Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Consider This About Jesus........

Is everyone still arguing about what they "believe" rather than what they "know"? If so then carry on.

There are Christians who realize that the life they lead and the values they exemplify should speak clearly to their beliefs and Christianity, and that nothing they could speak would be as telling as their behavior. They realize that they are born sinners saved by Grace and can never hold themselves higher or better than the most obvious sinners extant.

Many such Christians know the Scriptures - sometimes well - but do not quote such in arguments or discussions with non-Christians, nor do they try to tell non-Christians what they should do with regard to personal beliefs. There are many ways to witness and testify to one's Christianity.

One key is the realization that their faith is enabling in many ways and that non-Christians do not have the benefits of such faith and actually cannot understand or accept the fact of such faith. That void seems very significant.

In the same vein, such Christians understand the importance of defending their faith. They will do so, in part, by recognizing the belittling attacks, untruths, blasphemy, unethical behavior, etc., etc. as presented by those outside the Faith. False statements and devious tactics are to be exposed.

Those who attack and decry Christianity and Christians here are not bothersome or upsetting, for good reason. However, the darkness is a concern. Responding to that is not a game or pastime - it is not showtime to be taken lightly. A small candle may amount to very little in such vast darkness, and sometimes the best one can do is to try to open the door and shed light.

God, through His Son, brings about any conversion - it is not caused or gained by man.

"Many such Christians know the Scriptures - sometimes well - but do not quote such in arguments or discussions with non-Christians, nor do they try to tell non-Christians what they should do with regard to personal beliefs."

This has got to be sarcasm. Right?

It does not say "all" - it says "many". If you are capable of understanding the difference, you may be able to fathom the absence of sarcasm. If you are bent on sarcasm, it can be yours.

How many is "many" Christians and how do you know what they know about Bible scripture or what they try to tell non-Christians with regards to personal beliefs? In my lifetime ALL the Christians I've known do EXACTLY what you say they don't do. I can't tell you how "many" ALL is either but there have been a lot of them since I was first introduced to Christians 70 years ago.

I hang out with great folks. Seems like maybe you don't choose so well. Hoping you find better.

"I hang out with great folks. Seems like maybe you don't choose so well. Hoping you find better."

So you think that you hang out with great folks and maybe I don't. Now you're talking like all the Christians I've known who see themselves as superior to anyone who doesn't share their beliefs. I hang out with great moral folks and always have. I have always chosen my friends based on how they lived their lives not what they believed in. Some of my friends are Christians but I don't hold it against them or try to convince them to change their beliefs (I can't say the same for them). Hoping you won't always be an arrogant, condescending, conceited, sanctimonious and self righteous jerk. Maybe prayer will help, but I doubt it.

"If you are capable of understanding the difference, you may be able to fathom the absence of sarcasm."

Wow! That's a good one. You really put me in my place.

Who is this Jesus you all speak of?

I know a Jesus. He mows the lawn at my office complex.

Nice fellow. Wants me to take him trout fishing.

victoro - I've taken time to explain the way I try to be and have noted the behavior of many Christians I know. You know full well that I'm not trying to speak for/about all Christians. You know even better that I've not ever tried to tell you or others here what you should believe or how to live - period.

You seem to want to fight about your experiences with Christians. Go ahead - especially if you need or enjoy that sort of thing. If you need it, do it. The fact that your experience with Christians differs from mine may be due to many factors and explained in differing ways, and that's hardly worth discussing.

I know nothing about your chosen friends. Above you seem compelled to defend them and, at the same time, complain because they try to get you to change your beliefs. If you think they are great but dislike their behavior in that regard, your dislike is a consequence of your choice. That can't be very hard to understand.

Or, is the discomfort caused by something else? I have no dog in that fight.

don't know how many were living at the time of the Birth of Christ (+1-3 AD?). at least one i'm pretty sure. inside the scope of some 300 million humans give or take one or two?

anyways, today if the same proportionality held, we'd need about slightly more than 23 (assuming my math is correct).

I never used the word proof, I used the word evidence.

We have plenty of evidence our sun is currently stable and will not go Red Giant for another 5 billion year.

How old did you decide the earth is?

You are presuming he is real, which you have not sufficiently established.

You must live a very sheltered life.

Ask jag. if God created the animals first or man first.

Genesis 1 indicates animals were first.
Genesis 2 indicates Adam was first.

1:24 And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.
1:25 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle,
and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.


2:18 And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.
2:19 And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them:
and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.
2:20 And Adam gave names to all cattle, and to the fowl of the air, and to every beast of the field; but for Adam there was not found an help meet for him.




and where is the 'Heaven' that Christians hope to find? it is solid tangible earthly real estate, yes?

Genesis 1: AKJV

6 "And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day."

Starman posted:

Genesis 1 indicates animals were first.
Genesis 2 indicates Adam was first.



No, your conclusions are not substantiated and just flat wrong. Again, I doubt you even read Genesis 1 & 2 but even if you did, you did not get the drift.

Adam and Eve were created in Genesis 1:27. The animals were already created previously on that day. Then Genesis 2:4-25 is that day in much more detail. Simply an account of that same day. There are not two different chronologies. Also, the Genesis 2:4-25 introduces “Man” as being superior to the animals and different in relationship with God.

There is also some discussion of how Genesis 2:19 should be translated given that certain Hebrew words could be translated differently depending upon the context of the subject verses.
There are some that believe the verse could be translated as follows: “Now the Lord God had formed out of the ground………..”

Recently I contacted a guy to build on my property and we would both make some money. My wife told me, "Don't do business with Christians. They will cheat you every time." She's 72 now and has been around "Christians" for about forty years.

Nope, not spin.

Guy was just flat wrong. No spin required.