Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Optics Help me pick a scope

Here is the story. I went out west for the first time this year and got a 6x6 bull at 405 yds with a 30/06. I realized I wasn't prepared for shooting at such long distance. I plan on going back and want to be prepared. I'm going to get a 300 win mag (unless someone convinces me something is better) and I want to scope it with some type of ballistic plex system. What's a reliable, simple to use scope for this purpose. With the set up I had I aimed 20" over the elks back and clipped the spine. I think luck was involved.

Seems to me all you needed was a ballistics chart, which are free online............

Man you'll get different suggestions from different folks.

Get a good range finder, a quality scope with ballistic plex type reticle since you don't seem to want to spin turretes

then go somewhere where you can actually practice out to say 500yds. IMO your 30-06 if a MOA shooter is actually fine for what you need with the right bullet.

biggest thing you can do is actually practice out to the ranges you want to be able to take game at.

What kind of budget do you have ?

VX-3, 3.5-10x40 CDS in yards for your best load.

My .300 WM likes 180 gr. NBT's and NAB's, both shoot to the same POI. And it likes RL-22.

DF

This one, I have one exactly like it on my .300...

6x36

[/u]

Originally Posted by CowboyTim

This one, I have one exactly like it on my .300...

6x36

[u]

FWIW that's a good deal on a solid scope. Buy that, a rangefinder and then go shoot your 30-06 A LOT.

I knew the distance by my range finder and knew what to aim over. I just didn't like using Kentucky wind age. Maybe I'm over thinking things. Have a vxII 4x12 on a old FN actioned sako, and it shoots under Moa.

Amen brother! I've been dialing one in on the 7-08 McWhorter and am reminded how easy they are to like.

^ This.

I am a ballistic reticle fanatic and practice long but don't see the as worth much except giving me false confidence when:


A) the shot exceeds 400 yds

B) conditions are less than ideal

It's hard enough to make a hit a target at 600 yds and using Kentucky wind age & guessing is fine on steel but not something I'd do on meat.

CDS at least allows you a leg up on drop and that's big, but wind is damn near impossible especially out west.

Ymmv, but I'd learn to army crawl a couple hundred yards. The difference for me between 600 & 400 yds is NOT 200 yds in my experience.

I have killed quite a few elk with a 30-06 and a 3-9 scope. After a time I found a longer range gun was necessary, I got a 300 Weatherby with a Swarovski Z-6 3-18 scope with a BR reticle. I have since then killed quite a few elk at over 500 yards.

The ballistic reticle is better than the CDS or Turrets, as there is no changing of the reticle to rely on the repeatability of adjustable scopes. Many will argue his, but the fact still remains with a ballistic reticle there is no messing with the reticle.

Big or small it works well. Another thing the 7mm-08 shooters don't realize, is the 300 not only works at long range, but you can still shoot elk when they are close. The 300 Weatherby is a bit better than the 300 Winchester, the Z-6 is a better scope than a Leupold, so that is why I have it that way, you won't be disappointed with the same setup...

Pretty hard to argue with any of that. Good post. Pretty much the way I see it as well...

If you want to shoot distance [bleep] can the ranging reticles and the CDS. You want repeatable reliable turrets. SWFA SS if you're cheap, a lot of good options if you've got more to spend. Go to the long range forum and ask your question, see how many recommendations you get for CDS and ranging reticles....

Your rifle is fine, if anything it's more than you need. Reliably hitting at long range means practice. A lot of practice. Recoil doesn't make you want to practice more. Take that 30-06, leave it just as it is and go buy a 223 w/ at least a 9" twist barrel and a 6x SWFA SS and shoot it like you're trying to wear it out. Do that for 6 months and you'll be in a lot better position to decide what you want on your '06 or if you want to sell it.

Your too far away from where you want to be to make good decisions. Aquire the skills and the knowledge and the decisions will be easy for you. A cheap 223 with a fast twist and 6x SWFA SS is the least expensive path to acquiring them that I can think of.

David

A ballistic reticle is not a ranging reticle. Anyone who twists dials still needs to know the range with the assistance of a rangefinder. I guess elk hunting in Louisiana is different than the mountains, but a ballistic reticle and a rangefinder work together well without the risk of turrets and the changing poi.

