Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Backpack Hunting Kifaru Regulator bag????

Where are the nasty comments, guys? Merely an opinion that is turning out to be correct?

Okay, a bag is DEAD WEIGHT, unless you are in it, right. Same with sleeping pad. I think we can agree on that... So stop carrying a ton of layering clothes and have one layer that provides warmth and can also be utilized inside the bag.

As for my system, it is very similar to ken999's: Wiggy's Mountain Hunter bag, Barren Ground Jacket, Leg Jackets, Booties. With this system I can go down to 0 or -10. I'll know this winter when I get a bottom number for comfort range, but I KNOW it goes to zero.

My sleeping bag is 3#, 1oz. and is solid down to 25 even if it is soaked. I haven't used it exclusively below that, so I don't have a bottom temp on the bag alone. Besides, that varies from person-to-person, anyway. The Barren Ground Jacket is my layer; period. It may be the best single piece of gear I've got in the store other than sleeping bags. This year I added the leg jackets for comfort when glassing in the wet cold during spring bear season. They can also be worn in the bag, but are not really needed unless the bottom falls out of the thermometer. The booties are great once you get back to camp. They dry your feet and have a textured bottom so they can be worn in or out of the bag.

The idea behind my thinking is that one, lightweight bag will take me through nearly all of my temperature zones EXCEPT deep winter.

The garments go on all of my hunts, without thought as to whether I'll need them or not, so I don't think of them as part of a sleep system only. I do solo hunts, like my goat hunt this year, and if I get in trouble out of reach of my bag, I've got a whole system that will get me through the chill.

Like I think I stated earlier: Take proper garments to the bag and you'll need less bag. I got this lessong from an experienced Iditarod Musher who has our Antarctic Parka and Bib. They always see -50 degree temps on the Yukon River and he wanted to make due with as little sleeping bag as possible. That turned out to be a 0-degree Hunter with Hood.

I had to date been "stripping down" to sleep in my bag, to allow the bag to do what it does. Great idea, but I could now get more out of less bag by wearing Lamilite garments as well.

Now did that lighten my overall backpack hunting load? I can't really say. It's pretty light as is, and gets tweaked based on solo or accompanied, expected weather, terrain, etc. So it won't do me any good to quote you a number as far as the weight of my pack is concerned. Hope you weren't expecting that. Let's just say that no matter whom I hunt with; my pack is always lighter and we're on the same hunt.

Sorry if you guys are angry at me or hate me for some reason, but I'm in the game on three ends. Consumer development,and salesman.

This year I hunted bear, sheep, goat and moose. I took black and brown bears, a goat and a moose.

Sorry, but I'm walking the talk, and if you've got preconceived notions about my business affiliations, then that's an internal struggle. I offer THE BEST service to my customers, and I offer advice based upon ALL of my experience. I didn't start sleeping in sleeping bags when I opened this store, I just continue to do so.

If I may gloat for a moment: This thread was going nowhere until I showed up...

Still we have no testimonial from a "Regulator" user...

Taylor

I do believe Mark, that in describing your sleeping system above, that this could be the first time you have ever added anything useful to a thread here on the campfire. As a consumer it makes me wonder why a person in your position only shows up here every once and a while, and then only to bad mouth one of your competitors. Honestly, how in the world can you try to evaluate the merits of a sleeping bag system without ever seeing one in person?

Anyways, always thought that maybe you were cut from a different cloth then Jerry, but it sure doesn't seem so.

Levi

that's it? no weights?

3-1 for the mnt hntr...what size is it?

...how about the return policy at W's Levi??...

Ken - Reg/Wide

Levi - I've written two very successful books full of information. I don't post here often because my "home" forum is PristineVentures.com. I monitor most threads of interest, though.

I just don't see how a sarcastic response can cause fifty-something posts and a thousand views. Obviously, my reputation precedes me...

It's a good thing!

Love ya, and have no hard feelings toward anyone on this forum.

Taylor

It doesn't sound like you are using Jerry's compression sack.

