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7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions

Posted By: donsm70

7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

I recently purchased a Remington 700 Classic in 7mm-08 with some Kampfeld upgrades that shoots 150 gr Nosler Partitions very well. I really like the rifle, the weight, the mild recoil and the way it shoots.
Here is my dilema. I have a wilderness horseback elk hunt (probably my last) scheduled for the fall of 2020 in Wyoming. I also have rifles in 6.5 CM, 7x57, 280ai, 30-06 and 300WM that I like and are very accurate. I have a self imposed shot limit of 300 yards. I am not a turret twister. My last two hunts there have produced 6x6 bulls at 160 and 27 yards.
Is the 700 in 7-08 up to the task?
donsm70
Posted By: Caleveras

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

The debate I am having is between 140 grn Accubond or 140 grn Trophy Copper for my elk hunt.

Bottom line, the 7mm-08 is up to the task.
Posted By: chlinstructor

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

I’d load it with either 150 gr 160 gr Partitions And not think twice about it.
Posted By: Razorhog

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

donsm70

First, good luck with your hunt! Secondly, it's absolutely up to the task. Thirdly, I thought you'd be shootin' a ULA or NULA???????????? LOL
Posted By: Rock Chuck

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

I've killed a bunch of elk with a 270 using 150 gr bullets of various types, including PT's. There isn't a lot of difference. Use it and enjoy.
Posted By: Jerseyboy

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

Gunwriter John Haviland and his family like and use 7mm-08s for much of their hunting, including elk hunting. I think one of the sons uses a Remington Model Seven with 18-1/2" barrel in 7mm-08. Why don't you write him a letter?
Posted By: donsm70

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

Originally Posted by Razorhog
donsm70

First, good luck with your hunt! Secondly, it's absolutely up to the task. Thirdly, I thought you'd be shootin' a ULA or NULA???????????? LOL


Thanks for the help, guys.

RazorHog,
The 7x57 that I mentioned is a NULA, as well as one in 260 Rem. I'm not sure the 260 would handle a heavier bullet. I normally shoot 120 gr with the 260.

donsm70
Posted By: Hesp

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

Any of the rifles you mentioned are absolutely capable of elk, especially at the ranges you mention. I have taken numerous elk over the years & my favorite is one of the 6.5's. I like the mild recoil & flat trajectory. Any reasonable cartridge with a stout deep penetrating bullet properly placed will get the job done. I prefer the Barnes mono's. They have proved 100% reliable with complete penetration from any angle even thru heavy bone.
Posted By: Sako76

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

The 7-08 is up to the task. Probably couldn't find a better bullet than the Nosler Partition. Good luck.
Posted By: PJGunner

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

I'm seriously considering using my 7x57 with 150 gr. Nosler Partitions loaded to 7-08 velocities. I can easily do 2700+ FPS and do have a load that does 2800+ FPS so should work for the elk hunt I'm doing this coming December.
Paul B.
Posted By: DakotaDeer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

All of the rifles chamberings that you listed are up to the task with good bullets.

Pick whatever you want and practice with it.
Posted By: ingwe

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

Originally Posted by donsm70
I.
Is the 700 in 7-08 up to the task?
donsm70



Yes. Slam Dunk.
Posted By: RMiller2

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/11/19

Easily up to the task.
Posted By: ShortMag11

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/12/19

Originally Posted by Sako76
The 7-08 is up to the task. Probably couldn't find a better bullet than the Nosler Partition. Good luck.


This!
Posted By: Billy_Goat

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/12/19

if my 708 shot 150 PT's well, that's what I'd be loading!!

instead, I run the 150 AB.

inside 300, I'd not lose sleep over the load.
Posted By: 65BR

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/12/19

The 150 ABLR might eat into powder capacity a bit. To 300 yds, I'd run the following:

150 PT
140 AB
150 NBT

One other option, the 120 Barnes, but at modest speeds, the above 3 will give you solid performance.
Posted By: Pharmseller

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/12/19

Yes.

And I’m not posting any more dead elk 7mm-08 pictures.




P
Posted By: Brad

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/12/19

I'm struggling to understand how this is even a question...
Posted By: Mule Deer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/12/19

Because so many hunters think elk won't die unless they're shot with a .300 or .338 magnum. Or they've heard that from somebody....
Posted By: PJGunner

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/12/19

Originally Posted by 65BR
The 150 ABLR might eat into powder capacity a bit. To 300 yds, I'd run the following:

150 PT
140 AB
150 NBT

One other option, the 120 Barnes, but at modest speeds, the above 3 will give you solid performance.


That's a good looking bullet but in my three 7x57s and a .280 Remington it's about useless. I'd originally on using that one in the 7x57 as a means of getting a little more range but accuracy has not been good. I keep trying different seating depths but the best I've gotten in any of my rifles is three inches. Guess I'll just have to go with the Partition.
Paul B.
Posted By: Hammerdown

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/12/19

Originally Posted by Brad
I'm struggling to understand how this is even a question...

+1
Posted By: OttoG

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/12/19

If he'd said moose would opinion be the same? Saves me a post.
Posted By: Brad

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/13/19

Originally Posted by Mule Deer
Because so many hunters think elk won't die unless they're shot with a .300 or .338 magnum. Or they've heard that from somebody....


I’m always astonished how many locals - often native Montanan’s - are so-armed. I suppose it’s a group-think/peer-pressure/testosterone-laden type of thing. Of course, even locals can have very little experience killing elk, and are susceptible to the common idea - spread via various media - that a magnum is a requirement for killing elk.

I have a friend that grew up in Helena, and had good opportunity to hunt elk. As a teen, in his and various other relatives hands, his 7mm-08 took over a dozen elk. Somehow though, in his twenties, he felt certain he needed a 300 RUM. He does, however, drive a big jacked-up 3/4 ton truck. I asked him if he’d ever had trouble killing elk with his 7-08, and he replied “never.”

Go figure...
Posted By: northcountry

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/13/19

Originally Posted by Mule Deer
Because so many hunters think elk won't die unless they're shot with a .300 or .338 magnum. Or they've heard that from somebody....


Yes and to think in days of yore people have been reported as even shooting moose with a 30-30 can you believe that. Cheers NC
Posted By: AZtwins

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/13/19

I think it was Bob Hagel that said “Don’t choose your caliber based on what you can get away with when everything goes right. Choose something that will work when everything goes wrong”

Very few people need a magnum for most situations and probably even less can shoot well enough to make the shot even when it would be necessary. I know I shoot better when I’m not getting body slammed every time I pull the trigger.

I did shoot my last elk with a 7mm08 but I doubt I’ll do it again. Yes it’s dead but, personally, I feel better with some more bullet weight in the air. I’m looking at a 35 Whelen right now.

I know guys that shoot piles of deer with 223’s but I wouldn’t do that either...
Posted By: donsm70

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/13/19

Originally Posted by Mule Deer
Because so many hunters think elk won't die unless they're shot with a .300 or .338 magnum. Or they've heard that from somebody....


Hey John,
You should have posted this before I bought that 300 WM. You know, of course, that is just for target practice.

Thanks again to all that replied. Now, I just have to be healthy enough to go.

donsm70
Posted By: 338Rules

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/13/19

Originally Posted by donsm70
Originally Posted by Mule Deer
Because so many hunters think elk won't die unless they're shot with a .300 or .338 magnum. Or they've heard that from somebody....


Hey John,
You should have posted this before I bought that 300 WM. You know, of course, that is just for target practice.

Thanks again to all that replied. Now, I just have to be healthy enough to go.

donsm70


Enjoy your hunt sir, and come back and regale us with your adventure. Post pics please.
I’ve had nothing but great results with the 150 NP, and have every expectation that you will too.

The trouble with magnums comes with those pesky short range opportunities that present themselves so often when pussy footing around. I do like my .338 when in active grizzly country. Let your guid worry about that though.

Cheers, and Good Hunting
Posted By: scenarshooter

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/13/19

Originally Posted by Brad
I'm struggling to understand how this is even a question...



Yes, for the 10,000th time.....
Posted By: jorgeI

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/13/19

Originally Posted by ingwe
Originally Posted by donsm70
I.
Is the 700 in 7-08 up to the task?
donsm70



Yes. Slam Dunk.


So the same would apply to a 308 and 165 Partitions or how about 130gr TTSXs? Also, I have a personal limit of around 350 yards and I am not much of a knob turner. I've had great luck using the B&C reticle out to 350 yards.
Posted By: ruraldoc

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/13/19


I have killed bulls with a 270 and a 44 magnum handgun. A 7mm-08 or 308 will certainly kill any elk alive with good bullets and reasonable shot placement.

The Partition would be an excellent bullet for the task.

The 300 yard self imposed limit makes it even more of a no brainer.
Posted By: beretzs

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/13/19

Originally Posted by jorgeI
Originally Posted by ingwe
Originally Posted by donsm70
I.
Is the 700 in 7-08 up to the task?
donsm70



Yes. Slam Dunk.


So the same would apply to a 308 and 165 Partitions or how about 130gr TTSXs? Also, I have a personal limit of around 350 yards and I am not much of a knob turner. I've had great luck using the B&C reticle out to 350 yards.


I’d be just fine myself with any of those combos. A good shot is a good shot. Elk are tough but none of them can live long without lungs or heart.
Posted By: seattlesetters

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/14/19

I’ve killed a few elk with the 7-08 and the 150 NPT as well as the 140 NPT. All within 200 yards and no tracking required.