That is not saying turrets won't work, but to suggest 1000's of rounds of practice with a lighter cartridge will benefit you more than working with the rifle you plan to hunt with is unnecessary.

I have had both and gone from turrets to ballistic reticles for simplicity and reliability...

You don't have to hunt elk in Louisiana to know stupid advice when you read it. You're recommending to a guy that can't connect the dots on his own with a 30-06 at 400yards to step up to a 300weatherby and a ballistic reticle? Positively idiotic.

I know you can do it. How many rounds of small caliber 22's and the like (222, 222mag, 22hornet, etc) do you fire a year? For somebody that needs a couple of Dillons to keep up with his ammo requirements you sure are quick to dismiss the benefits of practice.

David

This isn't a pissing contest, just advice. I probably hit more elk with a pickup than you have with a rifle. Even so, a 300 WBY works or I wouldn't use it. Second, the ballistic reticle works or I wouldn't use it either. The combination is simple and deadly.

Rangefinding is a essential element in long range shooting, turrets or ballistic reticle. The lack of twisting dials and dealing with the change of the reticle opposed to a static reticle, is less likely to cause a wardrobe malfunction in the field...

I won't get into brands other than to say every recommendation as to brand you get from everybody will probably suffice. When it comes to simple ballistic plex system, you can't get more simple than mil dot, long range dot (like Leupold) and simple hash BDC (like Vortex and others). I have and use several of the other "busy" type reticles and really like them; but, for simplicity, dots or hashes are what you seek.

There are a truck load of cartridges with "similar" ballistics and trajectories. Had you known your cartridges trajectory a little better, knowing the range, you would not have held that high and spined that bull. With a 200-tard zero, a generic 30 cal bullet (180 ?) out of the '06 would drop some 18-22". That 6x6 (congratulations!) bull was probably 28-36" deep through the chest from spine to sternum (assuming broadside), so a 6-8" hold over hair was all you needed at that range for a good mid to low chest hit.

The cartridge is not in question here I don't think and I wouldn't encourage to go so quickly to a magnum. You can see when you review the scenario that placement was the issue. So, you are good to go as is but you need to shoot a lot more to make trajectory knowledge intuitive. With that trajectory knowledge and a good LRF you can kill a bull to 400 with little hold-over without special reticles or turning turrets. As you go to deer and antelope, this does get trickier as they are much smaller. And I don't advise you think longer than 400 yards on any game shots; at least, not yet.

Like Schrap, I also have had good experiences with ballistic reticles in Leup's, Swarovski's, and Zeiss scopes but these really don't get real useful until you are going much beyond 400 yards. And they are not automatic game changers; to be properly used requires some ballistic program work and a lot of reaffirming practice at the corresponding ranges. While turrets can work fine too and may in some cases be more precise especially at long, long range, I prefer the reticles for hunting and I don't shoot past 600 (300 Weatherby also and others).

So, if you make 400 yards your limit you need change nothing except add more shooting at all ranges up to that range to familiarize yourself with '06 trajectory so you are more familiar with hold-over at that range.

Beyond that range, things in the field get more difficult quickly.

Shrapnel,

No doubt you find it works for you. A ballistic reticle is by design an imperfect compromise. Nothing is easier than putting the crosshairs exactly at POI and squeezing the trigger.

For a guy that doesn't want to turn this into a pissing contest you sure are strutting around like a banty rooster about the elk you've slain. You might review what I told him - hold off trying to buy another rifle/scope for elk hunting till he has a better grasp on shooting long ranges - I don't think I made a recommendation for an elk rifle at all.

I know you say it has no bearing on the subject, but how many rounds a year did you say you shoot again? 2000? 5000? 10,000? More?

Seems like the guys with the most trigger time can make any system worka hence the recommendation to get the trigger time instead of trying to purchase skills....


David

Sorry you don't get it, but that's not my fault. If experience is strutting like a Banty rooster, you are an egg that hasn't even been layed yet.

The op mentioned going to a 300 mag and a ballistic reticle, I just responded accordingly. You on the other hand, went off on a sidetrack about dials and turrets.

Just let it rest and quit derailing this thread due to your limited experience and poor comprehension skills.

My apologies to blairvt, but if you are still seeking any more advice, feel free to pm me...