Found one at $1500.

Not sure it's all original, but intend to hunt it.

As soon as I have pics in hand I'll post.

Thanks Scotty!

Pick it apart fellas!

Cool find buddy. Was the barrel reblued, it's sticking out like a sore thumb to me? Extractor jeweled too? Hard to tell in the pics. The butt plate shows a lot of wear like it's been in a gunshops rack and picked up a lot for a long time.. Just because you said "pick it apart", I'd also check to see if the rear dovetail was filled and ground. The only reason I'd think someone reblued the barrel. I'm also seeing a slight color difference where a dovetail would have been. We all know the front sight can be sweated off, as that was done on some of these fwt's. I'd hunt the hell out of it for sure.

I wondered about the barrel blue as well, but without HD pictures its hard to tell.

What would concern me is it's been picked up and looked at a lot.. Was it in a well known gunshop?? This reminds me, I saw my good buddy gunsmith at the gunshow last Saturday. I wished he posted here. I'll bet your buddy in Lyle knows him too. He would be able to tell us. If there were more and better pics, it may be easier to know for sure too.

Well, point is moot.

"Won't ship to the Northeast".

Tried explaining to him it was like shipping anywhere else.

🤷‍♂️

That's just dumb!

WTH??? Geez. It probably would have been a good shooter. The search is on I guess.. I've never seen one in person, so like I said in your other thread, finding one is going to be a challenge. Especially if you are looking for an original. Good luck with it buddy. I really hope you find a good one!! The last pre 64 I had in my had was an all original 1950 30-06 for $700. That was last Saturday at my clubs gunshow. I always look for nice featherweight rifles at great deals though. Even those are getting harder to find, it seems.

Background moment. The "Gopher Special" was a Winchester Factory variation. A small group of rifles contracted by Gopher Shooter Supply a firm in, as I recall, the Dakotas. Based on the pre '64 Model 70 action in Featherweight configuration. "Gopher" variation as a "sightless barrel" of standard 22". Available only in 30-06, .270 & .243 Winchester chamberings. The stock of Monte Carlo configuration consistent with scope use mandated. Model 70 serialization in late 1959 through 1961.

No distinctive "Gopher"/such nomenclature on these rifles. The specs above constituting 'the Duck'. If it it quacks to such tune, it's presumptively a Gopher Special category Duck! That making it more collector valuable. That also making it candidate for faking. The pesky aft dovetail sight slot in the ordinary Featherweight as required "deletion", technically most difficult to deal with as faking. The other dimension, as all collectible Winchesters, "factory original" status. Original barrels themselves the 'core' essential component. Receivers and stocks substituted 'du jour' and that, without observing niceties of above specs, often providing a strong instant tilt to a knowledgeable collector.

The allegation of the same barrel configuration by any other name, to be of equal value. Not so, if objectively in collector context. The claims of rare factor variations or factory special orders... Fill the annals of rifle owner claims. Most wishful thinking as trying to legitimize their 'finds'.

The O/P here, to his credit didn't come here with such claims. Unfortunately from the visuals provided, his rifle SN is about 1955 production date and thus too early for Gopher era. The stock isn't displayed in manner to confirm the MC feature either. Last, the blue on the action, isn't original and barrel as ? pending better visuals; now point moot!

The rifle appears a very nice pre '64 Model 70 in ultimately useful .270 Win chambering. Assuming it shoots well, a very nice package. Leaving valuing its worth in dollars to others!

Best!
John

John has it pegged IMO!

John, Gopher Shooter's Supply was in Faribault, Minnesota when I did business with them but they may have moved to the Dakotas.

This tells the Gopher Special story...

https://scatteredshots.com/2022/05/30/gopher-shooters-supply-model-70s/

My grandparents lived in the Fairbault area, and I went there many times. I was on the Gopher Shooter's Supply mailing list in the early 70's and lusted over the wares!

Damn! that's a fake, i also dont like the way the barrel looks directly in front of the action, a damn Sharps rifle is the only thing that's supposed to have a Hartford Collar, may be glare/angle, but i doubt it.

All i have is a regular FWT 270, really sweet little rifles.

Let me be clear, not looking for a Gopher, but a Type 4 sightless Featherweight.

The hunt is half the fun, no?

They're the same thing, no? If not, what's the difference?

Provenance

It's apparently impossible to know, so that can't be it.

Exactly

The Red Book of Gun Values as “Gopher Specials”, manufactured between serial numbers 440793-465040.