Take it and go have fun. It’ll do it for sure.
Posted By: 65BR

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/14/19

Originally Posted by PJGunner
Originally Posted by 65BR
The 150 ABLR might eat into powder capacity a bit. To 300 yds, I'd run the following:

150 PT
140 AB
150 NBT

One other option, the 120 Barnes, but at modest speeds, the above 3 will give you solid performance.


That's a good looking bullet but in my three 7x57s and a .280 Remington it's about useless. I'd originally on using that one in the 7x57 as a means of getting a little more range but accuracy has not been good. I keep trying different seating depths but the best I've gotten in any of my rifles is three inches. Guess I'll just have to go with the Partition.
Paul B.


Which one the ABLR? Some bullets simply do not sync great with various throating on certain rifles, etc. or for whatever unknown reason just are fickle.

I say shoot what you are comfortable using....Literally. I bet the youngster using the 300 RUM is not as comfortably feeling that go off, vs when he used his 7/08 wink

Displacement cannot substitute Shot Placement........So be sure you can hit vitals. I recall Sam Fadala writing about his wife going hunting Elk with her Sako 7/08. She knocked one over before they realized she grabbed the 'wrong ammo' - and used factory 140 Corelokt. Likely the original loading that IIRC, used the 139 Hornady IL-SP. I took aim with that very bullet chambered in a 20" Win M70 carbine on an elk at 40 yds one fall in Colorado....but it was not legal. Next day I bumped off a Mule Deer in the same spot, but at 115 paces. Did quite a number on that deer, thru the neck and unfortunately exited hitting the spine/backstrap and hind quarter.......doing quite a bit of damage. It would have done an elk no good. I do not like the current 140 CL that Rem calls "New CL" - do not seem to be accurate when I tried them.

Good luck on your hunt OP - have confidence.
Posted By: Filaman

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/14/19

A few years back, like maybe 8 or so I thought I was going on an elk hunt. The guys on the forum (Not this forum) kept telling everyone that for elk you need a 7 mag minimum and that a .300 or .338 mag would be so much better. So I never having shot an elk bought a 7mag off a Gun Broker auction for $205 with the intent of having it re-barreled to .308 Norma. Then a guy I knew said he had a .300 Weatherby he'd sell me. So I bought it for $1000. It's a Lazer Mark and a damn nice gun (which I still have). But I ended up leaving the 7 Rem. Mag as a 7 MM Remington Mag (and still have it)and Then I didn't go on the elk hunt. Now that I have two magnum rifles, I get on here with some very experienced elk hunters and I find very few here use magnums and most use everything from a 7-08, 7x57, to a .270 and .30-06. I have a 7x57, a .270 Win. and a .30-06, so I guess if I get the opportunity I'll have plenty of choices. And I shoot my .270 so well, I've had it for 53 years and killed a slew of deer and hogs with it, that I'm thinking from what I read here that I'll load me up some 140 or 150 grain NP over some RL 22 and go kill an elk.
Posted By: Reloder28

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/14/19

Originally Posted by donsm70
Here is my dilema. I have a wilderness horseback elk hunt (probably my last) scheduled for the fall of 2020 in Wyoming.


How is that a dilemma, exactly...? laugh


As long as my bullet speed exceeds 2800 fps I am perfectly confident in it out to 350 yards.
Posted By: donsm70

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/15/19

Thanks again to all that have replied. I have enjoyed the thread and you guys have confirmed my suspicions. 7-08 with well placed 150 gr NP equals dead elk.

PS. I may have 10 or 12 rifles up for sale very soon.

donsm70
Posted By: WAM

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/15/19

Originally Posted by Filaman
A few years back, like maybe 8 or so I thought I was going on an elk hunt. The guys on the forum (Not this forum) kept telling everyone that for elk you need a 7 mag minimum and that a .300 or .338 mag would be so much better. So I never having shot an elk bought a 7mag off a Gun Broker auction for $205 with the intent of having it re-barreled to .308 Norma. Then a guy I knew said he had a .300 Weatherby he'd sell me. So I bought it for $1000. It's a Lazer Mark and a damn nice gun (which I still have). But I ended up leaving the 7 Rem. Mag as a 7 MM Remington Mag (and still have it)and Then I didn't go on the elk hunt. Now that I have two magnum rifles, I get on here with some very experienced elk hunters and I find very few here use magnums and most use everything from a 7-08, 7x57, to a .270 and .30-06. I have a 7x57, a .270 Win. and a .30-06, so I guess if I get the opportunity I'll have plenty of choices. And I shoot my .270 so well, I've had it for 53 years and killed a slew of deer and hogs with it, that I'm thinking from what I read here that I'll load me up some 140 or 150 grain NP over some RL 22 and go kill an elk.


Yeah, it’s a generally fickle bunch on Internet forums when it comes to rifles. Or scopes. LOL!
Posted By: BuzzH

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/17/19

Never have shot the 150 partition at elk in a 7-08, but they would work for sure. I've shot 14 elk with 140 grain accubonds from my 7-08 from 50-620 yards.

Day before yesterday, my 14 year old nephew shot this cow in Wyoming with his 7-08 and a 120 grain ballistic tip at 231 yards...load particulars 46.5 grains H380 MV 2825 FPS. Broke the on side shoulder bullet was just under the hide about 3 inches behind the off shoulder. Elk ran about 25 yards, swayed for a couple seconds and down.

[Linked Image]

I shot this cow last night with my newly re-barreled and refinished ruger tang safety m77 in 6mm. My Dad and Grandfather bought this rifle new for me in 1979 and was my first big-game rifle. Good to have Dad, my brother and 2 nephews along list night to see that rifle put back to use. Shot was 134 yards with a 95 grain ballistic tip, nicked the back of the on-side shoulder exited on the point of the off-shoulder. Ran maybe 30 yards.

[Linked Image]

Posted By: beretzs

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 08/19/19

Great pics! Way to make meat buddy!

That 6mm looks wicked.
Posted By: Jackson_Handy

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/26/19

Originally Posted by BuzzH
Never have shot the 150 partition at elk in a 7-08, but they would work for sure. I've shot 14 elk with 140 grain accubonds from my 7-08 from 50-620 yards.

Day before yesterday, my 14 year old nephew shot this cow in Wyoming with his 7-08 and a 120 grain ballistic tip at 231 yards...load particulars 46.5 grains H380 MV 2825 FPS. Broke the on side shoulder bullet was just under the hide about 3 inches behind the off shoulder. Elk ran about 25 yards, swayed for a couple seconds and down.

[Linked Image from photos.imageevent.com]

I shot this cow last night with my newly re-barreled and refinished ruger tang safety m77 in 6mm. My Dad and Grandfather bought this rifle new for me in 1979 and was my first big-game rifle. Good to have Dad, my brother and 2 nephews along list night to see that rifle put back to use. Shot was 134 yards with a 95 grain ballistic tip, nicked the back of the on-side shoulder exited on the point of the off-shoulder. Ran maybe 30 yards.

[Linked Image from photos.imageevent.com]



I think you meant niece....
Posted By: bsa1917hunter

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/26/19

Originally Posted by donsm70
I recently purchased a Remington 700 Classic in 7mm-08 with some Kampfeld upgrades that shoots 150 gr Nosler Partitions very well. I really like the rifle, the weight, the mild recoil and the way it shoots.
Here is my dilema. I have a wilderness horseback elk hunt (probably my last) scheduled for the fall of 2020 in Wyoming. I also have rifles in 6.5 CM, 7x57, 280ai, 30-06 and 300WM that I like and are very accurate. I have a self imposed shot limit of 300 yards. I am not a turret twister. My last two hunts there have produced 6x6 bulls at 160 and 27 yards.
Is the 700 in 7-08 up to the task?
donsm70


You lost me at 700 Don.
Posted By: bsa1917hunter

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/26/19

Originally Posted by Brad
I'm struggling to understand how this is even a question...

Rhetorical
Posted By: Kimber7man

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/26/19

Originally Posted by Jackson_Handy




I think you meant niece....



That's a dickhead comment
Posted By: Remsen

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/26/19

I'll add my "yes" to the pile. A few weeks ago a cow elk met a 139 gr GMX projectile going about 2900 fps out of my Remington 700 7-08 (stock other than a McM hunter stock). It wasn't the biggest elk around, but it was decent sized and it took about 1 step before going down.
Posted By: super T

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

I'm throwing in with those who say the 7mm08 with the 150gr NP will be fine. But I'll like to add something unrelated to bullet and cartridge headstamp. A good rifle for a horseback hunt has some special requirements. It should be on the short side and not overly heavy. And, if scoped, the scope should be small too. All this is important because the scoped rifle must fit under your leg in a scabbard. So, for me, the rifle itself is more important than the headstamp. But, maybe you already know this.
Posted By: Mule Deer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

super T,

Excellent points.

Have actually seen the objective bells of longer scopes bent slightly, but noticeably, after riding around for a while....
Posted By: bigwhoop

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

Almost 20 years ago now, we started hunting elk with 300's and 338's just "because they were tough and the mountains were big".
Well, right now no one shoots a 300 of any kind. Its all 30-06's, .270 Win., and .308's. Go figure - what worked in the midwest on whitetail deer, worked on elk in WY. CO, and NM..
Posted By: Highoctane

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19


I betcha 10 dollars to a donut that those 150 gr Partitions from a 7 aught 8 won't bounce off any elk!!
Posted By: keith

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

I put 1000+ miles on a Browning A bolt SS stalker in 7 Mag with 26" barrel plus a brake, mules and horses, leupold 4x12 A.O.

