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That is flat out FUNNY!!! :-) Thanks for the morning chuckle!

Where in the world did you find that? Search on "saddle sore" or something?

Disclaimer: yes I have been in some bands. Yes I'm sure we looked like dorks <g>. But not like THAT! :-)

Hey Jim- PM sent!

-jeff

Jeff, I'm an old Huey Lewis music fan..and that vid was too funny to pass up..:) Jim

Jeff -

Groin muscles never were an issue, it's knees and inside of thighs. The horse is sorta roundish on top making your feet stick out somewhat and the weigh of feet, shoes, and stirrups twist the knee joint sideways. Different horses' shapes are different so it's not a constant deal. We had 2 horses. The one I usually rode, if I rode, was a morgan mare and she was bad that way, almost flat on top. On the other hand, she was much the safer to ride. The other one was a quarter horse / arabian mix and terminally dumb. The original dizzy blonde horse. He didn't have sense enough to watch his feet so he'd shortcut across canyons where there was no dirt, just air, and wonder why he was falling. His plus though was a relatively skinny back so when riding, my feet were more nearly under me. The mare was a retired cow horse, the gelding had spent his whole life in a stable. For the thighs, it depends on a good saddle fit.

Best thing I can say is every hour or so, get off and walk for 5-10 minutes to let the blood circulate, knees recover a little, etc. After a couple hour ride, I had a hard time walking back to the house from the barn. Legs just didn't really want to operate normally.

Tom

Greaaaat.

I bet I end up walking next to the damn thing half the time!

No point getting packed in there, if my legs are too stove up to function afterwards. Gonna need my legs in there.

-jeff

Oh, I think it's well worth being packed in. Even if you walk the whole way, the horse can carry camp in and elk meat back. You don't have to over dress just to have warm gear, you can carry a little more stuff to camp more comfortably ... etc.

Another thing I like about horses is they are pretty good lookouts around camp. If there's any sort of critter lurking around they'll generally smell it and raise a fuss.

Tom

Yeah, that's the idea- let the mules carry enough stuff that we can have a comfortable camp. Otherwise it'd be a spartan backpacking camp, and frankly while I'd do that, the other guys wouldn't. No way. Our normal elk camp is an embarrassment of "stuff".

-jeff

Terrific post KC. You said what I had been thinking for a long time. Some really excellent and informative responses shared some really valuable hard earned experience. My personal thanks.

I've often noticed frequent, almost passionate, arguments over merits of a bullet or caliber vs. another, yet almost everyone will agree that there is hardly anything legal that won't be lethal if bullet is placed properly. This site has a rich tradition of being heavy on the topic of firearms compared to other sites that dwell more on hunting technique, campcraft, methodology, etc.

I really enjoyed the examples of various terrains that people hunt and I would like to add one more.

I've had much of my success by climbing above other hunters -habit from years of mountaineering activities. Traversing above treeline on this sunlit peak in the background (and ones like it) is the type of hunt that has been productive for me. Timberline is 11,500 in the photo.

Gees I would have to take a oxygen bottle with me to up there nice photo though.

Alamosa:

I can't figure out where that picture was taken. Not steep enough for the Sangres. San Juans, maybe some place near Sawatch Park or Cochetopa Pass? I hunted Sawatch Park, the Weminuche and over on the Creed side but that was a couple of decades ago.

What's the name of that peak?

KC

That is Hermosa Peak in the photo taken from the Graysill ridge in GMU 74. It is also pretty typical of the type of higher terrain I hunt in the Weminuche and Sangres as well.

I've met a number of other regional, SoCo, hunters that I guess you could call alpine elk hunters. My own style of hunting depends heavily on the wind and sometimes I have to get to these altitudes just to find any wind. It's a b!tch bringing an animal down from those elevations but at least it's downhill and there are usually good opportunitys for cooling the meat.

I've noticed that elk found at these altitudes seem to always have escape routes planned in advance - just like elk anywhere else - they never seem to me more than a few seconds from the exit.

So are you finding the elk in the basins? Is it hit and miss with the snow? Seems like you must have a small window of time to hunt them in the fall?? I am guessing you bump some nice deer in there as well.

Only on very rare occasions have I seen snow accumulations enough to impede hiking above timberline before December. A more common problem is the weather can change really fast and hit really hard. When the rock gets covered with a layer of ice footing can be really treacherous. Lightning gets real personal when there is no cover. It suks getting forced down the mountain by some route you dont want to take and then having to take the long way back. Fortunately elk don't usually go too far above their safety zone of trees unless they are traveling somewhere.

