught to shoot 'em in the shoulder so they wouldn't go anywhere and get claimed by someone else. That was in the good old days when we hunted in the mountains of N Central PA. Literally a guy behind every tree. Still remember the first deer I shot through he lungs - couldn't believe I pulled the trigger and it ran away! Of course it was plenty dead and less messy than that square in the shoulder shot. I'll still do it if I need the critter to stay put and I don't have a rest for a clear neck shot. Most of the time though we just put a nice hole through both lungs and collect them a few yards later.

+1 to this response.

so they dont run far

Yeah, I'm from the coal regions of Pa too. I will shoot the shoulder if the deer is near the edge of something.
Some of our areas are anywhere from cliffs to deep ravines. A good shoulder hit is almost an instant kill, right into the heart. Drops a running deer like a bag of cement too.

I learned to aim into the crease behind the foreleg. Haven't seen the tracking that some have. I think 30-35 yards is the longest I've seen an animal go, but I know of some that have far different experiences. I would only shoot a shoulder through error. I know the high-shoulder hit is dramatic in that they drop right there most of the time, and only go a few steps the rest of it. To my thinking though, if the ribs aren't facing me, it is time for a neck shot. To each his own.

IME an animal hit directly behind the shoulder may drop instantly or it may make it 50 or so yards. I think I saw one elk make it about 200 yards, but it was steep downhill.

Shoulder shot critters may drop on the spot or make it 50 or so yards too. I get pissed every time I see a heart get destroyed too.

I see no reason and no upside to shoulder shots (high shoulders are something else) unless they simply give you confidence. I killed an elk about two weeks ago, and one shoulder was shattered (accidentally shot too far forward). That bull made it about 50 yards before crashing. I've seen antelope run with both shoulders broke too. Never very far, but they still run.

Here is CT the problem is that if a Deer runs off the property you are hunting, you have to call the Game Warden and get permission to go after the deer. I am lucky the neighboring property owners hunt to and we have an agreement about this issue. As for shoulder shots on White tails, its fine with me, I would rather have the game down on the ground. Then again I don't shoot soft bullets that tend to break up either. One of my neighbors told me once that there is not a whole lot on the front shoulder of a deer to begin with. At most I might have lost 10 lbs off of a Buck I shot that field dressed a tad over 180 lbs. Then again a guest the same year should have taken a shoulder shot but he wanted not to waste a couple of handfuls of meat and that buck ran off and we never was able to find him. I looked for him for a week after that. That guy never hunted my property ever again. In europe they train dogs to find game once shot, its to bad we can't do that here, a good tracking dog would have found that deer. It still bothers me some 30 years after the fact.

My learnings and experiences mirror HuntnShoot. I learned to hunt with a master hunter who was as shrewd as any hunter I had ever hunted with. We used to hang a deer for a week or so, depending on the weather. So a shot up deer, was a no no. I generally shot a 270 or '06 and put deer down within yards. In all those years of hunting, I only lost one buck. And that was simply poor shooting on my part.

Hey Dog-hunter Matt Foley Dittos!

A car can't move w/o wheels. powdr

I shoot [bleep] until it dies-simple as that. Behind the shoulder or on the point of it both work fine for me.

Tanner

Some good reasons to shoot deer in the shoulder:

-To kill it.
-It's a vital area,and a shot there can immobilize it. See above.
-That might be the shot you are presented.

If guy stops using tin foil bullets,he may find that shoulder shots can be taken without spoiling everything forward of the diaphragm.

Mornin Fred -

I am hunting private property that is surrounded on 3 sides by owners who don't allow hunting. It's important to me to DROP a deer ASAP.

I am posting 2 pics of HI-shoulder shots from last season. As you'll see there was minimal meat loss.

Also with this shot the animal is dead IMMEDIATELY. The spinal cord gets severed and it's along the bottom of the back strap. There was no kicking, pawing, crawling or anything. I watch them hit the ground and there is NO movement.

If your shot hits lower there will be more meat damaged.





For NO meat loss and if it's not important that the deer runs some distance, the lung shot is deadly.

This. I question why someone who's hunted as much as they say, why they would question "why a shoulder shot" in the first place.