First, I hate a rifle under my leg, I want to feel the animal and give him cues with the calf of my leg...he is used to this. So, I tied the Rifle scabbord to D rings on the right front side of the palma, rifle went down toward the stirrups, straight up and down. I had taps on my stirrups. Rifle was easy to get out of the scabbard while sitting in the saddle, while difficult/impossible pulling it out from the rear when the rifle is under your leg.

When hunting off a mule or horse, you get a lot closer to game if members in the group are not talking, and your tack does not "clank". During Summer months, we have rode right in the middle of elk herds and not disturb them.
Posted By: super T

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

The observations and experience of someone with a 1000+ miles on horseback hunts can't be ignored, but I must ask, were these hunts in North America? I ask because I have never hunted with a cowboy/guide/outfitter who would allow a paying hunter to pull a rifle as you described out of a scabbard while still mounted.
Posted By: bsa1917hunter

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

Originally Posted by Highoctane

I betcha 10 dollars to a donut that those 150 gr Partitions from a 7 aught 8 won't bounce off any elk!!

I'll second your bet. When I had a 7mm08 (just sold it on GB a couple weeks ago) I settled on the 150gr. partition as a "do all" bullet. I actually bought a few (maybe 5) bags of seconds from shooters pro shop and will likely sell those for a good deal to someone. I don't see how you could go wrong with that combo. I've been thinking about buying another 7mm08, but a Tikka superlite when I find a good deal on one. I may just hang on to my partitions until the right superlite comes along.....
Posted By: bwinters

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

I've always wanted a 7mm-08 but owning 280s, 280 AIs, 7mags of various flavors, it just didnt seem like enough gun for elk. I've been shooting a 308 for 4-5 years now and have come to the conclusion that a properly constructed and placed bullet kills everything I hunt, regardless of caliber or cartridge.

I've waxed and waned several times in recent years on the 7mm-08.

I think a SA Rem 700 Mtn Rifle, punched to 284 win with a Wyatts mag box shooting 150/160 Partitions or lighter TTSX would be a 1 rifle masterpiece. Likely also dropped into a McM Mtn Rifle Edge stock with a NF SHV 2-10 on top. Likely weigh right at or slightly under 7lbs. Hmmm.......

Or just leave it 7mm-08......
Posted By: T_O_M

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

Originally Posted by donsm70
Here is my dilema. I have a wilderness horseback elk hunt (probably my last) scheduled for the fall of 2020 in Wyoming. I also have rifles in 6.5 CM, 7x57, 280ai, 30-06 and 300WM that I like and are very accurate. I have a self imposed shot limit of 300 yards. I am not a turret twister. My last two hunts there have produced 6x6 bulls at 160 and 27 yards.
Is the 700 in 7-08 up to the task?


I don't understand the dilemma I guess. Yes, it is up to the task, but you have at least 1 equal choice (7x57) and 3 even better choices. I can understand if you only owned the 7mm-08 ... I'd say go for it. I can understand if you just really really really want to kill an elk with the 7mm-08. But lacking those two, which you seem to, it seems foolish not to reach for one of your even better options instead.

Tom
Posted By: Pharmseller

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

I’ve killed elk with the Mighty -08 and watched others do the same. Never felt under gunned. It’s about bullets and placement anyway.




P
Posted By: Andy3

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

Originally Posted by donsm70
I recently purchased a Remington 700 Classic in 7mm-08 with some Kampfeld upgrades that shoots 150 gr Nosler Partitions very well. I really like the rifle, the weight, the mild recoil and the way it shoots.
Here is my dilema. I have a wilderness horseback elk hunt (probably my last) scheduled for the fall of 2020 in Wyoming. I also have rifles in 6.5 CM, 7x57, 280ai, 30-06 and 300WM that I like and are very accurate. I have a self imposed shot limit of 300 yards. I am not a turret twister. My last two hunts there have produced 6x6 bulls at 160 and 27 yards.
Is the 700 in 7-08 up to the task?
donsm70



You say you have a 300 win, that is accurate, and you like. Run a premium bullet out of it, the closer to 200 grains, the better.

Last year I also hunted a guided/wilderness elk hunt in Wyoming, as a retirement gift to myself. We hunted at timberline, and above. My bull died at 11,800 feet in elevation, the nearest tree was well below us. Possible shots could have covered the spectrum, in distance.

Big/mature bulls can take a beating. In my experience they are much tougher to kill quickly than raghorns and cows. The bull that I killed in Wyoming, took three 200 grain accubonds, out of a 300 win, into his shoulder at 435 yards, on the ridge top. He was a big bodied 7x7, that had a 50"+ outside spread.....his reaction to each shot was close to nothing. He just stood there, and took all three.....then turned around and went ass over end, down a granite chute, coming to rest about 200 yards below. He chocked up on a single basketball size rock on a small level spot. Otherwise, it was another 500 yards to the bottom.

His cape was ruined, his skull fractured in multiple places......several of his molars were broke in half, vertically. Luckily, the meat and horns were in good shape. If I had to do it over again, after the first 2 shots, I would of tried to break his neck, and anchor him up on top. The quartering of that bull had a pretty good risk factor......think bighorn sheep country.

My math for NOT using a lesser cartridge/bullet is:

mature/tough animals
wild and open country
expensive wilderness hunt
traveling from Pennsylvania
already owning a more capable rifle that is proven
hunting in grizzly country (that's another discussion, in itself)

No doubt which rifle to take.

FWIW, I usually use fixed powered scopes and etched reticles. But on this hunt, at the suggestion of the outfitter, I took a long range 300 win with a NXS nightforce on it. It's the only scope I 100% trust, when spinning turrets. The scabbard I took was the trail max by outfitter supply. After a 14 mile horseback ride in, the actual hunt, and 14 miles back out....the rifle remained sighted dead on.

The guide had my day pack and rifle on top of a pack mule, that he led, while we were hunting. After the bull was down, my pack and scabbard went on my horse, and the first load of meat went out on the mule. It worked really well, especially in grizzly country.....getting that first load of meat out.

Anyhow, that's what worked on this hunt. As they say, "your mileage may vary".

Andy3
Posted By: WyoCoyoteHunter

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

Andy makes more sense than all I have read here..
Posted By: Dirtfarmer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

Originally Posted by WyoCoyoteHunter
Andy makes more sense than all I have read here..

Maybe because he’s BTDT.

Like they say in theological circles, revelation vs speculation.

DF
Posted By: WyoCoyoteHunter

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

Maybe, but the 7mm-08 never seemed impressive.. I have used mine on coyotes pigs, whitetails and antelope.. Can't say I know anyone that has one in this country... I am sure there are but never see them or talk to 'em .. I have only found a very few pieces of brass at the local range..
Posted By: Dirtfarmer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

As much as I like my 7-08, if I was going elk hunting, I’d probably take my 7RM, 160 gr NAB’s over 67.5 gr RL-26 at 3K fps. Not that the 7-08 wouldn’t do the job, maybe just as well, I have a lot of confidence in that 7RM load, know what it will do.

DF
Posted By: WyoCoyoteHunter

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

I would agree with you completely!!
Posted By: Jim_Knight

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

My good friend uses nothing but a Browning BLR 308 and 150 Corlokts. He has killed some nice bulls out around 350yds, but mostly he kills smaller/younger bulls & cows up on the ridges in mixed timber and under 200yds. I like more "oomph" in an elk round but there are many who use the 7mm08 and do well. Big bull hunts though, that cost a lot of money? Its marginal.
Posted By: Brad

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

Originally Posted by Jim_Knight
Its marginal.


How do you know this?
Posted By: Brad

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/27/19

Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
Originally Posted by WyoCoyoteHunter
Andy makes more sense than all I have read here..

Maybe because he’s BTDT.

Like they say in theological circles, revelation vs speculation.

DF


BTDT. One bull. Seriously?
Posted By: Dirtfarmer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

With big bulls and expensive hunts, I want all the margin I can pull together.

DF
Posted By: Brad

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
With big bulls and expensive hunts, I want all the margin I can pull together.

DF


I don't necessarily object to your opinion, I'd just like to know on what experience that opinion was formed.
Posted By: Pharmseller

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

Originally Posted by Brad
Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
With big bulls and expensive hunts, I want all the margin I can pull together.

DF


I don't necessarily object to your opinion, I'd just like to know on what experience that opinion was formed.



And be warned, Brad has killed big mature bulls with a 7mm-08.





P
Posted By: bigwhoop

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

My guide buddy in Alaska has had his teenage son and wife use a 7-08 quite a bit. The son shot a black bear and two caribou. The wife has taken a caribou and cow moose. Its funny when the lower 48ers show up with magnum 300's on up. The need for confidence comes in many cartridges.
Posted By: Andy3

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

Originally Posted by Brad
Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
With big bulls and expensive hunts, I want all the margin I can pull together.

DF


I don't necessarily object to your opinion, I'd just like to know on what experience that opinion was formed.