Even within that range, without provenance, the rifle must be assumed as a type 4

They sure are gunner. I had one at one time. The second cleanest 270 fwt I've had in my hands. The other one was NIB, that I could have bought for $350 more than the one I bought. My smith friend told me to buy the one I did because he knew for a fact it was a "shooting sumbiotch". His words not mine. If I was a 270 guy, I'd still have it..

I’d venture to guess my 270 Featherweight in near my favorite rifle, next to my Mashburn and 338.. All three of them are very good hunting rifles for me.

Gotchya, thanks. I didn't think that information was available, and I'm often wrong!

Since you don't want a sightless one made to be sold through Gopher Supply, I'm curious, why not? Is the non-gopher sightless more valuable?

Brad, I'd gladly pay for an authentic Gopher, with provenance.

The issue is there's very few that have the necessary documentation to be considered anything other than a class 4 rifle

Ah - gotchya. Now it makes sense. Sorry for clogging the thread...

Some thoughts about Gopher Specials….
Gopher Specials were in the 1959 Gopher Catalog and their magazine advertising said, “after waiting for a year” they were in stock. This would suggest that they were ordered from Winchester in 1957 or 1958. Additionally, one must take into account that Gopher offered sightless M70’s (including the 308 Win and sightless Standard Westerner) all the way through 1963. So there had to be more than one order from Gopher to Winchester, the later one including the 308 Win. Fwt and 264 Win Mag Standard Westerner.
The Red Book notes the full S/N range of 1959 M70 production and assumes that Gopher Specials were all made in 1959.
Good Luck finding a genuine Gopher Special.

I assume a Type 4 or Class 4 rifle was a special order? Please pardon my ignorance. Thanks

The rifle shown appears to have an aluminum butt plate. From about 1958 on the butt plates were composite...at least it is on my 1958 Standard .30-06. That would tend to rule out the " 1959 gopher special" designation for this gun or at least raise some questions.

335127 ruled it out a while back.

I can't be sure! But all this maybe advocacy about "sightless", I think we may have a "Mole" amongst us!

Factually, such configurations deprived of iron sights, resulting entirely dependent upon scope for any semblance of accuracy at range. Such, depriving the rifleman of a very inexpensive, innocuous 'backup tool' for little good cause. As in the middle of nowhere with a busted scope, those set of 'irons' could be invaluable! The "trend away from irons", not so much the riflemen I suspect, as the manufacturers looking to squeeze every nickel out of each build cost factor!
Long term trends by now of decades, disdaining "irons". Not saying I'd put them on a gun - factory without. But appreciating that measure of ultimately cheap "insurance".

Course, "Cheap insurance..." I was the guy who advocated condom dispensers for the back seat of every car too!

Best!
John

Oops, I missed that serial number picture. Anyway, I was digging around in Rule's book and found that supposedly the composite butt was a 1959 change, so now I have questions about my 1958...sorry for getting off track.

I have posted that buttplate question before and the best that I can figure out is that it was a gradual process. One of the authorities on the Winchester collector site has documented stocks which serialize to ‘59 and even ‘60 with aluminum plates; as well as ‘58 with composite.

Exactly. I've seen late 58's with composite plates..

Yes, class 4 special order..

John, you are a little older than I am, but I think JOC had a lot to do with guys wanting to go "sightless", as some of his customs were built that way. I think he had a preference for them with his "sheep" rifles because he was trying to lighten them up as much as he could. So, it was around the time he had his #2 rifle built that guys were getting intrigued by these sightless rifles. I believe that was in 1954.

Is it my eyes or the picture, but looks like the serial numbers have been polished out...

I don't think it's your eyes. The rifle in question is not an option for the op now, which is a good thing. He found a much nicer example. You should check out the other thread he started. Not a lot of Winchester experts commenting on this rifle, but there is a lot that stands out in those pics. Like I said, that rifle has been picked up a lot and examined at a gunshop somewhere. In person it is probably even more obvious that the finish has been re-done etc..

I think some guy from Washington thinks I posted pics of this rifle. I brought up some good observations, but you are pretty tight lipped. I stand by exactly what I said about this rifle, as it hits the nail on the head. NYrifleman is doing much better with the other rifle he's working on getting. I don't mind calling this poster that PM'd me, but he may not like what I have to say. Don't want to make anyone cry on a phone call either..

Based on this thread my offer on this rifle was significantly lower than the $1500 asking price. Thankfully bcame a moot point when the shop wouldn't ship.