Yepper. It works for me too.
Besides knocking out the front wheel drive, good chances it'll blow up the heart too.
Happened to this one...

When/where dictates how/when I shoot..........

This doe died 20 yards from a neighbors back yard, where I needed it to NOT GO.

The crossbow/shot placement did it's job........

punching some bone gives TSXs something to work with and prevents your food from using it's last 30 seconds to make your next several hours suck.

They don't give a chit, plain and simple and it looks better on their so called TV shows to see whatever dropping at the shot.

Look at how many shows these days wait until the next morning to go retrieve whatever game, as it makes better shooting light.

I use the shoulder shot only if I have to stop the deer right there otherwise it sure makes a mess of things.

I'm blue/green and red/orange color blind. (I can see the colors but they look a lot a like, don't stick out to me - sucks but I also can see deer MUCH faster than normal vision people. Movement is like a klieglight to me, not so much to others.)

Blood on leaves isn't the easiest thing in the world for me to see. I drill shoulders so they don't run.

Runt shot a buck this year and stewed the lungs. Was 70 yards before we found blood and about 90 before the deer was found.

My father is a great tracker as is my brother so I either have to know they're in camp or take out the steers. I rather take out the steers and just show up bloody....

Taking out the shoulders put's them on he ground quick. I don't mess with shoulder meat. Too much trouble for too little reward. I'd rather shoot another.

Keep the shoulder whole, wrap it in foil and throw it on the grill for a few hours. You end up with something like this.

If God didn't want us to shoot deer in the shoulders He wouldn't have but the goodies betwixt them.

It amazes me how many folks here find critters don't go anywhere when shoulder shot. Different situations and experiences I guess.

I have found no difference in how far critters run whether shot through the shoulder or directly behind it. Sometimes they make it a few steps and sometimes they don't. High shoulder shots excluded of course.

This is why I try to avoid shoulders, even with premium bullets.



This elk made it about 10 steps after a 200 grain accubond broke both shoulders (by accident). 10 steps is not far enough to make any difference, but that gritty, nasty bone marrow and bone fragments were everywhere.
Roughly half of the critters I hit behind the shoulder don't even make it 10 steps. Again, no upside to drilling shoulders as I see it, unless it simply gives you confidence.

Yep.

Tin foil bullets at the speed of light, ain't that the truth...

CWM/Skane: Yea we love our plastic tipped and fragile skinned bullets for their wonderful accuracy and aerodynamic flight;prep ourselves for that long shot then shoot some beast at 100 yards and wonder why we have blown the fronts to smithereens,with exits the size of watermelons....

You're going to spoil some meat with shoulder shots with anything because you have to break a few eggs to make an omelet...but if you use a high velocity cartridge the carnage can be kept under control by using a bit tougher bullet.

I shoot shoulders so there is no guessing...

Did I make a good shot? did it hump because I heart shot it or gut shot? Is it good blood, is that liver or lungs? Do I wait awhile to start tracking? I swear it was standing right here by this tree, but no blood... Dramatics...

I just like to go over and gut it or bone it out depending if I'm packing or dragging.

Kent

Anyway, I can get about 100 tacos out of a deers shoulders... if I only get 50 I don't really care much.

Kent

Going center shoulder leaves a lot of room for placement error.

^^^^ +1 ^^^^

I try to hold the X on the front half of them.

+1 ...

Yes, and if haven't shot many deer you come up with a different answer. I'll break shoulder blades at every opportunity. So what if I lose 3 pounds of meat? They go down instantly.

My exact thoughts.

Unit L, we ain't got time to 'whittling' slivers of meat outta scapulas.

de-bone the hams, strips the back straps, carve a little off the neck

next!!!!

What ? do you leave the tenderloin??

The front shoulders make very good ROASTS!

BTW - I shoot HI shoulder, little meat loss.

Not to me they don't I process my venison and get every sliver of silverskin I can off the meat. The front shoulder is just way too much hassle. With the large limits we have in TN, I'd rather shoot another doe and have a rear ham for roasts.

The motivation to shoot deer in the shoulder for me is if it is the only target presented. Otherwise I am an equal opportunity shooter. Broadside behind the shoulder, frontal neck shot, uphill into the brisket, downhill into the spine, raking forward shots.