Hello Brad. Here's a brief history of my elk hunting experience. I'm 58 years old and have been hunting bull and cow elk since 1982, when I moved to New Mexico from North Carolina, at age 21. I am a self taught elk hunter, and the first couple elk hunts came up with no tags punched, but it was a learning process that I wasn't going to give up on.

I was hunting 4th season rifle tags (because the odds were much better than 1st rifle tags, so I could hunt every year). I learned to hunt bedded bulls, in black timber, on north facing slopes....on small benches. The first 4 bulls I killed were between 16 and 32 yards......with a 375 H&H. Still my favorite black timber elk rifle.

I killed quite a few elk in NM, but mostly rag horns and a few cows, because I was young and hungry (literally), working construction. I always killed the first legal animal I saw. But, I learned to kill high pressured elk.

Some years later, I heard that Idaho had OTC rifle tags, that opened September 15th, for 2 months! I sold out, and moved to Boise without any leads on work or a place to live. I did this so I could hunt elk every year, if I didn't draw. NM was 100% draw OR buying land owner tags....not an option for a blue collar guy.

I killed a 5x5 that first year in Idaho, on Sept 16th 1995. After that, I was lucky enough to draw some very good bull tags, so I could finally start holding out for larger bulls....and I did. My favorite Idaho draw hunt lasted 16 days, and I shot the 47th branched antlered bull that was in rifle range. I turned down more 6x6 bulls, on that hunt, more than I had seen in my entire elk hunting career!

It's been that way, every year since. And yes, I killed a 6x6 this year, with a muzzleloader on an either sex hunt....had a slim chance at the biggest bull of my life, but he made it to private land, 200 yards ahead of me.

The Wyoming hunt was something I always wanted to do, hunting the wilderness area, on the east side of Yellowstone, near Cody. I had max points and wanted one of the best hunts in the state. Being in the wilderness area, and me being a non resident, I hired the best outfitter I could find. And he made it everything I could ask for in a guided hunt, with me killing the biggest bull of my life. My first guided elk hunt was the perfect retirement present to myself.....and I don't see me doing it again. Perfect.

So Brad, this is what I base my elk hunting opinions on. At nearly 59, I'm still learning, as I tend to hunt different units each year. I know there are better elk hunters than me and more dedicated ones too......a couple are my best friends. But, I take pride in hunting alone, figuring out new country, and getting elk killed. I've been pretty successful doing it.

Andy3
Posted By: WyoCoyoteHunter

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

Not like shooting your elk in the back pasture....
Posted By: sierraHunter

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

Andy, great story. I love my 280 but in that situation would also use my 7RM. In a hunt of a lifetime I believe what is better is best. I really enjoyed your rendition of the hunt. Enjoyable! Yes, a 7-08 would do but in the end it is what is best in a worst case situation, not what works in a lesser situation.
Posted By: Dirtfarmer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

Being comfortable with a round and a rig is a big leg up, IMO.

Go with what works for you, what you have confidence in.

That’s what I do and will continue to do.

It’s opinions.

DF
Posted By: Brad

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

Andy, thanks for answering, though my question was directed to Dirtfarmer.

You are obviously an actual elk hunter. Same age as me. Similar bio, except I don't travel beyond Montana to hunt since were are quite blessed with good wilderness here around Yellowstone to hunt elk. My hunting is also all solo on public wilderness, both dayhikes and multiday backpack hunts. Depending.

Since you've answered, I see you mention the 375 H&H... what other cartridges have you taken elk with besides it and the 300? What was the outcome?

Happy Thanksgiving.
Posted By: Andy3

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

Brad, I apologize about fielding the question meant for Dirtfarmer.

Off the top of my head, I can recall killing elk with: 8mm Rem, 375 H&H, 300 win, 338 win, 54 cal muzzleloader. And one cow, many years ago, with a .270. All elk shot at, ended up dead, without any cripples or lost game....."knock on wood". Some, with the 300 have taken more than one shot, as I keep shooting until they hit the ground. I can't remember any elk staying on its feet when hit with the bigger bore cartridges. A couple with the 54 stayed upright after the shot, but where down by the time I got it reloaded.....one cow took 2 shots, with it. I don't recall any of the first shots, that weren't fatal....but elk are tough, and crippled elk seldom head for your rig, to die! wink

It's a pretty even split, I would guess, between the 300 win and 375 H&H, for total count. The 300 gets the nod when hunting more open country, where I can pick my shot, usually draw hunts. The 375 is used when expected ranges are less than 300 yards.....usually OTC hunts, in the thicker stuff.....where I CAN'T pick my shots.

But, if I had to pick one......I have a stainless Ruger 338 win, with iron sights, and a 2.5x8 leupold with B&C reticle with QR rings, shooting 225 grain accubonds. The iron sights are set for 300 grain woodleighs, 1" high at 50 yards. That gun pretty much covers everything in North America, and perhaps the world.....I just hope my 375 doesn't hear that!

I once read that, "a 338 kills elk, like an 06 kills deer". I find that hard to argue with.

Have a great turkey day!

Andy3
Posted By: Dirtfarmer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

Thanks Andy and Brad for a interesting exchange. Enjoyed reading it.

I’ve used a 300 mag with good results. My latest project is a 98 Mauser 338-06. That one would be an interesting elk rifle. I’ve read here on the Fire, with good authority, that it’s the boolit not the headstamp....

Use what works.

DF
Posted By: bsa1917hunter

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

4
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
I’ve killed elk with the Mighty -08 and watched others do the same. Never felt under gunned. It’s about bullets and placement anyway.




P

Sure pharm, you know its all about the rifle. Tikka or nothing baby!!!! whistle
Posted By: Pharmseller

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

More bulls without a Tikka than with...

But not since 2013.
Posted By: Dirtfarmer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/28/19

Originally Posted by bsa1917hunter
4
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
I’ve killed elk with the Mighty -08 and watched others do the same. Never felt under gunned. It’s about bullets and placement anyway.




P

Sure pharm, you know its all about the rifle. Tikka or nothing baby!!!! whistle

He has some impressive groups and dead critter photos.

And don’t forget to mention Big Game powder. Good stuff in the 7-08.

DF
Posted By: Jim_Knight

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/30/19

Originally Posted by Brad
[quote=Jim_Knight] Its marginal.


How do you know this?

You know you are right! I do not have first hand knowledge of any failure with this combo, so I am not qualified to naysay it! Please forgive me guys. I myself have killed a 450-500 pound Scimitar Horned Oryx ( spike elk sized) at 184yds ( base of neck, pass through) with a 6mm 85 XBT going 2900 at muzzle! ( used a 222 Magnum necked up to 6mm, had a recent neck fusion). I also killed two axis deer same hunt. A 90lb doe and at least a 150 pound ( or more) buck. That
opinion" of a 7mm08 was hypocritical of me! . frown
Posted By: mudhen

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 11/30/19

Not to muddy the waters, but my grandson killed the largest cow elk any of us has seen with a 7mm-08 shooting a 120-grain Nosler Ballistic Tip. One shot at 309 yards, got both lungs and the bullet exited.
Posted By: Brad

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/01/19

Originally Posted by Andy3

Off the top of my head, I can recall killing elk with: 8mm Rem, 375 H&H, 300 win, 338 win, 54 cal muzzleloader. And one cow, many years ago, with a .270.
It's a pretty even split, I would guess, between the 300 win and 375 H&H, for total count.


Thanks for the response Andy. It does, however, bring to mind an old saying; "experience can be long but narrow."

You obviously favor large armament, and have not veered from that philosophy. Of course there's nothing in the world wrong with that. A big gun is never a bad thing, as long as you can shoot it (you obviously can). However, the term "confirmation bias" does come to mind. Hmmm...

I've used the 338 WM and 300 on big bulls. I've used the 270, 7-08, 30-06, and 308 on big bulls. They all died, but lighter rifles are far more enjoyable to pack for my hunting style (mostly backpack hunts), and lighter recoiling cartridges are more fun to shoot in light rifles. Obviously if a horse is carrying your rifle, within reason it really doesn't matter what it weighs. However, I prefer rifles around 6.75 lbs "all up" (scoped, w/ sling and rounds). For me, the 338's and 300's really should weigh in the 7.75lb range, and really, a bit more weight is better (it goes without saying "balance" is more important than sheer weight or lack of it).

I'd also suggest you really don't know what a 7-08 with a 150 gr bullet is capable of unless you've killed more than a few elk with it and similar rounds. Cartridges are truly more alike than different. Punch the lungs and elk die quickly like any other deer. Hit them at the margins, they'll run all day no matter the cartridge. And despite what gunwriters say (and which everyone seemingly repeats), I've never found big bulls die much different than any other average sized elk. Blasphemy I know...

At the end of the day, we only have ourselves to please. But I can truthfully report there has never been a bull I've taken, including old mountain animals in the 6.5-11.5 yo range, that needed anything more than a good bullet from a 7-08.


Posted By: Mule Deer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/01/19

Brad,

Here's one "gunwriter" who doesn't say bigger bulls are harder to kill--and I've also known other writers who don't believe it either, some of whom have killed more elk than many other hunters and gunwriters. Bob Milek killed a pile of elk, and among his favorite rounds was the .25-06.

That also jibes with a Colorado elk outfitter I met a number of years ago, whose clients had taken an average of around 30 elk a season for many years. Have told this story before but here it is again: I asked him what he felt was a good minimum cartridge for elk hunting, and he immediately said: "Two fifty-seven." I then asked him whether he meant the .257 Roberts or .257 Weatherby, and he said, "Either one!" Bob Milek's .25-06 falls right between them.

