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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,742 Likes: 20
Campfire Sage
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OP
Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,742 Likes: 20 |
Hunting is one thing. Getting attacked by some nut is another. You need to be instantly prepared to keep from getting killed. Any time spent between drawing, and aiming is critical. Walking around with a cold chamber is no better than walking around with an empty gun. By the time you get a round in the chamber and re-position your slide operating hand for firing, it may be too late. Handguns without a safety are fine for lying on your Nightstand, but if you are walking around with a CC in a holster or in your pocket, use a gun with a safety. It's only common sense. safeties on defensive handguns are dumb...1911s are best owned as range pistols This. Double action revolver, double action auto, or Glock-style striker fire trigger are all good choices for defensive concealed carry. I've come to the belief that a safety on a concealed carry defensive handgun is unwise. Can it work? Sure, but you can also usually do just fine defending yourself at home with a bolt action .30-06 rifle if that's what you have on hand. That doesn't make a bolt action rifle a particularly good choice as a home defensive weapon. The fact that a manual safety equipped handgun usually works out just fine in the role of defensive concealed carry handgun doesn't make it a good choice for defensive concealed carry either, if a handgun without one is available to you.
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Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,418
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,418 |
There is a place for a safety on a defensive carry gun. Clothing, zippers, draw strings etc. can (and have) enter into the trigger guard while holstering and discharge the firearm. Once properly holstered in a holster that isolates the trigger, there is no danger. A striker pistol with a safety that can be engaged (like most Shield models) while holstering and then disengaged once the trigger is isolated is safer. Also, it is safer to engage the safety when holstering/unholstering/handling the gun at a range. For carry, take the safety off, once secured. Accidents, such as I outlined, can be averted by using extreme care in holstering your firearm, but, sometimes, we all can have a momentary lapse.
As for the 1911, it can be safely carried cocked and unlocked in a holster that, again, isolates the trigger and has a thumb break strap that rides under the cocked hammer. Again, the safety can be employed while holstering and disengaged once the trigger is isolated or hammer blocked in the holster.
Last edited by cooper57m; 01/31/17.
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 42,620 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 42,620 Likes: 1 |
I don't have an issue "wiping" the safety on a 1911 as it comes up. Neither do I have a problem with striker pistols.
A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022 |
I've never understood the theory. I've always figured if I needed a gun outside of effecting an arrest, it was going to be needed right got damned NOW, with damned little time to discuss other options I haven't read the whole thread, but just on the first page alone there were people agreeing with this. I was a deputy in Texas for 17 years, and you couldn't be more RIGHT if you tried. You can extend the urgency of needing a firearm to folks who carry using the variety of modes of concealed/open carry available, depending on the state you have your CC license in. When you need a firearm you need right NOW. I carry with one in the chamber and the magazine topped off. Always.
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022 |
I must be as incompetent as Steelhead.
Mack, You and Scott would be among the last persons someone with a warped sense of reality would try and label as "incompetent".
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022 |
Someone like you that askeered of shooting themselves or someone else with a rifle while walking around in the woods, certainly shouldn't be trusted with a rifle with a 30 round magazine. Give a moron like you a 30 round magazine and you might just be able to hit someone. It's best that a klutz like you be limited to just 5 rounds. Wow! Hard to believe you typed that and posted it.
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 39,301
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 39,301 |
Someone like you that askeered of shooting themselves or someone else with a rifle while walking around in the woods, certainly shouldn't be trusted with a rifle with a 30 round magazine. Give a moron like you a 30 round magazine and you might just be able to hit someone. It's best that a klutz like you be limited to just 5 rounds. Wow! Hard to believe you typed that and posted it. Differences of opinions and not permitted here.
The first time I shot myself in the head...
Meniere's Sucks Big Time!!!
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 67,738
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 67,738 |
I'm in the group that always carries with a loaded chamber. That includes both CCW and when hunting. My reasons are, well, my reasons, and they have worked for me over the past 60+ years. I really have no issues with folks that do it differently. Their reasons are most likely well thought out, and work for them.
Sam......
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 |
When I started deer hunting in the early 50's here in Michigan, almost everyone used lever action Winchesters and Marlins. The were carried hot with the hammer on half cock. I still use that kind of rifle today and wouldn't think of going into the woods with an empty chamber.
Watching some of the Alaska shows on TV and noticed they chambered a round AFTER they see an animal...BULL CRAP!, I've hunted Alaska and you DO NOT walk around in Bear country with an empty chamber...that's TV editing.
As for empty chamber on a hand gun?....you'd better have your Will made out and your Life Insurance paid up. Not BULL CRAP. Well, perhaps for Yankees, they do all sorts of stupid shiet. I lived there, carried a rifle damn near daily, and I can't recall a time it had a round in the chamber. I can't recall my pards having one chambered either.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 16,000
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 16,000 |
just a personal opinion, but an observation. It seems as if some people are living in an environment where they are walking down the streets of tombstone to the ok corral or facing matt dillon in dodge city. i have never carried a rifle with a round in the chamber unless i was ready to use it right now. it doesn't take that much time to jack one in. I carry handguns with one in the chamber if i see the situation warrenting it, otherwise not. I have never found a safety to be an issue, subject to the handgun, certainly not on a 1911 style firearm. i can still remember this guy with a remington 1100 walking behind me in heavy brush flicking the safety on and off. After i cleaned my pants and switched positions i asked him if he thought quail carried switch blades. Never hunted with him again. he had one in the chamber too.