Pretty much. If I can hit a shoulder or two, I do. You don't lose that much meat and if the deer runs, it's a short distance.

I did hit a buck in one shoulder that ran about 70-80 yards, but he still died in seconds.

I hunt with a lite caliber now because of back and neck issues and take a neck or head shot no mess and all the deer that I have taken like this only takes one step down

The roasts from the front shoulder are typically too small & a bit too tough. The "roasts" make great stew meat & jerky (real jerky, none of this jerky cannon crap), and the rest goes into the grind tub.

Depending on the shot angle, distance, and circumstances, the shoulder area gives you the largest target and room for error. As mentioned, the high shoulder is going to anchor them almost every time (every time if you hit the right spot).

As good as many folks are at shooting paper, when it comes to shooting an animal, with the emotions and excitement and everything else that comes with it, I'd prefer that folks aim at the middle of the boiler room rather than try to take a hero shot to save a couple pounds of meat.

With a few exceptions I'd bet those boys only take the head/horns home and donate the rest. The important thing for the camera is to get a DRT shot or one that won't run far so they can get the "kill" on film. Taking the shoulder first will make sure the critter won't get far.

My choice of shot is just behind the shoulder ... double-lung. Although I've made a few high neck shots when they don't give me a broadside.

Down Wind -

I see from your avatar.....


you are the Wal Mart COWBOY <G>

I like to shoot shoulders if I'm after horns. Drops them fast and I don't care if it wastes some meat. I prefer behind-the-shoulder shots on meat deer if possible but sometimes you have to take the shot that is presented.

Just recently I shot a doe at 160 yards. It was the last morning of the hunt and it was my only chance for venison. She stood quartered to and I shot her on the shoulder with a 139 Hornady out of a 7-08. She made it about 10 feet. When I cut her up I lost about a pound and a half of meat from the shoulder I shot. I figure it was a small price to pay to bring home venison.

I like shoulder meat; I've not found it to be tough at all. I've even cut it into chops. Makes good pastrami too. But the meat at the top of the shoulder just isn't that thick, and it would end up in the grind as it too thin to cook it whole.

I use it all.. It all makes good snack sticks once it is ground up..

I shot this mulie facing me, straight into the chest. Somehow, the Nosler Partition turned into the left shoulder leaving this:



Not sure what happened but it looks like the bullet fragmented after hitting the shoulder bone(which also would have likely fragmented) Either way, that shoulder was unuseable and left to the wolves, bears and coyotes.

That's wasted meat.

I realize, some states (NC included) have very generous bag limits and if one chooses to NOT collect all the useable meat, well, that's one thing in situations of abundant game, not that I agree with wasting meat.
However, out west, most guys get ONE tag good for ONE deer. I feel we have a responsibility to collect pretty much all useable meat with few exceptions. Shoulder meat can be ground and makes just as good burger or sausage or jerky as any other portion.

I don't like losing a shoulder, sometimes things just happen that cannot be explained, sometimes we miss our aim point, sometimes circumstances may dictate a shoulder shot, sometimes the shoulder is the only shot presented.

Personally though, I avoid shoulder shots unless that was the only alternative. I just don't like intentionally ruining meat.

some of you western guys have to remember, some of our southeast whitetails are less than 100lbs on the hoof

shoulders? we talking about 1-3 lbs of usable meat minus the bone and sinew silver skin, artery cording, chunk of fat....

mehhh


unless some of you are under some delusion as to what magic happens inside the processors shack....if you've never self processed a carcass.

provided the processor himself is not flicking cigarette ashes into your grinds, or spittin copenhagen juice or losing a band aid or scratching his ass

'Cept when they are the "rear shoulders" !!

Even that isn't an obstacle to some of the folks who sometimes post here.

I shoot whatever the little devils show me, including necks, chests, shoulders and even armpits. I do feel better shooting at the parts that keep me away from the guts though, which is where the shoulder and occasionally the neck really shine.

works:

I suspect you remember the original post by a now departed member who talked about shooting a deer in the "rear shoulder"?

Yessir. I hesitate to post a name lest he return....

Few years back we had four elk hunters and two of us trying to get them each a bull.

Second morning, two hunters still with tags, I just get back to camp with one guy and get a call that another hunter gut shot a nice bull. They trailed it across the flats for miles, got another shot but missed, then lost the trail.