As you pointed out, one of the potential problems of judging "adequate" cartridges is is "confirmation bias." Quite a few hunters start with their mind made up. They also rarely or observe other people shooting big game, particularly elk hunters, because they tend to hunt alone even if they camp with others. And even if they do see others kill game, firmly believe a hunter has to personally pull the trigger for rifle/cartridge experience to be valid.

The other problem, of course, is that many hunters (and even many guides and outfitters) still have almost no clue about the difference the specific bullet can make in on-game performance. I still run into many Montanans who firmly believe any bullet lighter than 180 grains is inadequate for elk, both because all they've used are typical cup-and-cores, and they've rarely seen anybody else kill elk. I even knew a younger elk guide in Idaho who believed the .338 Winchester with a 225-grain bullet was the best minimum. Why? Because that's the cartridge he picked years earlier as a teenager--and used with a particular 225-grain cup-and-core. He was even astounded when any smaller cartridge killed big game quickly. Thus, once again, confirmation bias.

Of course, one of the reasons I wrote this is the numerous times I've heard, "Gunwriters always say X." Gunwriters do NOT all have the same opinions, any more than other hunters so do not all write the same things. Perhaps the most blatant example occurred when Eileen and I had a table at the Bozeman gun show maybe a decade ago, partly to sell our own books. One guy around 60 stopped and looked them over, then said, "So you write about hunting rifles? Why is it all you gunwriters say the .270 isn't enough for African plains game?"

I looked at him and said, "I've never written any such thing, because I know from experience it's not true." But he was already too far into his rant to hear me. (Or maybe he was simply a deaf older shooter.) He went on for a couple more minutes before finally leaving. Instead of trying to argue with him, I just waited him out, which over the years I've discovered is easier than arguing with such people.

Personally, the minimum cartridge I know is adequate for elk is, like my outfitter acquaintance in Colorado, the .257, whether Roberts or Weatherby, because I've seen the job done cleanly with one bullet from both.
Posted By: Brad

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/01/19

John, good stuff as usual.

I know you and know you're not "one of those gunwriters." Of course we all stumble in what we say and write, and I should have said "some gun writers."

Problem is, those are the ones that are most adamant and loudest... a lot like some of the personalities on this forum.

Posted By: Mule Deer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/01/19

Yep!

However, some of them do change their minds over the years--but we tend to remember their adamant statements. Craig Boddington has changed somewhat over the years, partly due to actually shooting a big bull elk with the .270 Winchester, with a 150-grain bullet at over 400 yards during a hunt on the Whittington Center in New Mexico. It went down faster from a plain lung-shot than any other bull he'd taken up to that time with larger cartridges. Then his daughter started hunting, and used the 7mm-08 in Africa with good results not just on one animal, but quite a few. And Craig acknowledged that he'd had to reevaluate some of his long-time beliefs.
Posted By: Andy3

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/01/19

Brad, You point out how what I do works, but then start critiquing what I do, with comments like...... experience can be long but narrow.....and confirmation bias....how heavy my rifles are......and how I don't know what a 7-08 does unless I use one.

I don't question what works for you, so who put you in charge of doing that to others? Or perhaps this is your idea of a "discussion"? To be truthful, you come across as a bit of a self righteous ass.

I don't shoot pheasants with a .410, or fly fish with 7X tippet, or big game hunt with a lesser cartridge.

At the risk of "justifying what I do"......see specific responses, below.



Originally Posted by Brad
Originally Posted by Andy3

Off the top of my head, I can recall killing elk with: 8mm Rem, 375 H&H, 300 win, 338 win, 54 cal muzzleloader. And one cow, many years ago, with a .270.
It's a pretty even split, I would guess, between the 300 win and 375 H&H, for total count.


Thanks for the response Andy. It does, however, bring to mind an old saying; "experience can be long but narrow." Another old saying is, "if aint' broke, don't fix it"

You obviously favor large armament, and have not veered from that philosophy. Of course there's nothing in the world wrong with that. A big gun is never a bad thing, as long as you can shoot it (you obviously can). However, the term "confirmation bias" does come to mind. Hmmm... Yes, I can confirm. Large, heavy bullets kill bigger animals, quicker than little bullets.....other than CNS hits.....and leave a large exit hole, which is always welcomed.

I've used the 338 WM and 300 on big bulls. I've used the 270, 7-08, 30-06, and 308 on big bulls. They all died, but lighter rifles are far more enjoyable to pack for my hunting style (mostly backpack hunts), and lighter recoiling cartridges are more fun to shoot in light rifles. Obviously if a horse is carrying your rifle, within reason it really doesn't matter what it weighs. However, I prefer rifles around 6.75 lbs "all up" (scoped, w/ sling and rounds). For me, the 338's and 300's really should weigh in the 7.75lb range, and really, a bit more weight is better (it goes without saying "balance" is more important than sheer weight or lack of it). I've never seen where a pound or two makes much difference, at the end of the day. My daypack weighs several times more than my rifle....If I'm gonna shed pounds, I'll look there first.

I'd also suggest you really don't know what a 7-08 with a 150 gr bullet is capable of unless you've killed more than a few elk with it and similar rounds. Cartridges are truly more alike than different. Punch the lungs and elk die quickly like any other deer. Hit them at the margins, they'll run all day no matter the cartridge. And despite what gunwriters say (and which everyone seemingly repeats), I've never found big bulls die much different than any other average sized elk. Blasphemy I know... When I was a kid, my dad was a bush pilot, in Alaska. I killed a 68" bull moose with a .243 and 100 gr cup n core bullet, with one shot. It took awhile before he died, and I had my dad backing me up with a .300 weatherby, if needed. That doesnt' make a 243 a moose cartridge....but, using your logic, maybe it does? Anyhow, as the famous quote says......when I grew up, I put childish things away.

At the end of the day, we only have ourselves to please. But I can truthfully report there has never been a bull I've taken, including old mountain animals in the 6.5-11.5 yo range, that needed anything more than a good bullet from a 7-08. On this we agree....the bigger the game, the larger the cartridge I use.....and that pleases me!


Posted By: Andy3

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/02/19

Originally Posted by Mule Deer
Yep!

However, some of them do change their minds over the years--but we tend to remember their adamant statements. Craig Boddington has changed somewhat over the years, partly due to actually shooting a big bull elk with the .270 Winchester, with a 150-grain bullet at over 400 yards during a hunt on the Whittington Center in New Mexico. It went down faster from a plain lung-shot than any other bull he'd taken up to that time with larger cartridges. Then his daughter started hunting, and used the 7mm-08 in Africa with good results not just on one animal, but quite a few. And Craig acknowledged that he'd had to reevaluate some of his long-time beliefs.



John, Is this the write up regarding the bull your referring to? If so, I don't think Mr. Boddington has jumped on the 270 wagon....at least not with both feet!

https://www.cabelas.com/product/Elk-Medicine/532930.uts
Posted By: Mule Deer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/02/19

Andy3,

I was not referring to any particular "write up," because I have read several--and also stood in the very spot where Craig shot from, maybe 2-3 years later, with the guy who was with him at the time, now-retired Whittington Center director Mike Ballew. Mike also pointed out where the bull was standing, and described Craig's surprise when it dropped so quickly.

Having some experience in the same business as Craig, I am not surprised he hasn't "jumped on the .270 wagon," because real hunting-gun journalists (as opposed to those who made up their minds years ago), need to keep experiencing, experimenting and reporting. I was pointing out that Craig has learned from his experiences--and reported on that experience honestly, along with his daughter's use of the 7mm-08. Whether he jumped on any wagon is beside the point.

In fact, I was in the process of deciding on what to write for my monthly column for the Campfire. One of the ideas involved how being a gunwriter can result in actually learning something, if you haven't already made up your mind. Your comments helped make up my mind to write on exactly that subject.
Posted By: Andy3

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/02/19

John, Glad to help!

Take care, Andy3
Posted By: alpinecrick

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/02/19

Originally Posted by Mule Deer
super T,

Excellent points.

Have actually seen the objective bells of longer scopes bent slightly, but noticeably, after riding around for a while....


I've seen two rifles that had their barrels bent--both of them by horses while the rifle was in the scabbard, one barrel was a 24" and the other a 26" (it was a very pretty Mark V no less).
Posted By: Jim_Knight

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/02/19

Did the horse roll over on them Alpine? What do you think caused the damage? I've always taken a rifle out of the scabbard any time I was away from the horse awhile. Those crazy things always seem to find a way to rub or roll over, even when tied! ha Many times, I just rode with the rifle slung or across the pommel ala John Wayne ( the Searchers) style, lol. "That cuts it Preacher!"
Posted By: Jim_Knight

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/02/19

Just to clarify "my" definition of marginal. Any load that will not completely penetrate on a broadside shot "most of the time". To me, smaller calibers require that I wait for a shot presentation that I am comfortable with, meaning in my mind I am 80% sure I will get the results I'm after. I pass a lot of shots, or course, I think we all do. IOW, I won't take a hard angling shot that I am not 80% sure of with even a heavy rifle and not at all with a smaller round. Just me. I like to shoot heavy animals with heavy/hard hitting rounds; I just like that "OMG I've been shot"! look on their face! smile

But, I know several guys who kill their elk every year with .243, 6mm Rem, one 240W, far more with .270/30-06/7mm Rem Mag than 300s-375s. I know only two fellows that use a 25-06. Never ran into anyone over here with a 257 Roberts. If good bullets/good shooting is done, I can't honestly say anyone is wrong. Nowadays, the most "unethical" thing I see is NOT using a smaller round, but shooting at a longer range than they have practiced for. I am worthless judging the wind past "hold on the windward edge of the kill area", so LR is much shorter for me than most. I guess that's why I am more comfortable in the edges or timber. Rare to get broadside, but I do get them! smile
Posted By: keith

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/02/19

+1
Posted By: BuzzH

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/02/19

15th elk I've shot since 2013 with a 7-08, 140 Accubonds...73rd elk I've shot.