Unless your parka is a pound and a half lighter than my sweater, you sleep system sounds heavier AND bulkier than mine.

Patrick coined a term years ago that seems to fit.... He called them "Jerry's men" IMO this troll needs to be placed in the campfire's trash bin along with his buddy Jerry...

Interesting we still have the stab at no regulator users, even though its extremely new and takes time to get into the field and get trials run...

I know I had W bags for 2 years till I knew whether or not the zero bags were good at 10 degrees or not.

I do know that I have a 35-40 I don't recall, W bag, and had 2 of the W ground mats down and at 32 one night I about froze my azz off, had to get up and put my wools back on, the bag had all kinds of cold spots to it. I was pushing the limits on it though.

Jeff

I took into account all the hype associated with the design and release of the bag; The fact that it was immediately marketed to the entire membership of that board. It spilled over to this board, and it really isn't that recent a release. I've sold over 2 dozen Glacier Hunter Bags in the last two months since I released it. Put up a thread and you'll have "takers" on that bag. If the "Regulator" comes down in price by 20%, it may reach market.

The only part of my sleep system that is "sleep only" is the bag. All other parts are redundant, therefore not dead weight.

No, I don't use a stuff sack. It stuffs nicely into the bottom of my Osprey.

Jeff, I'm to understand you were using either a Desert Bag, or an Overbag. Yes, you will be cold in either at 32 degrees. I sell them here as 40-degree bags, and not to be heavily relied upon below that.

2ndWind - Go ahead. "Trash me" It hurts just thinking about it.

Taylor

So is that anyone that owns a Wiggys bag? Talk about trolls, jumping into a thread with that smartass comment without contributing something useful to it, now thats a troll. See the fit??

Sure, AkMtnHntr, Patrick owns a Wiggy Bag. I personally sold him one!

But he cut it up in the beginning stages of designing his current system. He then bought insulation from the same manufacturer who makes the raw product for Lamilite. Yes, there is more to the story than most know or remember.

That is about the time I got launched from the Kifaru board, because I was selling sleeping bags on that board and supported all Jerry's theories about a sleeping bag's capabilities and limitations. I'm a Jerry's Man! And loving every minute of it!

Taylor

Ok, that's ENOUGH, I started this thread because I wanted some input on a certain product made by a well known and highly respected longterm gear designer/maker, NOT because I wanted the egotistical ranting of someone whose "facts" appear to be as faulty as his memory.

Taylor, on the Kifaru MB and, until now, here on the Campfire, I have tried to refrain from negative comments about you, although you richly deserve such remarks due to your infantile, ignorant and unwanted comments on this thread.

However, I WAS THERE when you were, deservedly, banned from Kifaru's board, WHEN you and that total psychopath you represent were allowed to sell bags on the board that Patrick Smith PAYS FOR.

Your whacknut mentor, one of the most offensive jerks I have ever spoken with and one with NO wilderness mountain experience AND YOU were rude, insulting, deceitful and lied on Kifaru's MB; there were incidents of sneaking back there under other "handles"as well.

I SAW this and so did lots of other guys. So, your protestations about why you were turfed are not factual; you were banned there for behaving as you have done here, as I think others will remember.

I am probably not the most popular person with the Kifaru regulars, at least several of them and that's fine with me. HOWEVER, I have FAR MORE RESPECT for any and all of the posters there, even those who may make untoward comments about me, than I do for you, your imbecilic lying mentor and his/your products.

Yeah, YOU have written TWO BOOKS about backpack hunting, WOW, you kinda remind me of a certain famous American author who "lived"just outside of Hudson's Hope, BC., in the '60s and early '70s; he wrote about how to ...Stay Alive...etc., in the BC wilderness.

ALL the little "Back to the Land" groupies who flocked here in that era just HAD to buy and read his tomes. We who actually LIVE here and WORKED in the areas he mentioned used to laugh ourselves hoarse whenever we heard this guy's name; you remind me of him, only he had better manners.