Back out I go.

By afternoon they were ready to give up... I said let me drive around a couple miles ahead, I know where he's going, possibly I'll find him before he gets to the junipers.

I found him in a creek bed under a cottonwood, laid down but still alive.

Called the others to bring the hunter.

He got above the bull at 50 yds, we stayed back.

He shoots, then again, and again... five times...

WTH!

The way the bull was laid and looking back he thought his rear 'shoulder' was his front.

Killed the chit out of it's hams...

Kent

That's SAD, for the elk and the "hunter" (?)

Like others said, to me it depends on if its meat or horns I'm after.

i shoot exclusively for shoulders if possible....and with a TTSX I get 2 exits and no explosions

i dont eat shoulder meat anyway

You don't want one to go to far over the downside. Probably a 45 degree 500yard tangled blowdown slope with waist deep water at the bottom. A little lost shoulder meat would be the least of your problems.

There's meat on the shoulder.
This one didn't run.

Depends on the situation. There ARE places I want them down NOW, not 35 yds later.

In South Texas I want them down ASAP, which is smart unless you like crawling through head high cactus and mesquite thats too dense to see 20 ft in and will make you look a lion attacked you when you finally make it out. Not to mention the numerous rattlesnakes...

Out west I like it if the animal is near the edge of a canyon or anything else that will make the pack job twice as hard if they get too it.

Out in the open, sure, I'll go behind the shoulder.

I think people that ask questions like this either haven't hunted as much as they say, or they've never hunted anywhere else except "their spot" and think deer are hunted the same way and conditions are the same everywhere in the world as it is "where they hunt"

Bill

I get more reliable quick kills with a handgun shooting a shoulder going in.

FWIW-which isn't much-neither did this one.

For me, it depends on a number of factors, including but not limited to: location, time of day, weather conditions, what I'm using, what kind of shot is presented, how much meat I've already got in the freezer... When I'm pulling down on a deer I run all these things through the mental computer and decide. I could never say "I always shoot deer (this way or that.)

I didn't read many of the other replies so....

High shoulder shots on TV are for the effect, for some reason folks want to high five after slamming an animal to the ground, and question a hunter if they see a deer run after the shot.

Never mind the fact that there is less room for error with that shot and I always thought that conserving meat, and going for a high percentage shot was the best bet most of the time.

I've said it before and will again, if I feel the need to have DRT the largest target thats easiest to locate IMHO is the brain. The spine as it comes off the brain is half the size IE diameter. And it snakes around and is never in the same location in relation to the top of the back line of the deer so you have to know anatomy very well if you want to hit that tiny target at any place in the animal from any angle.

I understand the idea of not wanting to track or not having the animal go furhter, but thats the chance you take when you hunt and have to make your choice.

Can guarantee that moose hunting in some situations I'd take a brain shot due to water. And remember a cold evening in a river, cussing the fact that a buddy had made a high shot by accident on a caribou at least... REALLY wanted that bull to run out of the river before expiring.

You make some good points.

However, with the shoulder shot it's not the spine I'm after. It's the front wheels and as Steelhead says the stuff in-between.

Some of the shows are into instant on the ground, but it seems the majority like to have footage of them running off and then coming back in the dark with the made up high fives, giggling and hugs.

As an example, I'm guessing (based on recent PM's) that 1) you seldom hunt from your hind feet 2) you seldom hunt in a rain forest.

If there is a downside to having a critter drop sooner rather then later, I'd like to hear it.

There's alot more good stuff center leg up than behind the armpit or head, and room for error...

Plus no drama.

+1
If you don't mind trying to find a buck after he goes into thick cover then there would be no need to shoot the shoulder. For those who worry, how many pounds of shoulder meat do you think is ruined from a shoulder hit?
And last but not least, how many animals do you think you actually killed, but didn't know for sure if they were hit because you lost thier trail after 60 yards of thick brush?

Once again Stick dropped a pearl not so long ago.

Out in flatlands for the most part it makes little difference. In the thick and uncivil places things are often different and losing a pound or so beats losing all.

Successful tracking of wounded animals is an admirable skill. Today most don't get enough practice to get good at it.