[Linked Image from photos.imageevent.com]

My Dad, Brother, and a good friend have all killed elk with the same rifle. My wife has shot 2 elk in her life, both good 6 point bulls, with her 7-08 and 140 accubonds, both one shot kills and combined they went less than 20 yards after being shot.

I've sort of come full circle on elk and what I shoot them with. I started using a 6mm, quickly went to a 30/06, then a .338. Used a 7 RM for a number of years, but since 2013 have only shot one with anything bigger than a 7-08 (shot one with my Dads pre 64 in 30/06). Haven't killed one with a .338 since 2006.

I cant say shooting them with my .338 resulted in quicker kills than the ones I've shot with a 7-08, or even a .243/6mm for that matter.

Used my 6mm remington I just had re-barreled on one this year too...and a 95 grain ballistic tip, complete pass-through at pinch over 100 yards. Same performance as most other elk I've shot through the lungs...40-50 yard scramble and done.

[Linked Image from photos.imageevent.com]

Elk aren't nearly as tough to kill as most people believe.
Posted By: Jim_Knight

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/03/19

Dang Buzz! 73 elk! First off, I'm jealous, 2nd, how do you sleep at night? surely you are "haunted" by that many dead elk! ha. Congrats. That is a nice looking 6mm you ave there!
Posted By: BuzzH

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/03/19

Originally Posted by Jim_Knight
That is a nice looking 6mm you ave there!


That's the first hunting rifle I ever owned, ruger m77 that my Dad and Grandfather bought for me in the winter of 1979. I beat the hell out of it in my youth, so re-barreled and reworked the stock. Back to as good as new...

[Linked Image from photos.imageevent.com]
Posted By: Judman

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/03/19

Big Roosevelt cow I killed with my 6ai, 80 gr bt
[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
Posted By: 10gaugemag

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/03/19

Originally Posted by Judman
Big Roosevelt cow I killed with my 6ai, 80 gr bt
[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

I need to load some of those in my 6 and kill some deers w em.
Posted By: Judman

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/03/19

Pretty impressive combo out to 450
Posted By: SLM

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/03/19

You guys are going to put a few into a tail spin talking about killing elk with a 6mm.
Posted By: AKduck

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/03/19

Good stuff Buzz. Nice rifle there.
Posted By: beretzs

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/04/19

Neat rifle Buzz! Love seeing those old rifles with new tubes still getting after it!
Posted By: Mule Deer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/04/19

Will add that one of my local friends is a retired outfitter. He used to use a 7mm Remington Magnum on elk, partly because he's in his 70's and grew up in the era when the "Big Seven" was OBVIOUSLY far better than the .270 or .30-06--but partly because he was often guiding dudes who did not hit 'em just right.

After retirement, he switched to the .22-250--because he hunts primarily for meat, whether a raghorn bull or cow. These are usually in herds, and the .22-250 kills well, without the bullet exiting and possibly wounding another elk. He's been doing this for around a decade, shooting them behind the shoulder.
Posted By: 10gaugemag

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/04/19

Originally Posted by SLM
You guys are going to put a few into a tail spin talking about killing elk with a 6mm.

Ain't never elk hunted but something tells me my 6mm could git er done pretty handily with a 95 grain Partition!
Posted By: WAM

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/04/19

Originally Posted by 10gaugemag
Originally Posted by SLM
You guys are going to put a few into a tail spin talking about killing elk with a 6mm.

Ain't never elk hunted but something tells me my 6mm could git er done pretty handily with a 95 grain Partition!

That is typical for not seeing the results of mousegunners shooting at elk with sub-par cartridges. Happy Trails
Posted By: Pharmseller

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/04/19

People who don’t know you can’t kill elk with a 6mm, kill elk with a 6mm.




P
Posted By: WAM

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/04/19

Originally Posted by Pharmseller
People who don’t know you can’t kill elk with a 6mm, kill elk with a 6mm.




P



Touché

😎
Posted By: Jim_Knight

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/04/19

I have read about Game Wardens culling elk with a 22-250 before. I also knew two old gents ( both long since gone) who used the Mod 99 250/3000 "with the 87gr bullet"! for everything here and over in Star Valley, WY. So...since I ate a big helping of crow on the 7mm/08...I think I'll feel better about taking my 6.5 Creedmoor as a spare elk rifle! smile If I get tired of toting that 300WM, I'll tote Jr awhile! ha
Posted By: Dogger

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/05/19

I hope to hunt elk in Wyoming in 2023... my primary will be my M77 in 6mm Remington (100 partition) and back up will be the 280 Remington (150 Partition), 300 RSAUM, and 300 H&H !! smile
Posted By: NTG

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/05/19

Originally Posted by Mule Deer
Will add that one of my local friends is a retired outfitter. He used to use a 7mm Remington Magnum on elk, partly because he's in his 70's and grew up in the era when the "Big Seven" was OBVIOUSLY far better than the .270 or .30-06--but partly because he was often guiding dudes who did not hit 'em just right.

After retirement, he switched to the .22-250--because he hunts primarily for meat, whether a raghorn bull or cow. These are usually in herds, and the .22-250 kills well, without the bullet exiting and possibly wounding another elk. He's been doing this for around a decade, shooting them behind the shoulder.

That's good information. Do you know what bullet he uses, by chance?
Posted By: Pharmseller

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/05/19

I had elk stew for dinner tonight, 150 eldx, 7mm-08.




P
Posted By: Mule Deer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/05/19

NTG,

I don't remember the specific brand of bullet, but do remember it's some common 55-grain cup-and-core. As noted, he primarily wants to make sure the bullet doesn't exit.

Might also note that a dozen years ago I went to Africa on a month-long cull hunt with a dozen other guys. One of the professional hunters took me and a friend out one day, allowing us to use his personal culling rifle, an old Sako .22-250. At that point it was on its 4th barrel and had taken around 12,000 springbok, a delicious antelope about the size of pronghorns. His favorite culling load is the Winchester factory 55-grain soft-point--which he gets wholesale because he also owns a big sporting goods store.

Anyway, we mostly were shooting springboks, and the rifle and load worked great out to 500 yards, which is as far as we ever shot. We were switching off on the rifle, and when it was my buddy's turn to shoot we came across an injured kudu bull, and the PH told my buddy to shoot it. He did, through the heart because the kudu had started to take off. It went went about 75 yards before stopping and dropping. Maybe it wouldn't have gone that far if shot with a bigger round, but I've seen more than one kudu bull go 60-100 when shot with the .375 H&H--and they're not considered among the tougher of the elk-sized plains game animals.
Posted By: 10gaugemag

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/05/19

Originally Posted by Mule Deer
NTG,

I don't remember the specific brand of bullet, but do remember it's some common 55-grain cup-and-core. As noted, he primarily wants to make sure the bullet doesn't exit.

Might also note that a dozen years ago I went to Africa on a month-long cull hunt with a dozen other guys. One of the professional hunters took me and a friend out one day, allowing us to use his personal culling rifle, an old Sako .22-250. At that point it was on its 4th barrel and had taken around 12,000 springbok, a delicious antelope about the size of pronghorns. His favorite culling load is the Winchester factory 55-grain soft-point--which he gets wholesale because he also owns a big sporting goods store.

Anyway, we mostly were shooting springboks, and the rifle and load worked great out to 500 yards, which is as far as we ever shot. We were switching off on the rifle, and when it was my buddy's turn to shoot we came across an injured kudu bull, and the PH told my buddy to shoot it. He did, through the heart because the kudu had started to take off. It went went about 75 yards before stopping and dropping. Maybe it wouldn't have gone that far if shot with a bigger round, but I've seen more than one kudu bull go 60-100 when shot with the .375 H&H--and they're not considered among the tougher of the elk-sized plains game animals.

Funny how a hole through the heart or airbags ends life whether from a .22, .375 or a broadhead tipped arrow.
Posted By: castnblast

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/05/19

I have shot an elk every year for more than a couple dozen years. I think I do my homework, and I like experimenting and learning from my experiences.

I have used several rifles, and gained a reasonable bit of real world data to base my opinions on. I have personally shot elk with a .270, 7x57, 7x64, .308, 30-06, 8x57, .356, .35 Whelen, 9.3x62, .375 H&H and .450-400 3" Nitro Express. I have seen quite a few more shot with the same or similar cartridges and also with the 7mm08.

The three elk I had the most trouble with after the shot were hit with .35 Whelen / 250 gr. and .375 H&H 260 gr. and .450-400 400 gr. The ones that were wounded and got away were shot at over 300 meters away with a .300 magnum, and 250 meters with a 30-06, and one gut shot closer in with a .35 Whelen.

