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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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BTW, "a lack of belief in gods or supernatural beings" is a [/b]belief[b] system; ergo, a religion.
😊 George, you don't understand Atheism. Atheism is a belief regarding a single question, nothing more, so it is not a "belief system". Now many Atheist follow specific belief systems, such as secular humanism, or skepticism, or they can even belong to certain Buddhist sects. They can even be commie Marxist who hold their position because of their "Faith" in Marx, Engels, and Lenin. So Atheist may have a belief system, but Atheism itself is not a belief system.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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I can count on one hand (with leftovers) the Christians who have the moral, intellectual and spiritual honesty to say, "I choose to believe this not because of facts or proof but because I want to'. And, again, let me stress...that's ok. However, it leads to at least two questions for me..
One, because it is a matter of pure 'faith' (belief without or in the face of facts) how do you regard your version as any better or 'truer' than another's?
Two, (and this is the big, important one for me) how does your 'faith' then make you a better person? Because most Religious people I've met end up using their beliefs to judge others and make themselves feel superior--sometimes 'innocently' and often maliciously.
In the end, both atheists and Christians have the same evidence for God/gods...none. The Christian chooses to believe anyway and tries to convince you it's fact. The atheists chooses no belief and doesn't try to convince you of anything.
Who's more honest?"
I will be honest with you. I believe in God and Jesus Christ, the Son OF God. Why, because I want to, I made that choice myself without any need for proof. In fact I will go on record as saying not only is their no proof but it may even be a sin to try to find a proof. I believe because I believe and that's all I need. Just out of curiosity, which finger am I? I won't be upset if you say the middle.  Scott, per usual, you provide a straight forward honest answer. As for the question, is it a sin to seek proof, many belief the search is justified by 1st Peter 3:15, which I will paraphrase for you: ...be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you... Technically, you met your requirement by stating the hope in you is from Faith alone, but others may feed the need to present a logical argument to the logical minded. You make a good point. Perhaps I should have said I think it might be a sin for a Christian to seek proof. Christianity is one hundred percent faith based. Through faith in Christ I am saved. Without faith what does a Christian have? Without Faith, what does a Christian have? A more clear view of reality. Without Faith, what does an atheist have? One heartbeat from hell.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Without Faith, what does an atheist have?
One heartbeat from hell. Do you have evidence for Hell? If so, lets hear it. Or was that just intended to be another threat?
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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The truth will set you free, its not a threat. The Science you worship tells you that for every positive there is a negative, yet you only accept the physical and not the metaphysical. You acdept the flesh, but not the spiritual. You accept the whole, but not the black hole. You deny the balance for the things you see.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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The truth will set you free, its not a threat. The Science you worship tells you that for every positive there is a negative, yet you only accept the physical and not the metaphysical. You acdept the flesh, but not the spiritual. You accept the whole, but not the black hole. You deny the balance for the things you see. Science does not say that for every positive there is a negative. If hat was the case we would never make any progress and we'd all still be wearing animal skins and hunting with spears. And I don't worship science. I don't get together with my friends once a week sot sing devotional songs about science, or pray to beakers and scientist. I'm not the one telling people they have to believe or they will be tortured FOREVER. If you have any evidence for the metaphysical, or the spiritual, LETS HEAR IT. Of course you don't have any, and that's why you will just continue to blather on.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Those who believe there was an explosion in the presence of gases and minerals and chemicals which started life are saying an explosion is what caused the car they drive.
You accept the creation you exist in but not the creator.
God does not want us to give proof. If He did, He would have given it. He even says you are right, there is no everlasting life for you, but those who believe and have faith are also right and because of that they will never die. He gave us that hope because it is possible. Animals dont concern themselves with thoughts of it, because Jesus didnt come, suffer and die for them. Its not an accident their brains dont concern them with the things our brains do.
If you insist on being nothing more than an animal, you will get no more than an animal.
Last edited by eyeball; 08/27/15.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Campfire Ranger
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"Show me a good action that can be taken by a Christian, that cannot be taken by an Atheist."
Maybe bringing comfort to the dying by affirming the existence of a kind and merciful God?
Never holler whoa or look back in a tight place
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Those who believe there was an explosion in the presence of gases and minerals and chemicals which started life are saying an explosion is what caused the car they drive.
You accept the creation you exist in but not the creator.
God does not want us to give proof. If He did, He would have given it. He even says you are right, there is no everlasting life for you, but those who believe and have faith are also right and because of that they will never die. He gave us that hope because it is possible. Animals dont concern themselves with thoughts of it, because Jesus didnt come, suffer and die for them. Its not an accident their brains dont concern them with the things our brains do.
If you insist on being nothing more than an animal, you will get no more than an animal. Like I predicted. Lots of blather, no evidence. As for your understanding of the Big Bang, just WOW. There were no chemicals and minerals at the time of the Big Bang. Subatomic particles did form until after the period of inflation. The heavier elements formed later in the center of starts. Specifically, Elements up the the atomic weight of Iron can form during the standard fusion process, and the heavier elements are formed during super nova's.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Campfire Ranger
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BTW, "a lack of belief in gods or supernatural beings" is a [/b]belief[b] system; ergo, a religion.