Along the ridge atop the Sangre de Cristo's there is a spot where the ridgeline drops to 12,500ft - just low enough for a few trees to cover a saddle and provide some cover. This is a natural passage for game animals crossing from one side to the other. I took this photo of this large broken arrowhead I found in that saddle.

This was evidence to me that hunters had been climbing high to bag their game for a long time around here.

Awesome pic and irrefutable evidence you are hunting someone else's honey hole.

Alamosa:

That's a really cool picture. It would be nice to get some idea of scale. Are you sure it's a broken arrowhead? Could it be a scraper?

KC

That is cool hunting where hunting as been going on for hundreds of years that will give you goose bumps.

I absolutely love this thread and the premise behind the original post. Don't get me wrong, I like a little gun talk too, but THIS is the type of information that a guy perusing the elk hunting forum is really looking for.

I tried to start a thread a while back to get some tips on late season hunting. If anyone has any advice it would be much appreciated. The last time I elk hunted was almost 20 years ago and even then it was more of following my dad around, him getting me into the elk and him field dressing it for me. After that we hiked back to the truck and paid a guy to follow us back with horses to pack him out. To say my elk hunting experience is limited is an understatement. I've been twice in my life and to be honest the only thing that I learned (through no fault but my own) is that I walked a lot, and killing was the easiest part. In hindsight I wish I would have paid more attention to the details, but that's long gone. I got back into hunting for the first time in 20 years (I'm 36) last year, and I'm feeling more enthusiastic about it with every passing day. To think about the time in my life that I wasted by not hunting bums me out, but I figure better late than never.

This season I was fortunate enough to draw for a late season bull tag in 3A and 3C of Arizona. For those of you familiar with the area, I believe, there was close to a world record archery bull taken in this area a couple of years ago. The area is notorious for big bulls. However, the majority of these big daddies are taken during the archery season. By the time my hunt starts (Nov. 28th) they'll have been pressured to high heaven. I would LOVE to take a big bull and that's my primary focus, but my hunt is only 6 days long. I will probably focus my 1st 3 days on trying to take a monster. By the time I get to my final three days, I will probably be in the mood to take anything legal! Considering the fact that I MIGHT draw this same tag (or the one I REALLY want, which is an early season tag in the same area) 2 or 3 more times in my life (if I stay in AZ and put in every year over the next 15 to 20 years), I am very anxious to make this hunt a successful one.

Any advice is truly appreciated (especially concerning late season hunting).

Thanks.

skinsscalper:

SCOUT, SCOUT, SCOUT.

If I were you, I would spend every weekend from now until the season starts, getting to know your hunting grounds and elk movements within that territory. I would study maps, then take lots of day hikes and overnight backpack trips into your area. Take your time and stop to study what you see around you. You will be on fact finding studies and getting somewhere is not the goal. The journey and what you learn along the way, is the goal. Get off the roads and trails. Do lots of cross-country hiking where no one else goes, except the elk. Then transfer all that you have learned onto your maps.

In Colorado the Division of Wildlife publishes big game maps containing lots of good info that's area specific. If AZ offers the same, I would study what they have to offer. See if they show where the elk spend the winter, where they calve, where they spend the summer and the routes by which they get from one place to another. Transfer that info onto your maps too and memorize your maps.

Then take some more day hikes and overnight backpack trips. Learn where the water is, and where the game trails are. Where there are meadows, aspen groves and dark timber. Try to figure out, if you were an elk, where would you get your water, where you would feed and where you would hide through the night. Learn where the mean nasty hiding places are located and how to get into those places in the dark before the sun rises.

If you wait until hunting season to do all this, it will be too late. You need to know this stuff before the season starts so you can develope several hunting strategies that are based upon field gathered data. You need to know your hunting area like your back yard and you need to know how and when the elk move within that area, specially how they move as a response to weather.

BTW if you think that you can be successful and not do this because the wife has other plans, or you have to take the kids to soccer games, or you have to work, or you have to go on vacation somewhere else, or you have to visit the realtives, or you have a weak back, then forget hunting. This summer you have spend hunting and other priorities have to wait.

Good luck and safe hunting.

KC

skinsscalper:

Did I mention that you have to do lots of scouting?

KC

Yeah, I think you covered that!

You are, of course, correct... one little thing though. Scouting helps a LOT, but the elk's behavior will change completely once the shooting starts. So, some "social engineering" is in order, too. If skinscalper can find people who've hunted that exact unit and ply them with beers or something, and find out how to integrate the intel he gets from heavy scouting, with what guys who have hunted it tell him about the elk behavior once the season starts... THEN he'll really have something! IMHO.

-jeff

Hire somebody to fly you over it. You can learn more in 30 minutes than is three weekends. And you don't have to fly that low.