The one elk I saw that dropped at the shot through the lungs ( no CNS or heavy bone was hit) was one my son shot with a 7mm08 and standard Rem. 140 corlokt bullet. The same bullet placement at a similar distance on a similar size nice fat 5 point bull (120 paces) this year with my "African Dangerous Game Double Rifle" - Merkel 140 AE .450-400 resulted in a death dash of over 160 meters. I suppose the Hornady DGX bonded bullet was just too "hard" to do much damage to the lungs.

My son shot another 5 pt bull last year with his 7mm08 and 160 Speer Grand Slam at 2600 fps muzzle velocity. Impact was just behind the shoulders through both lungs at about 120 M distance. It ran about 40 meters after the shot. My cow was hit in the pretty much same spot and at a similar distance with my 9.3x62, and 285 gr. RN Lapua Mega, 2400 fps muzzle velocity. Ran about the same distance and dropped.

Choose a bullet that penetrates well and expands, but does not fragment. Place it right, and therefore don't shoot too far away. That's it.

Thank you for having the courage, wisdom and determination not to shoot farther than 300 yards. Use A GOOD BULLET. Go forth and slay your elk. Shoot straight and enjoy the venison.
Posted By: powdr

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/07/19

Don, if it was my last wilderness hunt...I'd be totin that 7x57 w/160gr Partitions. Dead elk! powdr
Posted By: alpinecrick

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/07/19

Originally Posted by Jim_Knight
Did the horse roll over on them Alpine? What do you think caused the damage? I've always taken a rifle out of the scabbard any time I was away from the horse awhile. Those crazy things always seem to find a way to rub or roll over, even when tied! ha Many times, I just rode with the rifle slung or across the pommel ala John Wayne ( the Searchers) style, lol. "That cuts it Preacher!"


The other bent barrel was my father's M721. And no, nothing special happened in either case that any of us could remember--no rodeos. In both cases I think the horse rubbed against a tree, either when being rode through thickish timber or when tied up. One would think in order to bend the barrel it would practically tear the scabbard loose from the saddle, but there was no sign of damage to the scabbard. In fact, we still have that same scabbard today.

I have also heard a couple other stories of bent barrels in scabbards. The common theme was 24" or longer bbls on all of them. As John mentioned big scopes take a beating too, horses, ATV's, etc........
Posted By: WAM

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/08/19

Never had to chase an elk shot with my .35 Whelen with 225 gr TBBC, but I never gut-shot one either. The last several shot with a 168 gr TTSX out of a .300 Weatherby dropped like they were struck by the Hammer of Thor. Your results may vary.
Posted By: Mule Deer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/08/19

Ah yes, the old hammer of Thor! Did you put the 168's behind the shoulder or into it?

For many years my wife's primary big game rifle was one of those dreaded .270 Winchesters. Back then TSX's did not exist, so she used 150-grain Nosler Partitions, handloaded to around 2850 fps. (Back then we also did not know that 3000 fps was absolutely necessary for hammer of Thor-ing big game.)

The victims included several elk, none of which went more than 50 feet, and probably half of which never took another step. In between the elk was a bull Shiras moose, quartering away at around 125 yards. It managed to take a step-and-a-half before dropping and never moving--and the bullet did not encounter any bone other than a rib, until it ended up in the meat of the opposite shoulder. It's still by far the quickest-dropped moose I've seen taken with a shot that didn't break a shoulder or the spine. A 150 Partition from the 7mm-08 is essentially the same thing.
Posted By: Brad

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/08/19

Thor and his Hammer seem to spend a lot of time following around guys with magnums smile
Posted By: Mule Deer

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/08/19

Yes, and also the famous Hammer of Roy....
Posted By: WAM

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/09/19

Originally Posted by Mule Deer
Ah yes, the old hammer of Thor! Did you put the 168's behind the shoulder or into it?

.


Yes, it is a tired cliche.

Behind the shoulder. Never aim for the shoulder.

Happy Trails
Posted By: Pharmseller

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/09/19

Is it Hammer of Thor-ing or Hammering of Thor? Kinda like RBIs in baseball, RsBI?




P
Posted By: splattermatic

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/10/19

Ha, glad my 7-08 is one of my keep rifles in my purging.
Posted By: Shag

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/24/19

To the OP. I've never recovered a 140gr NP in a 6.5cm, .260rem, 7mm-08rem, .270win. I have several recovered 150gr NP's .277. Everything died. Deer elk bear. Just never found 140gr NP. Just my experience. I'd load up a 140gr NP before a 150gr NP. IME the .25cal 115gr NP has been favored over 120gr NP also. To each his own.
Posted By: Reloder28

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/28/19

Always felt like the 150 Partition/280 Remington would be the ultimate one gun one load for all my hunting. Have never had any fortune with Partitions, ever. Have always used 140 Accubonds since their inception because Nosler did not offer 150’s. I griped at them until they did & now I am happy.
Posted By: rickt300

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/28/19

I'm so old I remember the only "premium" bullets around were some heavy barnes round noses and the Nosler Partition. I remember before the innerlok Hornady used to brag in their advertisements about their bullets not exiting so the animal absorbed all the energy. And then RN bullets had a big share of the market still.
I have used a good number of Partitions on game, mostly the85gr...243, 140gr .284, the 150 gr. .277, the 150 and 180gr .308. Of these I only caught one (150 gr. 270) in an Elk that was running away after being hit. This shot was not needed or it may have hastened the elks demise. The only one I did not like was the 85 gr. 6MM, made narrow wound channels but they were deep. Come to think of it I did catch one of the 85's it went in over the skull and traveled down the neck vertebrae into the chest, through the heart and into the guts. Couldn't find it, pig weighed 275 pounds.
Posted By: Reloder28

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 12/29/19

It is humorous how much talk we produce over bullet construction. We know tissue destruction, cut arteries & nervous system hits kill animals quickly. The only responsibility of the bullet (any bullet) is to do some of that.
Posted By: George_De_Vries_3rd

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 01/01/20

Originally Posted by Brad
I'm struggling to understand how this is even a question...


I sometimes wonder if WWll had anything to do with it. The 30/06 for human targets in all scenarios. And then all those vets coming home and hunting the ubiquitous whitetail deer with it imbedded it into the mental climate of the culture as the ever-after human, deer-sized creature cartridge. Which it is good at but not necessary.

Then in the 50’s and 60’s and on even into the 90’s you have writers like Bob Hagel, Bob Milek, and and others waxing on the 338, 340, and the 375 for elk and moose and it seems reasonable that for these big animals a cartridge-size increase was needed. Proportion, you know. And it was probably true to some extant due to poorer bullets. I bought into it in the 80’s and 90’s having hunted with a 340 for two decades. It was lethal but not necessary.

As the it’s-the-bullet-not-the-headstamp era dawned on the loons, it became obvious that smaller, “lesser” cartridges thus loaded were more than adequate. Yet the perception that bigger for elk is always better remains.

Obviously, the military figured out that the “small” 5.56mm was lighter to carry and adequate for killing or maiming (even better because you don’t have to kill an enemy but maim him to burden the whole system) humans. Obviously, maiming doesn’t transfer to hunting game animals.

I killed my last 6x6 easily with a hand loaded 284 Win.
Posted By: Brad

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 01/01/20

Originally Posted by George_De_Vries_3rd
Originally Posted by Brad
I'm struggling to understand how this is even a question...


I sometimes wonder if WWll had anything to do with it. The 30/06 for human targets in all scenarios. And then all those vets coming home and hunting the ubiquitous whitetail deer with it imbedded it into the mental climate of the culture as the ever-after human, deer-sized creature cartridge. Which it is good at but not necessary.

Then in the 50’s and 60’s and on even into the 90’s you have writers like Bob Hagel, Bob Milek, and and others waxing on the 338, 340, and the 375 for elk and moose and it seems reasonable that for these big animals a cartridge-size increase was needed. Proportion, you know. And it was probably true to some extant due to poorer bullets. I bought into it in the 80’s and 90’s having hunted with a 340 for two decades. It was lethal but not necessary.

As the it’s-the-bullet-not-the-headstamp era dawned on the loons, it became obvious that smaller, “lesser” cartridges thus loaded were more than adequate. Yet the perception that bigger for elk is always better remains.

Obviously, the military figured out that the “small” 5.56mm was lighter to carry and adequate for killing or maiming (even better because you don’t have to kill an enemy but maim him to burden the whole system) humans. Obviously, maiming doesn’t transfer to hunting game animals.

I killed my last 6x6 easily with a hand loaded 284 Win.


Good morning George, and Happy 2020!

I think your WWII idea is a true one, but I think I'd go back even further in time to WWI (and earlier).

A lot of surplus rifles post WWI chambered for 30-06 found their way into the hands of hunters all over the country. And of course the 30 caliber has been a standard of American and Canadian hunters going back to the 1800's.

Over 20 years ago I was hunting spring bear in the Bridger's and found a spent 30-06 case laying next to a fossilized Aspen leaf (I eyed the case first and only saw the fossil as I was bending over to get the case). The case head stamp was from WWI...

Gun writing spanned the entire 20th Century, and undoubtedly all that verbage has had an effect!