😊 So Atheist may have a belief system, but Atheism itself is not a belief system. Boy, ..you do like semantics! 😉
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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"Show me a good action that can be taken by a Christian, that cannot be taken by an Atheist."
Maybe bringing comfort to the dying by affirming the existence of a kind and merciful God? So you consider lying to be a good action? An Atheist can still bring comfort to a dying person. We just might employ a different approach.
Last edited by antelope_sniper; 08/27/15.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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"Show me a good action that can be taken by a Christian, that cannot be taken by an Atheist."
Maybe bringing comfort to the dying by affirming the existence of a kind and merciful God? So you consider lying to be a good action? An Atheist can still bring comfort to a dying person. We just might employ a different approach. But the Christian would not be lying. Even you must admit that a God MAY exist, or you will have abandoned your precious science. And how would YOU comfort a dying man? Maybe..... "Well, Pard, you're gonna make some purty dirt."
Never holler whoa or look back in a tight place
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Lying is saying we are no more than animals.
As He said, we would perform miracles, if you dont believe so, let a dog operate on you.
Last edited by eyeball; 08/27/15.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Campfire Ranger
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Mojo: "The Christian chooses to believe anyway and tries to convince you it's fact." Mojo – a poor assumption and weak position. Seems like you have pumped yourself up too much in an effort to press your views. I am a Christian and not for one second do I – or would I – say a word in trying to convince you or any atheist (or any agnostic) of the existence of God. I know quite a few Christians and believe they act the same. BTW, your post seems to be aimed at something other than the stated topic. Come on CCCC, you've tried to convince me before. But considering how it was in this forum, I'd say it was fair, and give you a pass. Well, thanks for your generous pass I suppose - but am thinking it's not needed. If you can show me a direct quote of my own words as used in any effort simply to convince you that God does exist, I will own it - and will accept your pass. Short of such clear evidence, thanks anyway. You don't remember going 100+ posts with me during one of these discussions? Yes, I remember a prolonged discussion and I remember some folks having been disingenous and evasive at times. Here you are citing a volume of interaction - but I hope you are not so silly as to suppose that volume to be evidence. Quantity of speech is meaningless without essential content. I remember your style, too. You are not citing any words from me in any such effort to convince you of the existence of God. Waiting for a direct citation of post and quote to that end.
Last edited by CCCC; 08/27/15.
NRA Member - Life, Benefactor, Patron
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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Lying is saying we are no more than animals. Yea, the Holocaust proved that.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Lying is saying we are no more than animals.
As He said, we would perform miracles, if you dont believe so, let a dog operate on you. We are neither plant, nor mineral, so that leaves animal. We have big brains and opposable thumbs, that differentiates us from the rest of the animals, but the truth remains, we are animals.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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Lying is saying we are no more than animals.
As He said, we would perform miracles, if you dont believe so, let a dog operate on you. We are neither plant, nor mineral, so that leaves animal. We have big brains and opposable thumbs, that differentiates us from the rest of the animals, but the truth remains, we are animals. The difference between us and other animals is that we have an air of self-importance/superiority and entitlement. Why, I have NO idea.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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A scientist told you that and unbelievably you havent the capability to see the difference. Perhaps for you, there is no difference. But as R Reagan replied to Sam Donaldson, maybe Sams predecessors were monkeys but his werent.
Donaldson was a liar, however.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Lying is saying we are no more than animals.
As He said, we would perform miracles, if you dont believe so, let a dog operate on you. We are neither plant, nor mineral, so that leaves animal. We have big brains and opposable thumbs, that differentiates us from the rest of the animals, but the truth remains, we are animals. The difference between us and other animals is that we have an air of self-importance/superiority and entitlement. Why, I have NO idea. Yep. You have no idea.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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"Show me a good action that can be taken by a Christian, that cannot be taken by an Atheist."
Maybe bringing comfort to the dying by affirming the existence of a kind and merciful God? So you consider lying to be a good action? An Atheist can still bring comfort to a dying person. We just might employ a different approach. But the Christian would not be lying. Even you must admit that a God MAY exist, or you will have abandoned your precious science. And how would YOU comfort a dying man? Maybe..... "Well, Pard, you're gonna make some purty dirt." Russel's tea pot in theory could exist, but that doesn't mean there is any good reason to believe it does. One of the things Russel's tea pot has in common with the Bible is we have good evidence regarding who made them up and when which goes a long way to discrediting their proposed existence. Just because you can define something in a way that makes it possible to exist, does not in and of it self make it reasonable to believe in it. Perhaps you are not familiar with the concept the the Null Hypothesis and how non-acceptance of a hypothesis is the default position until the evidence indicated other wise. If you believed in everything just because it was by definition possible, you would have to believe in everything on my earlier list of non-beliefs. I imagine you don't extend that same courtesy to any other supernatural claim except your God, which means you are just engaging in another case of special pleading.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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Oh, I do. It's cuzz some book told you that you're important and special, why, because you need that self affirmation.
I have no doubt that you, Eyeball, are indeed SPECIAL.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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