Last edited by RoninPhx; 02/07/17.
THE BIRTH PLACE OF GERONIMO
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022 |
I would be too worried constantly if I carried a 1911 style pistol locked and cocked that didn't have the trigger enclosed in a sturdy holster AND a thumb strap, buckled, between the cocked hammer and the rear of the firing pin. I'd be a nervous wreck. Striker fired pistols are different...they are never "cocked" and the length of pull is a lot longer than a 1911 style semi-auto. Even so, for my carry gun I've gone to a striker fired Smith&Wesson M&P Shield (in .45 - waiting for the inevitable 10mm model) which and as an option you can chose to have a 1911 style frame mounted safety on frame, which I had added. I can stick that gun in my front pocket inside a simple leather pouch to prevent printing and to cover the trigger. I feel comfortable carrying that one loaded.
The only type of hunting I carry with one in the chamber is turkey hunting; the birds can see you move hundreds of yards away. I get seated, load one in the chamber, and start calling. If you have to reach up and jack a round into the chamber as a bird approaches the bird will hear and see you move, and will simply leave the area to the nearest cover. If turkeys had a sense of smell like a white tail deer no one would ever kill one.
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 22,930 Likes: 15
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 22,930 Likes: 15 |
nope. they'd hunt them from trees and over feeders....
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022 |
nope. they'd hunt them from trees and over feeders.... Not in Illinois.
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 59,167 Likes: 2
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 59,167 Likes: 2 |
i have never carried a rifle with a round in the chamber unless i was ready to use it right now. it doesn't take that much time to jack one in. I'm sure it depends a lot on the terrain and/or distance one must walk/ATV in to the hunting area.. Out west where one can take a couple hours to walk (or ride a horse) in to the area it makes perfect sense to carry empty.. But in the upper Midwest where the woods begins at the ditch, taking "that much time to jack one in" will result in whatever deer you might have seen to be in the next county, post-haste.. After i cleaned my pants and switched positions i asked him if he thought quail carried switch blades. Never hunted with him again. he had one in the chamber too.
He was a dumbass.. M1100 with safety on AND ALWAYS pointed away from any other hunting partner is the way it should be done.. But quail, around here, are GONE in about 1.5 seconds - and NOBODY is gonna 'jack a round' into the chamber, mount and shoot a quail that way here.. BTDT.. Used to do a bit of quail hunting - and the little bastids are danged FAST... But again, it's mostly woods here - not open prairie.. FWIW.
Ex- USN (SS) '66-'69 Pro-Constitution. LET'S GO BRANDON!!!
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 4,755
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 4,755 |
Striker fired pistols are different...they are never "cocked" and the length of pull is a lot longer than a 1911 style semi-auto. Even so, for my carry gun I've gone to a striker fired Smith&Wesson M&P Shield (in .45 - waiting for the inevitable 10mm model) Actually, many striker fired pistols do ride fully cocked - specifically the M&P series. That long trigger pull in an M&P is not cocking the striker, it's just creep. Glocks are different, they sit at about half cock at rest, and the long trigger pull completes the rest of the striker's rearward travel. Not sure about XD pistols, been too long since I owned or worked on one.
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Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 8,109
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 8,109 |
Stopped in at a pawn shop today. They have a stainless .357 LCR Ruger revolver, much lighter and smaller than my .38. They are asking $429.00 and accept trades. No exposed hammer either. May have to see If I can swing the upgrade. No visible wear at all to the .357. Is that price about right?
Last edited by kellory; 02/08/17.
An unemployed Jester, is nobody's Fool.
the only real difference between a good tracker and a bad tracker, is observation. all the same data is present for both. The rest, is understanding what you're seeing.
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
If they'd take $400 you're in there like swimwear.
Dave
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 8,109
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 8,109 |
If they'd take $400 you're in there like swimwear.
Dave Appreciate the feedback
An unemployed Jester, is nobody's Fool.
the only real difference between a good tracker and a bad tracker, is observation. all the same data is present for both. The rest, is understanding what you're seeing.
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022 |
Striker fired pistols are different...they are never "cocked" and the length of pull is a lot longer than a 1911 style semi-auto. Even so, for my carry gun I've gone to a striker fired Smith&Wesson M&P Shield (in .45 - waiting for the inevitable 10mm model) Actually, many striker fired pistols do ride fully cocked - specifically the M&P series. That long trigger pull in an M&P is not cocking the striker, it's just creep. Glocks are different, they sit at about half cock at rest, and the long trigger pull completes the rest of the striker's rearward travel. Not sure about XD pistols, been too long since I owned or worked on one. I am contrite.
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 573
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 573 |
"Epitaph"
John liked to carry with no shell in the chamber
He thought he could rack it if he was in danger
when he met with a bad guy, he came out second best
Now here lies poor John with a hole in his chest
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