I still consider the 30-06 "The Everyman's Elk Cartridge." It really is the Gold Standard of performance in my mind. But my personal elk hunting economy has been off the Gold Standard for a long time... smile
Posted By: Joe

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 01/01/20

Killed my first elk in '89 with a .30'06 and my last in 2005 with a 7x57. One shot each.
Posted By: bigwhoop

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 01/01/20

There has never been so much ink used in discussing the proper cartridge for elk. Somehow we were "coerced" to believe that an animal twice the size of a whitetail deer needed something of greater proportion to be successful. Over ten years on this site has convinced me this has become part of our hunter DNA.
I too fell victim to this "syndrome" with magnums and calibers greater than .308 accompanying me over 22 years of elk hunting. I can now say with certainty that a proper bullet in the right place trumps proportionality. Of course, if you just want to buy another rifle, I'm all for it! Happy New Year!
Posted By: beretzs

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 01/01/20

Well said George. I was a young reader of Hagel and still believe what he wrote was great for the times, because as you mentioned, bullets weren’t as great.

Today, I still use boomers and 6.5/270/280 all together but it’s more about want than need.

It’s kinda funny though but out to 400-500 pretty much all of the “normal” cartridges look more like a 270/30-06 than different. Plus or Minus a few FPS whistle
Posted By: George_De_Vries_3rd

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 01/01/20

Originally Posted by Brad
Originally Posted by George_De_Vries_3rd
Originally Posted by Brad
I'm struggling to understand how this is even a question...


I sometimes wonder if WWll had anything to do with it. The 30/06 for human targets in all scenarios. And then all those vets coming home and hunting the ubiquitous whitetail deer with it imbedded it into the mental climate of the culture as the ever-after human, deer-sized creature cartridge. Which it is good at but not necessary.

Then in the 50’s and 60’s and on even into the 90’s you have writers like Bob Hagel, Bob Milek, and and others waxing on the 338, 340, and the 375 for elk and moose and it seems reasonable that for these big animals a cartridge-size increase was needed. Proportion, you know. And it was probably true to some extant due to poorer bullets. I bought into it in the 80’s and 90’s having hunted with a 340 for two decades. It was lethal but not necessary.

As the it’s-the-bullet-not-the-headstamp era dawned on the loons, it became obvious that smaller, “lesser” cartridges thus loaded were more than adequate. Yet the perception that bigger for elk is always better remains.



Obviously, the military figured out that the “small” 5.56mm was lighter to carry and adequate for killing or maiming (even better because you don’t have to kill an enemy but maim him to burden the whole system) humans. Obviously, maiming doesn’t transfer to hunting game animals.

I killed my last 6x6 easily with a hand loaded 284 Win.


Good morning George, and Happy 2020!

It does make sense to back further to the “30-03” (the 30/06)

I think your WWII idea is a true one, but I think I'd go back even further in time to WWI (and earlier).

A lot of surplus rifles post WWI chambered for 30-06 found their way into the hands of hunters all over the country. And of course the 30 caliber has been a standard of American and Canadian hunters going back to the 1800's.

Over 20 years ago I was hunting spring bear in the Bridger's and found a spent 30-06 case laying next to a fossilized Aspen leaf (I eyed the case first and only saw the fossil as I was bending over to get the case). The case head stamp was from WWI...

Gun writing spanned the entire 20th Century, and undoubtedly all that verbage has had an effect!

I still consider the 30-06 "The Everyman's Elk Cartridge." It really is the Gold Standard of performance in my mind. But my personal elk hunting economy has been off the Gold Standard for a long time... smile




Brad, It does make sense to go back even further (the 30-03) in seeing how perceptions are formed.

It’s interesting, I had an eager young man talk with me about a new elk rifle the other day. After he mentioned the 6.5’s to the 26 and 28 Nosler; the 30 PRC, and the 300 magnums, he described ballistically what he was looking for with, wisely, a nod to unwanted recoil.

I: “do you know what you just described?”
He: “no.”
Me: “the 30/06.”
“Really?”

🙂

A blessed New Year to you and yours Brad!
Posted By: George_De_Vries_3rd

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 01/01/20

Originally Posted by beretzs
Well said George. I was a young reader of Hagel and still believe what he wrote was great for the times, because as you mentioned, bullets weren’t as great.

Today, I still use boomers and 6.5/270/280 all together but it’s more about want than need.

It’s kinda funny though but out to 400-500 pretty much all of the “normal” cartridges look more like a 270/30-06 than different. Plus or Minus a few FPS whistle


I still remember Hagel writing about using the 378 Wea on an Idaho moose; the 270 and the 340 Wea’s also.
And Ross Siefried writing about his Champlin 340 Wea in Guns ‘n Ammo. Boddington wrote about using the 340 with 250-gr RN’s (a peculiar choice of bullet) at 400 yds on an BC (?) moose.

I’ve had most of the cartridges from the 270’s to the 458 Lott and barring extremes at each end of the spectrum, one learns a whole bunch of them are more alike than different when used with good bullets placed in the pump room.
Posted By: George_De_Vries_3rd

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 01/01/20

Originally Posted by beretzs
Well said George. I was a young reader of Hagel and still believe what he wrote was great for the times, because as you mentioned, bullets weren’t as great.

Today, I still use boomers and 6.5/270/280 all together but it’s more about want than need.

It’s kinda funny though but out to 400-500 pretty much all of the “normal” cartridges look more like a 270/30-06 than different. Plus or Minus a few FPS whistle


I still remember Hagel writing about using the 378 Wea on an Idaho moose; the 270 and the 340 Wea’s also.
And Ross Siefried writing about his Champlin 340 Wea in Guns ‘n Ammo. Boddington wrote about using the 340 with 250-gr RN’s (a peculiar choice of bullet) at 400 yds on an BC (?) moose.

I’ve had most of the cartridges from the 270’s to the 458 Lott and barring extremes at each end of the spectrum, one learns a whole bunch of them are more alike than different when used with good bullets placed in the pump room.
Posted By: beretzs

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 01/02/20

Originally Posted by George_De_Vries_3rd
Originally Posted by beretzs
Well said George. I was a young reader of Hagel and still believe what he wrote was great for the times, because as you mentioned, bullets weren’t as great.

Today, I still use boomers and 6.5/270/280 all together but it’s more about want than need.

It’s kinda funny though but out to 400-500 pretty much all of the “normal” cartridges look more like a 270/30-06 than different. Plus or Minus a few FPS whistle


I still remember Hagel writing about using the 378 Wea on an Idaho moose; the 270 and the 340 Wea’s also.
And Ross Siefried writing about his Champlin 340 Wea in Guns ‘n Ammo. Boddington wrote about using the 340 with 250-gr RN’s (a peculiar choice of bullet) at 400 yds on an BC (?) moose.

I’ve had most of the cartridges from the 270’s to the 458 Lott and barring extremes at each end of the spectrum, one learns a whole bunch of them are more alike than different when used with good bullets placed in the pump room.




I still remember Seyfrieds 300 and 338 RUMs, before they were RUMs. I still love the boomers and use them but I know the danged bullet matters more than sheer HP.
Posted By: AussieGunWriter

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 01/02/20

Originally Posted by donsm70
I recently purchased a Remington 700 Classic in 7mm-08 with some Kampfeld upgrades that shoots 150 gr Nosler Partitions very well. I really like the rifle, the weight, the mild recoil and the way it shoots.
Here is my dilema. I have a wilderness horseback elk hunt (probably my last) scheduled for the fall of 2020 in Wyoming. I also have rifles in 6.5 CM, 7x57, 280ai, 30-06 and 300WM that I like and are very accurate. I have a self imposed shot limit of 300 yards. I am not a turret twister. My last two hunts there have produced 6x6 bulls at 160 and 27 yards.
Is the 700 in 7-08 up to the task?
donsm70


If you already have a 7x57 then you already know the answer.
It will be fine.
Posted By: Jim_Knight

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 01/10/20

I can still remember when the .257 Roberts was touted as "perfect" for whitetail Texas deer, then the 25-06 came out and it took its spot in my part of the country. Then the 6mm Remington in the 742 came out, wow! It really took off! And its only a few thousands different in diameter, same case as the Roberts! ha. I know several guys that kill elk every year with 6mm Rem, 243, and 240 Wby. So, when I hear about killing elk with the 6.5 Creedmoor, I begin to wonder how many folks used the 257 Roberts on them ( and everything else!) ha Plenty I bet!
Posted By: snowwalker

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 02/23/20

7mm08 is up to the task.
Kampfeld upgraded (assuming lightened) 700 short action that throws 150 NPT’s nicely?? You have like a near perfect elk killing death stick. Especially if you dont touch turrets or go past 300 yards. Sounds like a nice rig. Good luck on your hunt.
Posted By: gatekeeper

Re: 7mm-08 with 150 gr Nosler Partitions - 07/12/20

It truly makes me laugh, some of what is said on the internet. 'Anything less than a 416 Cheytac for prarie dogs and you might as well be peeing into the wind'...At least I find some very good humor. I admit, I did used to think like that, but I am grateful to writers like John Barsness and John Haviland for writing articles that state the truth, and educate people like me. Then, through my own experience, like others, I validate everything they said about caliber choice, using a good bullet, placing it correctly and result is a cleanly harvested animal. I am a big fan of the 7mm-08, and with a Nosler Partition or Accubond, would not hesitate to shoot the biggest bull elk walking out to 400yds. Good luck on your hunt!
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