I will also say, having owned a successful specialty retail store, managed another and worked in the backpacking/mountaineering industry, that YOU have the weirdest method of attracting and keeping customers that I have EVER seen.

Look at the number of posters here who find your posts offensive, these are people who tend to buy MORE gear than most; it seems to me that a person who owns a gear outlet and wants to sell product would refrain from behaving as you do, simply out of sound business sense.

However, none of US "know" as much as you do, geezuz, boy, you are a piece of work and not like the Alaskans I met up there in '72. I think that everytime you post here, you just alienate potential customers,but, maybe you enjoy such weird behaviour, just as Wiggy seems to.

I know the whole thing Mark. Heck Wiggy even sent me some stupid faxes that meant God knows what. Why in the heck he did this is beyond my comprehension. Spelled out his whole insane thinking process to me. It was maddens plain and simple. Even was crying that one person has two IP addresses and were conspiring against him over at the Kifaru site never mind that I met both and know for a fact they often use the same computer. It was the most insane Nero type gibberish I have ever been exposed to any outdoor form.

This whole thing is a darn shame as I do think Jerry has a great deal of knowledge. I think once others run the company things will get better. Maybe a draft collar or two? Who knows? As for the MOB I was given the opportunity to test it out as a garment.



I only had the opportunity to use it for about 12 hours. During that time it was used for pulk runs between a cabin and the road. About 8 miles worth though 4 feet of snow. It was cold. Sometimes there was light snow all the time there was wind blown snow. I was warm. The draft collar thing kept my face warm as using the pulk I couldn't simply turn away every time the wind changed direction.

I was working too hard and wetted up the head. But after I dug out about 4 feet of snow while still wearing the thing I found it dry.

Here I am the next day.



Does this make me an expert on the MOB? No! Only one day is not enough time. Do I know more about hunting and sleeping bags than you? Probably not. However unlike you I have seen the Kifaru sleeping bag in person. I used it as a garment for a day. What have you done? Nothing....

Comes down to who can I believe. A guy that flys to the East Coast to show off his gear and sits down to eat one of my Kielbasa sandwiches or someone that I found to be unstable and seems to go out of his way to bad mouth everyone. Personally I own some gear from Wiggy and Ti-goat. I got nothing against any competitor of Kifaru. I think the more North American gear makers the better. If Ti-goat wants to make stoves and tents more power to them. If Wiggy and Kifaru both make bags that is a good thing. Too bad not everyone feels that way. I am glad that you have the opportunity to sell gear and hunt in AK. But not so happy with your one issue input to this MB.

Kute...Sorry that your thread got hijacked.

No worries, your input, as always is practical, experience-based and well worth reading. My feelings parallel yours concerning gear,etc., I simply am interested in what others have to say concerning their use of various products.

The Kifaru bag looks very interesting to me and seems extremely light for it's temp. ratings, so, I thought I would solicit opinions here. Thanks, yours is EXACTLY the kind of post I wanted to see here.

WW,
Here is the problem I envision with the MOB as it is described to be intended. I "will" eventually get dirt,debris,mud,water etc in the zippers even if they are conceled it will eventually happen.
Next when hunting I get cold when I am sitting for a while & the weather kicks up. Of course then I try & hide in alders, behind a rock,or what ever shelter presents itself. Now if I am wearing my sleeping bag in parts they will get damp, muddy, wet & the worst part eventually get torn on a unseen thorn, stick,or rock. (the same reason some people don't use thermarests prolite series, or frogg toggs ) At the end of the day I don't want to go back to a cold camp & try & zip my bag back together after it has been getting wet & beat up & then crawl into it for the night. With 3 days straight of this it won't dry out for the remainder of the hunt unless there is a serious weather change.
I would like to hear opinons of those who can experience it for a week long or so & how its temp rating is.
I think I would look to using just the plain regulator system for a bag only.

Now, here is another useful, rational comment and a very good point. THIS is what I am interested in as I have obtained a lot of very useful info. from this forum and that is why I read and post here.

I have no issues with anyone who chooses a W bag or a Kifaru, a NF, FF, WM or ID...or any other item of gear. What I WANT to do here is learn, contribute and enjoy, NOT slag others as only little pri*ks (in every sense) behave this way.

Also, people's opinions change with new experiences; for many years, although I tried a number of synthetic bags, I ALWAYS prefered and used down, especially with a GT-type shell. Then, I decided to try Integral and Exped Primaloft bags and now use these most of the time.

I have down bags by WM, FF and ID, the premier makers available, other than perhaps Peter Hutchinson and Valandre and yet I find my ID North Twin plus Andromeda Strain overbag to do about all I want in most BC situations. So, my opinion has changed and many others do as well as different products become available.

Good point about possible contamination of the Regulator's zippers, hope someone can shed more light on this.

Taylor, don't flatter yourself, this isn't about you or your products, it's about the Kifaru regulator bag.

The comments made about you pertain solely to your pathetic attempts to denigrate a product you've neither seen nor used. The fact that the product belongs to your competitor makes your conduct inherently unethical, and it's plain to see from the comments here that unethical sales tactics aren't working for you.

If you claim to "offer advice based upon ALL of your experience" and your experience doesn't include using the bag, then ALL of your experience ain't worth squat in this discussion except to sell your own products by running down your competitor.

Nice job.

But as long as we're on the subject of you, tell me, why is it that just about any time the subject of Kifaru comes up here you can't resist jumping in with your negative comments?

Is it possibly because you're envious? I sure would be if I were in your position. That is, trying to sell a product that seems worthwhile, but has a stigma attached to it due to the character issues associated with the purveyors.

And you have to compete against a company that has not only a loyal following, but satisfied customers willing to try a brand new product based on the character attributes of the purveyors and their reputation for quality gear and outstanding customer service.

Yup, if I were you I'd be envious too. Kifaru has something you'll never have.

Keep chipping away on the internet, that's sure to put you on par with their reputation and loyal customer base.

LOL!!!!

PS, Kutenay, I've been in the market for a lightweight, compact 20 degree synthetic bag for a while now. All this talk has prompted me to check into the regulator. I'm going to swing by the Kifaru shop today and pick one up. I like the compactness, as Ken commented on. I've seen the compressed bag and it's about the size of a football. I've also seen a hunting partner use it with attachments at around 5 degrees (last year) and from the sound of the snoring, he was not cold in the least.

I will let you know how the regulator does for me as soon as I get a chance to use it.

Sorry your thread got dumped on.

Mark...I'm sure that reports on the Regulators will start now that people are actually getting out and using them. Up until now, the weaher here in NY has not been all that cold....and it's still not cold enough to find out what the bottom temp rating of my MOB will be, but it's getting down to where I can justify carring the bag. And let's not forget I just got the thing a week ago. So be patient, the reports will come.

As far as the "hype" is concerned, what's not to like about losing 2 lbs and gaining pack space? Is it the end of the world? NO...but, for me, the MOB is helping to make a 4200 in. pack a reality for 2-3 day trips. It's pretty thick here in the ADK, and by getting into that pack things will certainly be easier while stillhunting. It amazes me that you, being a backpack hunter, cannot not even acknowledge the FACTS w/ regards to space and weight.

For the last 2 years I've USED nearly an identical 'system' as yours, and now I'm 2 lbs lighter, using less pack space and LIKELY will be as comfortable. AND, I'd be willing to bet, if I pack my Kifaru Woobie along w/ the MOB, it'll be no contest in the comfort department...I'll STILL be lighter than when I was in Wiggy mode, as the Woobie is only 1-6.

GG- Mr. Smith has been using the MOB's in some form or another for two years...any zipper issues have likely been addressed...

You could be right. I too would like to hear the experiance of those that have used it for longer than me. I would put the thing under a hard shell if looking to beat the bushes.

Here's a couple more facts...







My long/wide WKS in a GG comp sack next to a long 20 deg Regulator...not even close.



...not even close again...3.5 lbs for a 40 deg. bag??...